Any Brother who says he is without Sin is a What?

"HE is faithful to complete the Work HE has begun in you ."......

I am confused about some of the positional truths in the epistles will someone educate me ? I have been to Bible school that made me academic. I have asked church leaders and they are confrontive or clueless. Where are the fathers in the faith to disciple and encourage? . Is it OK to come to the conclusion that we just dont Know?....It drives me to read my bible and pray everyday..Is this a generation of the Blind leading the Blind? I have heard alot about these topics from Godly people but they all have something different to say.I can see the fruit in all of thier lives but they all interpret these differently.I was raised Baptist,recommited my life at a calvinistic church ,went to a fundemental baptist seminary and I know serve at a Calvary Chapel (pentecostal).I have grown in my walk with Jesus thru them all.Trust me it was and is a Breaking process.My question is can a believer really live a completely "SET APART " Life and still sin? I know Pauls struggle," Revenhill once siad to my father in law that "if you "deep down" WANT to Love Jesus More then you do now then you are Saved." I am young and seeking Godly counsel if your not walking with Jesus please do not confuse the Issue with many Idle words.The truth is if you cant teach it to where a child can understand you most likely dont know what your saying.

Great.Sorry I am new to this.

Any brother who says he is without sin is a sinner... that's in 1 John.

He is faithful to complete the work He has begun in you... I think the main question for American Christians is 'has {He} begun a work in you?'

I've been listening to a lot of Paul Washer recently, there are nearly 100 of his sermons on this site. He's in his prime now, he spent years as a missionary in Peru, and around the world.

If you like Leonard Ravenhill then you'll like brother Washer, he sat at the feet of Ravenhill, he reads his bible for the answers... he yearns to be closer to God -but is bluntly frank about his sin and how far we are from the way God wants us to be.

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/viewcat.php?cid=442] Paul Washer Sermons[/url]

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/singlefile.php?lid=12877&commentView=itemComments]What's Wrong With American Christianity[/url]
[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/singlefile.php?lid=12878&commentView=itemComments]What is the Grace of the Gospel?[/url]
[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/singlefile.php?lid=12879&commentView=itemComments]How Can You Have Assurance?[/url]
[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/singlefile.php?lid=12880&commentView=itemComments]The Holiness of God[/url]
[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/singlefile.php?lid=12881&commentView=itemComments]Practical Holiness[/url]

Plus besides his affinity for Leonard Ravenhill, Paul also has a strong affinity of Keith Green and AW Tozer... and he's a Southern Baptist, and a missionary = currently my favorite preacher.

Ian, how do you fill in this blank?

Anyone who says that the blood of Christ cleanses them from [b]all[/b] sin is a _____.

Hi Blunt,

I am young and seeking Godly counsel if your not walking with Jesus please do not confuse the Issue with many Idle words.The truth is if you cant teach it to where a child can understand you most likely dont know what your saying.

My simple advice would be- strive to walk in the Spirit that you may be like Jesus Christ. This is all the holiness you and I can ever possibly hope to attain. Anything else is earthly at best and demonic at worst. It is not about a lot of the silly things we often think it is that puffs one up against another in the name of humility. It is simply being like Jesus.

As far as you are from Jesus Christ is as far as you are from perfection. He is the 'Canon'- He is the measuring rule. Not Finney, No Moody, Not Ravenhill, Not Edwards, Poonen or any of these people as wonderful as their testimonies may have been. It is Jesus Christ [i]alone[/i]. We have to drill that into our heads or we will seek some holiness out in 'lah lah' land some place that has no biblical precedent whatsoever; a grasping after the wind. Yet, the fruit of the Spirit in harmony- that is Holiness. Like light into a prism breaks out from white to colors so also is holiness into the fruit of the Spirit. We need to be FULL of the Holy Ghost and walk in the Spirit. That is what we are called to do.

God Bless,

-Robert

Right on. Jesus did say Strive to enter thru the Narrow gate, But Heb 4 says for me to rest. So do I strive to rest?

Welcome Blunt,

I believe you have come to the right place.

Is it OK to come to the conclusion that we just dont Know?....

In many instances ... would encourage it! In many others it is only a matter of time if we are in diligent pursuit that we find this, Leonard Ravenhill expressed as much toward the end of his life in the proverbial [i]The more I know the more I realize how much I do not know[/i](Paraphrased).

But more specifically, the 'positional truth's' are often discussed here in great length and great breadth, many sermons of a variety of perspective and articles as well. All that may either add to the confusion or be a great blessing to glean from, pray it is the later.

I have grown in my walk with Jesus thru them all.

My question is can a believer really live a completely "SET APART " Life and still sin?

If I may turn it around a bit ...
Can we live [i]today[/i] completely set apart?

Where I think we cause ourselves more undo harm and have already been rebuked for it is in;

[i]Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?

Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.[/i]

Casting off to the future by worries and anxiety, even whether or not we 'can' or will 'sin' in the future ... Today is enough of it's own trouble and today is enough of an opportunity to walk after the spirit.

Good word !
Thanks for the encouragement.

It sounds like you guys have learned to listen ,trust me its refreshing.

Parsly,

John 1:8-10

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

I'm not a big fan of 'Christian Perfection.' Since this is a thread for encourating our new friend here, let's stick away from arguing a topic like this in front of him.

I have heard alot about these topics from Godly people but they all have something different to say.I can see the fruit in all of thier lives but they all interpret these differently.

Years ago my phone was disconnected. The Holy Spirit told me to leave it off and learn to listen to him. I couldn't call my friends and therefore couldn't hear the six or seven counsel me with their wisdom. I would spend hours reading my bible and praying. I was basically handfed by the Spirit in the bible which is God's word. I was hugely blessed by this,beyond measure, running down you might say.

