Entire Sanctification...Part 2

I hope I have not broken any “forum rules” by starting this continuation thread. I apologize if I have done so.

Thank you all so very much for your responses to the “Entire Sanctification…Really?” thread. I moved to Indiana in the last few days and have not had time to review and study all the information provided , but would like to talk about this entire sanctification thing.

Entire Sanctification would seem to be…well…entirely possible…if the right definition/explanation is used.

I have spoken to and/or read of people that are, or at least claim to be, “entirely sanctified”. I would like to share some of this with you.

ES (entire sanctification)

Person A gives explanation of ES I say it is impossible
Person B gives explanation of ES I say I am too
Person C gives explanation of ES and I am confused
Person D gives explanation of ES and I am sad
Person E gives explanation of ES and I am glad
Person F gives explanation of ES and I want to flee

Some seem to be redefining sin. Some say they do not sin. Some say they do sin, and still others say things that…well I’m not sure, but its not Biblical. Some have been, but no longer are. Some have been many times, and some are still searching.

The mere mention of entire sanctification seems to cause a vast array of emotions in people.

It would seem to me that entire sanctification is a very difficult, if not potentially dangerous, subject to handle properly without a more unified definition and explanation.

Does entire sanctification require a book for it’s definition? I know certain books and authors can and have provided enlightenment on various subjects, but I am just after the basic entire sanctification facts and truths.

As you can tell I need much more education on this subject.

I really enjoyed the explanation given in the article I linked to and have included it again, and would love to have more responses about it.

Would the majority of entirely sanctified people agree with this article?

http://home.snu.edu/~hculbert/entire.htm

As for all the additional ES information provided in the original thread I would like to say thank you all very much. What a wealth of knowledge.

This subject is of great concern to me, so please if you have time let me know about the explanation given in this article.

God bless you all

TJ

Paul writes to the Philippians

Philippians 2:19-21

"But I trust in the Lord Jesus to send Timothy to you shortly, that I also may be encouraged when I know your state.

For I have no one like-minded, who will sincerely care for your state.

For all seek their own, not the things which are of Christ Jesus."

Does Timothy posses "entire sanctification?"

In Christ
Jeff

That depends on how you define "entire sanctification", and that seems to be the largest problem with it. Any thoughts on the article I posted?

Thank you for your reply.

God bless

TJ

Tj asked:

Any thoughts on the article I posted?

I read the article. Warning flags always go up where there are more words of men, than of Scripture to define a precept or statue found in the kingdom of God.

Side note...do you believe as the article pointed out that OT saints could be entirely sanctified?

In addition to prayers for holiness, the Bible contains commands that we be holy. "Be holy because I, the LORD your God, am holy" is one of several passages that call us to a high plane of living (Leviticus 19:2; see also Matthew 5:48 and Hebrews 6:1).

God Bless

Jeff

I'm not sure. Once again, according to some definitions and explanations...possibly. That is what is causing me such great concern about the article. I am affiliated with a denomination that, over all, does not believe in ES. I, like many others, don’t strictly believe like the denominations we attend or even work in. I grew up not believing in ES, but there is so much more to holiness than most of the church makes of it. It is of the most serious. I so long for it. In recent months I have started to investigate ES more closely. Sometimes I think it is simply a higher level or plateau of spiritual maturity and of consecration, not that it is a simple thing, but maybe it is easier to define than some make it.

Thank you for your reply

God Bless

TJ

Brother TJ wrote:

It is of the most serious. I so long for it. In recent months I have started to investigate ES more closely. Sometimes I think it is simply a higher level or plateau of spiritual maturity and of consecration, not that it is a simple thing, but maybe it is easier to define than some make it.

1 Corinthians 3:

1 And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ. 2 I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able; 3 for you are still carnal.

Paul teaches that there is a difference between those who are babes in Christ and those who have grown to understand the law of the Spirit.

Jesus teaches this same precept also...

John 8:31 Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed Him, “If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed. 32 And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”

John 8:33 They answered Him, “We are Abraham’s descendants, and have never been in bondage to anyone. How can You say, ‘You will be made free’?”

John 8:34 Jesus answered them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin. 35 And a slave does not abide in the house forever, but a son abides forever. 36 Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed.

In both of these sections of Scripture we find that both Paul and Jesus teach that there is a difference in those that believe. In both of these sections, the focus is on overcoming the old man.

Paul teaches in Romans...

Romans 8:

5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.....

13 For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

..."but IF by the Spirit YOU put to DEATH the DEEDS of the BODY, you will LIVE..."

This precept is found throughout Scripture....

So what then differs between those who live according to the carnal man and those who live according to the Spirit?

In Christ
Jeff

rookie wrote:

So what then differs between those who live according to the carnal man and those who live according to the Spirit?

