Ted Haggard Seeks Financial Support

"Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for
whatsoever a man sows, that shall he also reap.
For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh
reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit
will of the Spirit reap everlasting life."

GALATIANS 6:7-8

This made me want to cry for a myriad of reasons but most importantly is that much of the Church probably doesn't see that demonic monsters have infiltrated the churches. Haggard as counselor to Christians? I think not.

Greetings in Jesus' Name by Whose Blood we are Saved.AMEN.

indeed what happened with bro Haggert was a most grievous thing. Lest we think we are beyond falling into that sort of iniquity, we ought to remember the Mercy God has shown us for our sin. Christ said that to even look at a woman lustfully is to commit adultery. i would think the same standard applies for women regarding men so let us examine ourselves to see if we are guilty of this and if so, consider the Mercy God has shown us for it...

2 scriptures were brough to my rememberance at this time concerning Judgment and Mercy toward one another. from 1 Corinthians 5 we have this scenario:

[b]1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. 2 And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you. 3 For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged F14 already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed, 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. 6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? 7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed F15 for us: 8 Therefore let us keep the feast, F16 not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators: 10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? 13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.
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clearly we ought not associate with wickedness but put such people out. i think we got that part on lock...

however this aspect of it i believe we all need much work on...from 2 Corinthians 2 concerning this brother in the above text:

[b]1 But I determined this with myself, that I would not come again to you in heaviness. 2 For if I make you sorry, who is he then that maketh me glad, but the same which is made sorry by me? 3 And I wrote this same unto you, lest, when I came, I should have sorrow from them of whom I ought to rejoice; having confidence in you all, that my joy is the joy of you all. 4 For out of much affliction and anguish of heart I wrote unto you with many tears; not that ye should be grieved, but that ye might know the love which I have more abundantly unto you.5 But if any have caused grief, he hath not grieved me, but in part: that I may not overcharge you all. 6 Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, F5 which was inflicted of many. 7 So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow. 8 Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him. 9 For to this end also did I write, that I might know the proof of you, whether ye be obedient in all things. 10 To whom ye forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person F6 of Christ; 11 Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices.

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the bringing back in of that lost brother...namely Forgiving...oh we're quick to throw the book at one another sometimes...a little easier on ourselves though sometimes...a tad harsher on the crimes committed by others that we ourselves are not guilty of...lenient with our own crimes sometimes...or maybe i'm just tripping and this has no basis. somehow i think not, and perhaps it is because i know myself i have been given much Grace in this area but am in ever desperate need of Him lest i falter...my iniquity is ever before me said David, so is mine to me lest i think i am above falling or think i am no longer in need of Grace...

Paul says to welcome back this brother lest he be consumed with much sorrow. in this pitiful state, our brother is a sitting duck for the enemy and because he is our brother, we can't leave him out to dry. i know for sure i'd not want to be left out there in the cold...don't know about you...Note Paul also says that we ought to forgive lest the enemy take advantage of us...meaning the whole...those in need of forgiveness and those who need to pass it out...if we have been forgiven by God of our sin, we ought to pass that on to one another. i fear we Christians are not always to Gracious or willing to show the Mercy which we have been shown to others (even among ourselves) and so we are oft kept at arms length on account of that wickedness...God forgive us for not forgiving and may we receive Grace from Him to forgive.AMEN. i am not saying at all that one should be absolved from whatever consequences (legal or otherwise) from one's sin. Paul clearly says we ought to receive whatever punishment is due. However Paul also clearly says that afterward we ought to bring our brother back in to comfort him lest the enemy hustle even us who weren't guilty of anything but making us think more of ourselves than we ought.

i am grieved by what happened but as God has shown me Mercy, i can't help but show bro Haggert the same Mercy...so i bow my knees to our Lord and God that He restore this brother to Himself and to us, and us to him also.

it is my hope brethren that behind our speaking out against this wickedness, we spend much more time in travailing prayer for our brother than we do speaking against this. and i hope we so do for one another when we discover wickedness, let this be how we treat one another that the world may once more know we are Christians by how we Love another...let us Love one another as Jesus Loved us, Rebuking and Forgiving one another as He did us.AMEN.

Grace and Peace are ours in Jesus' NAme.AMEN.

bro Compliments
Greetings in Jesus' Name by Whose Blood we are Saved.AMEN.

The man lied about his relationship with this homosexual, lied about the drugs and then later on confessed in other interviews that he did get the drug from his guy.

indeed this is true. this makes me wonder how many times i've lied in a similar fashion and how often God has forgiven me...do you or have you wondered the same?

