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I am not sure of my salvation anymore?

sermonindex Oct 12, 2007

I have been on SI for a while now and it has greatly encouraged me and challenged me. However I am struggling with this issue about my salvation for a couple months now. I have been seeking the Lord about this and nothing yet has happened to where I hear Him say to me "Thou are saved!" I don't know what is going on with me at this point, I have always felt pretty strong about my faith, but recently somethings have caused me to be concerned. I don't know if I am seeking a revelation from God, but in a way I am. I have listened to Paul Washer give testimonies about others who doubted their assurance and wrestled with God over it; God heard their cries and answered them to where they know now!! Just believing isn't enough. I need something more. i am not sure what that is, but I know it isn't an audible voice or a flash of light. But I seek something that only God can do, if He is willing.

This maybe a shock to some, but I am so down and confused now, it is causing me to even wonder if I have ever been saved. I don't know if I am just beaten up spiritually and being a doubter because of circumstances? Until I know with out a doubt I am His, I won't be back to SI. I can't fake it anymore while I am struggling with this issue.

Mike

T
theopenlife Oct 12, 2007

Yes, this post is lengthy, but I do care to give you a whole-counsel answer. I have seen your posts for many weeks now and with affection desire your benefit.

My dear brother, perhaps my own testimony may help you. I also came to a severe struggle after hearing Paul Washer's Youth Evangelism sermon, amongst others. I had gone to bible college, been a missionary, and other things, yet in his sermons I realized something was missing. That "something" was a natural - or supernatural, if you will - hungering and thirsting after righteousness. I wanted to obey the bible to a convenient extent, but I had no hunger to be "perfect as the Father in heaven is perfect".

Soon I came to realize that new birth produces hunger after Christ's life in us, hunger after holiness. Without new birth, I could not be saved.

Yet, I also realized that no amount of perfection could make me acceptable to God.

"I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain." — Gal. 2:21.

What has scripture asked us to do that we may be saved? To believe on Christ as our righteousness. We are not told to believe on a feeling, nor upon Christ plus our obedience, but upon Christ alone, and upon His grace towards all who believe.

Romans 10

"4For Christ is the [b]end of the law[/b] for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:)
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)"

That is, do not think that to be saved one must attain to heaven on earth or prove your worth by traveling into hell and back again first...

"8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed."

The question comes then, How do I know if I have believed? How do I know if I have been born of God?

As a style of life do you set your mind on things of this world or upon things above?

Colossians 3:1-3

"If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God."

Do you love the world? That is, do you predominantly find your gratification in sinful things, or are your failings now bitter to your soul?

1 John 15-17
"Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever."

What is the will of God? That you believe on Him whom He sent.

John 6:27-29

"Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed.
28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent."

In short, you must surrender yourself to the kindness and goodness of God to do works necessary to save you. Give your salvation to His care, for He cares for you. Meanwhile, you must begin to thank him with obedience and service.

Though for years I had been very religious and devoted, shed many tears over sin and desired a form of godliness; at times cried out loudly to Jesus to change me, and gave unusual attention to the scriptures and prayer - yet for all this I had not understood the Gospel nor the imperative of "you MUST be born again." I thought, in heart if not in confession, that to be "born again" meant that I had prayed the prayer, felt a feeling, made a commitment, and tried my "best" to live according to the word. Surely it had never occurred to me that those who are "born again" of God's Spirit do not, as course of nature, give themselves to worldliness and set their minds on earthly things. (1 John) That seemed impossible to my then-unbelieving heart. But what is impossible for man is possible with God!

God, in His wisdom and providence, has made an example of me. I now understand what Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 13, that a man can "give his body to be burned, and yet not have love," the true love of Christ living through him.

My dear friend, consider how good and gracious God's love is! Hear His Spirit through this most wonderful scripture, Titus 3:3

"For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another."

Ephesians 2:2-3, makes our position before salvation even more stark:

"Remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, WITHOUT HOPE and WITHOUT GOD in the world."

