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Should Christian Parents send their kids to public schools?

sermonindex May 28, 2008

We've discussed homeschooling a little on this forum. Most of you know that my wife and I homeschool our children.

Sometimes because of finances, or other situations, parents have no choice but to send their kids to public schools.

But I'm interested in hearing from those who purposely put their kids in public schools, and do not necessarily think homeschooling is the better option... or perhaps oppose homeschooling all together. Would like to hear your thoughts on the matter.

I'm not trying to pick a fight! Just really interested in hearing opposing views on this.

And on the flip side of that... how many here do homeschool?

Krispy

M
MaryJane May 28, 2008

Greetings
I homeschool my children all five of them.

God Bless
MJ

B
BenBrockway May 28, 2008


KrispyKrittr wrote:
We've discussed homeschooling a little on this forum. Most of you know that my wife and I homeschool our children.

Sometimes because of finances, or other situations, parents have no choice but to send their kids to public schools.

But I'm interested in hearing from those who purposely put their kids in public schools, and do not necessarily think homeschooling is the better option... or perhaps oppose homeschooling all together. Would like to hear your thoughts on the matter.

I'm not trying to pick a fight! Just really interested in hearing opposing views on this.

And on the flip side of that... how many here do homeschool?

Krispy


I'll give a little different perspective, as a formely homeschooled student...

I started out at a young age going to a Christian school. Unfortunately for me, in this situation, I was a PK and everyone in school knew that, and they didn't like it. Thoughts of me being a goodie-goodie and a tattle-teller, crossed most kid's minds and therefore I was one of the school's outcasts. I was always picked on, and never picked for P.E. sports or whatever. My spiritual growth kind of stunted for me as a child because of these things. I then was homeschooled and it was good. I didn't have to make friends, I had my brother and sister, and a pastor-dad, and mom. So, I grew in the Lord a good bit. I even ended up going back to the Christian school to finish out my last few years in "middle school," and it was all the same thing all over again.

But, quite honestly, I didn't really start to grow in the Lord until I went to public high school. It was strange. I had moved to a new state and going to the public school, I wasn't judged or mocked. Everyone accepted me. It was here at this public school that my faith grew ever so much stronger then it ever had previously. I am so thankful for the experience I had attending this public school.

That's my experience, though. I'm sure mine is different then most everyone's... ?

C
ccchhhrrriiisss May 28, 2008

Hi Krispy…

I certainly support homeschooling. My wife and I have all but decided that we will homeschool our children (when we actually have children and they reach school age).

I asked a question in the last home school thread that was overlooked (I think). My biggest concern with homeschooling actually lay with questions concerning the college acceptance/scholarship rate. My wife and I both relied upon large, national scholarships (as well as some minor ones) to pay for our university educations. I received a large scholarship from NASA that paid for both of my undergraduate degrees (paying for my tuition, fees, books, travel expenses, while also providing summer internships at NASA). My wife relied on several major scholarships for both her undergraduate and graduate degrees.

My wife’s sister will be graduating from a large public high school next week. Lucia will graduate at the top of her class, and was consequentially offered full scholarships at several major universities – public, private and Christian – including several Ivy League schools. She decided to accept a “full ride” academic scholarship at Stanford University that is worth at least $275,000. It pays for her tuition, fees, room, board, books, travel expenses, summers abroad (tuition, fees, room, board, travel, etc…), insurance, private tutoring, a laptop, school supplies, and a living stipend. In other words, she will not have to pay for any of her education out of her own pocket or through student loans or grants (however, she is permitted to apply for and keep the Pell Grant/Stafford Loans for whatever she deems necessary).

My question concerns the availability of such scholarships to those students who are homeschooled. Are there any figures that indicate the acceptance rate of homeschooled children at major colleges and universities? While walking Lucia through the application process (neither of her parents speak English), I noticed that some schools do not make a distinction between “home schools,” “private schools,” or “public schools.” However, I noticed that some seem less willing to accept a home school student. Why? A “class rank” matters to some schools.

There have been home school students admitted into Ivy League schools like Harvard. However, some of those students received “admission points” for other reasons (alumni/heritage points, higher SAT scores, etc…). While it is true that your SAT/ACT scores are the most defining criteria for admission, they are not the deciding factor (by far).

