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Evangelism

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todd May 27, 2004

Outside of the gospels, wherein Jesus Christ Himself directly commissions the disciples in evangelsitic types of endeavors, is there any other New Testament exhortations to evangelize? Not implied, but clearly stated?

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rocklife May 27, 2004

Paul says copy him in 1 Cor 4:16, and 1 John 2:6 says copy Jesus. Paul and Jesus went fishing for men and doing good, all for the glory of God. Jude vs 22-23 says "Be merciful to those who doubt; snatch others from the fire and save them; to others show mercy, mixed with fear- hating even the clothing stained by corrupted flesh." I encourage evangelism, I think that's one of the most loving things we can do for people (I also evangelize as God directs). It is surprising to then read in Rev 22:11 "Let him who does wrong continue to do wrong; let him who is vile continue to be vile; let him who does right continue to do right; and let him who is holy continue to be holy." That Scripture seems a little odd to me. (I'd appreciate any insights myself)

sermonindex May 27, 2004

Outside of the gospels, wherein Jesus Christ Himself directly commissions the disciples in evangelsitic types of endeavors, is there any other New Testament exhortations to evangelize? Not implied, but clearly stated? Brother Todd, thats a great question and I know there are many scriptures that clearly say for us to 'evangelize' (tell others verbally about Jesus Christ and how in Him is life). But I think this is a great place to also share something I feel is right on this topic. In another thread Chanin (moreofhim) and myself ran into this topic and we felt for every christian to go out and street preach or proclaim CHRIST in a very outward verbal way all the time seemed abit weird. Sure there are many called to do that and that is their calling, and callings cannot be taught by men but given by God. I think the scriptures are clear in that our life (which is Christ in us) bears witness to the world, in our good deeds, actions, words, conduct, behaviour. This is the best way of evangelizing: Just being a Christian, being in Christ and abiding in Him. Sure there is times to verbally share the faith but for all Christians to go out on the streets and proclaim Christ, some being in sin, others not even knowing Christ, others even speaking out of a wrong spirit, then the world would definetly not get the right impression. And to back that all up its not biblical.I hope my point is taken without offense and its in no way exuastive. If this thread matures I am sure the we all will have time to get out many scriptures to get a more detailed picture of this. It's so encouraging to see you all striving after truth. Surely its the Love of truth that keeps us from going astray by the mercy of God. ;-)

K
KeithLaMothe May 27, 2004

The commands in the Gospels should not be treated as "only for the early church" without good cause, but if you want other verses:Acts 1:8But ye shall receive power after the Holy Ghost is come upon you; and ye shall be witnesses unto Me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth."Romans 1012 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich unto all who call upon Him.13 For "whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."14 How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?15 And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written: "How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the Gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!"16 But they have not all obeyed the Gospel. For Isaiah saith, "Lord, who hath believed our report?"17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God.2 Timothy 41 I charge thee therefore before God and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at His appearing and His Kingdom:2 preach the Word; be instant in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.James 519 Brethren, if any of you err from the truth and one convert him, 20 let him know that he who converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.(It's talking about turning believers from sin to save them from spiritual death, but the situation isn't that different with the non-believers)Jude20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,21 keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life. 22 And on some have compassion, making a difference;23 and others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire, hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.As mentioned above, Paul also exhorted his readers to imitate him as he imitated Christ; both Paul and Christ did quite a bit of what we might call "evangelism."I think the emphasis is more on preaching the Word and discipling people, not making quite as sharp a distinction as we do today between preaching to believers and preaching to non-believers.edit:As for the calling or lack thereof needed for evangelism; I do believe there are some specially called to the duty, but I also believe every mature believer should have the knowledge, faith, and courage (from faith) to preach the Law and the Gospel in the open air. Not that they have to do so, but the reason for them not doing so should not be lack of knowledge, lack of faith, fear of men or lack of fear of God. I could go into verses supporting public preaching of the Word (for evangelism and other things), but I think I'll refrain from quoting the whole Bible in every post :)

