IS COURTSHIP JUST AS WORDLY

Courtship has been a high chose of christians seeking a God-honoring relationship... but is it really or just a less worldy way. Courtship seems to be just an umproper thing. The bible tells us that we are to guard our hearts, how should you do that while in that kind of relationship, and also how can you expect a lady to open her heart to you without the marrage tie. I think that is kind of unfair to ask of them.

It just seems to wishy washy... If God tells you to marry her why dont you, if he wants you to wait why are you getting involved.

Can anyone shed some light on this for me?

brother Amos

amos54 wrote:

Courtship has been a high chose of christians seeking a God-honoring relationship... but is it really or just a less worldy way.

The worldy way is to try it before you bye it, they call it dating. Christains are just trying to be separate from the world by useing diferent terms, courtship.

Joseph was "betrothed" to Mary, we would call it courting.

betrothel was as binding as mariage because joseph was going to writ a bill of divorce.
[b]Matthew 1:18-19[/b] [color=990000]The circumstances of the birth of Jesus Christ were these. After his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, before they were united in marriage, she was found to be with child through the Holy Spirit.
:19 But Joseph her husband, being a kind-hearted man and unwilling publicly to disgrace her, had determined to release her privately from the betrothal.[/color]

If we would be as stern as that, what do you think about courtship then?

Courtship is only dating in christianees (a christianised word for dating).
In courtship, all you are doing is getting to know eachother to find out if you want to merry or even able to live it out once the vows are given.

The bible tells us that we are to guard our hearts, how should you do that while in that kind of relationship,

[b]Proverbs 4:23[/b] [color=990000] Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.[/color]

The word for heart here is the heart; also used (figuratively) very widely for the feelings, the will and even the intellect, understanding, wisdom.

It is just saying be smart and diserning and use wisdom in all your decisions.

how should you do that while in that kind of relationship,

and also how can you expect a lady to open her heart to you without the marrage tie.

By trust in the man to act in a Godly manner.

God say in other words, if you both want to get married, then get married.

I dont mean to overspiritualize it but it seems these days that we take a lot of worldy wisdom as truth.

What is the difference between courtship and engagement then?

amos54 wrote:

What is the difference between courtship and engagement then?

Courtship is planning on marrying by finding out about each other to see if your compatible, and you dont have rings.

Engagement is planning the wedding and y'all have the rings.

:-(

That's pretty good Logic...

I don’t know much about dating and courtship...I could never figure it out. Maybe it's just one of those mysteries we wont know.

You have those people that wont date, and wait around until someone asks them to marry them. That’s great and all but from my experience those that have that school of thought seem to be more flirty and open to the opposite gender than those that court or date. They say they want to wait on God for their husband but they try to open every door possible themselves.

Another thing I see happen a lot among my peers is that so many, barely knowing a girl(and in some cases not even being friends) will "pray" about her and decide that God wants them to marry her. How can someone who has no habit of prayer and doesn’t know the voice of their Lord offer up a few words of want and think they have their answer. They hear their own flesh and think its God. It's so dangerous and in the end they end up hurt and questioning whether or not they can even hear the Lord. I know of a young woman that worked at a church, very attractive, loves the Lord...in one week 3 men came to her (I think, associate pastor, youth pastor, and another man) and told her God had told him he needs to marry her. Something's wrong there.

Now with dating and courtship, those two, and even marriage can be just as worldly and sinful as the other. I guess its all where your heart it. Has your interest become your idol? Do you lust? Does the relationship glorify God or disgust Him? If we date like the world dates it is as Logic said, "try it before you buy it" The way the world seems to see dating is that you can still look around for something better. The sad thing is, that mindset seems to carry on into marriage and opens up the door to divorce.

Things to consider with dating which I have found to help.

When I look at dating (or courting... whichever term you would like) I first think that it is vital that you know the person you are considering in this. Know them well, before you get into anything even close to serious.

Then once that has been done you can safely move forward. Move forward after establishing the answer to the question of "who is this person?"

Then something else to consider. Talk about what you expect from a husband/wife, how many children, if any, life after having children, and all aspects of the future and of course speak of this all in accordance with GOD's word. Do this as early in talks as possible.

This sort of up front attitude clears up confusion and sets standards from the very begining to be understood by both parties.

