Think and Grow Rich

WARNING! There is a real danger to your walk with God in reading this book. It is very easy to get off track in our walk with the Lord. I am posting this for the purpose of information only.

This book, written by Napoleon Hill, is probably one of the most significant pieces of literature affecting our society in the 20th century. It has flown under the radar of the Church in large part because we as Christians recognize that we cannot serve God and mammon. The book is however, required reading for management in most fortune 500 companies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Think_and_Grow_Rich

In this book, Hill describes his 7 imaginary spirit guides. He trusts these imaginary friends implicitely. They give him advice and inspiration. The secrets to success that Hill espouses were given to him by these "friends".

It is no great stretch to recognize that these friends are nothing less than demons. Understand then, that the world of big business has been taking advice from demons for years and years. Is it any wonder we see such ungodliness on TV, in advertising (more on this later) and in movies?

The ramifications of this are extensive. In the coming days and weeks I will be posting more about the far reaching affect this has had on our world and on the Church.

In His Love,

Doug

[edit]

Well Jim, that just about says it all :-(

While there may be a corelation between Hill's book and the heresy of word of faith teaching, the impact goes much MUCH deeper.

Picture if you will, a board room. At the head of this table sits our chief adversary. Around the table sit his demonic princes. They are having a brainstorming session...

The topic at hand, how can we poison the minds of the human race against God and His Son. Too many people are getting saved and we must do something to stop the flow!

One of the demons pipes up. "I saw some of my own doing a study, they took a single frame of one of their movies and replaced it with a picture of ice cold cola and a box of candy. At intermission the concession sales nearly doubled. It got me to thinking. What if we began to bombard the human race with subconcious images that will cause them to desire sin even more than they do now?

Brilliant...

They succeeded. The reality of todays world is that nearly every single piece of advertising that your eye takes in contains a subliminal message. At first the message consisted of a single word written as many places as possible on printed (magazines etc) advertising. That word was sex. This will be very uncomfortable to face. Many of you won't believe this. Some may even want to lash out at me in anger. This word is even printed across the forhead of Keith and Melody Green as they smile for the camera with thier fingers forming a cross. Please note!! I am NOT accusing the Greens of any sin or evil. Keith Green was a brother whose heart was after God. NO QUESTION! His music has ministered to me for years. Never the less, the printed covers of his albums still had this subliminal text implanted on it. This is just an example. It wouldn't matter which gospel artist's album you look at. This stuff was there in most if not all.

It is important here to get back to the book by Mr Hill. This subliminal advertising did not make its way into our world via mankinds brilliant notions. It got here because money is the root of all (much?) evil. Men who desired wealth read this book and began seeking demonic advice on how to increase thier sales. The subliminal ads that followed are one result.

So, Does this affect the church? You bet it does. Is there anyone out there who has not watched television or read magazines or looked at the cover of a Keith Green album? If the answer is no, then every single one of us has had some level of subliminal brain washing impact how we think.

This is a difficult subject. Maybe you begin to understand why I have been unwilling to this point to say anything. But I am compelled to begin to say what is in my understanding.

As I close this, I am reminded of my sign off "In His Love". There is nothing here that shows the tenderness and care I feel for you all. Please know that I am sincere when I say...

In His Love,

Doug

The following is a copy of a post from the "Pastoral Feedback" thread. After posting it I realized that it makes a good next chapter in this thread.

One of the main points that I want to find a way to communicate has to do with the believers worldview. The reason I began talking about the devil's use of subliminal messaging has to do with one of his main objectives. He understands that much of our effectiveness as Christians is derived from our level of intimacy with the Father. When Jesus died the scripture tells us that the veil in the temple was rent from top to bottom. Through Jesus sacrifice we now have access to the very Holy of Holies! Yet so many of todays Christians do not consistently enter into that holy place. Why? It is my assertion that one causal factor in this is the effectiveness of this subliminal brain washing of man. One of his purposes is to create a deep inner dis-ease. An inner voice that tells us that we do not measure up. We can only measure up if we are successful, or beautiful, or own nice things such as a new car or the latest fashions etc. he has had great success in his endeavors. We as a society are deeply dis-eased. Even those of us who were redeemed early in life have been exposed to this subteranean mental destruction. We read the word of God that says we have been made acceptable through Christ, yet our inner man doesn't really believe it.