M
matthew May 27, 2004

but for all Christians to go out on the streets and proclaim Christ, some being in sin, others not even knowing Christ, others even speaking out of a wrong spirit, I must first ask for clarification, are you of the opinion that those who continue (I know that's not your word if I've misinterpreted your words I apologize) in sin, and those who do not know him ARE Christians?John 17:3Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent. Also,Philippians 117The former preach Christ out of selfish ambition, not sincerely, supposing that they can stir up trouble for me while I am in chains.[1] 18But what does it matter? The important thing is that in every way, whether from false motives or true, Christ is preached. And because of this I rejoice. 19Yes, and I will continue to rejoice, for I know that through your prayers and the help given by the Spirit of Jesus Christ, what has happened to me will turn out for my deliverance.Paul is pleased that people are preaching Christ to make trouble for him. That is deffinitly not the right motivation...butThe important thing is that in every way, whether from false motives or true, Christ is preached. And because of this I rejoice.

M
matthew May 27, 2004

Given this is not the case, but IF there were NOTHING save the command of Jesus to evangelize, would that not be enough? Maybe I'm missing your intent in asking, if so Sorry...

M
moreofHim May 27, 2004

Just wondering... isn't sending out 100's of copies of the Revival Hymn- evangelism? isn't having this site to spread the true gospel considered evangelism? Or is evangelism only considered to be public speaking? If so, there are many who might not be capable of this.We all need to do the best with what we've got - the gifts we have. As we grow in Christ- I am sure He will lead us to do what we are supposed to do.In my lifetime, I don't know how many non-christians I will explain the gospel to. I do know that I have a heart to explain the true-full gospel to "christians"- to challenge them to live up to the name of Christian. To wake them up from their sleep.If I had the opportunity to talk to non christians about my faith- then I take the opportunity. But I feel my calling is to the exhisting church. We all have different callings and gifts which gives us a heart or passion instinctively for certain things.-in Him, chanin