Lucia was accepted at several reputable universities. She was offered admission to Yale, Princeton, Dartmouth, Stanford, Penn, Wellesley, Baylor, Rice, Vanderbilt, Duke, Georgetown, University of Chicago, and the California Institute of Technology – along with quite a few public and Christian universities (including just about every school in Texas). She was actively pursued by these schools initially because of her class rank at a large high school (she ranked between #1-3 throughout her junior and senior years – out of a senior class of over 500). She eventually decided upon Stanford since my wife and I hope to relocate to the area by the end of the summer (and she will have family in the area).

I just cannot help but wonder if these same sorts of opportunities would have been offered to Lucia had she been homeschooled. I am not saying that a public or Christian college of university would not provide a wonderful learning experience (as well as a much-needed degree). However, there are few scholarships that are offered to students who attend smaller local colleges and universities. Lucia’s brother, Emmanuel, graduated near the top of his class (out of about 575 students). He opted to enroll as an Architectural Engineering student at a smaller, local public university instead of one of the more prestigious schools that he received full scholarships. While he received plenty of the school’s local scholarships, most of them were offered for only the first year (to get him into the door). Emmanuel has been forced to take out student loans to pay for the cost of his education. He calculated that he will eventually borrow about $40,000 to pay for his education. If he had enrolled at a school like Penn or Princeton (where he was accepted), he would never have to borrow a dime in order to pay for college.

Anyway, this is just something that my wife and I have been pondering. Both of us attended lesser-known, but still well-respected public schools for our educations. However, even with all of the scholarships, grants, fellowships and awards, we both were required to borrow a little money to survive (especially for my PhD tuition and fees). My wife and I will likely homeschool our future children throughout elementary and junior high school. However, we aren’t quite sure about extending such homeschooling into high school. We pray that our children will be capable of shining the light of Christ and excelling in a public high school. However, we will certainly approach that situation with prayer and the mind of Christ when the time arises.

I would be interested in knowing your thoughts about whether or not it is advantageous to homeschool your children through high school.

Thanks!

:-)

*EDIT*
- I just wanted to add that Lucia was able to maintain and grow in the faith during high school. She is a strong believer from a strong Christian family and was able to influence many of her classmates with the knowledge of God.

sermonindex May 28, 2008

I dont have time to get into this right now, but will later. If I dont, remind me, ok?

But breifly most colleges now are actively recruiting homeschoolers. Homeschoolers on average score much higher on SATs and other college entrance exams. Also, colleges recognize that homeschoolers generally tend to be self motivated and more self-discipled than their public school peers. This has become very attractive to colleges.

However, I would recommend you dont send your homeschoolers to a secular college. Heck, I wouldnt even recommend most "christian" colleges. We need to be very cautious about that.

While academic excellence is certainly something we want for our boys... the reason my wife and I homeschool is mainly because we want to raise men of God who will rock this world for Jesus. Academics are secondary.

I'll write more later.

Krispy

sermonindex May 28, 2008

Hi Chris,

As I read your post I thought, 'well, not every homeschool student is going to need that type of further education...' but that's another topic. ;-) I did want to say that there are other alternatives to the traditional college route that many homeschool students have taken advantage of. It takes more discipline but takes less time and money and applies knowledge the student already has instead of causing them to sit through hours of unnecessary training just to get a degree. http://www.globallearningstrategies.org
Here's a few testimonials from students who have gone this route:

[i]Student Testimonies

Here’s how accelerated distance learning methods are helping students earn their degrees:


“Rather than spending seven years and over $100,000 earning my degree and becoming a CPA, I am using accelerated distance learning to reach this goal in less than three years and for less than $5,000” - Erik, Des Moines, IA


“ Accelerated distance learning allowed me to earn a Bachelor’s and a Master’s degree by the age of sixteen.” – Alexandra, El Paso, TX


“ Using accelerated distance learning, I plan on earning my Bachelor’s Degree before my eighteenth birthday.” – David, Chicago, IL


“ Although I’m only doing part-time study, accelerated distance learning has enabled me to complete an average of three credits per week toward my degree. The skills I have learned are essential for success in my distance-learning program, but more importantly they will continue to benefit me throughout life.” – Kyle, Lakeland, FL


“ Instead of spending four years trapped on a college campus, I was able to graduate Cum Laude with my Bachelors of Science in Business and History, one year, seven months from my date of enrollment!” - David, Gary, IN[/i]

So, there are ways to overcome the obstacles the the world places out there for people who choose to take the less traditional path of homeschooling. And homeschooling is becoming more popular and more recognized, even as Krispy brought out.