Until the Father draws a person by the influence and regeneration of the Spirit, that man is foreign to every promise of God. The promises come by faith alone, and faith comes only by hearing with spiritual ears. Jesus told the pharisees, "you are not my sheep, therefore you cannot hear." All men are by nature un-hearing, and will never willingly hear God unless He moves upon them in grace to give them hearing ears. "The hearing ear, and the seeing eye, the LORD hath made even both of them." [Proverbs 20:12] This is why Jesus said, "My sheep hear my voice and follow me," and "I lay down my life for the sheep. And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd."

Those who hear the voice of Jesus are the sheep of His flock. He is a truly good shepherd. He gives us our food, He leads us to still waters and causes the cup of our joys in the Spirit to overflow. He gave His precious life for us so that none can snatch us from His hand.

Think of the grace, the exquisite, lovely, free grace of God; that He did not save anyone BECAUSE they sought Him or chose Him. Rather, we who choose Him do so because somewhere in the garden of Garden of Gethsemane He prayed with blood for us to come. Because somewhere in the timelessness of eternity He called and elected us to grace. [Romans 8:29] "He hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace." [Ephesians 1:4-7]

Which of us would have chosen anything besides sin if He did not open our ears?

"God looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, that did seek God. Every one of them is gone back: they are altogether become filthy; there is none that doeth good, no, not one." [Psalm 53:2-3] And, "the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God." [Romans 8:7-8]

We all deserved hell and nothing else forever. The unquenchable fires and desolate, lonely torments of a million - no, endless millions of years, this was our just wage for even the slightest sins against His awesome holiness. Feel something of the burning, something of the endless weeping and gnashing. And the unstoppable hate we would feel towards our Creator, it is almost unbearable to think of! If He had not drawn us we would, as others, run right out into the judgment still trusting in our own righteousness or, even worse, believing that God is unjust enough to pardon sinners not clothed in Christ.

Again, let us look to Titus 3:4-8

"But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
NOT BY WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE, but ACCORDING TO HIS MERCY HE SAVED US, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
That being JUSTIFIED BY HIS GRACE, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life."

Does anyone deserve to come to Him? No. Would anyone come to Him on their own? No. Is anyone justified because they "asked Jesus into their heart." No. We are not saved because we asked, obeyed, or did anything... we did those things because we were BEING SAVED BY HIM. This is why we call Him the AUTHOR and FINISHER of salvation. He is not co-author. Our name is not in the credits, for all is done by grace.

Hebrews 13:20-21, "Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
21Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen."

God saves His sheep because He is gracious. He has chosen a bride for His son not according to our works, but according to His kindness. We are not saved by commitments, prayers, or continued obedience - we are justified freely by His blood which needs no added works. This does not negate the essential commands to persevere; it makes them possible! So let us work boldly for Him out of thankfulness.

What it is to be "born again", I have discovered, is a supernatural transformation performed by the Spirit of God that turns the whole tide against selfishness and gives us a birthright to grateful holiness. It assures us of our position as heirs and changes our natures to long after Christ.

May God enable you to draw deeply from the Fountain of living waters, from the precious Lord Jesus, who enables us to rejoice always in His constant love.

T
thomasm Oct 12, 2007

I think, we have all been there, God uses these times to cause us to hunger after him. Im praying the prayer of eph 1;15-23, for you my brother, that Jesus, may give you what you need in this season you are going through, so he can bring you into a new season of his grace.

love In CHRIST tom
ps In times like these, focus on Jesus, he is our everthing, in him there is no condemnation, only love.His blood is enough.

M
myfirstLove Oct 12, 2007

You should read John Bunyun and David Brainerd's testimony. Finney has a similar one too. They knew when God granted them repentance. Mine was similiar to theirs when it came to the feeling and revelation of the gospel part. The peace of God that is not like the world came upon me and I knew God saved me!

I'll be praying for you. No doubt, I believe God is drawing you.

P
psalm1 Oct 13, 2007

reformer, dont leave si, draw on your bretheren.I have always hoped to encourage the bretheren. Like first love said read pilgrams progress.YOU WILL BE SO BLESSED.
Pilgrims progress will solidify your walk.
What you are experiencing is what John the baptist experienced.
I know I have experienced it too.
I can also tell you, you will experience it again.
Next time you will be ready and God will show you how to encourage yourself in the Lord.
You are your own best preacher!
So preach to yourself!
Make a sermon frrom ps 91.
then take a good look at the patriarchs in heb 11
READ PILGRIMS PROGRESS!
It is required reading in some bible colleges
This is only a test...........


