Dancing in the Church

A few weeks ago a Young Couple came to our Church and were dancing like the World would dance, on the front pew. One of them was part of our Youth Group.This was done during the singing.Not anyone in Leadership told them to stop.This grieved the Spirit of God in me.When some of us objected to this type of behaviour in Church, we were made to feel like we were the ones that were wrong, to even question it.These Young people need to be saved.Are we just supposed to pray, and act like nothing happened?Would like some input on this.Some Scriptures.Thank-you.God Bless youNellie

Nellie, the way you describe this situation would grieve me too. Even putting aside any spiritual or religous viewpoints, there is a place for good-old fashioned etiquette, ie, respect for others. If one's "worship" is self-absorbed and shows no consideration for others, they are only worshipping themselves. It is inappropriate to let this continue - even under the disguise of "freedom in the Spirit". Those who are bothered by it have no need to feel like THEY are the ones in the wrong. This is no different than for those who feel "free" to wear their dirty boots in the sanctuary or in someone else's house. They should know to take them off out of consideration, or else they need to be told to do so (if they are so immature that they do not see the need to do so themselves.) People may freely wear dirty boots or dance in their own homes; no one needs to stop them there. I remember being in a church service where two women were dancing "in the Spirit" the entire time of singing. They never thought that they were blocking our view to the overhead words on the screen. This was inconsiderate. I realize that our dancing friends can come back at us with the biblical passage about David dancing in the nude, and his wife despising him. But that episode is hardly a lisence for the "free" expression of the flesh. Diane

I'm wondering how you know that they weren't being led by the Holy Spirit? I have seen both "led and unled" dancing in church and I'm not going to be the one to put the Holy Spirit in a box. He can pretty much do what he wants. :)

I'm not going to be the one to put the Holy Spirit in a box. He can pretty much do what he wants. This is where discernment is needed. Not everything attributed to the Spirit originates from the Spirit.Some things are obvious, some are not. If the dancers are offended when the church leaders tell them to stop or to dance elsewhere, and they go around bad-mouthing or bitter, then likely it is an indication that they are not led by the Spirit, but rather by the flesh or deception. They still need to undergo some maturing. I guess you just have get good at inspecting fruit. Diane

Obviously there are many scriptures, especially in the Old Testament that sanction dancing. There's hardly a need here to create a long post full of examples of Hebrew words for whirling, clapping, joyful occasions and other worship concepts. I'm not going to be the one to put the Holy Spirit in a box.Amen! Hopefully no Christian wants to confine the Holy Spirit! Yet limits and constraints are also holy. If we don't like to leave these church-wide matters up to arbitrary methods of "discernment" then we are left with making rules. In my experience there has always been a simple rule to differentiate between spiritual dancing and sensual dancing: I do not believe in all of the biblical examples of ceremonial dancing that male and female could mingle in the act. I think this is unpleasing before the lord as a form of public worship. Thus, typical Charismatic expressions of congregational dancing are in my opinion, unpleasing to God. (I'm not talking about clapping hands...)One time a young woman shared a testimony on Sunday morning how the Lord delivered her from bondage. It was a touching and transparent moment for the congregation. But then she asked the sound man play a popular CCM song called Shackles (Mary, Mary) “Take the shackles off my feet so I can dance. I just wanna praise you.” The congregation, following her lead began to dance to the funky beat, women and men together. We had danced before during worship, but I had always been separate from the congregation, up on the platform concentrating on my keyboard playing. This time I was down on the floor with congregation and felt the wrongness of it. If anything, it made the older believers uncomfortable, and out of respect for them I felt it was inappropriate. Since then I decided to never play on a Charismatic worship team again…We have all week long to worship with our whole body and it's endorfins...can't we find a couple hours a week to set apart for worship in spirit?Now we want freedom in the Lord for sure. But for me, I want my liberty to edify and encourage my brothers and sisters. It is not a liberty that I want to claim at the offense of those who are older then me, or those who are uncomfortable with men and women dancing. Also, I do not believe dancing has a unique supernatural power, like “evoking the presence of God”, or “breaking demonic strongholds”. These things are accomplished through heart submission to the ministry of the Holy Spirit alone…we are set free from religious methodologies that have no power in themselves. As I said earlier, I believe that the Lord sanctions (some)dancing. I’ve seen politely dressed women perform moving and demure ballets in church, and I freely admit that I have felt a sense of the Lord's joy and danced freely myself on occasion in my own prayer time. But public shoulder to shoulder dancing in mixed company with men moving in the very midst of each other’s wives and daughters I think is unedifying to the Church and unwelcome by the Lord. True David danced publicly with all his might in the nude. But he also had concubines and cut the foreskins off of his enemies. David lived in a different chapter of God’s everlasting covenant then we do brethren. The Spirit has moved on and so we must also.Blessings,MC

