Tony Evans | SermonIndex

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MrBillPro Feb 5, 2007

I heard Tony Evans say in his sermon this morning that if you were not attending a Church that you were sinning, pretty strong words, sad thing is that he has mixed this sermon in with his tithing sermons he has been preaching on for the last few days.

I just wonder if this is some sort of back door sermon to get you to feel under some sort of condemnation to get you into the Church so you can start tithing? I don't know why Pastors just can't stick to the word of God and preach a good sermon that teaches us the word of God without always having to get around to the tithe.

I do understand that going to Church is a good thing for all of us but to say someone is sinning this is not right what about the folks that just can't make it because of health problems? I will say this it might be the last sermon I will listen to of Tony Evans, I will keep what I need to do personally in Prayer, for any of you that might want to listen to this sermon he preached this morning here is the link.
It's the sermon for Monday Feb. 5th:
http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/The_Alternative/archives.asp?bcd=2007-2-5

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preacherafla Feb 7, 2007

God has much to say about tithing, offerings, and blessings. Isn't to preach the whole of God's word to include these things? There are some who make that their emphasis and that is probably not healthy but neither is a believer who does not give to God out of the blessing God has given to him.

In His service,
Preacheraflame

sermonindex Feb 7, 2007

I heard Tony Evans say in his sermon this morning that if you were not attending a Church that you were sinning, pretty strong words, sad thing is that he has mixed this sermon in with his tithing sermons he has been preaching on for the last few days.

These are words of men that are trying to keep Church attendance up. Sadly for many they think that spirituality is based on the "hour" time slot every week. It is sad to see how much work goes into that one "hour" so it can work out smoothly. The western practice of Church is almost all wrong. I would not be bothered by his words on this subject. If a person is in "sin" and is not coming to Church then there is a problem that is biblical. But to miss a service here or there is nothing sinful about that.

"shall we continue in sin?" No. And thus those that have convenanted this with God soley based upon the work of Jesus Christ on the cross come together to fellowship as the "church" of God and share in communion together. Forgetting to meet one week or being busy not to make the "hour" appointment does not stop you from being part of that ekklesia. If you "are dead" and Christ is "your life" then you will be fellowshipping many times a week with other belivers who call upon the Lord out of a pure heart.

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philologos Feb 7, 2007

those that have convenanted this with God soley based upon the work of Jesus Christ on the cross come together to fellowship as the "church" of God and share in communion together.

Because of the way we use the word 'church' it is always difficult to see beyond the 'gathering for worship' but the local 'church' is not the 'meeting'. That is an aspect of being 'the church'. The real question is not "do I go to church" but "am I part of the church?".

Many who attend 'the meeting' are not part of 'the local church' in a functioning way. If persecution were to prevent the gathering of the saints together in public would that mean the end of the 'local church'?

"I have been to church this week" may calm a conscience but biblically it makes no sense at all.

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Yeshuasboy Feb 7, 2007

MrBillPro wrote:
I heard Tony Evans say in his sermon this morning that if you were not attending a Church that you were sinning,

Dear MrBillPro:
What comes to my mind is

Heb 10:24 "And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:"
Heb 10:25 "Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching."

Indeed is of great importance to provoke one another unto love and good works. I mean, look at the unity of the early believers in Acts 2:44-47 :-D To me, those verses illustrate a true "assembling of ourselves together." Where's the coveting there? I don't see it. Where's the pride? I don't see it.

Acts 2:44 "And all that believed were together, and had all things common;"
Acts 2:45 "And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need."
Acts 2:46 "And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,"
Acts 2:47 "Praising God, and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved."

Now that's church!!!!!!!!! Praise God.
Here's a question: If I am able to only attend a "steeple-house" where Spirit-less doctrine and traditions of men are preached, is it wise for me to sit under that kind of authority? Adding to that, a place where they have no prayer meetings and don't do anything in the community for the poor, the fatherless, and the widow? I would think that such a place is "self-centered" and it could very well be disasterous to my soul in the long-term.

I really think many would love to go to church, especially if God were there! Should that not be the reason to go? Yea, to fellowship with brethren , but also to spend time fellowshipping in the midst of God Himself? Indeed, how many have stepped foot inside a steeplehouse to meet God, and instead have met something of the world.

richie

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MrBillPro Feb 7, 2007

I feel that when we surrendered to Jesus as Lord, we also received a new spirit “whereby we cry Abba Father,” Romans 8. God is now our Father and we have the Holy Spirit dwelling in us who knows all things and reveals all things, John 14.

We no longer have to go to a temple to see God’s presence, He is right there within us all the time in the new temple, which is our own body. In the Old Covenant, the only people who were given the anointing of the Holy Spirit were the prophets, priests and kings (Psalms 51:11).

Every true born again Christian now has access directly to God and His Holy Spirit. This is why the veil in the temple was ripped apart at the same moment Jesus died (Mark 15). It was Gods way of showing us we now had direct access to Him and He no longer lived in the Most Holy Place of the temple.

We don’t need a priest to tell us how to give because we are supposed to use the Holy Spirit to guide us in those decisions.

sermonindex Feb 7, 2007

I like Tony Evans' teachings on some thing, but I completely disagree with him on tithing, and also about the church attendance thing.

I do neither, at least in the way that the institutional church says I should. Tithing is OT Law. The NT Epistles speak in great detail about those who would put believers back under the Law. That is what teaching the tithe to NT believers does.