......David

P
psalm1 Oct 13, 2007

Reformer, hey bro we're not home yet.....but maybe soon we will see him face to face. Thats EXCITING!!!!!!!
Remember our christian walk is a walk. Not a ride.
Sometimes you just have to move foreward.....When you take a step[this is faith]God meets you.
Do you worship him privately? And sit in his presence?
Sometimes when I worship him it takes a while but he always comes and sometimes so powerfull it feels like waves of his beautifull presence.
God bless you
.......David


sermonindex Oct 13, 2007


reformer said

I have been seeking the Lord about this and nothing yet has happened to where I hear Him say to me "Thou are saved!"
Brother, I have the feeling this is something we don't hear until we leave our mortality behind.

If you do a study, you'll find all three tenses represented in the New Testament (past, present\\present continuous and future.

This is the reason Peter talks about enduring to the end, and John barely uses the word 'faith'. It is all about 'believe', meaning 'now' and 'today'.

There certainly is a place of assurance that we know Him, but dwelling in that assurance without taking it for granted, requires continual refreshement, and many little reminders and tests to cause us to turn to Him again and again until it's the first thing we think of for any thing, any time.

One thing I'd recommend apart from Pilgrim's Progress, is to read the New Testament in Young's Literal Translation. That may seem like quite a hill to climb, but I don't think you'd regret it.

Also, as you may know, I cannot overstate how helpful I found Tyndale's New Testament. Even the prologues to each book are a joy to the soul.

But you know, what you're looking for from God isn't necessarily going to come because of something you've done, but because of something He will do.

In the past I had a lot of spiritual paralysis, and I always felt I needed someone else to do the praying to release me at those times, until I discovered I could ask God to break into my situation, rather than being stuck in a mindset which said I was helpless. I know that seems paradoxical. Another thing I learned about praying, was to put into words what I thought I knew about my situation, and then prayed around it by challenging it, as if I was praying for someone else in that situation.

What David said about preaching to oneself is also very true.

One last thought about faith is, that the faith of the Son took Him from heaven, through life and the cross to a place where He was completely dependent on His Father to raise Him up again. He believed. In John 10 He says He'd received that 'commandment' from His Father, to be able to take up His life again. That got me thinking about the word 'command'. God [i]commanded[/i] the blessing, even life for evermore. It is His faith which is going to raise you up when you are identified with His death. It's not something you do, it's something you receive.

David asked 'What shall I render unto the Lord' then answered his own question like this:

I'll take the cup of salvation.


Not for a second do I think you need to be saved in the way one needs when one first turns to the Lord, but we give ourselves a hard time simply because we use the word 'saved', which is more to do with what Jesus has done, than a condition we can claim for ourselves without another thought. God is intent on bringing us into ever closer communion with Himself, and He has a way of paying out His revelation to us of what we need, so that (for a start, we can stand it!) He is using every nuance of who and where we are, to inform us about His mind and will. He uses all our circumstances, past, conditioning, people we know, ways we think, to lead us on, and when we are ready and He is ready, He allows or causes a confluence of events\\circumstances, by which we [i]must[/i] grow if we keep trusting Him. Even if you have no idea what this is about, you can trust Him to keep you.

'I will never leave you or forsake you' is not a New Testament promise.

EDIT: I mean, it was first made in the Old Testament. end edit.

