All Israel Will Be Saved?

The other thread about Israel brought this question to mind, will all of Israel be saved?

Ro 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Will what this verse says literally happen?

Jordan

Will what this verse says literally happen?

This question is similar to questions that surround the coming of the Lord. There are two ways to answer the question, I think. One is a 'future' YES and one is a present day 'YES'. In like manor the Lord is coming for His Saints with ten thousands of His Saints, etc. This is a future event. But the Lord comes for Saints every hour of every day. For all that have died in Christ- the day of their death He 'came for them'.

Putting off the salvation of Jews to the future is for me a most terrible concept. I may not be a missionary to the Jews, but as each of us do in life, we encounter Jews just as we do non-Jews. Jews are both ethnic and religious. Some will argue this point- but this has always been the case. Paul was a 'Hebrew among Hebrews' and technically and arguable had a more pure ancestry than our Lord; as Ruth was in our Lord's bloodline. She was a Moabite (See Matthew 1:5). There has been some assimilation. But they have guarded their culture and heritage.

If any Jew is to be saved it will be through [i]the Door[/i] as coming in any other way is to be a thief and a robber. You will notice that some preaching in Acts is directed at folks as sinners. Many had no real trouble believing in and receiving Jesus Christ. They just did not want to turn away from their sins. For the Jews, in many ways, it was the opposite. The preaching was to the end that they might believe on Jesus Christ. This would mean to cease salvation by the works of the law and to receive the Holy Spirit by faith.

The trouble is that many are locked up in Rabbinic Judaism. This is the religion of the Pharisees twice over. When Ezra began to read the Law and attempt to bring the people under the Law a trend was started among the Jews that few realize. Some historians date his death as essentially the end of the prophets in Israel until John Baptist. But if you read Ezra several things happened in response to simply trying to 'line up' with the Law- whereas we would expect that the people would have sought out a prophetic word from God for direction. Instead, they went to the book and devised their own plans and oaths.

Ezra is a hero among heroes to the Rabbinic Jews. They attribute more things to him than we can list in a short post. He is praised for his stand against the newly formed Sadducees and is said to have written the entire Old Testament out from memory. This likely adds weight to their teaching that the Moral Law was passed down orally and was later written down. To this day many Rabbinic Jews consider STUDY of the scriptures as the highest form of worship. It all seems very noble? Right? Not so fast. They came to the place where they would not receive any prophetic revelation from God. Their attitude became one in which they, the Rabbi's, reserved the right to interpret everything from dreams to visions. They could over-rule a Prophet. As far as they were concerned- the authority was [url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/articles/index.php?view=article&aid=1959]NOT IN HEAVEN[/url], it was their alone as received from Moses. And being able to prove a false doctrine from scripture exegetically, they userped God's authority and right to interpret His own Word.

So the Rabbi's are in authority and they look to the Talmudic writings for answers. In their belief, God already gave the Torah to the Jewish people on Mount Sinai and they no longer pay attention to a heavenly voices that attempted to intervene in matters of [i]Halakhah[/i] (application of the word to peoples lives). God already wrote in the Torah at Mount Sinai (Exodus 23:2), so for their interpretation- “After the majority to incline.” From this verse they propose that Halakhic disputes must be resolved by majority vote of the Rabbis. God could not contradict His own decision to allow Torah questions to be decided by free debate and majority vote. This is why it is so difficult to reach a Jew. They look almost completely to the Rabbi as THE authority.

The only real hope, I believe, for a Jew to come to know Christ is for them to know the true presence of God as He is manifest among believing Christians or sovereignly (as with Paul) experiencing God- manifest (A theophanic manifestation). Some are confused and want to believe but the have been taught against Christ since they were Children. They see the Cross as a sword dipped in hundreds of years of Jewish blood. On and on and on. This is because of so much antisemitism over the years- especially some of the early church fathers.

This is not even a decent introduction to an introduction to the issues involved. But hopefully it sheds some light to get things started. Jews have to be saved just like everyone else. To reach them almost requires that we examine the host of issues involved to even get our head around where they are coming from. They so easily write Christians off. We have to study if we are serious about reaching them...

In a nutshell, all does mean ALL.