1 John 1:

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

I see these Scriptures to be speaking of our carnal man. We live in corruption now, but in the ressurection we will recieve the perfection that was promise to Abraham and his Seed.

This teaching by John has little to do with "positional theology." It has to do with real life experiencies brought by the washing of His word in our lives. Those who say we are now prefected in Christ and say that they have "attained' perfection in this life do not have the word of God in them. For if the word was in them, they would be experiencing...

Hbr 4:12 For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

The power of His word sanctifying us, showing us the thoughts and intents of our heart, will demonstrate to us our corruption always. But as we submit to His teaching us day by day...

He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

In Christ
Jeff

Paul teaches about this in 1 Corinthians 11:

27 Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks this cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of the body and *blood of the Lord. 28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For he who eats and drinks *in an unworthy manner eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the *Lord's body. 30 For this reason many are weak and sick among you, and many sleep. 31 For if we would judge ourselves, we would not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are chastened by the Lord, that we may not be condemned with the world.

There is a need for those who abide in Christ to consider the above teaching very carefully.

What do the Scriptures say?

In Christ
Jeff

I think Hebrews 4 also says, "Strive to enter" that rest.

Ephesians 6 says, "Put on the whole armour that you may be able to withstand" (first) and then to "Stand" (second).

Once you have entered all striving ceases.

Our position in Christ, according to Ephesians is that we are "seated in heavenly places in Him". When you are seated are you striving, or at rest?

Just some thoughts,

Kerry

rookie: 1 John was written by John for the Christian church, not for carnal people... I really recommend that you listen to the Paul Washer sermons listed here, he goes into great detail on this.

Brother Ian suggested Paul Washer as a source of enlightenment concerning carnal people or carnal christians...

I don't know about Paul Washer but I do know what Paul of the Bible teaches in Scripture...

1Cor. 3:1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. 2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. 3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? 4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?

Also once again, Paul teaches about the reason of communion...

1 Corinthians 11:

1Cor. 11:27 Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks this cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. 28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy manner eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body. 30 For this reason many are weak and sick among you, and many sleep. 31 For if we would judge ourselves, we would not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are chastened by the Lord, that we may not be condemned with the world.

In terms of sin, we all are corrupt until the day we are made perfect by Him at ressurection.

What does Scripture say?

In Christ
Jeff

In terms of sin, we all are corrupt until the day we are made perfect by Him at ressurection.

What does Scripture say?

2Cor. 9:8 (KJVS) And [b]God is able[/b] to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work:

Eph. 3:20 (KJVS) Now unto [b]him that is able[/b] to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us,

Phil. 3:21 (KJVS) Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby [b]he is able[/b] even to subdue all things unto himself.

2Tim. 1:12 (KJVS) For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that [b]he is able[/b] to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.

Heb. 2:18 (KJVS) For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, [b]he is able[/b] to succour them that are tempted.

Heb. 7:25 (KJVS) Wherefore [b]he is able[/b] also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

Jude 24 (KJVS) Now unto [b]him that is able[/b] to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, If we are condemned to the corruption of sin until the resurrection we have serious case of misrepresentation in these verses. Incidentally each one of these verses uses a cognate of 'dunamis' which is translated 'able'. It all links with the great promise of the New Covenant...“But [b]you shall receive power[/b] when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; [b]and you shall be witnesses to Me[/b] in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.”” (Acts 1:8 NKJV)

In terms of sin, we all are corrupt until the day we are made perfect by Him at resurrection.

I love this quote from Reader Harris, a English barrister and preacher from the mid-20th century: "The proper field for discussion is not whether or not any individual Christian lives unintermittently without committing sin. That is a matter between his own conscience and God and he is not called upon to give account of himself in this respect to him fellowmen. [b]What we ought to discuss is this: Has God made or has He not made an adequate provision for complete deliverance in this life from any sin? To argue that God has made an adequate provision, but that, for some reason or other, no Christian ever receives the benefit of it, is really to prove that it is inadequate and therefore useless.[/b]

Thank God we have a powerful Saviour, who is able to save to the uttermost.

[i]This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.[/i]

Still recall Charles Stanely expounding on this matter many years ago. In essence his argument was "Can you go an hour without sinning? Half a day? All day? Ten minutes? Why, sure you can!"

Perhaps it's the object of our concentration and focus that keeps us preoccupied with tomorrows problems today and yesterdays failures presently. The memory is not dissolved and the Holy Spirit is faithful to bring every needed nuiance to bear upon us if ...

[i]To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts[/i]

[i]That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; And be renewed in the spirit of your mind[/i]

[i]Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ[/i]

[i]Looking unto Jesus[/i]

[i]But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost, Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life[/i]

[i]If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry: For which things’ sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience: In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.[/i]

[i]But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth. Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds; And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him: Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering; Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye. And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness. And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.[/i]

Put off put on.

Well it certainly doesn't say that. What a pathetic Saviour this would be. This is my Saviour...

Thanks for sharing this Ron. The emphasis is clearly on Christ being able to save. I think where we get in trouble is when we place the emphasis unnecessarily on ourselves. We need His strength to live victorious lives in this fallen world.

Mike's: Perhaps it's the object of our concentration and focus that keeps us preoccupied with tomorrows problems today and yesterdays failures presently. The memory is not dissolved and the Holy Spirit is faithful to bring every needed nuiance to bear upon us if ...

One thing I have always struggled with is keeping a log of days between stumblings. Just being honest. Almost like being on a roll for a while and then tripping at some point. So much of my measure of joy and victory has been by this model alone. I have needed to stop that and just abide in Him where my strength is and stop trying to boast in the calendar days of victory over some besetting sin. Talk about a roller coaster ride!