Enough said for now. Thoughts and reactions anyone?

In His Love,

Doug

brethren
i am currently reading this book and am finding it pretty interesting. so far whatever i feel led to grasp i do so and discard whatever is of no use. i don't think it's a bad thing to be rich at all, however, our stewardship of what is God's is key here.

why do we want to be rich? for ourselves or to be used of God to tend to others?

how do we attain wealth? by unscrupulous means or honestly?

the problem with most saints and wealth and the disdain (sometimes) shown to wealthy people is because us as saints KNOW we would be out there acting crazy if we had a bunch of money. i was once that way but God has been cleansing that out of me for some time now in preparation for stewardship. i bless Him for it. i personally don't base my success on what i have, i don't have much. i have an old BMW which cost me a WHOLE lot less than what most people drive if that counts. i'm a car buff, i like reading up on what's new and all the technology and aesthetics which goes into the new cars etc. i have some cars i'd like to own but would not be devastated or diminished in any way shape or form if i never owned them.

indeed society has been infected with this need to prove something by what one has, hence people go into all kinds of debt to make a statement. this incidentally drives the economy by the way so much of what we think is prosperity is a front...but that's neither here nor there. the enemy is a master at pandering to our lusts, if you want to get some more info, google "the century of self" on google video.

speaking for myself, i'm not one who places my worth in anything on earth, my treasure is in heaven. i do know that God will give me great increase in wealth but He has shown me why, i'm a steward of His resources. that does come with perks of course such as provision for whatever i need and God will humour whatever i desire as long as it lines up with what He desires for me which is pretty cool.

Napoleon Hill was Christian was he not?

Napoleon Hill was Christian was he not?

My dear brother!!

Did you read the opening post on this thread?

Napoleon Hill was a demon possessed fool!

Just what do you think his 7 imaginary friends are? Angels?

Brother, I agree that some people are given a gift of generosity and wealth from the Lord, but if you try to use ANY, and I mean ANY of the methods Hill espouses you are risking your very salvation! WAKE UP!

Speaking the truth in love, not condemation,

Doug

Hi everyone. This may not seem related but I wanted to offer it as a gentle word of exhortation for us to consider.

It has to do with two things that I think I've begun to learn and retain:

[i]God tests us on the things He teaches us[/i]

[i]God tests us on the things we teach others[/i]

All grace and sufficiency be with your spirits in Jesus.

Hi Brethren,

I listened to the Juxtaposition of Carter Conlon and Joyce Meyers preachng. As we consider the spiritual darkness that seems to have frozen the American Church, and try to imagine what kind of 'miracle' it will take to thaw us from our ice age, from the coast to coast glacier that we are imprisoned in...consider this compliation the very kind of hot spring from heaven we need.

Although I have personally known many Christian friends and family members who felt the way Carter Conlon did in this sermon...it startles me to admit I have never once sat under a preacher...or even heard a preacher say anything close to this message. I am not talking of course about Sermon Index, or Sermon Audio resources...I am talking about the churches I have attended ever since I was a little boy.

Or should I say 'ziggarauts' I've attended.

Recently when I challenge the endless building programs of our churches I have been accused of judging. When I become teary over the lack of eternity in our churches I am accused of speaking from some personal hurt. When I turn down requests to play in praise bands (sic) I am suspected of not being a worshipper. When I say that church is not a community of believers and unbelievers alike but a communion of the saints in Christ, I am accused of not 'reaching out..."

