Set the Trumpet to Thy Mouth

Does anyone have a copy of David Wilkerson's book, "Set the Trumpet to Thy Mouth"? If so, read chapter one. This book was published in 1985. It would appear on the surface that with the downfall of the Soviet Union that he has missed the mark with this prophecy? What do you think? I have not kept current with his sermons or newsletters. Does he still hold to this belief? I would sure like to hear his response. I personally love the preaching and passion of David Wilkerson, I would hate to think that he speaks out careless prophecies. I would like to hear everyones input.

I am of the rare view point that David Wilkerson seldom ever prophecies anything of God. He has some good stuff, but, he is a very dangerous man to make a regular reading and listening of. I have a copy of that book (amongst many others of his), and I say you are well off if you just burned that book. Don't get me wrong, Wilkerson is dead on in so many areas, but usually when he starts saying something is prophetic, most of the time it is not. People have often thought simply because Wilkerson preaches it really really hard, that he must be of God. But, I know plenty of hypocrites with critical spirits that are just as hard about many things...and they aren't always Christians. I consider Wilkerson a geniune Christian who has entered into serious error, and often plays the false prophet. And I say all this with with much reluctance.

Please expound on your views of David Wilkerson "playing the false prophet." I have the book, unfortunately not with me but in my office, and I have read the whole thing, highlited it actually, and found nothing wrong with it. You apparently alluded to other "prophecies." Do you have the quotes in correct context??? I've seen a plethora of misquotes of Wilkerson on the internet. And where exactly has he erred I would ask you.Jeremy Hulsey

I have listened to David Wilkerson for several years and have attended Time Square Church many times over the past 2 years, from what I understand of him, he calls himself a Watchman, and not a prophet. He has stated prophecies throughout the years, and has been dead on with some but others he has missed on. I feel that his gift of prophecy is not any more apparent than anyone elses I have seen. In his ministry I have seen him as being selfless, or at least trying to be. His preaching always seems to be "On the Mark". We all must remember that no matter who preaches Gods Word we are always going to get the "flavor of the Hose", and this is where our discernment must come in.As for "The Vision" he makes no apologies, as he feels it what was put on his heart by the Lord, to me I see no hidden agenda otherwise.......

Preaching to Cannibals wrote; I consider Wilkerson a geniune Christian who has entered into serious error, and often plays the false prophet.I don't understand this idea of a genuine Christian who can play a false prophet. Jesus said false prophets are cut down and burned;Mat 7:15-19 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. (16) Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? (17) Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. (18) A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. (19) Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.It would seem to me the two terms "genuine Christian" and "false prophet" are mutually exclusive. Can you please expand on your claims of false prophecy with specifics? In Christ,Ron

Ktrek wrote:It's also interesting to note that of all the books he has written this appears to be the only one no longer in print by his ministry. hmmmWhich book are you refering to as out of print? The one I originally ask about (Set the Trumpet to Thy Mouth) or The Vision. I don't know what the status is with Set the Trumpet.. but I did read in one of his newsletters that my parents recieved that they were getting ready to reprint The Vision. His letter said something about him reading the book again and being amazed at how many of the prophecies have been fulfilled and so they were going to reprint it (this is from memory and not his exact words so I hope I am relaying this accurately, if not please forgive me).My original concern was with chapter one of Set the Trumpet to Thy Mouth.As one who has always thought highly of D. Wilkerson, I am than last person who would want to think that he has missed it. However, I do feel that if someone has missed the mark on something that was once so wide spread, they should be accountable and admit their error. Since the time on this prophecy was open ended, it it possible the he still holds to it. If that be the case then I guess it's 'just wait and see.'