As for a personal example of scholarships. I have a friend who obtained a degree with a major in physicology and minor in English mainly by taking CLEP tests and then he enrolled in [url=https://www.excelsior.edu/]Excelsior[/url] (I think) and finished up his degree. He recently decided on going to lawschool and after applying for scholarships all over the country he has a full scholarship for the University of Alabama Law School.

There are so many opportunities out there for homeschooled students. And I really think that homeschooling gives a greater opportunity for the student to pursue the topic or subject that interests him the most. I remember hearing a testimony of a young man who as a child was really interested in the guns/cannons of the civil war, and his parents encouraged him in his interest and he studied guns, metel, etc. And in his later teen years it opened up a great job opportunity for which he was already prepared because of his studying in that area. And I could go on with more examples...but I'll stop there.

My parents started homeschooling nearly twenty years ago. So that's all I ever really experienced. :) But it's definitely the route I'd want to go if I had kids. Oh, and this was the [url=http://ati.iblp.org/ati/]program[/url] I grew up in. It has great material and opportunities for young people.

~Joy

sermonindex May 28, 2008

My husband has a five year old daughter who will be of kindergarten age for the next school year. Due to circumstances in the custody arrangement, she will be attending public school. Private Christian schools have much higher tuition than we can afford, and the odds that my stepdaughter's mom would be willing to pay her half are very slim. So to public school it is.

If we ever get full custody, homeschooling will be reconsidered. At this point, however, it isn't an option. So we will pray that she learns the Truth, despite what the schools try to teach her. We pray that the Spirit of God would reveal to her that which is true and that which is false. If false teaching arise, we pray that she will discern the things which are of God. Prayer is all we can do.

I went to public schools throughout my education, and went to a secular college for a year. There were actually very few instances where I had to close my ears to what my instructors were saying (with the exception of when I took both cultural anthropology and sociology courses, both taught by the same instructor at the community college and found myself wincing often at his teachings)

As long as the children are able to learn the word of God from their parents, friends, AND church (not 'or'), there shouldn't be trouble. Especially if the parents are praying (in faith!) people. My parents didn't teach me much; my dad taught me some, but my mom is still not serving God. But I was able to get plugged in to a great group of people who not only taught me, but learned with me, and prayed with me. And despite 13 years of secular education, God protected me from learning and believing the lies that have infiltrated this so-called "education" system. I believe He can protect my stepdaughter in the same way.

sermonindex May 28, 2008

It takes praying and involved parents to get a child thru the public school system intact. I can certainly understand your situation, and clearly there isnt anything you can do at this point.

Unfortunately, most Christian parents in our society are no different than their pagan counterparts in the world. They are just as materialistic, therefore both parents work in order to have the big house, the SUV's, the X-Box, etc etc... so off to public school the kids go. They put money and possessions before God.

Most Christian parents allow their kids to listen to any old music, watch whatever movies they want, and waste 4 - 5 hours in front of the TV... parents AND kids.

Hardly read their Bibles, never have family devotions, never teach their kids about the Bible... much less about godly character, etc...

And then when Johnny or Mary turns out bad the first thing they blame... is the church. The church didnt do enough to keep their kid on the straight and narrow.

[b]wonserwonton[/b]... I completely understand and sympathize with your situation. You are an exception. Yes, pray. Yes, have faith in God to protect her... but also be prepared to do everything in your home AND your life to model for this precious little girl what a godly woman is to be. Teach her every minute you are with her about God and His Word.

And if you ever do get full custody (which I pray you do)... homeschool!

Blessings on you, sister...

