judging

From time to time whilst reading different posts I see people saying that we are not to be judgmental. Can I ask why not? Who says this?
Instead, they say we are supposed to love, because God is love, and He is. It is God who has told us to judge. John 7v24 'Do not judge according to apperance, but judge with righteous judgment'. Some use Matt 7v1 and say 'judge not', which it does say, but it doesn't stop there. Verse 2 tells us what judgment to use. Righteous, godly judgment. We judge according to God's word, His standard not ours.

This same God of love hates wickedness and punishes the wicked. Psalm 11v5-6 says...but the wicked and the one who loves violence His soul hates. Upon the wicked He will rain coals, fire and brimstone and a burning wind shall be the portion of their cup.

Don't want this to be too long. Hate long articles. Still God is God, His word is to be obeyed, or ignored, at our own peril. There is no middle road. God bless.

Thank you for the information about the book. Sounds good. God bless.

I personally think that it might be the way we judge like in the words we use when being judge mental is were most of us struggle, like my Brother used to always tell me before he went to be with the Lord he use to tell me Bill "approach" is everything. He used this as an example, he said the pizza delivery guy can just walk up to your door knock on it and slam your pizza against the door and say you owe my $17.50 could you hurry I have other deliveries or he could knock on the door and say Mr. Bill here is your pizza just freshly made it's hot and I got it here ASAP just for you, we sincerely do appreciate your business, that will be $17.50 and here is a coupon for your next purchase, take care and have a Blessed day, see it's all about the approach we use in life. :-)

1 Tim 3 tells us about the qualifications for a bishop, overseer or whatever you want to call that leader. He is not to be a novice, not puffed up, arrogant, if you like. Is he not being judged? He has to be judged, by others, to see if he fits the position. If not, he should not hold the position. 1 Cor 6v5 says...is there not a wise man among you, not even one, who will be able to judge between his brethren? We are to judge each other, using the word of God, not our own standard. Love does not ignore justice. God bless.

"Judge carefully",
"Do not judge",
"Judge between your servants",
"Stop passing judgment on one another",
"Judge for yourself",
"make a right judgment"…

maybe we should ask,WHAT should we judge?

For what it’s worth, that is discussed further here:

[url=http://www.thewayback.net/articles/JUDGING/1developing.htm]Judging - the difference between good and bad judging [/url]

Diane

There are definitely categories of judgment. There is the category of the wrong kind of judgment that we are not to practice - "Judge not, that ye be not judged" (Matthew 7:1). But there is also the category of the right kind of judgment that we are to practice - "Beware of the false prophets" (Matthew 7:15), "Judge not according to the appearance (that's the wrong kind), but judge righteous judgment (that's the right kind)" (John 7:24).

The problem comes in when we call the wrong kind of judgment, "good" and the right kind of judgment, "evil." "Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter" (Isaiah 5:20).

This was happening also in Jesus' day. The Pharisees practiced the wrong kind of judgment - they condemned the common man and called them accursed because, "this people who knoweth not the law are cursed" (John 7:49). The Pharisees were also guilty of judging by appearance which is the wrong kind of judgment - "He answered and said unto them, 'When it is evening, ye say, it will be fair weather; for the sky is red. And in the morning, it will be foul weather to day; for the sky is red and lowring. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but ye cannot discern the signs of the times?" (Matthew 16:3). Because the Pharisees and others judged by appearance, they called the Son of God, "Belzebub." "If they have called the master of the house Belzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?" (Matthew 10:25). They spoke well of the false prophets (Luke 6:26) and persecuted and killed the true prophets (Matthew 5:11-12). They judged by appearance (the wrong kind of judgment) but didn't make a righteous judgment (the right kind of judgment) based on God's Word - or else they would have known the true prophet from the false prophet and they would have known the Son of God from Belzebub!

http://www.devcobaptist.org/templates/System/details.asp?id=31831&PID=372703

Grace and peace
Olan

Something that just occurred to me regarding this topic- judging:

Yes, it is important that we become good judges, but what we do with our observations is another story. I ask, Do we always need to point out the bad and the wrong, or can we just show the better way?

I once read in a book for piano teachers: When you see a student doing something wrong, don’t mention what they are doing wrong. That is not the focus. Instead, explain the right way to do it – and DEMONSTRATE it. Then acknowledge their efforts when they do it right.

I think that many scriptures would back up that idea:

“Let us consider how we may spur one another on to love and good works…” Heb. 10:24

Can you think of more?

It’s easy to tell someone what they are doing wrong, but it is much harder to explain and demonstrate the good. I am guilty of this – even in my posts here. For years I have had a tendency to be critical – which is really a misuse of my judgments (though they may be good). Criticism just deflates and discourages people. Or it stirs them towards defensiveness. It doesn’t help them know a better way. And it doesn’t help them get there.

With God’s help, I would like to move on from my initial observations and judgments and spur others towards growth and maturity. But before I can do that, I have to learn to be a fair and discerning judge. (After all, if I can't see what's the problem, I can't offer the right alternative)

Diane

Yes, it is important that we become good judges, but what we do with our observations is another story. I ask, Do we always need to point out the bad and the wrong, or can we just show the better way?

I believe you have gotten to the heart of the matter with this statement and question. This is what Matthew 7:1-20 is all about - the wrong kind of judgment and the right kind of judgment.

We have both responsibilities: we must protest against reprobates (like Jesus and John the Baptist who called the reprobate religious leaders, "Brood of vipers and hypocrites") and we must spur one another on to love and good works (like Jesus teaching Nicodemus - a Pharisee).