I need something more. [b]i am not sure what that is, but[/b] I know it isn't an audible voice or a flash of light. But I seek something that only God can do, if He is willing.
You've hit on a truth here. We all know that God knows what you need, but this process is so that [i]you[/i] find out what you need, then you can ask Him and He'll give it to you. Basically, this is what prayer is all about... learning to communicate in a meaningful way with the Almighty.

thomasm said

I think, we have all been there, God uses these times to cause us to hunger after him.
Also, He wants us to learn to rest in Him - in the efficacy of all His work. The challenge then, is to receive His death with joy, that we may be joined with His life.

sermonindex Oct 13, 2007

Here's a verse that has always helped me:

Romans 8:1 (King James Version)
1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

If you love God and hate sin than I know you are walking after the spirit so there is no condemnation to you. : )


I remember when I first got saved I would find a verse that really spoke to me and just hang on to that one verse until it got into my spirit. Sometimes we read God's word but we don't let it get into our spirit and than they are just words on paper.Sometimes it may take several days before it gets into your spirit but just pray and ask God to give you the revelation and He will.


sermonindex Oct 13, 2007

reformer said

I am struggling with this issue about my salvation for a couple months now. I have been seeking the Lord about this and nothing yet has happened to where I hear Him say to me "Thou are saved!" I don't know what is going on with me at this point, I have always felt pretty strong about my faith, but recently somethings have caused me to be concerned. I don't know if I am seeking a revelation from God, but in a way I am. I have listened to Paul Washer give testimonies about others who doubted their assurance and wrestled with God over it; God heard their cries and answered them to where they know now!! Just believing isn't enough. I need something more. i am not sure what that is, but I know it isn't an audible voice or a flash of light. But I seek something that only God can do, if He is willing.

Brother, better safe than sorry.

It's far, far healthier for you to be worried about your standing with the Lord than to be "at ease in Zion" (AMOS 6:1). It's better to be alarmed than asleep.

As the old Scottish proverb states, "a man warned is half armed".

A word of warning: don't tempt the Lord for the "signs and wonders" types of evidence of salvation.

"And when the people were gathered thick together, he began to say, This is an evil generation: they seek a sign; and there shall no sign be given it..." (LUKE 11:29)

The enemy can make you feel, hear, and see things, too... Don't be seduced by sensually "spiritual" experiences.

"For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect." (MARK 13:22)

"Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?" (MATT 7:16)

Are you more patient than before? More generous? Do you listen to people that need a friendly ear? Do you ever call up that aunt that annoys everyone else in your family? Do you do little extras at your job to help your coworkers out?

Are you a "peculiar (person) zealous of good works"? (TIT 2:14)

Seeing a vision of an angel with the wingspan of a 747 or speaking in tongues is no substitute for taking your mom's trash out... or helping an old lady across the street... or asking that homeless guy how his day's been... or slipping him a few dollars...

Brother, [i]your fruit is your evidence of being filled with the Holy Ghost.[/i]

We won't be judged for our gifts, visions, or whatever else... we'll be judged by our fruit.

"And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me." (MATT 25:40)

sermonindex Oct 13, 2007

This maybe a shock to some, but I am so down and confused now, it is causing me to even wonder if I have ever been saved. I don't know if I am just beaten up spiritually and being a doubter because of circumstances? Until I know with out a doubt I am His, I won't be back to SI. I can't fake it anymore while I am struggling with this issue.
Brother Mike, your not a fake. I have wondered these things myself, we ALL do at times. It would be wise if you remained here on SI, the last thing you need to do is drop an avenue that is encouraging you.

I remember some years ago when a brother and I were praying for personal revival. We prayed every night for a few hours and he would share with me what the LORD was saying to him (he is a prophet). After a couple of months of this, I was getting a little jealous of this. I thought, "How come God is not talking to me". I thought something was wrong with me. So here was my solution to the problem, I said, "I am going to stop praying until God speaks to me". Looking back at that, I hide my head in shame, how foolish. My answer should have been, "I am determined to seek God if it kills me and God will have no choice but to speak to me because I am going to get into His face". But instead I did a belly flop right into sin and immorality.

Mike, this is not just an ordinary website, this is a God ordained website for people like you and me to come and to give and receive. At a critical time in your life that concerns your salvation, God knew that you were going to doubt your salvation so he placed you in a place where you will receive encouragement. Don't turn away His provision. The Brothers and Sisters on this forum know exactly where your coming from, they have been there. And they have been hand picked by the LORD to be apart of this online ministry to share what they have gone thru that you and I might share in the benefits of their testimony.