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crsschk May 27, 2004

Yes, a concurring thought that has been foremost in mind of late and with complete honesty I am a bit perplexed as to what the Lord would have me do.I can't but help being drawn back to what transpired at Pentecost, the sharp, distinct transformation of the disciples and especially of Peter who had only weeks before denied his Lord.A message that I have been listening to once again is; Martyrdom From Art Katz. Though this doesn't pertain exactly to 'evangelism' there is much that does lend itself to being living examples and specifically an emphasis on one telling word; FullFull of the Spirit.The example being primarily centered around Stephen in Acts 6 and 7.Act 6:5 "...So they chose Stephen, a man full of faith and the Holy Spirit..."Act 6:10 "But they couldn't resist the wisdom and the Spirit by which he kept speaking."Act 6:15 "Then all who were seated in the Council glared at him and saw that his face was like the face of an angel." Have always been fascinated by Stephen, by his character. Humble enough to be the equivalent of a 'bus boy', full of the Holy Spirit he goes on to give a masterful defense of the Christian faith along with a tongue lashing at the end (verse 51 and following). Then to top it all off and note again the emphasis of verse 55 "Act 7:55 " But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God" as he is being taken down under a hail of stones still says "Lord, lay not this sin to their charge."Another word that is predominate is: Unction (thanks Robert for bring that back to my recollection)Hopefully you can see where I am going with all this. But as it pertains to me personally all I can say is it seems that I am 'waiting', still...Still dying to self (Praise God!)Less of 'me'.."He must increase, I must decrease"I had to pause to try and get my thoughts together, went to prayer and this came to mind;Mat 7:22 "Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." I don't want to try and make this say what it is not saying out of context, but isn't there something key here? As I have alluded to before I hate 'sales' as something you 'do' because you 'should' or it's your 'job'. In the past even as a heathen found myself forced into this type of position and you might have as well written LIAR across my forehead, had to be the worlds worst salesman, just didn't have it in me to try and convince people to buy something. It was just phony, forced, dishonest...just couldn't do it.Sorry to be redundant again, but after going through the "Becoming a Contagious Christian class" it felt exactly the same, for me. I don't want to knock it or any other similar...like what Ray Comfort is doing for instance.I guess part of what I am trying to get at is this recurring thought of what seems to be hovering over much of modern day Christianity. Things are out of order.An easy-believism has produced a very different kind of 'believer' and a whole host of disciples that just ape their leaders and produce more of the same 'kind'. What about repentance? Are we really presenting conversion or is it more 'adaption'?Along that line is this comment from another excellent thread:Christian PerfectionFor some time I have been puzzled by a strange omission in modern Evangelicalism. Literature dealing with the issues of heart holiness has been conspicuous mainly by its absence. (Philologos) It is very easy to tell someone about Jesus, about faith, about Christianity and it seems that it can be construed as "well, I did my part", here's a tract, stop by my church sometime and then we end up with what brother Katz coins as the "succession of Sunday services" syndrome, like some kind of garment you take on and off. To use another great quote from Leonard Ravenhill: "What happens when they get shipped up the Amazon?"On the one hand I am truly glad that I kept my big mouth shut early on in this walk, being caught up in all kinds of false doctrine. There would have been an awful lot of backtracking to do. It took a lot of time to assimilate all this muddy teaching and even longer to unlearn it all.I praise God that He led me back down the old paths, to some 'hard' teaching, to a lot of things that I just recoiled at, though I knew they were true. Then that glorious day!SermonIndex! Oh my! I am not alone!"Thank you Lord!" and I haven't stopped thanking Him yet. To quote Paris Reidhead "...it changed it all!What I have learned here, from the messages, from you all...couldn't adequately express my gratitude. Taking stock of where I am now, looking back over the last year, shoot even the last month, it's quite incredible.But how does all this pertain to this subject?I don't know! :-P Do I fear men? Honestly?Nah, that's not it.Ridicule? Scorn? Embarrassment? Being made a 'fool'?Nah, grew up as a skinny little twerp, shy, reserved, harassed, then grew my hair long to boot...So just what is it that keeps my mouth shut?Mis-representation, think I fear that more than anything and the other thing is I feel compelled right now to keep my mouth shut in a way. Isn't that bizarre? It's almost like a "...my time has not yet come" and yet I can feel it just building up inside me at the same time. Don't get me wrong here, if spiritual matters come up, it does come out, boy does it come out, just hope it is not zeal without knowledge, I can ramble on (obviously!) with the best of them.But to go actively 'evangelising'...I don't know, may not be my calling or maybe it truly is and this is what I am being prepared for.Maybe I am just deceived.Maybe I need to have a fire lit under my...Maybe all this is just a covering for lack of courage? So easy to just talk here rather than face to face...Maybe someone can see through all this and exhort me, rebuke me, challenge me. You can't offend me so let me have it!Just want to be transparent here, time is short, many are perishing. In the mean time will keep waiting, keep praying and seeking the Lord. It doesn't matter what it is I am to be doing, just want to be about my Lords business because He is worthy! Forgive me, this is disjointed, but consider the source :-(... just musing out loud.

M
moreofHim May 27, 2004

personally- and I know I will have those who differ! I believe you have to sit at Jesus' feet first- learn all you can learn to get direction from Him. We will have plenty of opportunities to do whatever the Lord asks of us. But to me, He is my priority- ministering to Him. Waiting on Him. Someone recently shared with me this article called The Priests of the Lord.( http://www.watchman.net/articles/priests2.html ) How some are called to minister to others in the outer court and others are called to minister to the Lord in the inner court. Very eye opening. Neat how the priests in this certian temple (Ezekiel's temple I think) were to wear linen only- so as not to sweat- as in no works of the flesh) there were times when they did go to the outer courts too-but they were required to change their clothes.Anyway, I believe you are on the right track. :)I know many people who share the gospel via. the "FOur Spiritual Laws" and i know they are out and out hypocrites. Those who they are witnessing can se their lifestyle and their actions very plainly. Are they to believe this is ok? Are they being made into worse sinners than the person witnessing? I believe that could be the case. I wouldn't want that on my hands.I look back at my own example a few years ago- calling myself a "christian" and my actions are an embaressment to me. I defiled the Lord's name by making it seem that some things were ok while I called myself a christian. I know what you mean there.I would rather be wasted on the Lord and know for sure that I did not miss out then run around like a Martha and be missing Jesus. Not many are wiling to pour themselves out for the Lord and be wasted on Him alone. We have been taught in the church that it is all about "do, do, do". If we are ministering to the Lord and waiting on Him, we will certainly be able to hear Him say "get up now, time to go do this" then we come back to his feet and wait for his next direction. :)Just my own thoughts.In Him, chanin