Krispy

T
TrustingGod May 28, 2008

Greetings to all my Brothers and Sisters in Christ. I have not been on this forum very long, and just joined today as a "member". There are so many "WORTHLESS" "Christian" websites that will take your time, if you are not careful. However, THIS website has kept me coming back as I believe the members by and large, are genuine Christians on the journey to Heaven. Praise God. (All of my Scripture quotes are from the 1611 KJV Bible.) Now, The question asked by KrispyKrittr is one facing Christian parents the world over. Guess what. I'm not sure there IS a "right" answer! :-? I was brought up in a Holiness (non-tongues) Church all of my life. I lived in a very small Village, averaging about 1200 people. During my Jr. High school years, our own Church opened a "Christian School" (ACE). It brought quite a bit of strife in our Church as well as in the Community. In the Church, if you did not send your youngsters to this new Christian School, they you were about branded as a heretic. On the other hand, if you did send your children to the new Christian School, the "world" looked on and said "Oh, we see.... They're too GOOD to interact among US." In the 'middle' were the precious folks that chose "Home schooling" and they got it from BOTH sides! (My mother prayed and read Scripture each and every day prior to my sister and I leaving for school.) My parents kept me in public school, and soon after I graduated, the Christian School was closed, thus having caused "wounds" on the Body of Christ that were unnecessary. The majority of the kids that had gone to the new school, along with those who were home schooled, usually did better academically than those of us in public school. However, the downside was most of those same children had GREAT difficulty adjusting to living in "THE REAL WORLD" once they were out of that school or home. My wife and I had two precious children in 1981 and 1983. We struggled with this long before it was time to decide. One of the main verses that kept coming to our mind was: Proverbs 22:6. However, what about Jesus' prayer in John 17:15?! We finally started them in Christian School for a few years and then transferred them to the Public School, BUT, the School Principal, the teachers, the aides, etc. knew us by face recognition and our first names. That's because we kept VERY involved in their schooling. (I was a Fire Fighter/EMT who worked 24 hours on duty, and 48 hours off duty, so I got to spend much more time with this than the average working person would be able to.) In the last few years of their schooling, we were forced to move from the Dayton, Ohio area to the Mitchell, South Dakota area. Thus, we put them back in a Christian school there as we could not interact with the Public School in the manner we were accustomed to. For a period of time, we DID home school our children, and as I stated before, we were criticized by both the Church people and the secular neighbors. Although it's sounds so simple, the Truth is: Each parent has to pray and seek God's Will for THEIR children. If you do choose to home school or send them to a Christian School, then PLEASE on a supervised basis, let them interact with some of the secular children in the community. That way, under your leadership and guidance from the Lord, they will learn how to "Live in this world but not be a part of this world." Again, God bless ALL of you having to make this decision, and also God Bless all of you on these forums. =^..^= Don.

Roniya wrote:
Hi Chris,

As I read your post I thought, 'well, not every homeschool student is going to need that type of further education...' but that's another topic. ;-) I did want to say that there are other alternatives to the traditional college route that many homeschool students have taken advantage of. It takes more discipline but takes less time and money and applies knowledge the student already has instead of causing them to sit through hours of unnecessary training just to get a degree. http://www.globallearningstrategies.org
Here's a few testimonials from students who have gone this route:

[i]Student Testimonies

Here’s how accelerated distance learning methods are helping students earn their degrees:


“Rather than spending seven years and over $100,000 earning my degree and becoming a CPA, I am using accelerated distance learning to reach this goal in less than three years and for less than $5,000” - Erik, Des Moines, IA


“ Accelerated distance learning allowed me to earn a Bachelor’s and a Master’s degree by the age of sixteen.” – Alexandra, El Paso, TX


“ Using accelerated distance learning, I plan on earning my Bachelor’s Degree before my eighteenth birthday.” – David, Chicago, IL


“ Although I’m only doing part-time study, accelerated distance learning has enabled me to complete an average of three credits per week toward my degree. The skills I have learned are essential for success in my distance-learning program, but more importantly they will continue to benefit me throughout life.” – Kyle, Lakeland, FL


“ Instead of spending four years trapped on a college campus, I was able to graduate Cum Laude with my Bachelors of Science in Business and History, one year, seven months from my date of enrollment!” - David, Gary, IN[/i]

So, there are ways to overcome the obstacles the the world places out there for people who choose to take the less traditional path of homeschooling. And homeschooling is becoming more popular and more recognized, even as Krispy brought out.

As for a personal example of scholarships. I have a friend who obtained a degree with a major in physicology and minor in English mainly by taking CLEP tests and then he enrolled in [url=https://www.excelsior.edu/]Excelsior[/url] (I think) and finished up his degree. He recently decided on going to lawschool and after applying for scholarships all over the country he has a full scholarship for the University of Alabama Law School.

