A musical son of exaltation and the false daughter of a rock?

"And, behold, one of the children of Israel came and brought unto his brethren a Midianitish woman in the sight of Moses, and in the sight of all the congregation of the children of Israel, who were weeping before the door of the tabernacle of the congregation." - Numbers 25:6

Hi everyone.

The other day I was looking for something in the Scriptures and this passage in Numbers caught my attention. The scripture says that [i] the people began to commit whoredom with the daughters of Moab[/i] and as I understand it, this is where it was that Balaam taught Balak how to get at the children of Israel, by getting them to sin with the people of the land. If I've mixed that up or confused this with something else I would appreciate it if someone could clarify :-).

So anyway, this really stood out to me and I was just struck by how absolutely bold this act was by the man and woman, right in the sight of Moses and everyone else! And to top it off it appears as though the people were in the midst of crying out to God.

Well, as I looked at this, for some reason it came into my mind to look into the names of the two that did this thing. The scripture goes on to say of them...

"...the name of the Israelite that was slain, even that was slain with the Midianitish woman, was [b]Zimri, the son of Salu[/b], a prince of a chief house among the Simeonites. And the name of the Midianitish woman that was slain was [b]Cozbi, the daughter of Zur[/b]; he was head over a people, and of a chief house in Midian."

It turns out that thier names and the names of thier fathers have meaning.

According to Strong's Hebrew dictionary,

Zimri means [i]musical[/i] and Salu means [i]weighed[/i]. However, it also seems to suggest that it could be Sallai, instead of Salu, and Hitchcock's Bible names Dictionary says under Sallai: [i]Sallu, an exaltation; a basket[/i].

Follow me here just a bit more.

Also according to Strong's,

Cozbi means [i]false[/i] and Zur means [i]rock[/i].

So what you might ask? Well, here's something that has been sort of churning in my mind as I consider this: if we were to put these together, that is these meanings, if they are at all descriptive of the people to whom the names belonged, you might then call them

[i]a musical son of exaltation[/i]

[i]the false daughter of a rock[/i]

Music in connection with exaltation speaks to me of worship, the worship of God. And a rock speaks of salvation or a savior(see Deuteronomy 32:30-31 for instance).

Well then, if that is permitted, and we were to set these [i]descriptions[/i], so to speak, if we were to set them over and against the backdrop of this verse we started out with and apply them within the whole context of what was going on there, you might be able then to say this:

The union between that which is for the worship of God(in this case music) and that, or perhaps better, they, who are false to salvation, or perhaps of a false salvation, or maybe are merely false in some way, that the union between these is, or begets, or can lead to, [b]a sensual, flagrant, act of open rebellion[/b].

Whew. That is heavy. Am not going to comment any further than that but I wanted to submitt this to the body of believers here for your consideration and discernment and judgement.

Thanks,

Chris

I read and reread your post. I still don't get it. I am not too surprised that there hasn't been any response. In addition, even if your extrapolations were clearer, is there a spiritual truth that applies to daily living as believers. If so, what is it? Break this out further, in a manner that can be followed and a discussion might ensue.

In His Love,

Doug

edit

Chris,

I think I understand what you're getting at. A cryptic play of names, that, when put together, seems to convey a powerful maxim quite relevant to churchiology (especially in charismatic circles) today: False converts of Christ caught up in exalting strains of worship. And this so-called "marriage" of unregenerate spirit and musical exaltation amounts to nothing more than open rebellion in the eyes of God.

As far as a "cyptic" novelty, it's pretty neat. I don't think I'd preach it from the pulpit, though what it conveys is certainly worthy of expounding! I don't have my Bible with me, but if I remember correctly I think Eleazer went into the tent and slammed both of them through with a javelin. It may have been during an intimate moment where they were impaled in tandem. If this is so, from what you have proposed it can be deduced that the false convert brings death to all she touches. It was the Midianite that was false, but the music of Zimri was true. However, when music cohorted with the Midianite, both had judgment executed upon them.

Well, this is a hard concept to swallow, because music has no conscience. To tell you the truth, I thought of Lucifer when I first read "exalted musical son." Now, [i]this[/i] little morsel opens up whole new avenues, that, when considered meditatively, would fit into place quite nicely. The only problem we run into here is that Balaam was the influencer and Cozbi was the influencee. Zimri was also an influenced by Balaam - indirectly, so to speak.

