Hi can anyone tell me if theres such a thing as a Messianic Study Bible? I'm looking for one that follows the same kind of teaching of Art Katz's or at least similar etc..If not,what study bible of the present crop would be the most sympathetic
cheers andy
Hi again Andy, hope you got my last post to you last week.
I would email benisrael on that question because I know quite a few Messianic sites because I sort of lean that way too ... but few are as on target as Art was.
I don't think his website will stop though.
I hesitate to tell you which to avoid, because someone may take offense. Hmmm. Hard question to answer but I think Robert or Aaron or some others would be good ones to answer here.
It's just a 'tricky' thing for me to answer, having hung around these type sites back when.
Those connected with the Apologetic Coordination Team (ACT) would be safe enough.
Just be careful when others spiritualize verses without "Cross-referencing" or without doing literal/grammatical first.
Love to you !!!
Hope yer well.
Annie
Hi Annie thks for the reply..I guess every book or even bible translation is going to be bias to the writer or committee.
Personally i have heard a lot of sermons by Art,which really effected me,and that's why i want the study to reflect that.I feel he preached the truth about the end and i want the notes to educate me more..
So i'm presuming a study by a reformist wouldn't ie Sproul or MacArthur etc :-P
Thks for ur reply to my other thread
GB
andy
I haven't read it yet, but my family has one called "The Knowing Jesus Study Bible" It's a one-year study type of Bible. The version we have is NIV(I don't know if it is the only version).
Hi can anyone tell me if theres such a thing as a Messianic Study Bible? I'm looking for one that follows the same kind of teaching of Art Katz's or at least similar etc..If not,what study bible of the present crop would be the most sympathetic
I think Art Katz's teaching is unique and I work in the christian bookshop. Maybe the Ben israel foundation could produce one.
There is a bible by David Stern
[url=http://www.messianicjewish.net/cgi-bin/webstore/quikstore.cgi?category=JNTP_bibles&page=webstore.html&search=yes]Messianic Jewish Bible
but I would rather listen to Art Katz's teachings
Hi,
David H Stern also has a Jewish Commentary on the whole bible.
It is an average comementary but is worth a look.
You may be interested in the works of Alfred Ederseim who has dug deep in to the ancient and long forgotten customs of the bibliacl past.
John Gill's bible commentary may als help a persom who would like this type of commentary.
Alterantively, you could learn the Middoth of Rabbi Hillel which will give you a greater understanding of Midrashic interpretation.
If I may give a word of warning, please don't think that this type of understanding is superior to traditional understandings. Pride can easily set in without knowing it. We can be moved from the place of discipleship into the position of a Pharissee very quickly.
Hope this has helped.
Rhys
Hi thks for the replies i didn't realize that Stern had done a commentary cheers..
As far as midrash i'm not really thinking in that area,just wanted a study bible that reflected Arts teaching or similar about end times etc.I know a little about the midrash i know Jacob from moriel,as mentioned Jesus would of learned and taught using midrash etc, but i think he goes a few steps to far with its importances..
andy
Agree,
I know Jacob very well and his use of Midrash is sometimes unbiblical as he tends to descend into Kabbalah, and often opposes the practices that he himself is cuaght up in.
Many people who use Midrash tend to use it to promote thier own pet doctrines. Of course there is a simple interpretaion of the scriptures that can be learned by any Christian.
The Lord Jesus gave us the key to understand all from Genesis to Revelation. He taught us saying, "They speak of Me"
Rhys
Hi Rhys let me say i like Jacob i think hes very solid,i just think he tends towards midrash is the best way to understand the bible,as does my veryyyyy solid messianic friend..Ive never heard him utter a word about kabblalah..
andy
Hi,
I'm sorry if you misunderstood me.....he does not teach Kabbalah. However, some of his interpretation falls into that field. You have to understand that Kabbalah came from the mystical interpretations and priciples that can be found in the Midoth. Hillel, formed a methodology of 11 priciples. This soon became, I believe, upto one hundred priciples.
When a Jew, or anyone else is born from above he will be enlightend by Christ himself.
Thank God we do not have to rely on text books written by men to understand a book given to babes.