In these days as the hour grows more desperate, I am amazed to witness that it grows more luxurious and decadent for the church. It is a baffling mystery to me. The two latest Barnum Polls reveal that in all points of character and conduct the evangelical church is absolutely no different then the world...except that Christians are statistically slightly more addicted to porn then the world...probably because many of us are too white washed to commit open adultery.

Perhaps some of us do say these things out of judgment or hurt...but not of our own and not on our behalf. Brethren, like many here, graced with a love for the Church, even the worldly churches we have grown up in... we turn our faces like flints towards heaven and occasionally create sparks of friction amidst our friends. Their offense is reasonable...afterall they knew us when we joined in their celebrations. By the waters of Babylon we sat... and celebrated.

I am only a mild person...admittedly filled with unbelieving fear and prideful self-consciousness. I can imagine if there was a bolder man here, there might actually be a flame to help thaw the church in these parts. This is why I am so thankful for preaching like Carter Conlon...how the Christian soul in America is starved and malnourished from a lack of such shepherding! Forgive my sharing here...it helps to tap out morse code in the darkness now and then and recieve a confirmation.

Inspite of my weakness, I am left with a conclusion that perhaps many teachers of the finer points of the law may disagree with...affluence corrupts the Church. Let's not be clever and argue that it's not money that is the root of evil, but our love of it...money supplies it's own love with carnal people. It is wise to mistrust it because it changes what ever it touches in excess. Baking Soda may say that it can touch vinegar without changing but that would be the Baking Soda speaking...soon after mixing with vinegar the Baking Soda would be changed into something else that sees the world in a whole new way. It wouldn't even remember it's former state of existence. So it is with Christians who think they are stronger then money.

"We can stand affliction better then we can prosperity, for in prosperity we forget God." Dwight Moody.

"When I have any money, I rid of it as quickly as possible, lest it find a way into my heart". John Wesley

MC

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=14488&forum=35]Zac Poonen [/url]

Interesting to find this thread at the same time of this recent message preached by Zac Poonen that I would heartedly recommened (There is a video linked in the above).

This will be very uncomfortable to face. Many of you won't believe this. Some may even want to lash out at me in anger. This word is even printed across the forhead of Keith and Melody Green as they smile for the camera with thier fingers forming a cross. Please note!! I am NOT accusing the Greens of any sin or evil. Keith Green was a brother whose heart was after God. NO QUESTION! His music has ministered to me for years. Never the less, the printed covers of his albums still had this subliminal text implanted on it. This is just an example. It wouldn't matter which gospel artist's album you look at. This stuff was there in most if not all.

MC, once again you have spoken the same heart cries ...

bro Doug
you may want to read this about him on wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon_Hill

i read the opening post and i have to ask, what makes you think that these friends of his were demons?how did you come to this conclusion? has God not given His angels charge over us and do they not work in our lives as they once did? or has God changed and so stopped this?

Napoleon Hill was a demon possessed fool!

that is a pretty harsh accusation. did Christ not say that to call a brother a fool is to risk being cast into the lake of fire? are you not also risking your salvation by using that word? or perhaps i am misapplying what Christ said?

Brother, I agree that some people are given a gift of generosity and wealth from the Lord, but if you try to use ANY, and I mean ANY of the methods Hill espouses you are risking your very salvation! WAKE UP!

such as first conceiving what you want to do, and focusing on it until it is done? then surely we all would be in such danger! do we not all set a goal and strive for it? or am i misreading you? does everything not start off as an idea, a concept which is then worked out moment by moment until it reaches fruition? is this not how God created? my only problem with such is if the concept is if it doesn't come from God Himself. Israel never gained wealth from it falling from the sky, they had to strive, God opened doors but they had to walk through.

bro Doug and all, i would ask though as i did in the first post:

why do we want wealth? for ourselves or for God's use?

do we gain wealth by shady means or honest?

bro Chris

ChrisJD wrote:
Hi everyone. This may not seem related but I wanted to offer it as a gentle word of exhortation for us to consider.

