How I Lost My ‘Salvation’

Since the time I joined SI over a year ago, the topic of eternal security has surfaced several times. My understanding of this theology has been influenced by my own faith journey, and so I’ll share it.

I was raised reformed, in a hyper-Calvinistic environment where true spiritual vibrancy did not exist. Legalism and punitive life-views prevailed. I remember hearing in a sermon that some of us were destined for heaven and some for hell – and only God knew. I assured myself that I was not like those bad boys in the balcony who were throwing airplanes down into the congregation – those were the ones destined for hell.

I never questioned my eternal destiny. Yet I experienced a constant nagging doubt – not that I might be hell-bound, but that I could never be good enough for God or anyone. So (unconsciously) I made it my life goal to try harder in order to be approved. Yet no matter how much I achieved, I still felt a failure.

Then at 17, I was divinely led into a Baptist Church were I immediately heard of the need to ask Jesus into my heart so I could go to heaven. No problem! That was easy - there was not even any catechism to study! I said “the prayer”. But at the time I couldn’t think of any sins to confess. I already was good.

After that, the positive affirmation I received was astounding. At last, some people really liked me. It felt so good. The fact that I was too shy to give my testimony did not seem to put up red flags in anyone’s minds. They were all glad to have a nice young lady among them. I was baptized, and became a member. After that I witnessed, brought others to youth group, and did many other good Christian things. God blessed me in it all, and was good to me. However, all along, I knew that deep inside I was still the same insecure and fearful person. God knew too.

One day twenty years later, through Spirit conviction and circumstances, I realized that I did not love others enough. So I asked God to do whatever was needed to make me the way HE wanted me to be. God took me seriously. But at what a cost! For the next 10+ years he ploughed my entire life under through unimaginable and painful circumstances.

During those years I lost my “salvation” – that is, the salvation that I had come to trust in, along with the huge heap of baggage that accompanied it.

You see, that “salvation” was initiated by man. It was the work of man. God knew (but I didn’t) that all that stuff needed to be trashed in order to prepare the “highway” for the New Life. The trash can literally became a prophetic symbol to me.

My trust in man, the church, myself, my baptisms, my confessions, my knowledge, my achievements, my testimonies, my craving for people approval all underwent gruesome deaths, one after another. I was stripped to nothing. Everything that had been important to me went into the “trash”. I felt that I was good for nothing. I couldn’t call myself a Christian anymore. When nothing but Christ mattered to me, I was ready to receive him. I trusted him with the trust a baby has.

God’s Sprit birthed his new Life in me. Looking back at it all, I know the point at which I was really born from ABOVE. The change was remarkable, nothing like after my first “salvation”. I could never have known the difference ahead of time.

Yet during all that time of upheaval, I did not even know that I lacked the life of the Spirit. Yet, it really didn’t matter that I didn’t have a clear theological perspective of what was going on. That’s what made it so genuine. I wasn’t trying to fit into any theological pegs, or follow any steps.

I’m so thankful that God pulled me aside from the “crowds” so that he could do his divine work – of bringing me HIS salvation.

What I learned: We need to let God work in his time without trying to squeeze people into our expectations. Let the wind of the Sprit blow where it will.

God certainly can use us - but not if we’re interfering. In fact, our interference can induce the wrong kind of salvation – the kind that MUST be lost before there can be new Life - true eternal salvation.

Diane

Sister, your's is an excellent testimony. But's its conclusion is that salvation cannot be lost but a false salvation can ( and hopefully will be) lost.

The true line is not between keeping and loosing salvation but between false and true salvation.

The problem is that salvation has been watered down and misrepresented and a false sense of security given to the wrong persons. Mental ascent to doctrine and church attendance is given as enough to be saved and therefore if one viers off of this course and goes after the world (manifesting their true nature) then they rest in the false security of a false salvation experience.

Tell a person "pray this prayer, repeat after me and you will be asured of heaven no matter what and many will say, "sure, I pray a prayer, what have I got to lose?"

But the Bible says, "If you shall confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead you shall be saved."

Confession of Jesus as Lord is first and belief in the heart follows leading to salvation.

If He is your Lord and you have believed you are saved. But if their is no conciousness that He is indeed Lord then He is not Lord (yours anyway). The mouth and the heart are both involved according to the apostle Paul.

But from the divine perspective, salvation and regeneration bring in the Life of God which is eternal. It is based in Christ, comminicated in Christ and forever in Christ and Christ is forever in us.

So we may lose an experience, we may loose a relgious feeling, we may lose our "commitment" to live a certian way, we may lose our religous upbringing, we may lose what we thought we had. But security is for those who are genuily born of God and have His life. The Lord JEsus did not say to Nicodemus, "you must pray a prayer" but rather, "you must be born again".