Did you do a name check on Balaam (and Balak, for that matter)?

There's lots of holes here if we give equal attention to how the entire event transpired and use it as a corollary to the spiritual. Indeed, if we spiritualize it, and give no heed to the actual roles, it displays a truth. But I prefer to also match the actual with the spiritual for a perfect, all-around fit; i.e. If Cozbi symbolizes the false conversion, then she must have been conceived by Balaam, or Satan, and then delegated through Balak (or some demon or wicked spirit), to seduce Zimri, the symbol of exalting music. Ah, but music [i]can't[/i] be seduced! It is Zimri then that must entice Cozbi. And this very well may have happened in real life, I don't know.

A javelin is a different weapon from a sword in English, but I don't know how closely they are related in the Hebrew. It would be nice if javelin could be interchanged with sword - in which case we could have the true priest casting judgment upon the illegal affair [i]in the very act[/i], so to speak, with the Word of God. And this reminds me of George Fox contravening the sermons of the false teachers right as they preached from the pulpit!

I like it, Chris, though it becomes pretty muddy when you try to break it down further. But maybe there is no need for this.

Good thinking, good digging brother!

The Lord bless and keep you,

Brother Paul

Brothers Doug and Krispy, thanks so much for responding. Completely understand the asking to break this out further...it has been somewhat murky in my own mind too! As much as I shared was what I felt I could grasp and wanted to get some impressions from you all, having this feeling of being only at the surface of it.

I think brother PaulWest brought out some great insights and would like to follow with the vein he was mining, beginning with this...

"A cryptic play of names, that, when put together, seems to covey a powerful maxim quite relevant to churchiology (especially in charismatic circles) today: False converts of Christ caught up in exalting strains of worship. And this so-called "marriage" of unregenerate spirit and musical exaltation amounts to nothing more than open rebellion in the eyes of God."

Am going to try and follow along with his thoughts here and see where it goes.

Thanks brothers,

Chris

Thanks Paul for sharing your thoughts and insights into this, Maybe Chris was onto something after all! I know the meanings of names are significant so it's a worthwhile endeavor to look into these things. The utter depth of God's word always amazes me.

In His Love,

Doug

The utter depth of God's word always amazes me.

That's not the half of it, brother. I think it was Ryle or Torrey that said Jesus Christ is found on every single page of the Bible. You just have to be willing to dig deep enough. In my studies, I've found Him in every book, but certainly not every page. But I know He's there. Every hidden thing I uncover in the Word reveals yet more and more even beyond it. The more you magnify, the more stars you see. Multitudes of stars are suddenly discovered in areas you once thought barren, and a crystal-blue oasis appears where you once thought was only dry dust.

The Word is so totally alive and vibrant and pulsating. Every word is weighed seven times by the Spirit. The Word of God is the most amazing thing in the universe, an endless, fathomless ocean where the more you explore and find, the more overwhelmed and small you become. This little exploration Chris did is a prime example of the apparent profundity laying right beneath the surface of just a few Hebrew names in a situational context.

Brother Paul

Brother Paul, so glad you responded here. Reading through your post is really spurring some thought!Would like to follow along with you here and see what may appear out of it all :-) Will start at the beginning here...

"A cryptic play of names, that, when put together, seems to convey a powerful maxim quite relevant to churchiology (especially in charismatic circles) today: False converts of Christ caught up in exalting strains of worship. And this so-called "marriage" of unregenerate spirit and musical exaltation amounts to nothing more than open rebellion in the eyes of God."

This is much along the lines of the sense I have of it. I keep thinking of worship concerts where thousands of people are screaming before some man or woman while they perform. This phrase here is pressing into it...

[i]this so-called "marriage" of unregenerate spirit and musical exaltation [/i]

only one other word is perhaps needfull?

[i][b]soulish[/b][/i]

" It may have been during an intimate moment where they were impaled in tandem. If this is so, from what you have proposed it can be deduced that the false convert brings death to all she touches."

That's the impression I get, that they were together. Something else here about she bringing death: what is so amazing is that they did this thing while the children of Israel were...are you ready...

[i][b] weeping before the door of the tabernacle of the congregation[/b][/i]

That is just plain flagrant! What in the world was going on here!? Am getting slighty ahead here but you mentioned the demonic influence and I think it speaks here...

