I was wondering if anyone knows anything about Rob Bell and his church called Mars Hill. I saw him speak this evening and have a few opinions, but I would first like to know if anyone has any knowledge about him and his movement.
I just read about his ministry, and really like what i see, and hear and when that happens, I feel that that this will degenerate into an ugly thread.(I'll explain later)
I pray I'm wrong...be brave, what did you feel when you heard speak?
in Jesus, neil
Ive only seen that video "the bullhorn guy", and i don't have the same view on the scriptures as he does, he talks much about love, and i think hes right in we need to be more loving, but not at the expense of all the other truths in the bible, that was what i saw in that video....speak about love and not so much judgment and hell and the "negative" things....more on the love thing, i believe we should speak about love and scripture is clear about the importance of love, but we need to speak about the whole bible.... and judgment hell and everything else in there to... i like that man from the way of the master radio show who did a similar video :) i thought that one was a great reply to Rob Bell,
and don't know anything about his church, so i cant say anything, maybe hes got some good things to say and teach i don't know, but as always in these days we need to examine everything carefully, as i understand he is a part of the emerging church movement? i know that other guy that wrote that book "new kind of Christians" or what it was called, Brian Mcleared i think his name is, but anyhow i think they twist Scripture a bit in my point of view... but i know here are others whit more detailed info for you
anyhow pray for Rob Bell that God will use his life for Gods glory,
Hi, my ex Pastor as just got back from Bell's church and a tour of USA..He now seems to be changing his church to a more "emergent" scene like Bell's..
My friend asked me to read Bell's Velvet Elvis which i tried but didn't like,not for any doctrinal reason (i didn't read enough to find them)..Its considered a great book,but i found it all over the places style wise..
Bell's upset some people of late with some of His quotes..But to me He was throwing out ideas,more then calling Scripture into questions..
andy
Thanks for some of the responses. Yeah, bartle, I'd agree with you. I really liked some of the things I heard. His talk had a strong emphasis on social justice issues which I think are largely neglected by Christians. He made some really interesting points in favor of nonviolence that I am going to digest. Also, he is extremely knowledgeable about Jewish history and culture, and was able to really clearly paint the context in which Jesus was giving his parables.
A couple of things made me uncomfortable. He was asked a question about how sin, death, and hell can be reconciled with a loving God, and he basically threw up some smoke and mirrors. He said if we want to talk about hell, lets talk about hell on earth, and then began talking about things like Sudan, genocide, etc.
Another question was about universalism, and I was very unsatisfied with his response. He basically said that we can't really know, but that he knows the answer involves Jesus. Regarding the magnitudes who don't know Jesus, he emphasized how much God loves his creation, and said that he doesn't know what will happen.
I felt there was quite a lack of balance. Sometimes some of us can be out of balanced in the other way. I loved what he had to say about the Christian actually loving through our actions like Jesus did. But I get the impression that with this whole emergent church movement the focus is so strongly on social justice without giving proper heed to God's justice.
Bartle said he feared this thread would end up becoming ungodly and unproiftable. I think if i had of heard this question asked just a few weeks ago i might have sent this thread off in that direction. Since then however the Lord has humbled me and shown me that actually i do not have all thr truth, and there is a chance i can still get it wrong- it was quite a revelation to me at the time!
So in the light of that, i will be a little more gentle in what i am now about to say about Rob Bell's teaching (a few weeks ago i might have said something very strong about his teaching).
I really would like to warn people about his teaching, not because he does not say some true and good things but because of the emphasis of his teaching. In his book 'Velvit Elvis' he does challenge the fundamental, evangelical view of the Bible which has stood throughout all of church history. He is subtly (whether he means it or not) challenging its authority over our lifes because he is calling into question the view that there is actually one single correct interpretation of what a passage is saying.
He believes things are a bit more open to debate and not set in stone. He uses the illustration (in the book) of the orthadox evangelical fundamental approach to scripture. We (i say we because i am one of them) build up our doctrines one brick at a time, one on top of another rigidly. He challenges this because he says what if the Virgin birth were to be proven to be wrong, if that happened our entire faith would cruumble, he says. I say, yes it would, but thats the point! If that is not true nothing is true and lets eat, drink and be merry! Take out one brick and the house would fall down, but thats Christianity- it has to be all true doesn't it- or else what are we playing at!
I agree Rob Bell does give some wonderful insight into the background of the scriptures, especially in its jewish context. He is a very charming and inteligent man and he draws people, there is no doubt. However my great fears about his teaching is that it is all reactionary. It is a reaction against the dry, stuffy fundamental churches, of which he grew up in.