A man told me once, "yes I walked the aisle when I was ten". He was a Baptist and to him, this was synonomous with being saved. But there is nothing in the Bible about an aisle. He did not say, "I came to Christ, or I believed and was baptised, but, "I walked the aisle." Well, He may have been saved when he walked that aisle. But Aisles don't save, Christ saves.

And a person who is born of God, though he may for a time go off into the world, though this Life my be hidden deep within, yet it works in him and he cannot live that way in peace. He cannot live apart from Christ, continue in it and remain undiciplined by the Lord or in inward peace as one can who is still unregenrated.

Our problem is that in much preaching the emphasis is placed on what we do, our commitment, our praying, comming forward in a meeting, or some other thing and that thing becomes the "security of the believer". But that is not our security. Our security is Christ, in His unchanging grace and His indweling eternal Life.

You cannot backslide if you have never "slid forward" and to tell someone who just "prayed a prayer when I was seven and was saved" but Jesus Christ has never been a reality to him, that he is sucure in this is to do him a diservice. But to one who is genuinly saved and who has fallen and is feeling condemned that he must not be saved is to do this one a diservice. Rather He must know the blood of christ, the security of the believer and be encouraged to lay hold on the eternal Life and come to God on this basis. Not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works, but rather laying hold of Christ and moving on.

Graftedbranch

Hello Good Morning Child of the Lord

I'm from and island in the pacific, namely Guam. Guam is a U.S. Territory but not a state. However many missionaries come to Guam, many denominations, and also sects.

I just want t0 include that I may be able to interpret your problems in your testimony and HOw I was feeling. I attended a bible seminar, and I truy got to Understand the eternal security of my salvation. So i may be able to relate with your testimony.

Before I was saved, I always thought my good would weigh out the bad so i can enter the kingdom of heaven. I was raised as a catholic for 16 years, basically since I was born, and of course salvation is not accurately or revolved upon there. WHen I was a high school student, I attended a bible study at a classroom. The presenters simply presented Jesus Christ and asked us to pray with them to accept him as savior. Of course that as well, did not save me, just the fact that they thought it was that simple. As a matter of fact, I was not preached what Jesus has to do with me, but follow a routine that would supposedly get me saved. I was not saved there either.

Until my cousin begged me to attend a six day seminar. It was a baptist church, but they themselves refuse to be labeled as Baptists. Its funny, but in actuality In front of GOd he only sees sheeps and goats not Baptists and what not. But anyway, that church kept the Title with the word Baptist in it. the name may not be truly important but what they preach is of costly value.

It was the summer of 2002, I attended the bible seminar for three days. I learned the creation of God reveals his existence. I have never truly thought that God really existed, because of all this science going on with evolutionary theories. however, God did exist because the creation itself is a living miracle and science cannot explain the wonder it holds. THe constant Law of the rotation of planets and never displacing its orbit for thousands of years, science themselves cannot explain it. Great is thy faithfulness!... however I did not get to complete the seminar because of the heavy persecution from my devoted catholic Mother who threatened to kick me out the house if I converted. (which I now highly doubt)
Fall, September came and I was invited to go again to the seminar. Of course I finally got to attend again but with my mom's approval of attending only 1 day! however, I disobeyed for the greater good! (I suppose that justifies my answer) I attended, and at the fifth day it was "sin day" basically the sermon was about my position before GOd with my sins. I discovered I was born a sinner, a maggot before God, I was destined to fall into hell because of my sins. Hell was a just waiting to engulf me. "for the wages of sin is death..." (rom 6:23) the pastor said to repent tonight in front of GOd and ask for mercy and beg him to enter his kingdom of Heaven. He said it was an important step for tomorrow Sermon which was about the salvation of Jesus Christ. I cried and I awknowledge my sins before God flat, I mentioned the many sins i could possibly remember. After I prayed, I determined in my heart that I would tell my Mom I would convert.. Because I deeply wanted to be saved. So that night I spoke with her, and she was furious! she told me to stop attending! I was crying in front of her begging please let me attend the next day, "I feel closer to God this way" My mom said to me, "you attend and I will kick you out!" So i ran to my room crying and prayed that I may go. So the next day I went without her approval, because i thought its now or never. its like Heaven or Hell, I believe those choices are more valuable then "in" or "out" of the house.