Wrong:Exd 32:19 And it came to pass, as soon as he came nigh unto the camp, that he saw the calf, and the dancing: and Moses' anger waxed hot, and he cast the tables out of his hands, and brake them beneath the mount. Right:1Sa 18:6 And it came to pass as they came, when David was returned from the slaughter of the Philistine, that the women came out of all cities of Israel, singing and dancing, to meet king Saul, with tabrets, with joy, and with instruments of musick. 1Sa 30:16 And when he had brought him down, behold, [they were] spread abroad upon all the earth, eating and drinking, and dancing, because of all the great spoil that they had taken out of the land of the Philistines, and out of the land of Judah. 2Sa 6:16 And as the ark of the LORD came into the city of David, Michal Saul's daughter looked through a window, and saw king David leaping and dancing before the LORD; and she despised him in her heartDo we see the difference in dancing, when God has overcome enemies and does good to His people there is dancing before the Lord. It seems that God entertains the Joy of His people. 2 Samuel 6:16-23 And as the ark of the LORD came into the city of David, Michal Saul's daughter looked through a window, and saw king David leaping and dancing before the LORD; and she despised him in her heart. And they brought in the ark of the LORD, and set it in his place, in the midst of the tabernacle that David had pitched for it: and David offered burnt offerings and peace offerings before the LORD. And as soon as David had made an end of offering burnt offerings and peace offerings, he blessed the people in the name of the LORD of hosts. And he dealt among all the people, even among the whole multitude of Israel, as well to the women as men, to every one a cake of bread, and a good piece of flesh, and a flagon of wine. So all the people departed every one to his house. Then David returned to bless his household. And Michal the daughter of Saul came out to meet David, and said, How glorious was the king of Israel to day, who uncovered himself to day in the eyes of the handmaids of his servants, as one of the vain fellows shamelessly uncovereth himself! And David said unto Michal, It was before the LORD, which chose me before thy father, and before all his house, to appoint me ruler over the people of the LORD, over Israel: therefore will I play before the LORD. And I will yet be more vile than thus, and will be base in mine own sight: and of the maidservants which thou hast spoken of, of them shall I be had in honour. Therefore Michal the daughter of Saul had no child unto the day of her death.Let them dance to the Lord, iiiiifffff it is to the Lord and not of self in showing for self reward and self display for wanting others to see how spiritual they are. Like tongues, don't forbid, but make sure it is of God and not for self exaltation and works oriented. If it is of God, Glory. Don't be like Michal the daughter of Saul, despising the dancing to the Lord that was in David. There was a consequence to in the despising, no children all her life.In Christ our Joy is in us, which is Christ in us the Hope of Glory. Col 3:15 And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. Col 3:16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.In Christ: Phillip

NellieI have no problem with people dancing, or swaying, or lifting hands, and rocking back and forth, if there is no attempt to make a spectacle. In this case you state that they were dancing ON the front pew. I do not believe that this is appropriate behavior anytime, or anywhere, let alone during a church service, as this caused all the attention of the worshipers to be focused on them.Just my thoughts.. Many blessings Greg

Dear lit4everI would never want to put Holy Spirit in a box, either.God is never the Author of confusion.The Spirit of God is up-lifting, and He is a Gentleman.Blessings to you, alsoNellie

Even putting aside any spiritual or religous viewpoints, there is a place for good-old fashioned etiquette, ie, respect for others.Yes, precisely.In this case you state that they were dancing ON the front pew. I do not believe that this is appropriate behavior anytime, or anywhere, let alone during a church service, as this caused all the attention of the worshipers to be focused on them.Though all of 1Co 14 would apply ...1Co 14:40 Let all things be done decently and in order.