Another concern, is he is always wanting to say something so radical and new, (for example one of his revelations from Peter walking to Jesus on the sea is that 'we have always thought of Christianity as us having faith in Jesus', which he then turns on its head and says, 'but what about Jesus having faith in you'. He says Jesus calls you because he believes he sees something in you and believes you can become like Him. This turns all th emphasis onto us, and away from the Lord and as far as i see it does not exalt God and lead to the humbling of man- which is always a sign of a wrong doctrine.)
Its as though He want to teach something that you have never heard before, and for that matter nor has anyone else througout orthadox church history.
Paul Washer warns about people who say, 'i have found something new, everybody else up until now was wrong'. He says the test is not just is it scriptural, but has it always been taught throughout church history. I would encourage people to view Rob Bell's teaching in the context of Church History (as well as trhe scriptures of course) and then see what you think.
But i am very cautious about some of what he teaches, because i just think it is so unhelpful. I hope that helps.
George
Here4Him wrote:
Paul Washer warns about people who say, 'i have found something new, everybody else up until now was wrong'. He says the test is not just is it scriptural, but has it always been taught throughout church history. I would encourage people to view Rob Bell's teaching in the context of Church History (as well as trhe scriptures of course) and then see what you think.
The Meaning of The Cross by Paul Washer
https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/singlefile.php?lid=12885&commentView=itemComments
"We're rediscovering Christianity as an Eastern religion, as a way of life."—Rob Bell,
The point of the cross isn’t forgiveness. Forgiveness leads to something much bigger: restoration. God isn’t just interested in the covering over of our sins; God wants to make us into the people we were originally created to be. It’s not just the removal of what is being held against us; it is God pulling us into the people he originally had in mind when he made us…
It is one thing to be forgiven; it is another thing to become more and more and more and more the person God made you to be…
Salvation is the entire universe being brought back into harmony with its maker.-Rob Bell
I don't know if I like these quotes. If anyone knows what he was thinking when he said these that may help. But from these he seems to be into the seeker church, which is going totally against what the Holy Spirist wrote in Scripture.
Luke 3:16John answered them all, saying, "I baptize you with water, but he who is mightier than I is coming, the strap of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire. 17His winnowing fork is in his hand, to clear his threshing floor and to gather the wheat into his barn, but the chaff he will burn with unquenchable fire." 18So with many other exhortations he preached good news to the people. (ESV)
I just love that what John the Baptist was preaching in Chapter 3 the Holy Spirit says is good news
;-)
Here are some articles about Mr Bell.
[url=http://www.apprising.org/archives/rob_bell/index.html]Apprising Ministries
Here is a quote for us to think about
Velvet Elvis: Repainting the Christian Faith Charles Honey writes:
Rev. Rob Bell…the young pastor of Mars Hill Bible Church…Bell's first book…"Velvet Elvis: Repainting the Christian Faith," published by Zondervan, Bell presents a fresh picture of Jesus for those who have trouble with the traditional portrait… [b]The Bible itself, he writes, is a book that constantly must be wrestled with and re-interpreted.[b]He dismisses claims that "Scripture alone" will answer all questions. Bible interpretation is colored by historical context, the reader's bias and current realities, he argues.[b]"It is not possible to simply do what the Bible says," Bell writes. "We must first make decisions about what it means at this time, in this place, for these people."
An old pastor once said, "if it's true it's not new, and if it's new it's not true."
I am more concerned over his new book that will be coming out which speaks of sex as worship to God. Though this man may have many points that are good, I am reminded of a story my friend told me once.
In the days when he watched over sheep, he would need to kill one every so often for various reasons. He said that you could take a string and make a loop, and simply throw it over the head of the sheep, and pull it a little. The sheep would then think it was trapped, and would not even fight as you slit its throat.
The point is that much "new" theology is coming out under the banner of "I have a new revelation", and much of it is like the loop of string around the neck. Then satan moves in very slyly and kills what life was there.
It seems many today are attacking the very foundations of Historical Chrsitian teaching like Scripture Alone while siding with questionable allies.
I will take much flack for this, but it must be said - Rome is trying to reclaim what she lost during the Reformation. That is the sole purpose of The Council of Trent, and of Vatican 2. Rome hates that the Protestants use "sola scriptura"(scripture alone) as the Scriptures rebuke their traditions.
There is a new wave coming at us, a new volley of the cannons from the pit. This battle will be very difficult as many will come in the disguise of brethren. They will sound like a lamb, but have the horns of the beast.
Be aware brethren, and stick to the Bible, and the tried and true books of men and women of bygone eras. Study Church history and you would be amazed that these same lies keep coming just under different dresses.
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