It has to do with two things that I think I've begun to learn and retain:

[i]God tests us on the things He teaches us[/i]

[i]God tests us on the things we teach others[/i]

All grace and sufficiency be with your spirits in Jesus.

He does indeed!

bro MC

I listened to the Juxtaposition of Carter Conlon and Joyce Meyers preachng. As we consider the spiritual darkness that seems to have frozen the American Church, and try to imagine what kind of 'miracle' it will take to thaw us from our ice age, from the coast to coast glacier that we are imprisoned in...consider this compliation the very kind of hot spring from heaven we need.

OUCH! much of the church is concerned with what is here and now in a manner which is completely unhealthy. We ought to be seeking the Kingdom (God's will) and all else would fall into place. For us to be thawed out of this fascination with the here and now, the here and now must be shattered before us in a way that there can be no leaning on it any more. only a slap from the hand of God can wake us now. the prophets have gone forth with the word of repentance which (as in times past) was largly ignored, the only thing left is judgment, but it always works.

Recently when I challenge the endless building programs of our churches I have been accused of judging. When I become teary over the lack of eternity in our churches I am accused of speaking from some personal hurt. When I turn down requests to play in praise bands (sic) I am suspected of not being a worshipper. When I say that church is not a community of believers and unbelievers alike but a communion of the saints in Christ, I am accused of not 'reaching out..."

you know, the organized Church has oft embarked on different programs (building or otherwise) which rather than make much of an impact about people's state in eternity, soothe the conscience. we ought to judge alright, if Holy Spirit is calling us to speak out, we ought to. to be concerned for eternity (or the lack of its preaching) is indeed for us who are concerned for eternity out of a personal hurt. For us to be so deeply concerned about eternity is to see it from God's own standpoint, it is personal for Him and so it is for us. To get us focused on eternity at this stage the only thing there is is the abasament of the present before our very eyes.

In these days as the hour grows more desperate, I am amazed to witness that it grows more luxurious and decadent for the church. It is a baffling mystery to me. The two latest Barnum Polls reveal that in all points of character and conduct the evangelical church is absolutely no different then the world...except that Christians are statistically slightly more addicted to porn then the world...probably because many of us are too white washed to commit open adultery.

indeed we as Christians have so much to be purged of. we expect and God does too, wickedness from the world, but in the Church, that is a frightful thing because it also gives occasion for the world to blaspheme and reject God because we're not acting right as His ambassadors.

Perhaps some of us do say these things out of judgment or hurt...but not of our own and not on our behalf. Brethren, like many here, graced with a love for the Church, even the worldly churches we have grown up in... we turn our faces like flints towards heaven and occasionally create sparks of friction amidst our friends. Their offense is reasonable...afterall they knew us when we joined in their celebrations. By the waters of Babylon we sat... and celebrated.

yes but now God has gotten hold of us and we see as He sees and weep and mourn. unless God so quickens those around us in the same way, they aren't going to see it. this is a tragedy of our situation, we don't even know we need to be saved unless God quickens us to it...

I am only a mild person...admittedly filled with unbelieving fear and prideful self-consciousness. I can imagine if there was a bolder man here, there might actually be a flame to help thaw the church in these parts. This is why I am so thankful for preaching like Carter Conlon...how the Christian soul in America is starved and malnourished from a lack of such shepherding! Forgive my sharing here...it helps to tap out morse code in the darkness now and then and recieve a confirmation.

i see an unlikely candidate for His use in you! Perfect! i feel the same but God will set us on fire in His time.