This means we need discernment. How do we get discernment? Jesus answered that question in Matthew 7:7-8 - "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened to you: for every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened." See also as a parallel Proverbs 2:1-11 to see that Jesus' instructions were not just a generalization on prayer but a particularization for obtaining the discernment necessary for making the right kind of judgment - we do not have the ability or perogative in ourselves.

Grace and peace
Olan

we must protest against reprobates

How do we respond to the one whom we judge as evil (reprobate)?

Jesus taught:
“Do not resist an evil person” Matt. 5:38
The Greek word is anthistami, meaning: oppose, stand against, resist, withstand

"Do not rebuke a mocker, or he will hate you." Prov. 9:8

Jesus said, “If any will not welcome you or listen to your words, shake the dust off.’ What words? Jesus had sent the disciples out into the villages with these instructions: “As you go, preach this message: The kingdom of heaven is near. Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy, drive out demon…. Stand against sin (NOT!)”

Jesus taught, “You are the salt of the earth. ... You are the light of the world. Let your light shine before men.” I suspect that if we are not preaching the good news, healing the sick, driving out demons, or raising the dead, then perhaps we have lost our saltiness, and we are no longer salt and light to the world. Then when we condemn the evil person, we are in the wrong. We have a log in our eye because we ourselves have failed to be salt and light to them, and are blinded by our hypocrisy (our log.

Jesus said, “In the same way you judge others, you will be judged.” In other words, if in our judgments we “stand against” the reprobate, God will stand against us. This is exactly how Jesus and John the Baptist (God’s spokesman) handled the Pharisees: God’s hand was heavy against them, and they had asked for it. They had been heavy-handed in judgment of many sinners. They had damaged a lot of souls through their bad judgments. They gouged many eyes while trying to remove their specks (sins).

In Romans 2 Paul explained this same principle to the religious Jews: “You who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemning yourself.” (It’ll come back on you!)

It seems like Jesus, John the Baptist, and Paul reserved their strongest rebukes for the religious leaders. So, maybe those are the ones we should be standing against today. After all, many are leading their congregations straight to hell.

Yet Paul seemed to be extremely careful about his judgments against the leaders – well except one time – when he was cornered. He used a perfectly legitimate OT term to speak against the hypocrisy of the high priest. Apparently this was not well received, and Paul was told so in no uncertain terms: You dare to insult God’s high priest?” Paul did not get defensive, but instead said, “I did not realize that he was the high priest; for it is written; ‘Do not speak evil about the ruler of your people” Acts 23:5

This blows me away! Paul had NOT been speaking evil of the high priest. He gave a perfectly legitimately warning of divine judgment, saying, “God will strike you (honest warning of judgment) you whitewashed wall (honest picture of their hypocrisy).” When Paul felt cornered, he said something that was against his better judgment.

“Do not resist an evil person”

“Bless those who persecute you.”

Diane

God speaks to us in the Bible through precepts (explicit teachings - fully and clearly expressed) and principles (implicit teachings - not expressly stated; implied). Jesus taught the [i]principle[/i] of the resurrection to the Sadducees from Exodus 3:6 where the resurrection isn't explicitly taught but implicitly taught. Jesus even expected the Sadducees to understand the principles of Scripture - "But regarding the resurrection of the dead, [b]have you not read what was spoken to you by God[/b]: 'I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob'? He is not the God of the dead but of the living" (Matthew 22:31-32).

Jesus also did the same thing with the Pharisees. He used the principles of Scripture to prove His obedience to God's word of which He was being accused of disobeying (see Matthew 12:1-14).

That "we must protest against reprobates" is not a precept but a principle - one to which we have the examples of the prophets, the Lord Jesus, and the apostles.

John the Baptist - the greatest prophet that ever lived - protested against the reprobate religious leaders, so that he could prepare the way for the coming of the Lord. He labeled the deceivers so that others could beware (Matthew 3:7-10).

Jesus protested against the reprobate religious leaders of His day and even warned of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees (Matthew 16:6; 23:1-33).

Paul protested against reprobates and even called names (2 Timothy 2:16-18)

John - the apostle of love - protested against reprobates and even called names (3 John 9-10).

Poison needs to be labeled. That is the purpose behind the principle of protesting against reprobates. It is not loving to leave dangerous chemicals unlabeled and neither is it loving to leave dangerous deceivers unlabeled.

Part of guarding the flock (Acts 20:28-30) is the principle of pointing out dangerous deceivers.

Grace and peace
Olan

That "we must protest against reprobates" is not a precept but a principle -

Diane

Bartle:

Thanks for the blessing. May God bless you where you are.

Reprobate religious leaders were responsible for leading Israel into apostasy just as reprobate religious leaders will be responsible for leading the church into apostasy. These last days are filled with those who have a form of godliness but have denied its power. That's what makes discernment all the more necessary.

Grace and peace
Olan

Diane:

I am not saying that we put implicit deductions ahead of explicit commands. An implicit deduction (command in principle form) is neither a greater command nor a lesser command than an explicit command. One does not negate the other - both are to be obeyed. Just as we are to obey both the commandment to "judge not lest ye be judged" and to "make a righteous judgment", we are also to obey "let us consider how we may spur one another on to good works", and to "mark them which cause divisions and offenses contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple" (Romans 16:17-18).

Those truths don't contradict one another but balance one another. Without balance we would be either so accepting and naive that we would allow deceivers into the fellowship (see 2 John 7-11) or we would be so rejecting and arrogant that we wouldn't even allow in the true man of God (see 3 John 9-10). Discernment is needed!

Implicit principles will not contradict explicit precepts but the two will balance one another. It is possible to spur one another on to good deeds (explicit precept) and to protest against reprobates (implicit principle) in order to guide and guard those whom you are spurring on.

Grace and peace
Olan