Also it is interesting to note from scripture that the grandson of Rabbi Hillel was Gamaliel, Acts 5. Paul was taught by Gamaliel. It was Gamaliel with the others that had the apostles beaten for preaching Christ.
Sometimes, people can be so overcome with the methodology of interpreation that they miss what the Spirit is saying. Gamaliel was such a man. Paul, the Christian, or Messianic believer, which ever you prefer to call him, reckons all his midrashic learning to be dung.
Please pursue, what you feel is the path that will give you a greater understanding of Christ.
If the Midoth can enlighten you then you are blessed.
A messianic writer that I know will encourage you as to knowlege, is Arnold Fruchtenbaum, Ariel Ministries.
Rhys
I think the BESTEST way to have a Study Bible, is to download the WHOLE of www.e-sword.net .
It's got two books that go under the 'extras', (I think that's the category on the site) THE LIFE AND TIMES OF JESUS THE MESSIAH by Alfred Edersheim, D. D., Ph. D. and his other The Temple - Its Ministry and Service.
He's excellent. He's Messianic too. He's not to keen on Midrash neither. Neither am I for the reason I gave in my first post. Spiritualizing 'far' too much, is the tendency when they use all 14 steps. That was the "method" used to write the Talmud.
When folks say that Jesus and Paul used Midrash, I get a little bothered, because they spoke directly from God and didn't need a "method".
Part of the 14 steps are O.K., but again, too much spiritualizing causes quite a mess.
e-sword's free and if you download the whole shabang, you'll have the Hebrew and Greek and I can't see doing Bible 'study' without those two.
Each time you click on one individual verse, all the commentaries pop up that can speak to that verse and besides having a version that's numbered to the Strong's makes word studies very easy.
Most Study Bibles interpret for you. Word studies are better.
To me that's like the Nightly News over here. Someone speaks like a Senator and then a journalist has to tell us what the Senator 'really' said. That's insulting. HA.
The commentaries on e-sword give you the views of many men and all those guys have stood the test of time -- they're up in Heaven. But again, Language/word studies are the best "study" of the Bible that we can do for ourselves.
And did I say, It's Free. :-D GOD Bless Rick Meyer ! Amen.
You can download the whole of the Old Testament (Tanach) from a Jewish website, http://www.chabad.org.
It's not messianic of course, but has Rashi's commentary. I find it useful to get a more Jewish understanding, without pro-Christian "bias". Then, if you disuss with Orthodox Jews, they can't say that only Jews can understand their scriptures properly (which is often the attitude), or accuse Christians of mistranslating or altering the Word to support our beliefs.
It would be like showing a Catholic the warnings against specifically Catholic errors from the [i]Catholic
Its difficult to deny when that's what your own Scriptures say!
(Although I wouldn't risk it wth a Mormon or JW Bible - which are DELIBERATELY altered)
Blesings
Jeannette
Hi thks all..I've d/l that Jeannette thks...
The reason i posted this thread was due to Arts sermons,i found myself agreeing with his statements about Israel,post or no rapture,Jacobs trouble etc etc..
I notice a lot of study bibles had notes that reflex the person bias..But i wanted a study bible that highlighted the ideas of Art or similar,and gave good notes about the specific verse..Maybe i should go with a thompson chain and figure it out myself lol
andy
I think a Thompson's chain is only good if you just use it for cross-referencing, but the e-sword is much better and if you download Torrey's Treasury of Scipture knowledge, that is a great Cross-referencing tool, without the commentary.
Most of the Commentaries in it are not pre-t anyways. Matthew Henry wasn't and I can't think of one that I've downloaded who is.
Still think it wouldn't be a bad idea to email BenIsrael and get recommendations from them.
Lord Bless you Andy.
Hi Annie i took your advice and Reggie Kelly kindly replied in what must be a very hectic time!
He recommended 3 but with some caution on a few points..
andy
Hia Andy, I thought they also would point out the cautions there.
Brother Ormly just posted these links and he said that wonderful - that it's FREE. :-D
I tried to download it, but my settings {again} won't permit it.
http://www.bible-explorer.com/
http://www.bible-explorer.com/fbe_scripts/download.cgi?file=BE4setup.EXE
Hi surprise me he recommended 3 New Schofield firstly or Ryrie or MacArthur's with a few cautions
This discussion is locked.