M
matthew May 27, 2004

Chanin,There are many forms that evangelism can take. absouletly. But I never ment to give the impression that it is "public speaking." Much of what I've read and heard, says that the most effective way to evangelize is 1-to-1.Paul says in 2 Tim 4:2, that we are to be READY to preach the word in season and out of season (those are the only two times ). :-) That "preaching" is not always done publicly. Phillip left public ministry to go to the dessert to evangelize 1-to-1 with the Ethiopian eunic.In fact Billy Graham has been reported to have said that public crusades will not effectivly change people, but 1-to-1 will.for what it's worthmatthew

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todd May 27, 2004

Matthew,You wrote:"Given this is not the case, but IF there were NOTHING save the command of Jesus to evangelize, would that not be enough? Maybe I'm missing your intent in asking, if so Sorry"Thanks for your humble and sincere inquiry. Good question. My response is that Jesus Himself commissioned those specific disciples at that moment in time. Some might argue that if we are Christians then we are disciples of Christ and then this applies to us today as well. While that kind of works, it's not an absolutely conclusive argument, just opinion. If Jesus said something like "and all who follow after Me are to verbally evangelize on a consistent basis" then the matter would be settled. But I haven't found any such statement. Here's what Jesus did say in prayer concerning all who would later believe:"I do not ask in behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; that they may all be one; even as Thou, Father, art in Me, and I in Thee, that they also may be in Us; that the world may believe that Thou didst send Me" (John 17:20-21). What I am getting at is the religious burden of evanglism. The one that says "You're not as loved and accepted by God if you're not consistantly sharing your faith with unbelievers." The one that says "You have to evangelize, it's your duty as a Christian."Doing it out of some religious motive with the kind of mindset that you have to do it to be loved and accepted by God is the big problem I think.I think R.A Torrey does an excellent job concerning this issue in "How to Witness to Anyone." He says:"Certain requirements must be fulfilled for real success in leading lost souls to Christ....First, be a born-again believer. If you desire to bring others to Christ, you must turn away from all sin, worldliness, and selfishness, allowing Jesus to be Lord over your thoughts, purposes, and actions.Second, truly love others and long for their salvation. If you have no love for other souls, your efforts will be mechanical and powerless. But if you, like Paul, have great heaviness and continual pain in your heart for the unsaved (Romans 9:2), the earnestness in your tone and manner will impress even the most uninterested person....Third, have a working knowledge of the Bible...Fourth, pray frequently. Pray about whom you should speak to and what you should say. Pray that you would speak powerfully.Fifth, be baptized in the Holy Spirit. After Jesus gave His disciples the Great Commission, He told them:"But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto Me..." (Acts 1:8)"We can do a lot of things...work our courage up, die to self, etc., but I don't think we will see "real success" unitl all 5 of these requirements are met. That doesn't mean God won't direct us to evangelize in some way without all 5 of these in perfect maturity, but as a general idea, if we want to see real succes... I think the majority of "evangelicals" in America who feel burdened to evanglize might fulfill requirement 3. Sometimes, maybe number 4 is sincere, and perhaps some truly fulfill number 1. However, if 2 and 5 are not real in us, I would say we won't see much "real success".If our motive isn't primarily love for God and out of that sincere love for others, I think we probably have a religious burden and that will only weigh us down and will be of little help to others, likely having a negative consequence for both. Yes, Paul said to imitate him as he did Christ. I don't think that's totally clear. So we should wait until we are 30 to start public ministry, as Christ did? Or wait until we have a divine light blind us for three days and someone prays for us and scales fall off our eyes, like Paul? Or, like Paul, must we first go to the desert for years and only learn from Christ before we're qualified? I think a lot of what Paul was getting at is to imitate him in character, though there's likely a lot more to it. Yeah, let's imitate Paul and Christ in reference to evangelism by not doing it until there's sincerity and right motives about it.

R
rocklife May 27, 2004

This thread has some great Scripture insights. You guys are so helpful!!! Praise God He can help the sheep from this form of communication!!!