That answer is found in the scripture you gave

Romans 8:

6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God....

I’m not sure I follow. Are you saying that that is the difference between being entirely sanctified and not?

It would seem to me that the difference is…well…one of them is truly saved.

God Bless

TJ

Brother TJ wrote:

Are you saying that that is the difference between being entirely sanctified and not?

I can only speak from where I am and what I understand. I hear many different testimonies from brothers and sisters, all are unique. All have been dead spiritually. All have been given the gift of Life through the cross. Some testimonies speak of immediate transformation and fire that kindles the spirit of man. Yet others, after a time of living under the law, finally come to the same understanding. Then there are those who seem to never come to understand. They never seem to thirst for righteousness. They never grow in the blesssedness described in the Beatitudes.

In my own life, the moment I understood or recognized the voice of God, that moment I knew where faith finds it's source.

What God brings to a man, that is what he needs. Whether there is a moment in time or aN ongoing washing of the Spirit, I know not whether there is a precept that defines when that man is "entirely sanctified." All I know is what David speaks of in 2 Samuel 22:

47 \t“The LORD lives!
\tBlessed be my Rock!
\tLet God be exalted,
\tThe Rock of my salvation!

2 Samuel 23;

5 \t“Although my house is not so with God,
\tYet He has made with me an everlasting covenant,
\tOrdered in all things and secure.
\tFor this is all my salvation and all my desire;
\tWill He not make it increase?

I always go back to Job 33:

14 \tFor God may speak in one way, or in another,
\tYet man does not perceive it.
15 \tIn a dream, in a vision of the night,
\tWhen deep sleep falls upon men,
\tWhile slumbering on their beds,
16 \tThen He opens the ears of men,
\tAnd seals their instruction.
17 \tIn order to turn man from his deed,
\tAnd conceal pride from man,
18 \tHe keeps back his soul from the Pit,
\tAnd his life from perishing by the sword.
19 \t“Man is also chastened with pain on his bed,
\tAnd with strong pain in many of his bones,
20 \tSo that his life abhors bread,
\tAnd his soul succulent food.
21 \tHis flesh wastes away from sight,
\tAnd his bones stick out which once were not seen.
22 \tYes, his soul draws near the Pit,
\tAnd his life to the executioners.
23 \t“If there is a messenger for him,
\tA mediator, one among a thousand,
\tTo show man His uprightness,
24 \tThen He is gracious to him, and says,
\t“Deliver him from going down to the Pit;
\tI have found a ransom’;
25 \tHis flesh shall be young like a child’s,
\tHe shall return to the days of his youth.
26 \tHe shall pray to God, and He will delight in him,
\tHe shall see His face with joy,
\tFor He restores to man His righteousness.
27 \tThen he looks at men and says,
\t“I have sinned, and perverted what was right,
\tAnd it did not profit me.’
28 \tHe will redeem his soul from going down to the Pit,
\tAnd his life shall see the light.
29 \t“Behold, God works all these things,
\tTwice, in fact, three times with a man,
30 \tTo bring back his soul from the Pit,
\tThat he may be enlightened with the light of life.

This Scripture teaches about the ways God works to save men's souls from the Pit.

What do you think?

In Christ
Jeff

Those scriptures are so very touching. I am so undeserving. The Lord’s patience and desire to continue working on us…just staggers me. HE IS WORTHY !! I am closer to God now then ever before and it is now that I see myself as so utterly worthless. The closer I get, the more vile I see myself to be. What an awesome God we serve. I am so grateful. He is Worthy! I don’t see how I could ever see myself as “sinless” I know that apart from God’s grace I am detestable. I long for holiness and strive for it, and have a measure of it, but is not he alone holy?

2 Samuel 22:

47 “The LORD lives!
Blessed be my Rock!
Let God be exalted,
The Rock of my salvation!

To God be the Glory!

God Bless

TJ

May this help? 2Cr 1:10 Who delivered us from so great a death, and doth deliver: in whom we trust that he will yet deliver [us];

Could you not say, Who sanctified us? Who is sanctifying us? Who will sanctify us?

Delivered and sanctified in the Spirit by Christ's birth in us. Doth deliver and sanctifying us in our soul mind by the Holy Spirit Teacher, renewing our mind to the Mind of Christ. He will yet deliver and sanctify us completely in Body that will be like His.
"And so shall we ever be with the Lord", in the Fathers House, "therefore comfort one another with these words."

Sanctified, being Sanctifies and will be Sanctified. Act 26:18 To open their eyes, [and] to turn [them] from darkness to light, and [from] the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Rom 15:16 That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being sanctified by the Holy Ghost.

1Cr 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called [to be] saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours:

Who is our sanctifier, Who is sanctifying us, Who will sanctify us?