So, yes, Paul teaches that eventually, all of those who are part of the nation of Israel will come to salvation. This is confirmed also the closing chapters of Zechariah, where Israel is brought through a time of burning. Those who survive the redemptive judgments God brings upon them through will find salvation. Just as the prophet Isaiah also said, "Then [b]all[/b] your people will be righteous; they will possess the land forever, the branch of My planting, the work of My hands, that I might be glorified." (Isaiah 60:21)

Also just a note, the apostle Paul argues that the spiritual value of the eventual conversion of all the Jews will be so great that it will bring about the resurrection of the dead at the end of the age (Romans 11:12-15). Why? For if their rejection of the gospel brought about the blessing of the gospel being spread to all the Gentile nations, then their acceptance of the gospel will be a greater blessing than their rejection! So much so as to bring about life to the dead!

I highly recommend the teachings of Art Katz concerning these things- which are available on this site. He has many sermons on this very issue. Though I don't know if it is a great place to start, consider listening to his 2 part session on "Romans 11" from the 2006 Prophetical school, where he goes through much of this stuff verse by verse.

Ro 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

but before this Paul says:

For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
Romans 9:6-8 (KJV)

and

Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved
Romans 9:27 (KJV)

HomeFree89 wrote:
Ro 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Will what this verse says literally happen?

Perhaps listening to this may help:
[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=14171]Men's Hatred of God - Part 1[/url] and [url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=14172]Part 2[/url]

This is part of Ben Israel's 2006 Prophetic School, which can be found in its entirety under [url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/viewcat.php?cid=173]Art Katz[/url]. Reggie Kelly brings some particularly sharp insight into Romans 9-11, taking into consideration the Old Testament Prophetic texts.

Rom 9:6 ¶ Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel:

All Israel shall be saved, which are not of Israel but the Israel of God, which the Word of God has taken effect. Huh!!!???

So who of Israel are the all?

Rom 9:6 ¶ Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Rom 9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, [are they] all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

Rom 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these [are] not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Rom 9:9 For this [is] the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sara shall have a son.

Rom 9:10 And not only [this]; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, [even] by our father Isaac;

Rom 9:11 (For [the children] being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)

Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

Rom 2:29 But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.

So all is not all?

Rom 9:11 (For [the children] being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)

In Christ: Phillip

GrannieAnnie wrote:
In Hermeneutics class, we were taught, there is a time to not spiritualize Scripture .... When there are so many proof texts cross-referenced to prove a literal translation ... spiritualizing is not appropriate, especially in changing or forming new doctrines. As just for one belief, off the top of my head - the Oneness doctrine.

Spiritualising is not a bad thing, in itself, as long as it doesn't [b]replace[/b] the plain reading of Scripture, but rather enhances it. J Jacob Prasch teaches much on Jewish Hermeneutics, or Midrash. The summary of this, is that the Jews would read the verse plainly, but then look into the allegoric implications of the plain statement, in order to understand the depth of the statement.

Understanding this concept can be helpful in understanding prophetic literature, in that successive fulfillments occur, each being more and more precisely matching the ultimate fulfilment. Because of this, events such as Israel's return to their land under Nehemiah and again in 1948, serve as a shadow of an ultimate return, when the "Law shall go forth out of Zion", and "they shall beat their swords into ploughshares" and "learn war no more". This component of their return is as yet unfulfilled, and therefore there must be an ultimate fulfilment to come, after a later diaspora.

Each successive "fulfilment" gives us some insight into the final one, even when we look prior to the prophetic statement, to Abraham and later Jacob's sojourn into Egypt, departing to journey toward Canaan, we can grasp subtle details which the prophets merely allude to. Even from here, we can see something of our own sojourning through the world, as a type of a future Time of Jacob's Trouble, leading to the restoration of the ultimate God's chosen people.

Christinyou wrote:
Rom 9:6 ¶ Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel:

All Israel shall be saved, which are not of Israel but the Israel of God, which the Word of God has taken effect. Huh!!!???

So who of Israel are the all?

....

So all is not all?

Rom 9:11 (For [the children] being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)

I must say, Phillip that I am often finding myself a little confused after reading your posts. I'm sure the same can occur when people read my long winded ramblings, but nevertheless, this is yours I am commenting on, now.

You have said, "all is not all", which one can read as either their will be some that are not included, but for some reason "all" is still used; Israel has been replaced by the church; only those who are left standing will be saved. I personally believe the latter.

