Watchman Nee criticized?

It is said by many that Witness Lee perverted Watchman Nee's teachings. I've read a number of Nee's writings, and personally felt some of them were in great conflict, and when I learned later that many accuse Witness Lee of perverting Watchman Nee's teachings, and making various revisions, then the difficulties began fadding away. You have one preacher on here (forget his name off hand) that is said to have preserved Watchman Nee's teachings, which were not as cultic as Witness Lee made them. Witness Lee's "local church" or "living streams" or whatever they call themselves today have made inroads here even in CHarlotte. They tend to seek people from Universities. A good friend of mine was invited to such a meeting, and the people she said could not stop talking about Witness Lee and Watchman Nee, and had tons of their books scattered all over the place. As far as I'm concerned, Witness Lee found himself in a place where he could not succede very well without Watchman Nee, so he used Watchman Nee's writings to justify his own ministry which could not stand without them. Of course, this is just my theory, however I find it rather reasonable considering the hero-worship that exists in "the little flock" of their apostolic fathers.

Hi PreachingToCannibals,Overview:There are two different English (and Chinese) translations of Watchman Nee's work, one published by Living Stream associated with Witness Lee and one by Christian Fellowship Publishers translated by Stephen Kaung. Both Lee and Kaung were co-workers of Watchman Nee. Aside 1: Most work were originally in Chinese for obvious reasons, but the messages given by Nee during his trips to Europe were in English and then translated back to Chinese (Sit Walk Stand, The Normal Christian Life, Love Not the World, etc.). These English manuscripts were edited by Angus Kinnear, the son-in-law of T. Austin-Sparks.Aside 2: In the fifties, shortly after Nee's imprisonment, a small number of Nee's work were translated into English by foreign missionaries (such as those from China Inland Mission founded by Hudson Taylor), and published by Hong Kong Church Bookroom.Characteristics:Both publishers have published the collected works of Watchman Nee. The CFP version follows a topical scheme, whereas the LSM version follows a chronological scheme (and whenever available, it includes historical information such as the dates, times, and persons in attendance). I personally find the chronological one more helpful in studying the development of thought in Nee's thinking and teaching. Nevertheless, both are good resources.Process:Having met a number of people who had knowledge of the editorial process of the LSM version, I think speculations of Lee twisting Nee's words in his translations are unfounded. Without endorsing all of Witness Lee's own teachings, I give credit to him for his editorial and translation work in Watchman Nee's writings. While the quality of the translation may not always be consistent (Witness Lee did not do all the work himself, there was a team of people helping him), the work is based on original manuscripts of notes taken by some brothers and sisters who attended Nee's meetings. Some of these original Chinese manuscripts were originally kept by the Hong Kong Church Bookroom (run by the Church in Hong Kong, which has dissociated from LSM since mid-1980's).My conclusion:Witness Lee certainly went further in some of his own teachings, however, there is no reason to doubt his integrity in the editorial and translation work of Watchman Nee's collected works. The sources for the original Chinese manuscripts came from believers good at shorthand who had attended Nee's sermons and meetings, later edited and translated into English (and many other languages) by a commitee of believers at the Living Stream.To authenticate this, one can compare the CFP and LSM versions in English. Then compare the English and Chinese ones. I do not claim to have gone through this process, but of the Watchman Nee scholars that I know, even those who are most critical of Nee, none had found this to be a problem.By the way, if anyone likes to discuss about Watchman Nee, feel free to write me a message. I am obviously a fan. :)