Ktrek wrote:"It's also interesting to note that of all the books he has written this appears to be the only one no longer in print by his ministry. hmmm"I know that for a time it was back in print. I don't know if they are going to make another reprinting again. To my knowledge it has sold out. However, the sermon is available on tape. Kevin, I suggest you read the book, or listen to the tape.I have NEVER known David Wilkerson to hide things. When he has missed God he has admitted openly and freely. He is not flippant about prophecying. I STRONGLY suggest you get the book "A Final Warning" written by Nicky Cruz about Wilkerson. You will find your accusations baseless and outdated.Also, all I have seen so far are accusations. Once again I ask you to back them up. Where's your DOCUMENTATION???Jeremy Hulsey

I do not have much time to go back and research false prophecies from David Wilkerson's books. Maybe I will in the near future, but can't right now. Especially since when I did read his books, I *was* (though since converted by an English teacher) not one for highlighting books, and I'm not about to reread so many pages to find them again. Here are a few of my problems with Wilkerson that I can recall off hand:1. "The Vision" seldom actually contains any of the numerous visions that Wilkerson actually claimed he had. Instead of actually telling what he actually saw, most the time he told his interpretation of what he saw. Occasionally, he let's the reader know what he saw, but, mostly not.2. "The Vision" prophecies the unbiblical pre-tribulation rapture.3. "Set the trumpet to thy mouth" does call America the actual prophesied Babylon of the scriptures. This shows a misunderstanding of who "mystery Babylon" actually is.4. "Set the trumpet to thy mouth" is highly legalistic. While I believe in holiness, and a life without compromise, Wilkerson labels some things e.g. All TV and Secular Music as demonic. While not totally unscriptural that a lot on TV and on the Radio is bad, he should not broadbrush. Those tools can be used for holy use when one sanctifies something by means of the word of God and prayer.5. If you even asked Wilkerson himself if he has made false prophecies in the past, he would admit it (as one person noted). All while pastor of Times Square Church. I've heard him on more than one occassion repent of various false prophecies (ones that I was not aware of). This is not exactly something that a pastor should be prone to do... which Wilkerson seems to do from time to time. False prophecies are hardly a minor matter. Yes, one can repent of them, and find forgiveness from God, but, if one simply says "guess that one was not from the Lord...hey everybody, I'm sorry for speaking something God didn't command me to speak, even though I said He did." That is only the surface. Jesus taught that out of the abundance of heart does a man speak... and if one is speaking false prophecies, it shows that this person's heart is a lot different than you might think.6. Wilkerson denies being a prophet, but simply says he is a 'watchman' (as one person noted)...but can you show me biblically how they are different? In the Bible, a 'watchman' is another word used for 'prophets'. Isaiah and Ezekiel were rather fond of the title 'watchman.' In general, these are my complaints.

It would seem to me the two terms "genuine Christian" and "false prophet" are mutually exclusive.Let me clarify :) What I mean is that I have no doubt in my mind that Wilkerson has geniunely been born again of the Spirit, and I do not doubt he has a geniune call of God on his life. The book "The Cross and the Switchblade" bore much witness to my Spirit. However...I do not believe in all that he has been doing has been of God in the past 20 years. Frankly, while I've found his sermons to be usually good, I think he tries to play up the entire "watchman" role a bit, and has learned a style of preaching that makes him sound like he's just consumed with God. He's learned to sound like a thundering prophet of God (or at least, what most people would imagine one would sound like). This, mixed in with a cynical spirit, deceives many. Many forget the story Christ told about the man with a log in his eye, and him taking notice of another man with a speck in his own. Many never seem to notice in that story, that the man with the log in his eye was still able to notice a geniune speck in someone else's! Yeah, the man with the log in his eye must remove the log in his eye before he tries to remove the speck in another... but many don't. Such persons who have the log in their own eye are cynics. Such persons can be accurate in their "discernment" (as they would call it).

To speak to the first question asked about Set the Trumpet To Thy Mouth; Wilkerson is hermenutically using the duality of prophecy from scriptures. The prophecie of the Bible, especially the apocalyptic ones, that David is using in the first chapter deal first with the days that they were given but also with a backdrop of foretelling the distant future. As to the fall of the Soviet Union; Russia still exists with enough of her nuclear arsenal to destroy the world and certainly America. One of the closest calls we ever had with a potential nuclear holocaust was in 1995. Some American scientists launched an upper atmosphere rocket to test weather patterns over Northern Europe; however, due to miscommunication in the Russian millitary, the upper command did not know about this launch. They thought it was a potential missile strike from America. The briefcase with the Russian launch codes was opened and they came very close to launching untill the Russian Pres. decided to see what the missile on the Radar would do. Lukily its trajectory took it away from Russia.As for words like "immenent" and "at hand", prophecies are repleat in the Bible with these statements, yet it was years before they were fulfilled.