K
KeithLaMothe May 27, 2004

There's an article I'd like you all to read about open-air preaching, I'd quote it here but it's probably simpler to give the link:http://www.gospeljohn.com/method_biblical.htmedit: I agree, by the way, that we should not evangelize/preach/witness/etc because of some sense of religious obligation, and those 5 points by Torrey sound about right to me. I believe, however, that if we don't fulfill those 5, we should earnestly seek God that He remedy the problems, we should not be complacent about whatever is disqualifying us from the work of preaching the Word.As for the whole "4 spiritual laws" approach, it has some serious Biblical deficiencies regardless of the character of the one using it, though obviously a hypocrite preaching the Gospel is likely to make converts twice as fit for hell as he/she is.

M
matthew May 28, 2004

"I desire mercy not sacrofice"I would say that anything we do out of religeous duty is "filthy rags."Paul though says 2 Cor 5:11"Since, then, we know what it is to fear the Lord, we try to persuade men."I know there is nothing directly stated here, but it implies that the direct result of the fear of the Lord (which is the beginning of wisdom) is a desire to persuade men to the faith.My question is then...(and I know this is a bold question but I make it an extreme position for the sake of the discussion):If we can have nothing of Wisdom without Fear, has there even been a Cristian reborn who was not given a desire to reach the lost? I agree that to do anything out of religeous duty is dangerous at best, However EQUALLY dangerous is grieving the spirit who gave us the desire to see the lost saved, by keeping silent because of the fear of men.What I am concerned happens is that TOO MANY of us keep silent because we fear men more then God.I know that TOO OFTEN that hapens with me. In the book of Isiah 51 God shows That to be an offence to Him when he says:12 "I, even I, am he who comforts you. Who are you that you fear mortal men, the sons of men, who are but grass, 13 that you forget the LORD your Maker, who stretched out the heavens and laid the foundations of the earth, that you live in constant terror every day because of the wrath of the oppressor, who is bent on destruction? For where is the wrath of the oppressor? 14 The cowering prisoners will soon be set free; they will not die in their dungeon, nor will they lack bread. 15 For I am the LORD your God, who churns up the sea so that its waves roar- the LORD Almighty is his name. 16 I have put my words in your mouth and covered you with the shadow of my hand- I who set the heavens in place, who laid the foundations of the earth, and who say to Zion, 'You are my people.' " Sorry about the length, this is something God has REALLY been working on me about. for what it's worthmatthew

C
crsschk May 28, 2004

Wow, outstanding you guy's (and girl's :-D)Thanks to all. Matt, love Is 51, a scripture that often comes to mind and makes one realize the absurdity of fearing man who are but grass as we all are, here today, gone tomorrow. Mere creatures that come in and go out of this world the same way.Like the Torrey assessment as well and it seems the train of thought I am following is not lost on anyone. I guess I just don't want to be deceived or am 'coping out'. I think I am more inclined, because of my own past experience, to be a bit overprotective when I have been 'witnessing', which is not often."Stay away from these guy's" "Whatever you do, don't listen to..."It's still coming together but I do feel that my role may be that of prayer and of 'feeding'. 'You guy's bring 'em in and will get them a change of clothes, make sure they are well fed and protected, will stand guard and fend off the wolves'. Exhort and encourage.There are fishers of men but somebody has to clean the guts out...Have been praying about this this morning and wrote down what I think the Lord is telling me, may share it at a later date. I know am pretty fond of the word 'seems', I prefer it because I don't trust most of what passes through this fallible mind. Yet I also trust and know that the Lord will confirm what He wills to preform.Some more scriptures that come to mind:Joh 21:16 "He saith to him again the second time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him,Feed my sheep."Joh 4:34 "Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to accomplish his work".Mat 9:37"Then saith he unto his disciples, The harvest truly is plenteous, but the labourers are few; Mat 9:38"Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest." Mat 28:19 "Go ye therefore, and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them into the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit: Mat 28:20 teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I commanded you: and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world".

M
matthew May 28, 2004

Your post made me think of this...1 Cor 12:12The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ. 13For we were all baptized by[3] one Spirit into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free--and we were all given the one Spirit to drink. 14Now the body is not made up of one part but of many. 15If the foot should say, "Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 16And if the ear should say, "Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 17If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18But in fact God has arranged the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. 19If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20As it is, there are many parts, but one body. I don't mean to make it seem as if everyone needs to be a mouth, I guess I just see the field as being SOO white, and the workers soooo few.matthew

A
Agent001 May 31, 2004

Preach the gospel at all times, if necessary use words.This quote is often attributed to Francis of Assisi; however, you will not find it in any of his works. Nevertheless, it captures the essence of what he was trying to say.