After everything has been talked about, and things have been considered. Seek GOD on the matter and see just what exactly HE would have you do on it. If the answer is that the two should be joined, then by all means, courtship with intention to be engaged and marry is possible and should be done and only be done after seeking GOD, as it is GOD's will.

"Dating/Courtship" is not supposed to be a way to "try before you buy" as it has become today. It is a means to find a husband/wife and should not be abused as the heathens do. GOD should be the center of all aspects of life including the "Dating." It is after all HIS will we want, not our own.

What I have experienced in my life so far, is that you have to watch out where you focus on.
I really wanted a girlfriend! I really wanted someone to share my life with and to walk with the Lord with me. I'm not a person like Paul that can stay alone.

I prayed to the Lord often that I would like a girlfriend (and eventually marry ofcourse) and I said to Him that I would let the Lord find me someone. I said this because I was too focused on wanting a girlfriend. I fell in love with a girl which had no feelings for me, but we ended up being so good friends spending a lot time together that I got in trouble with my feelings. We had to end this, otherwise I couldn't get rid of my feelings for her. Even in that time she and I prayed a lot, still if I look back I can see the 'dumb' choices we/I made. I wanted to focus on the Lord but I found myself busy with girls more after that. Not that I was dating them, but wanting a girlfriend was often on my mind.
Not long after that I started to talk a lot with another girl and we wanted to date because we both really wanted a partner. We brought this to the Lord, but actually I was not letting God handle it (finding me a girlfriend) as I asked Him in prayer. It's like you pray for something, trusting God to provide it and then try to answer the prayer by yourself without God.

I've fallen in love a few times and forced things a few times, but eventually I really left it at the Lord and then I started to talk with another girl on msn which I know from a biblecamp.
She had a boyfriend so I never had the intention to eventually 'have her' so thats why I started talking with her, knowing that I would not have the thoughts entering my mind that she and I could ever be boy and girlfriend.

After a while her boyfriend broke up with her, to my surprise. I've prayed for them that the Lord would restore their relation if its good in His eyes. Even then I did not try to 'date' her or whatsoever as she just had an ended relation. I've listened to her and talked with her to help her.
We started to talk more and we found out we wanted to do the same education, so we went to the school to check it out. We enjoyed the company and started to become friends going to places together. We even sang christian songs in the train together!

Eventually I started to have feelings for her. This scared me a bit because I didn't want to fall in love with someone while its not the other way around. I brought this to the Lord and I told her about my feelings after we had ice skated in Deventer. (boy! I haven't been on skates since I was 6. :P)
She had trouble being clear on her feelings. And I was about to suggest to not continue seeing each other this much. But she said that we could continue having much contact and would see how it would go with us after my internship. We brought this to the Lord, each separately from each other. So I also prayed God to make her reveal her true feelings and basically start a relationship if it was good in His eyes and would fall in His plan. Later on, just a few days before my departure to Sint-Maarten for 6 months we fell in love. (I was surprised even that God answered my prayer, because it took so long) Two days b4 my departure we made it official!

We have noticed, even though we have not spend much days together (she was here in SXM for 10 days also) that we really really fit well together. God gave me someone who fits me much better then I could ever self find.

I would be wary of just dating people out of the blue, but even that is not wrong out itself depending on your heart behind it. The danger is that you can really end up more busy dating or finding a possible girlfriend then with the Lord. Since you don't know if someone fits you well you might end up dating a lot girls. I really had to look out not to be busy with girls all the time, seeing each girl I think was nice as a potential girlfriend.

I'm very happy that I didn't try and force it myself to find a girl (start dating) but really left it at Him.
We really fit so well together that it surprises us and make us thank God for this relation every day! Perhaps this little story can help someone!

Amen Bro.

Sometimes when we seek that companionship, we do take our eyes off the Lord. We must hold fast to HIS will and trust that HE will provide.

I believe all who want to honor God's name in this very important subject, this testemony will be very helpful and encouraging for them - [url=http://www.gospeljohn.com/dating.htm]The Match Maker[/url]

This testemony is also in some way connected to mine testemony :-) in God's time I believe I will share it with all of you. :-)

I have just one counsel, that's the word 'waiting'.
Wait upon the Lord, He is faithful. Don't listen someone who is telling to you 'act also on your own, she/he will not come from the heaven'. That's a big lie for me. Thousands upon thousand mistakes and broken hearts has been made from this 'acting'. When you wait upon God , He will clearly show you when to act, just be close to Him, that is all you need.

