Is coming national ID 'mark of the beast'?

[image][img]https://www.sermonindex.net/images/forum/2004/may/featured_news.gif[/img]

Is the national ID card the next step toward the imposition of the biblical "mark of the beast" Christians believe will be required to buy and sell during the Last Days?

That's the contention of a growing group of believers who are working to turn back the approval of the Real ID Act by Congress last year. Public Law 109-13 requires the national ID portion of the plan go into effect by May 2008.

"There is a prophecy in the Bible that foretells a time when every person will be required to have a mark or a number, without which he or she will not be able to participate in the economy," states the Christian website NoNationalID.com. "The prophecy is 2,000 years old, but it has been impossible for it to come to pass until now. With the invention of the computer and the Internet, this prophecy of buying and selling, using a number, can now be implemented at any time. Has the time for the fulfillment of this prophecy arrived?"

The site asks visitors to sign an online petition vowing not to vote for any candidate who does not commit to repealing the Real ID Act.

The Mark of the Beast

It seems very clear to me that those that take the "Mark of the Beast", either on their foreheads or hands, take it knowingly, with the understanding that they are worshiping antichrist. The taking of this mark will be for all of those that are lost sinners and deceived by Satan during the Tribulation.

Rev 13:18
13. And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, 14. And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. 15. And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. 16. And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: 17. And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
18. Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

xxxxxxxxxxxxx

It is also clear that many non-believers will come to belief in Jesus Christ as Lord during the Tribulation. These people will not be deceived, and will not take the mark. They will most undoubtedly be killed, but will immediately be in heaven, in the presence of the Lord:

Rev 6:9-11
9. And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10. And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11. And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season,

How are Christians killed during the Great Tribulation? By beheading!

Revelation 20:4 reveals to us that these believers were beheaded during the Great Tribulation because of their belief in Jesus Christ, and in their refusal to take the mark of the beast:
4. And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

In conclusion, I think that the time of the end is close. All of the signs are in place. All of the Nations surround Jerusalem, and Jerusalem is indeed a cup of trembling. There is now more anti-semitism than I have ever witnessed in my entire lifetime of 63 years. The World is getting ready to create it's one world government, that Nimrod tried to start in Genesis, before God came down and confused their language. The currencies in Europe are becoming one with the Euro. Our borders in America are disapearing. By 2010 America will be "borderless" --between that of Canada and Mexico.

The Church is becoming Apostate. No one wants to hear sound doctrine. Many today want teachers that give them what they want to hear-prosperity, name it and claim it, and materialism. They would rather listen to their flesh, and Satan (who they think is the Holy Spirit) talking to them, than studying God's Word. If they studied God's Word, they would know how to test the Spirit that talks to them.

God's Word tells us that the end is almost upon us:

2 Timothy 4:3-4
3. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
4. And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Time is close, come Lord Jesus, come.

God bless,

Stever

P.S. Israel was not even a Nation when I was born in 1942. Who would think that such a thing could happen? It has never happened before to a people group anywhere, once they were dispersed to form their own nation again. Dispersed for 1,500 years, and then become a Nation again--impossible! With God, nothing is impossible. God prophesized this event in Isaiah 66:8, that Israel would become a nation again, in one day, in the end times. That day occurred in 1948, 6 years after I was born. Once this event happened, end time events started falling into place, all with the Lord's timing. The Lord is indeed in control of history:

8. Who hath heard such a thing? who hath seen such things? Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? or shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children.

Let's read the rest of the prophecy:

9. Shall I bring to the birth, and not cause to bring forth? saith the Lord: shall I cause to bring forth, and shut the womb? saith thy God.
10. Rejoice ye with Jerusalem, and be glad with her, all ye that love her: rejoice for joy with her, all ye that mourn for her:
11. That ye may suck, and be satisfied with the breasts of her consolations; that ye may milk out, and be delighted with the abundance of her glory.
12. For thus saith the Lord, Behold, I will extend peace to her like a river, and the glory of the Gentiles like a flowing stream: then shall ye suck, ye shall be borne upon her sides, and be dandled upon her knees.
13. As one whom his mother comforteth, so will I comfort you; and ye shall be comforted in Jerusalem.
14. And when ye see this, your heart shall rejoice, and your bones shall flourish like an herb: and the hand of the Lord shall be known toward his servants, AND HIS INDIGNATION TOWARD HIS ENEMIES.
15. FOR, BEHOLD, THE LORD WILL COME WITH FIRE, AND WITH HIS CHARIOTS LIKE A WHIRLWIND, TO RENDER HIS ANGER WITH FURY, AND HIS REBUKE WITH FLAMES OF FIRE..