Jordan has brought us one verse of the Epistle to the Romans, which is preceded by:

[b]22[/b] Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in [i]his[/i] goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
[b]23[/b] And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
[b]24[/b] For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural [i]branches[/i], be graffed into their own olive tree?
[b]25[/b] For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
[b]26[/b] And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
[b]Rom 11:22-26[/b]

It would seem that Paul is pointing our attention to a future time, when Israel is grated back into God's vine. Obviously there will be Jews that are being born again before this ultimate re-grafting, just as Gentiles like Rahab and Ruth were "grafted in" during the old covenant. God is not, and never has been, the respecter of persons, however it would appear that for some reason He has chosen to demonstrate something to the world, and its principalities and power, through the chastening of Israel, and the restoration of a remnant. Just as He hardened Pharaoh's heart, prior to the Exodus, so He has and will continue to harden the hearts of the Jews. Could it be the the "all Israel" are those that are still alive when this event occurs?

Consider also Isaiah's words:

[b]1[/b] Thus saith the LORD, The heaven [i]is[/i] my throne, and the earth is my footstool: where is the house that ye build unto me? and where is the place of my rest?
[b]2[/b] For all those [i]things[/i] hath mine hand made, and all those [i]things[/i] have been, saith the LORD: but [u]to this man will I look, [i]even[/i] to [i]him that is[/i] poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.[/u]
[b]3[/b] He that killeth an ox is as [i]if[/i] he slew a man; he that sacrificeth a lamb, [/i]as if[/i] he cut off a dog’s neck; he that offereth an oblation, [i]as if he offered[/i] swine’s blood; he that burneth incense, [i]as if[/i] he blessed an idol. Yea, they have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations.
[b]4[/b] [u]I also will choose their delusions[/u], and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose [i]that[/i] in which I delighted not.
[b]5[/b] Hear the word of the LORD, ye that tremble at his word; Your brethren that hated you, that cast you out for my name’s sake, said, Let the LORD be glorified: but he shall appear to your joy, and they shall be ashamed.
[b]6[/b] A voice of noise from the city, a voice from the temple, a voice of the LORD that rendereth recompence to his enemies.
[b]7[/b] Before she travailed, she brought forth; before her pain came, she was delivered of a man child.
[b]8[/b] Who hath heard such a thing? who hath seen such things? [u]Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? [i]or[/i] shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children[/u].
[b]9[/b] Shall I bring to the birth, and not cause to bring forth? saith the LORD: shall I cause to bring forth, and shut [i]the womb[/i]? saith thy God.
[b]10[/b] Rejoice ye with Jerusalem, and be glad with her, all ye that love her: rejoice for joy with her, all ye that mourn for her:
[b]11[/b] That ye may suck, and be satisfied with the breasts of her consolations; that ye may milk out, and be delighted with the abundance of her glory.
[b]12[/b] For thus saith the LORD, Behold, [u]I will extend peace to her like a river, and the glory of the Gentiles like a flowing stream: then shall ye suck[/u], ye shall be borne upon [i]her[/i] sides, and be dandled upon [i]her[/i] knees.
[b]13[/b] As one whom his mother comforteth, so will I comfort you; and [i]ye shall be comforted in Jerusalem.[/i]
[b]Is 66:1-13[/b]

Could it be that God is saying that He will literally birth the remainder of Israel in one day? Art and Reggie, in the sermon that I posted earlier, suggest that Israel shall be saved prior to their repentance, and that their repentance shall spring forth out of the mercy that has been shown to them, by God in their restoration. If this is the case, then indeed "all is not all", for prior to this occurring, two out of three of the nation of Israel around the globe (presently approx 15,000,000 people) shall perish. Obviously those shall not be saved, in spite of "all" else being saved.

In a nutshell, all does mean ALL.

If "all Israel" shall be saved, and I believe it, what can "Israel" mean? Does this mean every single individual of the genes of Abraham who are alive at this point will be saved? If "Israel" means the 'covenant people' then the verse is easily understood, if it means 'all descendants of Abraham' I have no idea what it could mean.

brethren
Greetings in Christ's name by whose Blood we are saved. AMEN.

i think it is necessary to note that Paul also said that not all who are Israel are Abraham's seed. i think it was mentioned earlier that there is the prophecy of Zechariah in which 2/3 of Israel will be cut off and the remainder will be purified and saved. Perhaps all of Israel doesn't mean every Jew but rather every Jew who is elected for salvation just as we were elected before the setting of the foundation of the earth.

something to consider perhaps?

Grace and Peace to you all in Christ. AMEN.