This thread was posted in the Scriptures and Doctrine forum – specifically inviting discussion about the theology of dancing. However, as I look back over the thread, I think that there are some key elements that are being ignored. 1.Apparently one of the dancers belonged to the youth group. So, clearly, these are not adults. They are kids.2.Also, the church leaders were permitting this. 3.Those who expressed concern were “made to feel” that they were in the wrong. I’d like to encourage more thinking here by sharing an unrelated situation: I sometimes visit a school where there has been bullying in the playground, in spite of attempts to snuff it out. Then, when I walk past the classrooms, I see the teachers themselves bullying the children into submission. Now, I ask, Where do the children learn that bullying is the way to handle those who don’t do what you like? Don’t you see a double standard here? Young folk merely express outwardly the beliefs and behaviors of their adult authorities. Could it be that way with our dancing duo? Where do they learn what it means to “move in the spirit”? All too often, from what I have seen “move in the spirit”, let the spirit move you”, “do however you feel led”, all mean ‘DO YOUR OWN THING’, ie follow your instincts. If the adults in the church are doing their own thing, ie indulging at potlucks, being inconsiderate towards others, motivated by their own lower instincts, impulsive, living however they feel best, then I ask, HOW ARE THE YOUNG ONES SUPPOSED TO KNOW ANY DIFFERENT? Think how powerful the kids feel over the adults when they see that they can do what they want even when adults express objection. I believe that it won’t do any good to merely stop the unacceptable behavior without also promoting maturity by offering something better: the REAL thing – true spiritual life in Christ. Our youth need a better foundation to stand on than the front pew and an impotent religious system. Let’s not scapegoat the young folk for the failures of the adults. Just a few thoughts…. Diane

I almost forgot, how silly of me, find someone else to blame for our bad behavior. Well in my case it was Eve's fault, after all she ate from the tree that she was told not to eat from, so everything is her fault, so I should be able to get away with anything I want, and just blame her..When Jesus calls me to account, I will just point at Eve, and say "It's all her fault". If this is really what you think roadsign, I would suggest you check out scripture a little closer, because I believe it teaches we are responsable for our own actions..Blessings Greg :-o

My heart has been that people would dance in church so that the night clubs would be empty I used to dance abit in that kind of scene and loathe it with a vengence.I think Christian Dancing should be different that Worldly Dancing as we are Dancing to are savior.I think it was Richard Wembrant in prison that was when he got his feet damaged when they tried to make him not dance and sing to the Lord even thou they had been through much sorrow. If you notice there is worldy dancing in exodus.To me sometimes it is better people dancing in church than it is in nightclubs but hopefully not the same way as in the nightclub. That was one of the strong things that kept me in church dancing used to be quite regular in one of the youth camps to praise and worship music, I found it much more better than the rubbish from the world.There was one time when I was so miserable that I danced to the Lord out on the street, because I thought I might aswell praise and worship him it had been a really bad day. This is a very complex issue. it says to love the Lord with all you body mind and strenght and I guess that isnt passive. The Israelis are much more passionate about dancing if you know anything about Messiniac Christianity.I know I have got some things wrong, may the lord multiply my zeal for him a hundread fold so that I can dance even more for him.Jud 21:21 - Show Context And see, and, behold, if the daughters of Shiloh come out to dance in dances, then come ye out of the vineyards, and catch you every man his wife of the daughters of Shiloh, and go to the land of Benjamin.Job 21:11 - Show Context They send forth their little ones like a flock, and their children dance.Ps 149:3 - Show Context Let them praise his name in the dance: let them sing praises unto him with the timbrel and harp.Ps 150:4 - Show Context Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs.Ec 3:4 - Show Context A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance;Isa 13:21 - Show Context But wild beasts of the desert shall lie there; and their houses shall be full of doleful creatures; and owls shall dwell there, and satyrs shall dance there.Jer 31:13 - Show Context Then shall the virgin rejoice in the dance, both young men and old together: for I will turn their mourning into joy, and will comfort them, and make them rejoice from their sorrow.La 5:15 - Show Context The joy of our heart is ceased; our dance is turned into mourning.Ex 32:19 - Show Context And it came to pass, as soon as he came nigh unto the camp, that he saw the calf, and the dancing: and Moses' anger waxed hot, and he cast the tables out of his hands, and brake them beneath the mount.1Sa 18:6 - Show Context And it came to pass as they came, when David was returned from the slaughter of the Philistine, that the women came out of all cities of Israel, singing and dancing, to meet king Saul, with tabrets, with joy, and with instruments of musick.1Sa 30:16 - Show Context And when he had brought him down, behold, they were spread abroad upon all the earth, eating and drinking, and dancing, because of all the great spoil that they had taken out of the land of the Philistines, and out of the land of Judah.2Sa 6:16 - Show Context And as the ark of the LORD came into the city of David, Michal Saul's daughter looked through a window, and saw king David leaping and dancing before the LORD; and she despised him in her heart.1Ch 15:29 - Show Context And it came to pass, as the ark of the covenant of the LORD came to the city of David, that Michal the daughter of Saul looking out at a window saw king David dancing and playing: and she despised him in her heart.Ps 30:11 - Show Context Thou hast turned for me my mourning into dancing: thou hast put off my sackcloth, and girded me with gladness;Lu 15:25 - Show Context Now his elder son was in the field: and as he came and drew nigh to the house, he heard musick and dancing.2Co 4:10 - Show Context Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body.