This is what I want to deeply share with you about on that day concerning the eternal security of my salvation.
That day, I knew God in the form of Jesus Christ came down and Died on the cross for my sins. I was happy and thankful! but wait.. I thought to myself what if I sin tomorrow or the week after. Will I still have the hope of going into heaven? my security was questioned. Here is the verse that holds me tight!
"Not with the blood of goats and calves but with his own blood he entered the most holy place once and for all having obtained eternal redeption." {hebrews 9:12}

which means salvation/redemption, which means the Forgiveness of sins. My sins past, present, and FUTURE! were all forgiven. Even the ones that i haven't commited yet. He died for me more than enough. I was so thankful, I knew I didn't deserve such amazing Grace but he gave it to me anyway. Basically I was born again or saved on "September 28,2002".

"For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more." (Hebrews 8:12)"

He will never judge me for going hell now! in front of the judgement seat He will just see the blood of Jesus Christ. I have all the confidence i can to enter heaven because of the Eternal salvation he gave me, meaning Eternal forgiveness; past, present, and future forgivenessess.

"And I give them Eternal life, and they shall never preish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father's hand." (John 10:28-29)

It doesn't say, I "WILL" give them, but just "I give them", and "NEVER" will perish because he has given us eternal life. Its a gift thats irrevocable. (Romans 11:29)

Now people may think, so what? we can now sin all we want?! that is not the case, if one is truly saved by the amazing grace of God can one dare to sin? We are still in this bodily flesh with the potential to sin intentionally, or unintentionally. However we are still secured with Salvation no matter what,and no matter how bad we sin after we recieved salvation because God has promised us that. So what happens then? well one thing that assures us we don't sin is "Chastisement" hebrews 12:7-8. I truly know now that i'm his son because i get chastized by God after i have commited sins. He guarantees I make sure I notice it. Its like a living miracle, that I'am saved, because sadly i'm punished for things that I commit as a son. It could either be Financial problems, or physcial pain?! But like the verse says, "... For what son is there whom a father does not chasten?" Before we were saved were not sons of God, we were sinners destined to fall in to hell, actually we were considered sons of the devil before salvation is acheived. (John 8:44) however now we are sons of God our relationship changed on that time we believed and recieved salvation. Now Truly as a son of God, our father will teach us, chastize us, love us, all these things to make us grow in our faith lives.

So now let me conclude as this, We were sinners destined to fall into hell we must feel and know the "poop" of our sins so we can understand the grace of God of how severe he has to die for our "poop" of our sins.
And when he died he gave Eternal redeption, sins forgiven; past, present, and future. Thats why we are so compelled by his love, we dare not to sin but rather we are so thankful we can do anything for him and dare not to sin. His grace compells us so much we can risk our necks in spreading the gospel all becuase of that Eternal redemption of salvation he has given us of how he suffered severely for us on that Cross. He did so much so we can do so much as well.
We can never ever fall into Hell once we believed in this. Even if we WANTED to go hell or we hate Heaven we are guaranteed to go heaven there anyway no matter what our destination is. Our Citizenship has forever been engraved as "Van, citizenship of Heaven." or "roadsign, Citizenship of heaven" (philippians 3:20). So I hope it is not a sad thing, that we are forever going to heaven. (very awkward) but to get my point across, once we believed that we have eternal redemption we are sealed for Heaven no matter what! no conditions can change God's promise of Salvation, no matter how much we sinned. Aren't you so thankful? I myself am reminded that I can live for him more and more out of Thankfulness.

So I hope this helps you, and God bless. I have a feeling it will... If it does, I'am guaranteed to meet you in heaven and we can talk all about it... we can share fellowship in heaven saying "your the guy that wrote that long testimony online at www.sermonindex.net!"And I will say "yeah that was me! anyway, lets forever immerse ourselves in the Love of God in this wonderful paradise!!!" We will meet again... either in this world or the next. see ya!

Van
[b]This is what I want to deeply share with you about on that day concerning the eternal security of my salvation. [/b]

Hi vannlibranda,

Welcome to SI! Liked your "poop" ;-) Great testimony.

Think Diane well expressed it here:

What I learned: We need to let God work in his time without trying to squeeze people into our expectations. Let the wind of the Sprit blow where it will. God certainly can use us - but not if we’re interfering. In fact, our interference can induce the wrong kind of salvation – the kind that MUST be lost before there can be new Life.

[i]"Christianity is the only religion in the world where a man's God comes and lives inside of him."[/i]

Good testimonies!

Key verse for me was Rom 8:16 that basically says that the Spirit of God will witness with our spirit that we are children of God(saved) It is the Spirit of God that truely rebirths us, but He also gives us the confirmation of salvation so that we don't ever have to doubt.

Thanks for your great testimonies!
Be blessed!