T
todd May 31, 2004

Quote:"2 Cor 5:11'Since, then, we know what it is to fear the Lord, we try to persuade men.'I know there is nothing directly stated here, but it implies that the direct result of the fear of the Lord (which is the beginning of wisdom) is a desire to persuade men to the faith."This is an interesting thought, and I don't totally understand that passage. I don't follow your logic that "it implies that the direct result of the fear of the Lord (which is the beginning of wisdom) is a desire to persuade men to the faith." It seems clear to me that, in context, Paul is referring primarily to persuading Christians towards godliness. What I get from that verse is that, since they have comprehension of the seriousness of life and eternity, how our temporal choices have eternal consequences, they persuade men in various ways with eternity in mind. So I definately think this can be applied to evangelism but I don't think it's the primary meaning.Quote:"My question is then...(and I know this is a bold question but I make it an extreme position for the sake of the discussion):If we can have nothing of Wisdom without Fear, has there even been a Cristian reborn who was not given a desire to reach the lost?"I think the answer is clearly "yes." As far as I can tell, fear and wisdom are not requirements for salvation. Quote:"I agree that to do anything out of religeous duty is dangerous at best, However EQUALLY dangerous is grieving the spirit who gave us the desire to see the lost saved, by keeping silent because of the fear of men.What I am concerned happens is that TOO MANY of us keep silent because we fear men more then God."I think you could be right about this, and I think the fear of man is a big problem. But I don't think the solution is somehow working ourselves up and overcoming our struggle with the fear of man. Then evangelism becomes more of a therapy for you so you can feel like you're ok and God is now ok with you. Then, if you do somehow overcome the fear of man, you will likely have to deal with pride issues and that's obviously dangerous. I think this type of awareness (i.e. a desire not to greive the Spirit) is useful to drive us into the secret place and become more desperate for God and His power. But God deals with us as individuals and takes us through seasons and works on certain areas at different times and in different ways... so I don't think every sincere believer is going to start out with a sincere and burning desire to see the lost saved. I believe that as we get more intimate with God and keep the first commandment first (loving God), the second one (ministry) will naturally come about in it's proper time and way. To force it for any reason seems dangerous. God doesn't love or accept us anymore on the basis of our works. I think that when we get right with God we won't fear man. So God direcely is our source and means of change, not our own efforts to try harder. Just getting closer to Him.