Greg, think you might be missing something here..."Both"2.Also, the church leaders were permitting this.1Co 14:40 Let all things be done decently and in order. Why did Paul go to such lengths in explanation?Sorry Diane, no need of my intrusion on your behalf. But Greg, think you would do well to be less accusatory, maybe ask a question rather than make a statement.Edit*I guess you just have get good at inspecting fruit. Diane, this seems to keep coming up in other threads as well, even if it is being used somewhat differently in intent...Still, not understanding where this idea is truly something we are supposed to be doing. It seems to apply to false prophets. Better, will start another thread, it seems it needs to be looked at more closely.

Let’s not scapegoat the young folk for the failures of the adults.If this is really what you think ..., I would suggest you check out scripture a little closer, because I believe it teaches we are responsable for our own actions..I think Diane would agree with you Smokey. In fact I hear her saying the same thing...she is an adult and instead of blaming the children, she is asking where did they pick up these inappropriate attitudes and behaviors. As an adult she is asking adults to accept more responsibility. I remember the same conversation popped up in the thread about little children wailing in soul anguish to the Lord ...where do our children learn these unhealthy extremes from beating their chests with tortured spirits to dancing hilariously on the pew? From spiritually unstable adults perhaps? Unfit examples to the flock? I think Dianes point is not only are we as adults responsible for our own foolishness, but our children suffer because of our foolishness as well. When the oversight failed to correct them, and would not hear concerns, they are at once responsible for approving it. (At least that's how my children reason...)MC

Which dance is in fleshly manner and which is not. How can I define a fleshly dance based on what and by what interpretation? influenced by the culture of majority of Christians?… did the first disciple danced. How come where they not full of the Holly Spirit? Do we see any instances in the new testament where the disciple danced?Labeling something “by the Holy Spirit” does it really make it led by Him? Holy Spirit is HOLLY and the fruits results are holly and Him seek to glorify reveal Jesus and not man. If you mean to leap for joy praise the Lord then if that joy is cause by the Spirit who revealed Jesus to you and as a result of it you are full of joy then no one can stop you but when MAN is revealed then watch out. Did David dance nude? What nakedness the scripture mean for the old time(David’s) it is “normal” for us. (Exodus 28:42 And thou shalt make them linen breeches to cover their nakedness; from the loins even unto the thighs they shall reach:) we today have forgotten to blush.

I believe it teaches we are responsable for our own actions..Greg I'm glad you brought up this point for clarification. When I used the word "scapegoat", I wasn't using it to absolve responsibility in any way.The reason people scapegoat those who look more "obviously" like the problem, is so that they don't have to admit their own responsibility in this. The issue here is that some young folk look like THEY are the only ones involved in their choice. But think about it. How in the world did they get the idea that they could dance on someone's furniture? If this behavior is considered acceptable from the top, than how can anyone suggest to these young folk that they might be inconsiderate in their choices. I know that you would agree that part of the role of leadership is to foster responsibility and accountability in others. Diane

Hi Grealdine,Worldly Dancing is Sensual.This Young Couple were dancing not in the Spirit, but in the flesh.I'm not against dancing in the Spirit of the Lord, and I have seen Women and Men dance in the Spirit, Seperately, and I felt the Joy of the Lord, but in the Church, Sensual Dancing should not be allowed.What's Flesh is flesh, and what's Spirit is Spirit.May God have someone talk to this Young Couple , so that they will understand.Someone in Leadership, and I feel like the Pastor should be the one to do it.God Bless you.Nellie