The greatest encouragement and promise that I was holding firmly to was Proverbs 19:14:

House and riches are the inheritance of fathers: and a prudent wife is from the LORD.

Just take that and keep it soundly. Don't loose it. God is faithful.

Bro. Amos,

Perhaps a better question to ask, if you want to marry a Christian girl, is how can I win her? Others on this thread have suggested you wait on the LORD and let Him lead you to the right person. So far so good. But.

But if you would go up to a girl and tell her the LORD showed you that she is to marry you, it could be an insult to her...at least most females would think so. And then how will you respond? Godly females want to be pursued, they want to know whether your are trustworthy, pure in mind and lifestyle, godly. Would you be a good father to her children? a good provider? (One time when my sister was entertaining a marriage proposal and she did not know whether she loved him enough to marry him, I asked her how she felt about carrying his children? She found this idea repulsive; she did not marry him.)

In pursuing a woman, listen to what the Holy Spirit is telling you about this person. If you get an uneasy sense about this whole relationship, back off. She is not for you! And be pure in your conduct when with her, keep you hands off of her lest you be tempted beyond what is seemly.

To determine whether dating or courtship is worldy or not seem to be begging the question. The Bible does not give us any directions on how one should go about to find a spouse, but it does give us plenty of counsel on moral purity and THAT is what you need to be more concerned about. I know many who dated and were virgins when they married so it is possible. But it must be done with pure hearts and minds. Otherwise you will foul up your body and soul.

Hope this helps.

ginnyrose

PS: BTW, I have been married to the same man since 1967! and we dated three years...he was a CO, working for Uncle Sam during two years of this time and were separated by 150 miles.

Hi ginnyrose...

Thank you for this wonderful advice. I read a book by Elizabeth Elliot that provided similar advice. I am not married (yet), but I have been committed to the same girlfriend for several years. The funny thing about this discussion is that we often use different words to describe the same thing. I often say that I am dating my girlfriend. However, our "dating" consists of what most people would really call "courting." I knew my girlfriend long before we began "dating." After a while, I developed feelings for her. After much prayer, I chose to pursue her. Ironically, she was praying about the same thing.

Thus, we chose to commit to a relationship. We did not (and do not) take this commitment lightly. I met her family and asked for her parents' permission. We do almost everything together. If I am not at work, school, prayer or Bible study, I am usually spending time with her. We do go places together (dinner, shopping, etc...) -- but I would hardly consider those things "dates."

I personally do not believe in getting married until I can provide a "place" for her (and of course, I do not simply mean a physical house). I want to physically take care of a wife and the children that the Lord will bless me with. I am currently finishing grad school, and I will be looking for employment soon (I work at the University -- but I wouldn't consider this job permanent).

I do consider such relationships to be extremely important. I don't want to "miss the Lord" on something so utterly important! It is my belief that marriage should only happen once. What tragedy when well-meaning believers make mistakes in the name of "God's will" (but in reality, was simply youthful desire). I have given my girlfriend and this relationship to the Lord. God has never audibly told me to marry her. But neither has God not told me to break off our relationship. However, I have -- and will continue -- to bring this relationship before the Lord through prayer and fasting.

I sometimes get a kick out of the masses of unmarried believers that try to sensationalize (at least spiritually) their desire for a particular "God-ordained" relationship. Sometimes, they feel that God will give them visions and dreams to confirm a match ("...made in Heaven?"). I have personally had four girls tell me explicitly that "God [u]told[/u] them" that they were going to marry me (sometimes, supposedly confirmed by "dreams" and "fleeces"). Yet many people forget that both Paul and Jesus said that it is better for a man [u][i]not[/i][/u] to marry. It was tragic to explain to these wonderful girls that God had not told me the same!

I appreciate these sort of discussions -- and the advice and counsel that they generate. Such instruction is often sadly lacking in most Churches.

:-)

Chris,

I think your special friend would be the loser if she let you get away!!! :-)

Your testimony was so encouraging....keep it up and may God give you the desires of your heart.

Blessings,
ginnyrose