Nee, Watchman (1903-1972)Widely read Christian author with some controversial teachings. Nee required blanket, unquestioning obedience. He also taught that all Christians must have a "Covering" - a person who has delegated authority, must be obeyed unconditionally, and who must be imitated. This "covering" does not stop with matters of faith and doctrine, but also extends to personal and secular matters (such as choice of employment, place to live, whether or not to marry, etc.) In addition, Nee taught there should only be one congregation in each city. Whenever Nee's followers moved into a city, they proclaimed themselves as the only church approved by God in that city. These doctrines have been picked up by various abusive churches and cultic movements, such as the International Churches of Christ. Under the leadership of Nee's disciple and co-worker, Witness Lee, his house church movement, the Local Church (known to it's followers as "The Lord's Recovery") later also became controversial. taken from http://apologeticsindex.org/n00.html#neew With respect to Nee's teaching on authority, I recommend that readers read his own book, Spiritual Authority(published by Christian Fellowship Publishers), or Authority and Submission (same book published by Living Stream), before forming a pre-mature opinion.Apparently, some from the shepherding / discipling movement had manipulated the messages in this book to justify their control over their members. Watchman Nee would probably not endorse such practices.That members are controlled in even "personal and secular matters (such as choice of employment, place to live, whether or not to marry, etc.)" is also not apparent from the messages of Nee, although it is possible to twist his words to make them so. Western Christians are reminded that the individualistic spirit that was derived from the Enlightenment has not yet corroded the Chinese culture. Seeking advice from the community of believers and especially elders in regard to "personal" matters is very natural. Finally, the "one city, one church" teaching. My own understanding is that this teaching is an inclusive stance, not an exclusive one. It is inclusive because the spirit of this teaching is to acknowledge that all regenerated Christians within a locality are members of the Body of Christ as expressed in this geographical area (e.g. Greg is a born-again Christian in Toronto -- therefore he is a part of the church in Toronto, just as I do. There is no need to ask further questions about denominational affiliation, etc.) The spirit of this teaching is not to claim one's group as the only legitimate and authenticate church. Again, a radical teaching like this can be easily twisted to work completely contrary to its original purpose.

Peace to you Sam. I have browsed through some of what you have written of Watchman Nee and the church in China. I find your views interesting. I also was able to meet with some of the churches in China but it was in 1986. Perhaps we can share what we see and have gained of the Lord through Watchman Nee. Malachiah

Malachiah,You are most welcome to put forth your views here. Is there any particular theme on Watchman Nee that you want to share?I look forward to seeing your contribution!Sam

Greetings again to Sam and all, Surely the Lord blessed the church when He raised up Watchman Nee. Even his name is a sign and supply. Watchman! Only the Watchman can see the Lord's secret coming. Watchmen are crucial in these days. Watchman Nee was the beginning of the Watchmen. When Watchman Nee went to England and then began to see the proper ground of meeting the end of the age was drawing near. Watchman returned to China and began to sound out the ground of the church. For two millennium we had been in the age of the baptism into the death of Christ, but seventy years ago the end was drawing near. Two great signs appeared. One was Watchman Nee sounding out the oneness of the church expressed locally. I am deeply thankful for brother Watchman Nee. What he saw has given us a place to stand and to see the coming of the Lord that is hidden from the world. To all the beloved brothers who love the Lord and love their neighbor, bless you in the growing heritage Watchman has left for us in the local churches. "I have set WATCHMEN upon your walls, Jerusalem; all the day and all the night they shall never hold their peace: you that put Jehovah in remembrance, keep not silence, give Him no rest, till He establish, till He make Jerusalem a praise in the earth." Isaiah 62:6-7. Brother Watchman Nee saw that the Word is life. He declared: "the governing principle of the Bible is the Word becoming flesh". He saw that the Word became flesh and is Jesus. The Word was then imparted to others through Jesus laying down His life and taking it up in them. He saw that as Jesus has done all the members of His body must do for each other. By, in and one with the Living Word we are to lay our life down and take it up in others. To do this we must be on the ground that the Lord has chosen to place His name. Brother Watchman Nee was at the beginning of this revelation as it began to arise out of the great spiritual flood of the age. Now we have advanced into the millennium(seventh of man third of the new creation. It is the third day and the resurrection of the Word is branching already hand to hand. Herein present day Watchmen are produced and they are thankful for the heritage of Watchman Nee. I take my place among them in the mercy and grace given to our spirit in the revelation of Jesus Christ. In Him I seek out my brothers.In Jesus,Malachiah