I think that the following portion of an email I was sent today is very relevant to this discussion. "Knowing the Times After the 9/11 attacks, people poured into churches like never before in our history. Then, several weeks later, fewer people attended church than before the attacks because they did not find the church or its message relevant to the times. However, God and those who are awake and staying close to Him will know the times. Those who are faithful seekers will soon experience a great increase of words of knowledge, words of wisdom, and prophecy to keep us ahead of the times. In Matthew 16:2-3, the Lord rebuked the people for knowing how to discern the weather, but not knowing the signs of the times. When the Lord used such metaphors it was because there was a relationship. Discerning the signs of the times is actually similar to understanding weather. As a professional pilot I had to learn how to discern the weather because my life depended on it. We are likewise coming to the point when our lives will depend upon our knowing the times. One thing I learned early in my flying career was that I could not rely on the professional weather forecasters if I was going to be a safe pilot. I was certainly thankful for the professional meteorologists who gave themselves to knowing the present conditions and making forecasts, but I had to know the weather myself and I had to be able to foresee conditions which the professional weather forecasters might not see from their remote offices. This is true for Christians as well. We should be thankful for those who are devoting themselves to knowing the times and we should listen to them. However, this does not negate our personal responsibility to know the times, and to know what the Lord is saying to us personally. For a weather forecaster, the penalty for getting a forecast wrong was a bit of humiliation. For the pilots, who understand that the majority of aircraft accidents are weather related, the stakes are much higher. I therefore determined that I was going to know weather better than the professional fore-casters. I studied relentlessly, constantly making my own observations, and talking to every experienced pilot or meteorologist that I could. My goal was to never be surprised by the weather conditions which I found en route or at my destination. We need to have this same goal for understanding the times. After a few years of flying professionally, I was so good at knowing the weather that I was rarely surprised by it on a flight. Now I want to know the signs of the times so well that I am never surprised by what comes. At this time I am still far from this goal, but I am resolved to keep getting better. One of the ways I am pursuing this is by getting closer to those with the same devotion. I know the Lord would not have rebuked us for this if it were not possible to know the signs of the times better than we know the weather. People still make jokes about the weather forecasters, but the truth is that in the thirty years that I have been involved in aviation, weather forecasters have become amazingly accurate. It used to be rare for them to be accurate, but now it is rare for them to miss. Even so, I am amazed at how many people, especially among the older generation, have a perception that weather forecasters are wrong most of the time. This is definitely no longer the case. I have watched with curiosity as some of these people seized a single missed forecast to re-enforce their opinion, not seeming to regard at all the overwhelming majority of amazingly accurate forecasts. The same is happening to the church's prophetic ministry. It too is moving from a place of being a laughingstock to becoming increasingly accurate. It will continue to do so until we rarely hear of a miss. Even so, the perception of many, especially among the older generation, will be that it is rarely accurate even when the reverse is true. This can be discouraging, but we must not let it be. We just have to keep getting better at knowing the Lord's voice. We also need to view every mistake as an opportunity to learn, and to humble ourselves knowing that the Lord gives His grace to the humble. We are going to need much more grace for what is to come."