H
HakkaMin Jun 1, 2004

What an important thread! Thanks for all the comments offered and questions raised … good stuff. Hope you don’t mind my rambling a bit on several things that seem to flow throughout the thread. 1.\tIt can be quite dangerous to take the commands of Christ to His disciples and relegate them to the “not for us disciples today” pile without very good reason. If this door is opened too wide, think of the commands that might be banished outright. (“… love one another even as I have loved you,” and “…you also ought to wash one another’s feet.”) What’s to keep these commands – spoken only to the twelve – from being lumped into this pile for the same reasons? Of course there are times when the commands of Jesus were only for the twelve, but those are easy to spot as they were relevant to special times or circumstances. We’d have to work pretty hard to place Acts 1:8 and Matthew 28:19-20 in this special category. Though Acts 1:8 was apparently only spoken to the apostles, there is clear evidence that His whole message (verses 4-8) was also meant for other disciples of the time, and not just strictly the eleven. After all, it wasn’t just the eleven who waited in Jerusalem for the Spirit to be poured out. Acts 1:14-15 indicates that there were 120 believers waiting with the apostles for this outpouring. And they – along with the apostles – seem to have received it. If this part of Jesus’ Acts 1 message was heeded by other disciples at the time, might this be an indication that the command in verse 8 is for us as well?Matthew 28:19-20 is even easier to figure out. Jesus specifically tells the apostles to “teach them to observe all that I commanded you.” Think about it. This would mean that the apostles were under obligation to teach these “disciples of all the nations” (that’s us) to “go make disciples of all the nations.” This was, after all, one of the things that Jesus commanded them to do. We can know for sure, then, that this “Great Commission” is still a relevant command for all disciples today.Even though there are plenty of other New Testament scriptures (already listed in another post) that show our obligation to evangelize the lost, one might wonder why it isn’t mentioned more often or with greater clarity. Not to worry. I believe this only means that evangelism is one area that the early church got right. Most of the epistles were written to deal with issues or correct problems in the existing bodies. The historical record of the early church’s success in reaching the lost, along with this “lack of mention”, just shows how devoted these believers were to obeying the mission Jesus had given them. It’s been mentioned that maybe not every Christian is called to evangelism. I guess if one could show me an exemption from such a clear calling in the Word, I might buy it. Otherwise, it’s a bit of an iffy stand. (“Most Christians are called, but not me.”) I’ve encountered this thinking many times in the ministry we’re part of. A believer who would like to join our ministry team but indicates that their calling is discipleship and not evangelism. (Which always means, “I don’t want to do evangelism.”) My reply is always the same. What kind of disciples will you make if you are not actively involved in evangelism? Answer: Disciples who are not involved in evangelism. Disciples who don’t reach the lost. They will be molded by what they see in the “mature” discipler’s life and actions … and not just by the discipler’s teaching. They will end up following the example of “non-evangelism.” (And become a very unhealthy – unfruitful – disciple.)The whole Word of God reeks with the desires of God to set the captives free, and with our calling to partner with Him in this great mission. I think it was Hudson Taylor who said something like, “The Great Commission is a command to be obeyed, not a suggestion to be considered.” We have enough Christians today who will opt out of such a command … let’s be careful not to water it down for them. (Or for ourselves.)2.\tI think it’s a huge mistake to feel that we must get our lives and motives purified “enough” before stepping out in this great calling Jesus has given us. What is holiness but stepping out in obedience to the commands of Christ? Is there another practical definition I don’t know about? Should we ever delay obedience in order to become more obedient? Of course not! It has been suggested that we should obey the first (and greatest) command first, and that the second command will come naturally. Surely there is a relationship between the two, but the conclusion to wait is wrong. After all, the second command is a command. That means we are called to do it … whether we feel ready enough or not.It’s my experience that we actually put ourselves in a great position to purify our lives and motives when we step out in obedience to those things we might not be “ready” enough to accomplish. The very act of stepping out in obedience puts us in a position of growth. (I presume, of course, that I’m addressing believers on this board who desire to obey Jesus and live holy lives. This doesn’t apply to those church-going hypocrites – mentioned in an earlier post – whose hearts are not bent on following Jesus.) Also – let’s not presume that holiness or purified motives are a prerequisite for being used by God. Are any of us there yet? Not by a long shot. But God can use us in amazing ways if we allow Him to. We can even take heart (as Paul does in Philippians 1:18) that Christ is proclaimed even “in pretense.” (Not that we should ever aim or settle for such false motives. But Paul’s attitude sure puts things in a God-glorifying perspective.)In the final analysis, the “one who knows the right thing to do and does not do it, to him it is sin.” (James 4:17) I believe this would include our calling to evangelize the lost. Let’s not wait for perfection or maturity before obeying Jesus. Perfection and maturity are obeying Jesus.3.\tI agree that lifestyle is a very valid (read biblical) method of evangelism, but would caution against using an either/or stand in its application. Words without lifestyle is usually impotent. And lifestyle without words can be equally impotent. In other words, it’s usually not enough to preach or share when your life doesn’t match up. It’s also usually not enough to be a great example if you never end up communicating the actual gospel message at some point. We must have both if we want to be effective witnesses for Jesus. (The concept of lifestyle evangelism has often served as an obedience cop-out in many churches. The idea that as long as we live it we don’t need to preach it. This has sadly resulted in a “social gospel” approach to evangelism around the world.)Well, enough rambling for now. My bottom line is … let’s obey! We don’t have to be constrained by one method or strategy in reaching the lost, but let’s do be constrained by an obedience (yes, a “duty”) that results in God receiving the glory due His name.

M
matthew Jun 1, 2004

Is there any biblical support for this?It is a nice idea, but where is it in the bible?Actions are NECESSARY, but are words not also?matthew

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