And a blessed greeting to you brother!Brother Watchman Nee saw that the Word is life. He declared: "the governing principle of the Bible is the Word becoming flesh". He saw that the Word became flesh and is Jesus. The Word was then imparted to others through Jesus laying down His life and taking it up in them. He saw that as Jesus has done all the members of His body must do for each other. By, in and one with the Living Word we are to lay our life down and take it up in others. To do this we must be on the ground that the Lord has chosen to place His name. Such wonder -full words!"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth." Joh 1:12-14Herein present day Watchmen are produced and they are thankful for the heritage of Watchman Nee. I take my place among them in the mercy and grace given to our spirit in the revelation of Jesus Christ. In Him I seek out my brothers.Yes, very much thankful! And thankful to have you in our midst!

The local church already has something like agreement when they request a couple go through marriage counseling before they will marry them. I agree with that. Why would we not want our church, especially the wise elders, to help us make wise decisions? We go to them for counceling when the marriage is on the rocks! We believe the church can lead us in the most critical of endeavors, an eternal life in Christ, but when it comes to our daily affairs, thank you we'll handle this ourselves. Are we really that objective and competent? Over half the marriages end in divorce and jobs are often scarce whether due to lack of training or motivation. I don't like the idea of no input but I don't shy away from church authority having a voice in my life.

Hi smichael,Welcome to the forum!After reading your post (thank you for your contribution!), what is the relation between what you wrote about church authority and Watchman Nee himself?Agent001

Thank you brother Mike for your warm welcome. Not only Watchman is a great name but also Michael. "Who is like God". This may be the univeral question among the angels and we know that Michael is one of the seven holy ones that stand as fire before the throne. The question is answered in the hand of the son of man now, for in Christ we are created in the image and likeness of God. Man is like God, the man in Christ that is. A man that can take seven holy angels in hand is like God, let all the angels marvel in this present revelation.It is good to meet you here brother Mike. The heavens be open to you in the fellowship of the Father and Son.Malachiah

Greetings --I have been reading criticisms about Watchman Nee for years. They used to exasperate me. Now, they almost make me angry.Most of these criticisms are made by "ivory tower" theologians who don't know the first thing about suffering for the Gospel. Let someone who rotted away in a prison for Christ be the only one to criticize a saint like Nee.The fact of the matter is that most of the teachings of Nee which are most frequently questioned aren't even presented correctly. Take the issue of the "local church." Watchman was grieved by division in the body. His dream...and his demand...was that the body of Christ in any given locality come together as one body for the common cause of the Gospel, in a single congregation.Sounds like real heresy, doesn't it?I have also heard people complain that Watchman's theology was too "Eastern," referring to its "mystical nature." Well, I am sure that he would have found our theology is quite "Western," with all its man-centered, sin-excusing tendencies.By the way -- concerning Watchman's fellowship with the Brethren: did you know that he issued a strong rebuke to the Brethren, and was actually rejected from their fellowship over his strong friendship with T. Austin Sparks? This is in his biography if anyone would like a reference.Blessings,Jason

I have also heard people complain that Watchman's theology was too "Eastern," referring to its "mystical nature." Well, I am sure that he would have found our theology is quite "Western," with all its man-centered, sin-excusing tendencies.It is quite ridiculous, because if anyone trace Watchman Nee's development of thought, one will find that he drew his sources almost exclusively from the Western world--mysticism perhaps, but not the kind as understood in eastern religions. As for his history with the brethren, it was noted already that the Taylorite Brethren considered their past association with Watchman Nee a grave mistake. They could not tolerate Nee's "open Brethren" approach to the fellowship of the Lord's Table.