The problem Ironman is this, he would have still been seeing him were it not for this guy squealing on him. He was getting away with it and he would have still been doing this had he not been exposed.

could we not also say the same for some of the sins we are yet guilty of? that we keep them hidden until we are forced (because they are exposed) to confront them...remembering some of my own instances with this...do you remember times when God exposed your own sin that you would confront it?

It's clear that Ted Haggard is not repentive, he will not confess that he has leanings towards homosexuality. He is thinking that once this all blows over, I will go to another town start all over and this other part of me will just go away. It won't go away, he will fall to this again. Once you taste this type of lust it ain't easy to get rid of. He was counseled and declared straight. Homosexuality is very deceptive.

mmm i am thinking now of how i myself have not been repentive...can you think of any instances in which you have been like bro Haggert?

This is an awful thing to say, but Haggard needs to fall into sin again until he learns that he cannot overcome the flesh by doing good works, thats why he is going to college. The best cure for a hypocrite is to fall into sin, it will either harden your heart or cry out to God for mercy.

i don't know that it is necessary for bro Haggert to fall into sin once more to come to repentance but i do know that it is Necessary...dare i say IMPERATIVE that we as his brethren hold him up in prayer that God show Mercy.

remembering GOd's own Mercy toward me...as one who has benefitted from It i must share it. let us pray brother.

Grace and PEace are ours in Jesus.AMEN.

Brother Jimmy Swaggart was exposed as well, but he repented and sought the LORD for help. He refused the Assemblies of God's counsel which was a wise decision, their counseling is laced with psychology. Ted Haggard needs to learn from Jimmy Swaggart.

Exactly how did Swaggart repent?

Compliments,

That is a very high perch you are about to fall off.

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?viewmode=flat&order=0&topic_id=10733&forum=34&post_id=&refresh=Go]Jonathan Edwards - Undiscerned Spiritual Pride[/url]

Hello...

I am praying for this man, his wife and family.

I had never heard of the man before his public exposure. From what I have learned, I stand miles apart from him in some areas of doctrine. While I won't send him any financial aid (for his Master's Degree), I do believe that the last chapter in his life has yet to be written. Even if he has been a complete fraud, the end of his life hasn't been written. I pray that he has a glorious, truly Christ-centered ending!

:-)

bro Compliments

Greetings in Jesus' Name by Whose Blood we are Saved.AMEN.

Ironman, your speaking to one who knows how to sin and does it quite well. Can you carry on a conversation without having to put forth Pauls admonition? I am fully aware of what your saying.

have we grown to a point where we no longer need to hear this admonition? i know i haven't. i don't know that it could ever become irrelevant...in fact i feel that the moment we start to think that, we become sitting ducks. i may well be wrong or this admonition may well apply far much more to me than to you as God may have given you Grace to come to a point where you need not be reminded of this...i yet need it.

I know what this is saying, I am not talking about this. My posts have nothing to do with this, I am not speaking out of a self righteous pig. I am speaking about this man Ted Haggard. I know what I am talking about when it comes to homosexuality.

but brother Compliments, don't you think that our response to a brother who sins, be it in homosexuality, adultery or whatever ought to be the same as what Paul prescribed in this instance of adultery?Or should we be more harsh on homosexuality? i believe we ought not to show partiality...i have not seen the same outrage over fornication among our children, or adultery among us which i think has done far more damage than any other sexual sin.

i am trying to understand here bro so i ask that you bear with me.

God exposed this man because He loves him and wants him to repent of this thing and to seek Him for healing.

as He does with all sin yet it seems there is by far more outrage over this...do you think homosexuality is a worse sin than fornication and adultery...or gossip? i fear (and maybe my fears are unfounded) that the outrage is more an effort to keep us from tending to fornication and adultery which are more rampant among us...not saying homosexuality ought to be left off the hook by any means, just equal outrage...or don't we want to squeal on ourselves?

What your missing in my point my Brother is this, he would have continued on in homosexual activity had he not been exposed. He denies that he had any homosexual desires and/or practiced it. This tells me that he is still holding on to it and it will show up again. I know what I am talking about, I've said the same words to someone who accused me and I kept denying it, the more I denied the more it became evident, until I confessed it to a confidant. But he's denying it. Do you understand what I am saying?

oh no bro, i understand what you are saying that save for the exposure he would have continued...then again he may yet be continuing, that is not the issue. my thing is are you praying for him as much as you are speaking out? yes you have done well in pointing out the problem, are we working together in prayer for God's solution though?