Stever responds to CJaKfOrEsT:

Revelation 20:4-5 tells us that the believers did not accept the mark of the beast. I have to believe that the Holy Spirit, that resides within the believer, provides the spiritual discernment and knowledge on what to do (i.e. not take the mark, and suffer death by beheading):

4. And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which [b]HAD NOT WORSHIPPED THE BEAST, NEITHER HIS IMAGE, NEITHER HAD RECEIVED HIS MARK ON THEIR FOREHEADS, OR IN THEIR HANDS[/b]; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection

xxxxxxxxx
I personally don't think we have to fear the mark. It has to be voluntary. We have to want to worship the beast (and accept him as Lord), and want to accept his mark.

The same goes for accepting Jesus Christ as Lord. It has to be voluntary, no one can force us or deceive us to become a Christian, no one can force us to worship Him. He knows our hearts, and judges us as saved or lost by our hearts.

At the the Great Tribulation--many will choose the beast, and worship him and live. Also, many will choose Jesus Christ, and worship Him, and be killed. If the Christian is truly saved, he/she will not be deceived by the Antichrist or his minions, in my opinion.

God bless,

Stever :-)

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

CJaKfOrEsT wrote:

Stever wrote:
It seems very clear to me that those that take the "Mark of the Beast", either on their foreheads or hands, take it knowingly, with the understanding that they are worshiping antichrist. The taking of this mark will be for all of those that are lost sinners and deceived by Satan during the Tribulation.

I think that there is room for ignorance, on the part of the receiver of the mark, as to it's ultimate consequence. Note that the text say "he causeth all", not "they will choose". Also note that the beast "deceiveth them all", which means that there is the possibility that he has "tricked them" regarding the implication of the reception of the mark.

Note that Israel had deceived themselves into believing that worshipping the Golden Calf was a valid expression of worshipping Jehovah (they actually named it Jehovah), suggesting that they were unaware that they were worshipping Satan. Also, consider Samson, who "knew not" that the Lord had left him, until it was too late.

Perhaps it is a matter of being careful not to embrace the world, as you may not get another chance to repent of it, and we won't know when God says, "Enough is enough."

Stever posted:
The same goes for accepting Jesus Christ as Lord. It has to be voluntary, no one can force us or deceive us to become a Christian, no one can force us to worship Him. He knows our hearts, and judges us as saved or lost by our hearts.
....
If the Christian is truly saved, he/she will not be deceived by the Antichrist or his minions, in my opinion.

CJaKfOrEsT responded
I only agree in part here. While it is true that one cannot "accidently accept Christ as Lord" one doesn't need to worry about accepting Antichrist as lord because we are all born under his lordship. Considering Christ statement about being wary of the "many Christs" that will and have already appeared, I believe that there will be many if not all who will bow down to Antichrist, believing him to be Christ. After all, consider those who already bow down to the Anti... I mean ... Viccar of Christ today. They think that their bowing down to Christ, or at least his perfect representative.

Stever responds to CJaKfOrEsT:

Have you ever considered that Christ was addressing Jewish believers when he made the remarks we have been discussing?

If you believe in the rapture of the Church before the Tribulation takes place, then the Church is not on the scene during the Tribulation. Who is on the scene? Jews who are not believers, and are still looking for their Messiah, as well as Non Jews who hate God and have rejected Christ. With this as a given (for me anyway) it is easy for me to see that Christ is talking to Jews that come to belief in Him during the Tribulation, as well as non-believing Gentiles who have also come to belief in him during this time.

Luke 21:7-38 becomes clear to me, with the above understanding. This is a description of Jews, as well as Gentiles that believe in Him during the Tribulation:

7. And they asked him, saying, Master, but when shall these things be? and what sign will there be when these things shall come to pass?
8. And he said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them.
9. But when ye shall hear of wars and commotions, be not terrified: for these things must first come to pass; but the end is not by and by.
10. Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:
11. And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.
12. But before all these, they shall lay their hands on you, and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues, and into prisons, being brought before kings and rulers for my name's sake.
13. And it shall turn to you for a testimony.
14. Settle it therefore in your hearts, not to meditate before what ye shall answer:
15. For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
16. And ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and some of you shall they cause to be put to death.
17. And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake.
18. But there shall not an hair of your head perish.
19. In your patience possess ye your souls.
20. And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
21. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
22. For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
23. But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
24. And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
25. And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
26. Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
27. And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
28. And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
29. And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;
30. When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand.
31. So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.
32. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.
33. Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
34. And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.
35. For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.
36. Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
37. And in the day time he was teaching in the temple; and at night he went out, and abode in the mount that is called the mount of Olives.
38. And all the people came early in the morning to him in the temple, for to hear him.

Xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Since I do believe in the pre-Tribulation of the Church I see the above as having no reference to me or other believers that will not have to go through God’s poured out wrath on an unbelieving world.

God bless,

Stever :-)