I must add my 2 cents. I take it I am one of very few here that has actually met David Wilkerson and a good number of his family. All you have to do is talk to him and to his grandsons, and you will quickly find out that he is genuinely on fire -- the way he preaches is the way he lives. To quote one of his grandsons, "Grandpa doesn't love anything but Jesus." (That was stated with the understanding that this meant that he cared deeply for people as well -- don't take it out of context.) It is a fact that everything he does is with Christ in mind.This should square with what some have already posted. As for Set the Trumpet to Thy Mouth, I think the book is tremendous. I am aware of a prophecy from the early/mid 1980s (not by Wilkerson) that the USSR would fall (then it seemed impossible) for a time (in which many would be free to enter for the cause of the Gospel) and then rise again stronger than before -- trapping many behind the iron curtain. I believe this will indeed take place -- the first part already has. David still believes in his prophecies such as found in The Vision and in The Trumpet. The fact that they say "in a few years" shouldn't worry us -- let us recall that Revelation says that the things in it would happen "in a short time" (some of it did, some has been happening since then, and other bits remain unfulfilled). Also recall that the prophet rebuking Jereboam I announced the coming of a king named Josiah -- who came 250 years later, long after Jereboam's whole family had been eliminated. The prophecy surely would have been thought to come earlier. Jeremiah and Ezekiel fought this problem when they prophesied, because people by then recognized that most prophecies didn't come to pass until well later -- so they paid them no attention. Both responded by saying that this time, the prophesies would actually be fulfilled within their lifetimes. Let us then realize that "a short time" or "a few years" may well be longer than we might think. Just think -- Jesus hasn't come back in 2,000 years even though it has been "the last days" since the time of Peter and Paul.Now I agree that the pre-tribulation Rapture is unbiblical (it is actually very easy to disprove). Wilkerson has actually distanced himself from this interpretation over the last 20 years. Keep in mind that he has read and received the writing of George Warnock (who even spoke at two of Wilkerson's conferences), who is a strong opponent of the pre-trib rapture. At the same time, The Vision is actually presented in such a way that the section speaking on this subject (unlike the section in Beyond the Cross and the Switchblade, a book from 1974 not treated as prophecy, in which he shows his approval for pre-trib) does not present pre-trib as a part of the prophecy. He actually says, "God has not promised to keep His children from suffering. He has not promised to keep us from facing an hour of need. We have no promise of world peace, tranquility, security, or continuous financial well-being. We are promised peace and security of soul and mind -- the supernatural provision for every true need -- and assurance that we would never have to beg for bread. ... I believe the prepared Christian is going to face a time of sorrow and tribulation. I believe he will be tested, tried, and tempted. I believe true Christians are going to witness many of the horrors described in this vision. But I am also firmly convinced in my own heart and mind ... that God is going to deliver His true children from His final fury that will be outpoured on the earth."(Incidentally, I just found a comment upon opening The Vision (1977) that I did not recall -- it also agrees with the prophecy that I mentioned above. Wilkerson writes: "God is bringing to pass a temporary truce between the East and the West for the express purpose of getting the gospel into these Communist countries. ... A tremendous move of the Holy Spirit in Finland can and will spill over into Russia. Ironically, while the doors are beginning to close on this side of the Curtains, the doors will begin to open on the other side. And, after a short period of freedom and spiritual awakening among many, the doors will suddenly close, and the persecution madness will begin with intensity and engulf all those nations." Just thought you might be interested.)Anyway, I would have dealt more with The Trumpet than The Vision, but I thought enough of it to loan it to a friend who is out of town at the moment, so I will not have access to it for a bit. At the same time, I think it is a tremendous book, and that David's prophecies will come to pass. I should also add that I agree with him on television and the spirit of his words on music -- if you are aware of his understanding of what "rock music" is, I don't think you would disagree with his statement. TSC plays some pretty upbeat stuff in their services. As I understand it, he is more concerned with the spirit of the world in "Christian" music, than the tempo of the music itself. On this, I agree -- as someone who has been around the "Christian" music industry for over a decade, I emphatically state that there are few bands who are legitimately producing "fruit demonstrating repentance." Unfortunately, CCM is so secularized that it is hard to get Christian "Christian" music.As far as saying "the messenger" was the one who screwed the message up, consider that the Bible itself was passed through messengers -- the men who wrote and spoke it. If you are to say that today's prophets taint the pure message of God, then Scripture must also have that possiblity. You can't have it both ways. Either the Scriptures are indeed pure and the prophets of today speak equally true prophecy, or the prophets of today speak somewhat tainted prophecy and Scripture also. It is clearly the former rather than the latter. Let us not do as Israel and discount the words of prophets because they are not fulfilled in the time frame expected or perhaps in the way expected. Jonah opens up another can of worms that I don't want to get into here. Sorry this was so long, but I think this is important because David Wilkerson is indeed a man of God and a legitimate watchman/prophet. Few are worthy to hold his sandals -- he has lived a life consecrated to God, particularly over the last 20 years.The bottom line is that Wilkerson's message is pure (like Ravenhill's, Reidhead's, and others on this site) -- it is a message of repentance (those with hardened hearts say "legalism," just as those Israelites who would not follow their prophets), intimacy, and judgment. He has cried out against the message of peace and safety (which is the message of a truely false prophet). This follows the biblical model for the message of a legitimate prophet:Jeremiah 28:8-9 The prophets who were before me and before you from ancient times prophesied against many lands and against great kingdoms, of war and of calamity and of pestilence. The prophet who prophesies of peace, when the word of the prophet shall come to pass, then that prophet will be known as one whom the LORD has truly sent.May God's grace be upon the readers of this message, to give spiritual discernment and ears to hear.