Pray for him yes by all means, also pray that God will expose this in his life without having to bring more of a reproach on the name of Jesus.

will you also pray? you know, this has been a period of reflection for me. you know every sin we commit does bring reproach to the Name of God whether it is seen or not...i've brought much reproach to His Name...i bless HIm for and see more clearly His Mercy on me that in spite of myself...basking in the blessedness of that MErcy...

Preachers who make jokes about those caught in a particular sin will get caught in the same sin. God loves sinners, He hears their hurting cry every day. And then He becomes grieved when He hears preachers joking about sinners and those caught in their sin.

true, makes me wonder how He feels when we fail to pray for one another as we ought...God Help us be Merciful...

Grace and Peace are ours in Jesus.AMEN.

by KrispyKrittr on 2007/8/27 7:43:22

How about Ted Haggard stop viewing the ministry as an occupation... and go get a job and support his family like the rest of us instead of expecting other people to give him money.

Compliments wrote:
The man lied about his relationship with this homosexual, lied about the drugs and then later on confessed in other interviews that he did get the drug from his guy.

The problem Ironman is this, he would have still been seeing him were it not for this guy squealing on him. He was getting away with it and he would have still been doing this had he not been exposed.

It's clear that Ted Haggard is not repentive, he will not confess that he has leanings towards homosexuality. He is thinking that once this all blows over, I will go to another town start all over and this other part of me will just go away. It won't go away, he will fall to this again. Once you taste this type of lust it ain't easy to get rid of. He was counseled and declared straight. Homosexuality is very deceptive.

Brother Jimmy Swaggart was exposed as well, but he repented and sought the LORD for help. He refused the Assemblies of God's counsel which was a wise decision, their counseling is laced with psychology. Ted Haggard needs to learn from Jimmy Swaggart.

This is an awful thing to say, but Haggard needs to fall into sin again until he learns that he cannot overcome the flesh by doing good works, thats why he is going to college. The best cure for a hypocrite is to fall into sin, it will either harden your heart or cry out to God for mercy.

I know, for I am one of the chief of sinners.

Wow, Compliments, I am quite taken aback by all your comments on this thread. Especially the above ones.

It is a sad and disheartening sin that MY former pastor committed. He should not have done the things he did, and he should have been more open with his mentors, and those around him he had for inegrity purposes. He fell, and he fell hard into the trap of the enemy.

I guarantee, that if you were ever caught in sin that would embarass you and bring your ministry to ruins, you would most likely want to lie, just the same. He lost his ministry, many friends, trust within his family, his leadership in the NAE, and many other things. Imagine your life coming to a sudden crashing halt... it would suck big time, and it did for him.

You can not sit here and judge a man's heart based upon the very small detail that you know, and say that he is unrepentative. He is still getting counseling, and his entire family is getting counseling. It is going to be a long road for all of them.

Just because someone sins doesn't mean they lose heart and passion for ministry. Have you ever lost a desire to serve God, because you've sinned? If you haven't, then why put that on another brother?

Have you talked with Ted Haggard? Did he tell you that he still longs for a homosexual lifestyle? Because I have been told quite the opposite from his family. He knows it is a horrible sin what he did, and he is working on his issues.

Can I ask you Compliments if you have sinned this week? If you have, then can I ask why you are allowed to minister to people? Did God only die for your sins? Or did He die for everyone's? Are you not aware that even as horrendous as the sin was committed by Ted Haggard, that God still forgave him? (Or are you judging God's heart, too?)

Just because a man wants to go to school, because he knows he will never pastor again, doesn't mean anything other then the fact that he still needs to earn a living. Have you ever thought about that? I don't know what your job is, but let's say that you could never do what you are doing ever again, and you couldn't do it anywhere on this planet. Uh, wouldn't you be wanting to get a different job? After all you would still have yourself and a family to support, wouldn't you? Is Ted Haggard, not allowed to do the same?

I am so glad that God is his judge, and not you. You have a calloused heart.

By the way, if you read the article you will note that he is going to school, and working on a support basis in the Dream Center. He is not getting paid an hourly or salary wage. This is why he is asking for help.

P.S. To say that someone needs to fall into sin again, when they are trying so hard to get back on their feet and never let that happen again, and they are crying out to God on a daily basis, is such a horrible, horrible thing to say.

Krispy, both he and his wife discussed these matters. Getting a degree in psychology to be a prof. counselor, is sorta stepping out of ministry, wouldn't you think? By the way, He and his wife both are pursuing these degrees. they want to do counseling together.