As for church attendance... I know of many (myself included) who were called out of church for a period of time. For me, it was 6 months. I believe God did that in order to flush all the garbage (teachings/traditions of men) out of my system, and prepare me for the calling He was about to put on my life.

Moses had his time in the desert... so did Jesus... so did John the Baptist. It seems to be a precurser to being used of God.

According to Evans'... I was sinning. According to God, I was being obedient. And nothing God called me to do was against scripture. Even stepping away from the "church" for a season.

Krispy

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MrBillPro Feb 7, 2007

KrispyKrittr wrote:
I like Tony Evans' teachings on some thing, but I completely disagree with him on tithing
Krispy

I don't know if I am just listening to these particular Pastors that are pounding us in their sermons everyday about tithing, but I have never in my 55 years heard so many Pastors preach tithing like they do today.

Sometimes I wonder if the ones that really were not called by God are getting more concerned and that is why or maybe their not being good stewards of Gods money but something is definitely wrong here or changing.

I have been listening to Charles Stanley for over 10 years and I don't know if I have ever heard him preach a sermon on tithing and I am sure there are others, so I am guessing that maybe these tithing Preachers may need to really take a deeper look into the way there Preaching the Word of God number one and also how they are managing Gods money.

It has almost got to the point now were I can't even turn on any Christian station there not selling something or asking you for money, and what about this Mike Murdock guy man he is not bashful at all, send me $100.00 and just wait and see how God will Bless you 100 fold, if this is true why don't he have all these 100 fold receivers on his show with their testimonies? and I don't mean just a couple hand picked I mean if 500 folks gave him $100.00 I want to see 500 folks telling me how they received a 100 fold.

sermonindex Feb 7, 2007

I dont think they are all doing it because they want your money. I think some really believe that tithing is for the Christian, and they believe they are preaching the Word with boldness. And lets face it... you gotta be pretty bold to preach on money.

I just think they are wrong about tithing. It ALL belongs to God, and we should be obedient to whatever God tells us to give. It may be 5%, it may be 50%. But scripture makes it clear, Paul especially, that he did not want people to give because they were coerced into it. He was against people giving out of a sense of duty. He wanted people to give out of a love for God and concern for people. Tithing, especially with promises of wrecked finances if you dont, does not produce cheerful giving. Even in Leviticus there were certain offerings at the temple that God made clear He wanted the people to make of their ~~[i]~~own[/i] will, and not because it was commanded of them.

And Tony Evans is also misinterpretting scripture when he alludes to Paul taking up a collection:

~~[b]~~1 Cor. 16:1-3[/b] ~~[i]~~Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye. Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come. And when I come, whomsoever ye shall approve by your letters, them will I send to bring your liberality unto Jerusalem.[/i]

Paul was taking up a specific collection for the poverty ridden and persecuted Christians in Jerusalem. This passage speaks much about well organized administration in the church, and not anything to do with tithing.

All Paul is saying here is "Please take up a collection to help your brothers in Jerusalem. They are suffering. And so that we dont have to waste time doing it when I get there, please do it beforehand. This way, when I arrive I can spend my time teaching, and not collecting money."

Yet, preachers like Tony Evans take this passage and apply it to tithing. "Collect the tithe on the first day of the week!"

It's funny that preachers like Evans will misapply this scripture to tithing... and then break this scripture all week long. Scripture says first day of the week, right? So why do they pass the "offering" (tithing) plate on Wednesday too? Thats the 4th day of the week.

Krispy

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RobertW Feb 7, 2007

Many who attend 'the meeting' are not part of 'the local church' in a functioning way. If persecution were to prevent the gathering of the saints together in public would that mean the end of the 'local church'?

To go along with this and what Greg said I also agree that a tremendous amount of time is spent on trying to put on a performance for folks. I want to be careful here, but what Ron is saying about persecution I believe is quite true. Persecution would reveal who was legit.

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RobertW Feb 7, 2007

MrbillPro's: We don’t need a priest to tell us how to give because we are supposed to use the Holy Spirit to guide us in those decisions.

The problem is that folk have been raised up since they were children believing that tithing is for today and to not tithe would transgress their conscience.

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RobertW Feb 7, 2007

I have been listening to Charles Stanley for over 10 years and I don't know if I have ever heard him preach a sermon on tithing and I am sure there are others, so I am guessing that maybe these tithing Preachers may need to really take a deeper look into the way there Preaching the Word of God number one and also how they are managing Gods money.
It has almost got to the point now were I can't even turn on any Christian station there not selling something or asking you for money, and what about this Mike Murdock guy man he is not bashful at all, send me $100.00 and just wait and see how God will Bless you 100 fold, if this is true why don't he have all these 100 fold receivers on his show with their testimonies

This is one of the problems that comes about when churches try to keep growing and growing into Mega ministries. These things cost money. What happend to the old days when little churches were spread all over neighborhoods and folk just walked to church?

It has not been uncommon to hear that Christians who do not pay their tithe are 'cursed' with a curse. I am not saying folk should not pay tithe, but I am alarmed of how it is often presented. Many times it is the only carry over from the Old Testament law (actually there were 3 tithes under the law). If Paul slammed circumcision like he did in Galatians- what do you suppose he would say about tithing? Both are from Abraham's time? I think it should be a matter of conscience and as the person purposes to give in their hearts. If it is given grudgingly what doth it profit anyhow?