Inspite of my weakness, I am left with a conclusion that perhaps many teachers of the finer points of the law may disagree with...affluence corrupts the Church. Let's not be clever and argue that it's not money that is the root of evil, but our love of it...money supplies it's own love with carnal people. It is wise to mistrust it because it changes what ever it touches in excess. Baking Soda may say that it can touch vinegar without changing but that would be the Baking Soda speaking...soon after mixing with vinegar the Baking Soda would be changed into something else that sees the world in a whole new way. It wouldn't even remember it's former state of existence. So it is with Christians who think they are stronger then money

i still feel though that money is neutral and can't corrupt anyone unless it is inherent in that person to be so corrupted by money. Money only amplifies what one already is. with some saints who know what they are should be rightly wary of money because they will act out once they get hold of a big chunk of it. Obviously we all need money else we wouldn't work.

on the first quote from Dwight Moody:
indeed, i believe this is why the early Church didn't have much by way of wealth but shared whatever little they had and God honored it for they wanted not for anything.

on the second one from Wesley, this is where God is taking me, to stewardship and the giving out of wealth to the saints in need. God has long been purging me of my fleshly lusts for things and you don't know how much crap you have until it's time for purging...i bless God for His preparing me for such.

Ironman,

This is the first passage of scripture the Lord gave me to read today. I was not thinking of you when I turned to it, neither am I familiar enough with this book to know ahead of time what it would say. I stand behind my statements. The pope thinks he's a Christian too. I have done my duty to you before the Lord. I truly hope you get some discernment before it is too late and you have opened yourself up to spiritual forces of deception. Arguing the point is pointless.

The Watchman and His Message

Ezekial 33:1-11 Again the word of the Lord came to me, saying, 2 "Son of man, speak to the children of your people, and say to them: 'When I bring the sword upon a land, and the people of the land take a man from their territory and make him their watchman, 3 when he sees the sword coming upon the land, if he blows the trumpet and warns the people, 4 then whoever hears the sound of the trumpet and does not take warning, if the sword comes and takes him away, his blood shall be on his own head. 5 He heard the sound of the trumpet, but did not take warning; his blood shall be upon himself. But he who takes warning will save his life. 6 But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, and the people are not warned, and the sword comes and takes any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at the watchman's hand.'
7 "So you, son of man: I have made you a watchman for the house of Israel; therefore you shall hear a word from My mouth and warn them for Me. 8 When I say to the wicked, 'O wicked man, you shall surely die!' and you do not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at your hand. 9 Nevertheless if you warn the wicked to turn from his way, and he does not turn from his way, he shall die in his iniquity; but you have delivered your soul.
10 "Therefore you, O son of man, say to the house of Israel: 'Thus you say, "If our transgressions and our sins lie upon us, and we pine away in them, how can we then live?"' 11 Say to them: 'As I live,' says the Lord God, 'I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live. Turn, turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?'

In Christ,

Doug

There is a reason that I posted what I posted. In war, and we are at war, it is important to understand the tactics of your enemy. Finding the means to communicate the depth of what I need to say regarding this area is taking some time. I ask for your patience before drawing conclusions and calling me a sensationalist. Take a step back, please!

A major goal of the devil is to create a deep sense of insecurity in the inner man of every man, woman and child on this planet. The subliminal advertising is one of his major methods. he is succeeding. The level of societal neuroticism today is staggering! Can we not recognize that our culture is going over the edge as compared to let's say the 50's?

Keith Green (yes, that Keith Green) wrote a song titled "No one believes in me anymore". It was written as though the devil himself were exulting in our lack of discernment.

Believe me brethren. I did not want to start this thread. I have recognized this since the early 80's and have resisted being obedient in communicating it ever since. But the word He gave me out of Isaiah 62 is "I can no longer hold my peace."

Soon I will get back to adding another "chapter" to this thread, I hope the application to us as Christians will begin to get a little clearer at that time.

In His Love,

Doug

bro Doug
ok then, i will read it for myself and see for myself. i asked some direct questions of you which you didn't respond to and i hope you do if God leads. at any rate it has been made clear to me by God what this wealth is for and with that in mind, i'll do what He has asked me to do.

what is it exactly do you think i should be wary of in terms of being deceived?

have you considered maybe you may be deceived perhaps?

not being combative but trying to get at what exactly has you so concerned.