It would be a wise act that you stay with us my Brother, don't do what I did. I went thru hell for my foolish counsel so that you and others won't have to. But be strong and of good courage. YOU ARE SAVED!

B
Blunt Oct 13, 2007

I have had this question in my mind and I have also STRIVED to enter in through the narrow gate.

As I was dealing with this issue a father in the faith once siad to me " Would you be asking me this question (with this amount of concern ) if you were not saved?" .He went on to say the unregenerate just do not care about the True and Living GOD.It sounds like you do!
The world hates Jesus.It does not sound like you consider the cross to be foolishness.
Brother rejoice for you are not a fake,phony ,hypocrite,etc.

Remember when Jesus healed the leper.The leper siad "IF YOU ARE WILLING LORD YOU CAN make me clean".JESUS REACHED out HIS HAND and siad" I AM WILLING,Be CLEANSED!"This is the Nature of our Saving GOD.

No doubt SATAN is trying to shipwreck you.He knows the word also and he will use it against you.Let the Lord minister to you.BE STILL.

I will be praying for you BRO.

BLUNT

T
TimmyJoe Oct 13, 2007

Oh my brother, I have been there and believe every true believer has too. John Wesley struggled greatly with this.

This is something Paul Washer said that has greatly helped me,"Some of you need to go out to the woods and throw stones at heaven with boldness until you get an answer." Now I never did that, but I cried before God with boldness and honesty. YOU GOTTA GET REAL WITH GOD! This is NOT A GAME. This is not an intellectual matter, but a matter of the heart. You will never understand it all, so forget that.

Look at the gospels and see how our Lord was never impressed with anyones intellect, but with faith. By faith are you saved! Read the Word of God, Pray like you expect an answer, Cry out to God in faith and be honest. If you're faith is weak tell God. Because he already knows.

I LOVE YOU BROTHER! I will pray for you, but you must get real with God. You either believe or you don't.

With Love, TimmyJoe

R
roaringlamb Oct 13, 2007

Brother do you believe that you are a great sinner, and that Christ died for those sins?

If so, you are justified before God, for a natural man does not believe these things, and rather he rebels against them, and seeks to build a ladder of his own works to gain entrance to Heaven by them.

If you have faith brother, you are justified. End of story. The tribunal of God has declared you innocent, and Christ's righteousness is imputed to you.

What you are experiencing is the struggle of sanctification, and you will have this so long as you dwell here.

Brother this is why I tell people not to read Finney, and others who would tell a poor soul that justification is based upon sanctification, or that our works must match our profession in order for us to be saved. But it is an objective truth(apart from feelings) that Christ has died to save sinners, and this He does completely apart from our work.

If you continue to look inwardly for some sense of glory brother you will continue in despair, for you will find only brief bits of light overshadowed by the overwhelming reality of remaining sin. That is why we are told to look away from ourselves to Him who has saved us. He has obeyed for us, and He drank the cup of wrath we were to drink fully.

I will pray brother, that you see Christ as sufficient to save you, and that all measure of self righteousness be done away with so you rest in His righteousness.

Grace and peace to you dear brother.

C
ccchhhrrriiisss Oct 13, 2007

Hi reformer...

You are not alone. Your struggle isn't isolated to just you. I feel that it is a historic issue that believers (yes, believers) have struggled with for years. Your words remind me of the testimony of Charles Finney and John Bunyan in their autobiographies.

There is an assurance of salvation that comes from Christ. Be encouraged that Christ will NOT despise you if you come to him. Even during seasons where we are not as "emotional" as we would like, the truth of God's Word is enough. His eyes are always upon us.

I will be praying for you, my brother! Be encouraged to continue in God's Word and prayer.

:-)

R
roaringlamb Oct 13, 2007

I wanted to add some verses that came to mind-

John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and [b]him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.[/b]
John 6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of [b]all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.[/b]

Brother I might suggest a book entitled "The Bruised Reed" by Richard Sibbes. It is fairly inexpensive money wise, but priceless in its value to the soul.

R
roadsign Oct 13, 2007

I am so down and confused now, it is causing me to even wonder if I have ever been saved.
I don't know if I am just beaten up spiritually and being a doubter because of circumstances?