Diane,

your story is bringing tears into my eyes. Thank you for sharing it with us!

Be blessed!
Bea

AMEN!

Bea

Would you be saying that Diane was NOT saved through the years spoken of; would have gone to hell if she had died?

We can make a lot of quick converts based on the "if" principle - what if you die tonight! You better convert real quick!

But you make a lot of FALSE converts too. And there are countless "saints" walking around clinging to void eternal assurance policies that God never gave them. Man did. And then we wonder why so many 'Christians' don't seem interested in living the exchanged life. They can't because they don't have it!

God does quite fine working in people's lives in HIS timing. Father knows best. We are called to be the salt and light, and speak only under divine authority. We mustn't try to turn on lights with "strange fire".

If God had left me to the devices of man, I would surely have ended up in hell. But Praise God, he rescued me. It was a lonely journey - alone with God. Not one Christian saw my need for true salvation. I would even have passed under Ray Comfort's radar. That's how well I lived the Christian walk. I just listened attentively to sermons, and lived like I was taught. But I lived in my own strength, not the exchanged Life that comes with true salvation.

See why Jesus pointed out that the prostitutes and tax-gatherers will enter heaven ahead of the religiously dedicated people?

By the way, I want to emphasise the fact that I am deeply thankful for the way my life unfolded - right from the start. I hold nothing against anyone. It was all for the glory of God!!!!!!!!

A not-so-sanctified thought: Perhaps many of our zealous evangelists are safer selling house insurance than soul insurance. Then they can live by "ifs" all they want.

Diane

1 Corinthians 13
Love
1If I speak in the tongues[a] of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames,[b] but have not love, I gain nothing.
4Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears. 11When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me. 12Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
13And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

1 John 3:10
This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God; nor is anyone who does not love his brother.

1 John 5:2-4 (New International Version)
2This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out his commands. 3This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome, 4for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith.

1 Thessalonians 1:2-4 (New International Version)
2We always thank God for all of you, mentioning you in our prayers. 3We continually remember before our God and Father your work produced by faith, your labor prompted by love, and your endurance inspired by hope in our Lord Jesus Christ.

Galatians 5
1It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.
2Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all. 3Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. 4You who are trying to be justified by law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. 5But by faith we eagerly await through the Spirit the righteousness for which we hope. 6For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.
7You were running a good race. Who cut in on you and kept you from obeying the truth? 8That kind of persuasion does not come from the one who calls you. 9"A little yeast works through the whole batch of dough." 10I am confident in the Lord that you will take no other view. The one who is throwing you into confusion will pay the penalty, whoever he may be. 11Brothers, if I am still preaching circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been abolished. 12As for those agitators, I wish they would go the whole way and emasculate themselves!
13You, my brothers, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the sinful nature[a]; rather, serve one another in love. 14The entire law is summed up in a single command: "Love your neighbor as yourself."[b] 15If you keep on biting and devouring each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.
Life by the Spirit
16So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. 17For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want. 18But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.
19The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. 25Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

A convert can never be a false convert.

Here we go playing with words and definitions. What fun! I think of the word proselyte. You can be a convert (proselyte) to anything, and also be most sincere and genuine about it. I’m speaking of converts to the law, not to grace. We have a lot of those kind. Only they think they are converts to Christ. (‘cause someone told them, likely)

But are they damned or just not "born again"? God knows the heart, eh?

we wait for that for that to happen while obediently attending the numerous church programs and functions.

Diane

This reminds me, someday I'd like to start a thread: "God's role, Our role" We sure do get that mixed up.

the test will reveal the strength of it.

And how I praise God for the tests! They reveal to us what he already knows, but we don't! The judgments, tribulations, and trials, are God's means of mercy. Oh, how he loves us - so much that he doesn't leave us to our own devices and illusions - only to discover them when it's too late - at the final judgment.

We are so utterly dependent on our Lord to lead us to the narrow way, and help us stay there. We can't count on man. (What a surprise that can be!)

Diane

The judgments, tribulations, and trials, are God's [b]means of mercy[/b]. Oh, how he loves us - so much that he doesn't leave us to our own devices and illusions - only to discover them when it's too late - at the final judgment.

Exacting, Diane, I've hardly heard anyone consider this aspect of God's mercy and love to be part of essential Christian living these days, the days of "give me, give us...".. hardly ever! Praise God!

Diane, thanks for taking the time and sharing such a moving testimony. It all sounds so familiar. God has an incredible plan for us. We need to lose it all. All the distractions, all the idols, all the people-pleasing, etc. It is refining yet it brings us to that place where we
are purified and really more Christ-like. Yes, Romans 8:16 Amen!