Jason I second the motion......

First of all, I must express that I whole-heartedly agree with you on Rick Joyner, Paul Cain, and others who claim to be big-time prophets in the Charismatic world. I think by-and-large they are the equivalent of the 400 prophets of Baal. As I said before, few prophets will be visible, fewer will be received, and all of them will share a common message -- the judgment of God and the necessity for repentance.At the same time, I must disagree with your distinction between the "prophets of old" and those moved by the (same) Spirit today. I am curious as to what would make the Spirit less powerful in inspiring his people today. I also disagree with your reference to the Bible as "the Word of God." If we truly believe the Scriptures are inspired (as I do), we will recognize that they say that Jesus is the Word of God. He was the "Word of the Lord" who came to the prophets in days of Old and gave them words from himself. Yes, it is semantics, but semantics are important in Scriptural matters. The difference comes in the understanding that Jesus is no more bound in giving a pure message now than he was in those days -- he is the Word of God, still living and active, sharper than a two-edged sword. The idea that he is less able to pass on a pure word today seems to indicate the opposite of what Scripture indicates -- that the Spirit is given in more abundance now than before. However, even moreso than before, there are an abundance of false prophets -- this will continue to the end. 1 Kings and 2 Thess show us that these prophets are also sent of the Lord -- but for delusion rather than truth. I think you recognize this from your experience, and this is a blessing. I have seen this firsthand as well. At the same time, we must not be turned from the true by the false -- we may as well follow the false if that is the case. (The dwarfs at the end of C. S. Lewis' The Last Battle come to mind as those who have been "taken in" by the lie so badly that they can no longer be "taken out" to truth because of their fear of the false.) God still has a pure witness in the earth, but it is by and large hidden (like Elijah at the widow's house in Zarephath). I think George Warnock has a good view about these dark days in the world and especially in the Church: Where sin abounds, Grace abounds all the more ... this means that where there is the greatest darkness, God will work all the more to have a true witness.The difficulty is in distinguishing the true from the false. The false is just as sincere, just as devoted, and just as "spiritual" as the true -- but the true will always share the message of the genuine prophets in Scripture. As for that bizzare comment about homosexuals introducing "newd worship" -- we are very close. There are already homosexual "churches" all over the place, and they have had conferences that have been lascivious in every sense of the word. For all I know, this "newd worship" has already been done on a small scale. I do know from my research that it is very close -- all the pieces are very close to in place (much more so than in 1977 when the book was written).We know that God has not withdrawn his Spirit in the Last Days -- it is much the opposite! He is pouring his Spirit out on those with a whole heart to hear him and follow him. He is also allowing a Satanic delusion to envelop most of the Church without whole hearts. This has been prophesied since earliest times, and we are seeing it in our day. Scripture warns about these days that we must stand firm all the more -- let us not be taken in by the lie, and let us not doubt the power of the Spirit of God in us because of the lie. To do either one would be spiritual suicide. God has not withdrawn, he has hidden himself in those with faithful hearts.Grace and peace.

Quote: "Wilkerson claimed that all these things would happen within a "few" years. The Vision was not an open ended prophecy as suggested but he made some very detailed prophecies and said all these would take place within a matter of a few years."Here is What David Wilkerson says about the unfolding of the vision he had."Parts of this vision will come to pass in the very near future. Some of the events are more distant" (Introduction, The Vision, Jove Publishing 1977)"Some of the predictions in this particular part of my vision will happen within the next few years. Other disasters predicted are still future but will surely come." (page 27)Jeremy Hulsey