1 Corinthians 1:29-31 That no flesh should glory in his presence. But of Him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

Sanctification; 38. hagiasmos
Search for G38 in KJVSL
agiasmoV hagiasmos hag-ee-as-mos'

from 37; properly, purification, i.e. (the state) purity; concretely (by Hebraism) a purifier:--holiness, sanctification.

Sanctified; 37. hagiazo
Search for G37 in KJVSL
agiazw hagiazo hag-ee-ad'-zo

from 40; to make holy, i.e. (ceremonially) purify or consecrate; (mentally) to venerate:--hallow, be holy, sanctify.

Romans 15:16 That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being sanctified by the Holy Ghost.

Holy; 40. hagios
Search for G40 in KJVSL
agioV hagios hag'-ee-os

from hagos (an awful thing) (compare 53, 2282); sacred (physically, pure, morally blameless or religious, ceremonially, consecrated):--(most) holy (one, thing), saint.

Ghost; 4151. pneuma
Search for G4151 in KJVSL
pneuma pneuma pnyoo'-mah

from 4154; a current of air, i.e. breath (blast) or a breeze; by analogy or figuratively, a spirit, i.e. (human) the rational soul, (by implication) vital principle, mental disposition, etc., or (superhuman) an angel, demon, or (divine) God, Christ's spirit, the Holy Spirit:--ghost, life, spirit(-ual, -ually), mind. Compare 5590.

The Holy Spirit has to do with the mind. The Spirit of Christ has to do with spirit. The Body has to do with The Father.

Being sanctified;

In all three tenses of sanctification,In Christ:
Phillip

My time is very limited today so I will be brief.

When one is truly converted, he has the ability through the blood of Jesus not to sin. That's what some would call initial sanctification. Entire sanctification is simply that place when the old nature is cut off.

We're never immune from temptation but the inclination to sin is removed. That's a very brief explanation.

Brother wrote:

Entire sanctification is simply that place when the old nature is cut off.

When according to Scripture does this occur?

In Christ
Jeff

Only when Jesus replaces it with Himself.

Quote:

""
"In the process of sanctification, the Spirit of God will strip me down until there is nothing left but myself, and that is the place of death." Oswald ""

That is the Place of Life. The less I become the more He becomes. Life in Christ, not death in self. I die daily to self and live daily to Christ. "The life I now live I live by the faith of the Son of God" "It is no longer I who live but Christ who lives in me",,That Is "Christ in you the Hope of Glory". So, Colossians 3:1-4 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

The old man is dead, crucified with Christ, and yet we life. We live in Christ by the Father's Seed in the Power teaching of the Holy Spirit.

In Christ: Phillip

That is the Place of Life. The less I become the more He becomes. Life in Christ, not death in self. I die daily to self and life daily to Christ. "The life I now live I live by the faith of the Son of God" "It is no longer I who live but Christ who lives in me",,That Is "Christ in you the Hope of Glory".

John 8:31

"Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed Him, "If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed. And you shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free."

Is entire sanctification then a moment in time or a life lived by faith learning precept upon precept, line upon line of His word?

In Christ
Jeff

Sanctification made for us by God in Jesus Christ. This is the instant we are saved.
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
1Th 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and [I pray God] your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Corinthians 1:10 Who delivered us from so great a death, and doth deliver: in whom we trust that he will yet deliver us;

Paul is using a sentence of death by others as the same sentence of death we all have upon us, until we are delivered from death by God, saved by the Christ that is in us. This is a past tense delivered, It is past from the very instant we are born again. Then the doth deliver, is now, the will deliver is future. The Now is our mind, the will is our physical resurrection.

Sanctified, being sanctified and will be sanctified.

In Christ: Phillip

Hbr 13:12 Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.

Christ is made our sanctification. Is this not what this scripture says? 1 Corinthians 1:30 But of Him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: Does this say something I am missing? If Christ is made by God to be our sanctification, how when we are saved with The Fullness of God in us, by the Spirit of Christ, we not be sanctified at that moment of His birth in us? Christ in us is also progressive in our soul, and body. In Spirit it is done once.

Brother Phillip wrote:

Christ in us is also progressive in our soul, and body. In Spirit it is done once.

As you have quoted from 1 Corinthians 1, the brethren were in Christ according to Paul...

1Cor. 1:4 I thank my God always concerning you for the grace of God which was given to you by Christ Jesus, 5 that you were enriched in everything by Him in all utterance and all knowledge, 6 even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you, 7 so that you come short in no gift, eagerly waiting for the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ,

Yet, even though the "testimony of Christ was confirmed in..." them, they struggled in many ways. This is not the picture that I would see of one who says he has been "entirely sanctified."

Paul says to them...

1Cor. 4:15 For though you might have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet you do not have many fathers; for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

Why are things not coming together for the Corinthians who have the testimony of Christ in them?

God Bless

Jeff