Mike! Your salvation is not dependent on what you feel about it. It is dependent on God. There are countless who are very assured about their salvation, but, are really trusting in their assurance. But assurance is not what gets people into heaven.

Maybe God is taking you through this time of doubt so that you will learn to trust HIM, and not yourself. Can you trust GOD to get you through to the end?


Until I know with out a doubt I am His, I won't be back to SI. I can't fake it anymore while I am struggling with this issue.

Faking? It seems like you are being honest about how you feel right now.

Someone once said to me, “It’s impossible to be totally free from hypocrisy.” I am inclined to believe that more and more, and am convinced that only God knows what I am still faking (unconsciously, of course). I am reliant on him to lead me to truth and honesty in the inner places.

I hope you change your mind about your presence on SI. This is not the place where only the fully honest dwell, after all. … or maybe nobody should be here.

Diane

sermonindex Oct 13, 2007

I appreciate it so much all the encouragement and prayers. I have been reluctant to get back on SI. I don't plan on totally forsaking it, I just felt that I should take a break. There is so much spiritual food on SI, I don't think my body can take it. I can't speak for all churches, but the ones that I have been apart of, NEVER had doctrine like this! When the truth of Gods Word is proclaimed without compromise its exciting and then on the same token there is much despair because it is not preached this way in most places.

I have took the advice from Paul Washer and went into the woods to throw rocks at heaven. I rented a cabin and prayed, cried to the Lord and read for a few hours. It was hot, no electricity and I couldn't even get the fire started, so I quit and went home! I was crushed and defeated. I just don't have it in me anymore to knock on the door of heaven. I am a spoiled brat i have to say, when I don't get my way, I then begin to see myself sin and then more guilt is heaped on me.

It is just hard for me to put this into words, but it is the darkest struggle I have been in. Maybe I covet to much of others revelation and insight of the Cross. But, I can't let it go, I don't just want to believe, I want something deeper. I just want to make sure its not head knowledge. listening to these Godly men on SI, they have such a deep understanding of Christ, they know something that most evangelicals don't. Its one thing to say HE is Holy! But to really believe this! TO know it! that one thing. Words are thrown around at church life and christian life carelessly. Its our lingo! It takes away the biblical meaning of those words. Example from Paul Washer from a video clip on the name of Jesus. Its amazing to hear and humbling.
http://reformationnation.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/paul-washer-on-the-name-of-jesus/

because I don't have this type of understanding that others have, it causes me to wonder about my faith! God is Holy and Righteous, I have learned this and said this upteen times! I want to know it for myself! ITs all in Gods hands, He chooses those whom He chooses. I can't force Him.

Its weird right now thanks for understanding.

Mike

A
awakenwithin Oct 13, 2007

Blessed be God, for out hardest times come the most wonderful work of God in our hearts. For this when we cry out with all we have. Brother I am so thankful for this trail for God is with you to draw you to Himself. He wants you to know Him. What wonderful truth we do while to know. I think about the men in bible how God spoke to them. God dosn't let go of His child. He will bring you through. Don't give up their is hope in Chrit. But Bless be God. He want his children to want him to hear his voice. We can get caught up in men. sermons and books. But to know our God we must be with Him alone. The battle is hard. these last two week, I have questioned if God had called me to prayer, I have had such struggles..When we do things out of our flesh we fall, and get upset. But I think that there are time I sought God and it didn't turn out the way I wanted. This is a time to get deep in our hearts and see our thoughts. To see if there is any sin.
Brother I am praying for you.. and will keep doing so, I am thankful when we are not faithful he is. but I know God doing a wonderful work in our heart. Praise God for grace he has given you. To see what you are seeing, that is grace a gift from God

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in his love
charlene

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dohzman Oct 13, 2007

John 20:24-29

It's still a faith walk. We walk(live) by faith not by sight.

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osasbright Oct 14, 2007

I will advise other members to strive with me in prayer for brother mike.

if we all could make an intercession for him, i believe our brother's confidence will be restored back.

Let us not only exhort him with words but rather do the most important thing , which is prayer.

Remember, he that saves a soul covers a multitude of sin.

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