[b]And Israel joined himself unto Baalpeor: and the anger of the Lord was kindled against Israel.[/b]

It looks like the demons were succeeding(if it was them behind it) and that judgement from God had already gone forth when the Children of Israel began to cry out to God(in repentance?). So maybe this incident with Zimri and Cozbi was an effort on their part(the demons) to turn the Children of Israel back from repentance? I noticed that both Zimri and Cozbi were from [i]chief houses[/i], which might mean their actions would have alot of influence upon the people.

For our day, could it be that [i]this so-called "marriage" of unregenerate spirit and musical exaltation [/i] is a ploy of the adversary to counter the movement of God's people towards repentance?

"It was the Midianite that was false, but the music of Zimri was true. However, when music cohorted with the Midianite, both had judgment executed upon them."

That is strong brother, solid.

"The only problem we run into here is that Balaam was the influencer and Cozbi was the influencee. Zimri was also an influenced by Balaam - indirectly, so to speak."

You gave me another thought here. Balaam was, in my words and opinion, a prophet for hire. His undoing was covetousness or being greedy of gain. Now brother, you mentioned [i]charismatic circles[/i] and well, could that fit? Is it possible that the prophetic voice of the charismatic movement today is standing in the place and influence of Balaam? Have they, even unwittingly, brought Cozbi into the congregation of the Children of Israel through enticing and extravagant promises of prosperity? And now shes united in an unholy wedding to Zimri and thier flagrant party-like celebrations are a distraction to the people of God who are weeping before the door of the tabernacle and seeking God in repentance so that His wrath may be stayed?

Going to hold off there and let this sit on the mind and spirit for a bit.

Look forward to your responses brethren.

Peace be with the Israel of God.

Chris, you've brought quite a bit out into the open. What started out as a little nugget is now bursting apart in all different directions.

I noticed that both Zimri and Cozbi were from chief houses, which might mean their actions would have alot of influence upon the people.

And this is of noteworthy significance! There are two chief houses in the world, run by two fathers. The Father of Lights (James 1:17) and devil-father (John 8:44). The children of the devil's house have a strong influence over the children of God's house. If you remember, Cozbi and Zimri were found in a [i]tent[/i], and more particularly, in [i]Zimri's[/i] tent, in the territory of the children of Israel. A child of Light married to a child of darkness while abiding in God's camp. We see this widescale today. Notice, later, that it was God's command that[i] all Midianites be exterminated[/i] save the virgin Midianite women (Numbers 31:17). If the children of Light marry the children of darkness, it is counted adultery to the children who are the daughters of the King, and married to the Light.

For our day, could it be that this so-called "marriage" of unregenerate spirit and musical exaltation is a ploy of the adversary to counter the movement of God's people towards repentance?

Yes, or dupe the false convert into believing he is right with God. "Ye adulterers and adultresses" ( James 4:4). Judgment rose up in the midst of the congregation through Phinehas, the grandson of Aaron, and he slew both husband and wife in the midst of their adulterous deed. Cozbi, the Word says, was run through the belly (Num. 25:8). I believe the javelin went through the back of Zimri and through the belly of his "wife" during intercourse in Zimri's "tent." The church today is still bringing Cozbi into the tent while the congregation weeps, and because it's a tent, we think nobody sees the love affair. Ah, Zimri brought Cozbi into his tent. And not only that, he also brought her to his brethren according to verse 6. This has tremendous spiritual connotations, as you consider the idolatry of God's people today, in the midst of the congregation, married to and conjugating with that which is forbidden. Notice that not Eleazar, but a younger priest stood up, emboldened by God. This speaks to me of a younger generation of warriors, a bold Joshua-Caleb-Phinehas-Samuel generation that will not shy away from locating, invading and killing sin in the camp through the thrusting of the Word of God.

Remember when Samuel hacked Agag to pieces? Same principal here. Zimri took it through the back unawares, non-vigilant, unsober, in the so-called privacy of his own tent-heart. His back was turned on the Word of God, and when you preach sin in church, the Zimri's won't hear it. They want their illegal wife in a secret tent. But if they won't heed to the beckonings of God's righteousness, fatal judgment will suddenly pierce them through. They think their tent conceals the sin, but God sees in the heart and his javelins of judgment will strike like lighting. Cozbi, on the other hand, was a Midianite, and Balak was her king. She took it straight on through the belly, facing the man of God, nothing to hide. Remember, her people called Israel to sacrifice and bow down to [i]their[/i] gods. She wasn't expecting the fierce judgment of Israel's God to pierce her belly. In the same way a javelin of God entered into a Gentile belly with judgment, the Holy Spirit now flows out of Gentile bellies with grace (John 7:38).

Where are the bloodwashed and fire-baptized Phinehas priests of today that will rise up with golden javelins in their clean hands? Where are the priests with pure hearts aflame and zealous to raid the adulterous "tents" of God's people with the Word of God?

Enough for now! Let's ponder on this for awhile.

Brother Paul

Brother Paul...

[i] Behold, ye trust in lying words, that cannot profit. Will ye steal, murder, and commit adultery, and swear falsely, and burn incense unto Baal, and walk after other gods whom ye know not; And come and stand before me in this house, which is called by my name, and say, We are delivered to do all these abominations?[/i] -Jerimiah 7:8-10

Don't know if you've ever heard this song performed by Paul Wilbur, called [i]For Your Name Is Holy[/i], written by Jim Cowan

Lord I worship You
I worship You
Lord I worship You
I worship You

For Your name is holy, holy Lord

For Your name is

holy

holy

Lord

For Your name is

holy

holy

holy Lord

For Your name is

holy

holy

holy Lord

Some really good stuff to ponder over by Brother Chris and Paul!

Thanks guys!

Great truths Paul and Chris keep this thread going

No, brother Chris, I've never heard that song.

I'm familiar with Paul Wilbur, though. He is one of my favorite Messianic artists; I especially like the recording of the concert he did in Jerusalem. Listening to "Shouts of Joy" is quite the experience! When I hear it, I think of the terrible arm of Jehovah, the Mighty God of Israel, the conquering power behind David's mighty men, ripping ferocious lions apart, I think of the awesome Angel of the Lord destroying the entire Assyrian army in one night. Of God removing Sennacherib with bloody patricide in the temple of his own false demon gods. Oh, how Hezekiah must have danced and shouted for joy! I think of our fearsome Father bringing pagan Asheroth to her knees and anhilitating all the firstborn males of Egypt to deliver the apple of His eye.

Yes, this is the God I worship, and He is utterly fearful and three-times holy and pure. All his ways are exceedingly glorious.

Brother Paul

In knowing that we all do really want to worship the LORD in spirit and truth, this discourse fits really fits with what I've felt and know is false in many places I've either been or witnessed on TV.

One place I was at was nothing more than dancing around a golden calf of prosperity and it seemed no one could sense the lie and untruth that was going on. Flags flowing, people clapping, gold dust supposedly falling, feathers from God supposedly showing up, gold teeth in the mouths of people, a very long prayer line for sick and everyone falls except me. I watched this and knew there was a falseness about it.

I love to praise the LORD and am not against any action that the LORD might bring on me, but have been very troubled by the falseness or copy that Satan has somehow been able to bring into many of the Charizmatic organized churches in this way and in many other organized churches that aren't Charizmatic. But isn't it neat to be where that true worship of spirit and truth is going on whether it's a Charizmatic church or a quiet, humble humble church singing some old hymns to the LORD with the presense of the LORD there.

Thanks brothers,
GaryE

I just wanted to apologize if by my previous edit I hurt or offended you. My Spirit rejoiced at the start of your thread, because while reading it God spoke to me. I enjoy your teaching so much and I hope… that’s fine…that I can’t wait to get home to read and study. I wanted to let you know that you have been an encouragement in my life.

a musical son of exaltation the false daughter of a rock

If I were the one writing this thread, I would have written it like this,

A Musical Son of Exaltation

The False Daughter of a Rock (s)

And then I would have deleted the false

I know that this thread says and teaches a lot more then the area in which God spoke to me, and If time permits one day I would like to contribute.

Franklyne, thank you for taking time to write here and inquire about this.

Whatever you may have written I never saw, so there was no offence or hurt at all. But thank you still for asking.

It is [u]a blessing[/u] to me that you have been encouraged in any way.

Wishing you all goodness in Christ,

Christopher