There are so many opportunities out there for homeschooled students. And I really think that homeschooling gives a greater opportunity for the student to pursue the topic or subject that interests him the most. I remember hearing a testimony of a young man who as a child was really interested in the guns/cannons of the civil war, and his parents encouraged him in his interest and he studied guns, metel, etc. And in his later teen years it opened up a great job opportunity for which he was already prepared because of his studying in that area. And I could go on with more examples...but I'll stop there.

My parents started homeschooling nearly twenty years ago. So that's all I ever really experienced. :) But it's definitely the route I'd want to go if I had kids. Oh, and this was the [url=http://ati.iblp.org/ati/]program[/url] I grew up in. It has great material and opportunities for young people.

~Joy

sermonindex May 28, 2008

My kids attend a public school because my husband prefers the public school system over homeschooling. It's a challenge for me and for them and it takes alot of prayer but the enemy can put all kinds of roadblocks in your way no matter what you choose. Everything in life takes much prayer.

M
Miccah May 28, 2008

We homeschool our children. Mom teaches the curriculum in the day (God based) and I teach the Word of the Lord at night, followed by good old fashioned Bible stories at bedtime.

Most kids, Christian or not, who go to public school ARE affected/influenced by other kids and the system regardless of what we as parents try to do to stave that off.

You CAN tell a difference between a Homeschooled child and a public schooled child, from a Christian family or not. Every children that I know that goes to public school has disciple problems (That does not mean that your children do or that all children do, just the ones that I know do). These children are from some pretty solid Christian families, yet they still are affected by the system and other children.

Think about it. When we send our children into the lions den, the majority of the time they will be eaten by lions.

sermonindex May 28, 2008

To add to that though homeschooling in my opinion is always better than the public school system and that is where my husband and I do not agree but he is the head of this household and so it is God ordained.

My battle at home right now is more with the television set. I won't watch it but my husband and kids enjoy it so it's a battle as far as devotions go. I get up to go to work every morning at 4:00 am so at the end of the day it's a major challenge for me. Every once in awhile though I am successful at steering them away but it's not easy.

I think of King David though and Absolom, even he had problems so we can only do as we are able and the rest is in the hands of the Lord who can do above and beyond all we can ever ask or imagine. He is the potter and I am just clay.

B
bonni May 29, 2008

My husband and I have 4 daughters. The 3 oldest all graduated from public highschool. The youngest daughter has been homeschooled since first grade. While the 3 older girls were in 9th, 10th,& 11th , I enrolled our youngest in kindergarten. The next year she had to go to school all day long and I noticed such a change in her mood, not really an attitude of rebellion as much as a "distance" between her and I. Now mind you, I had been experiencing that strange "distance" with our older girls who were in highschool, only it was in greater measure by the time they had been in school that many years. I did not as easily recognize it as it crept up on us. But when I finally saw the fruition of many years of being away from their parents for 8 or so hours daily, it was too late to remedy. When I began to see the same, but subtle fruits in our youngest I began to feel a panic in my heart. I was afraid that I did not have what it takes to homeschool my child, but at the same time I could see the fruits of "not doing that". I began to pray and ask God to help me know what to do. He was faithful in showing me through unmistakable signs and confirmations that this was Him laying this on my heart. I told my husband and he said "absolutely not!". He did not want me to homeschool our daughter, so I had to pray and trust God to change my husbands mind if this was really God's will. I can say thankfully that the Lord did just that and I took her out of 1st grade. She is almost 17 now and my husband tells everyone that it was the wisest thing we ever did! All 3 of our older daughters are married and 2 of them have children now. The oldest one is already homeschooling their 2 daughters, and the 2nd daughter is making plans to homeschool her new baby girl. All 3 older daughters said that after seeing their younger sister homeschooled and the positive results,compared to their experience in public school, that they would not even consider putting their children in public school. What I am trying so hard to convey (in my limited ability to comunicate without too many words :-P ) is not so much the academic side of this equation, but what some people would term...tying heartstrings. It has been my experience that if we keep the heart of our children, we have much more influence with them because they are not distanced from us. Public school cut so many of those heartstrings in our older girls that we lost much influence with them, and therefore they had more struggles in life and had to learn some important lessons the hard way, suffering some of God's chastisement, and some of the fruits of their own choices. My husband and I blame ourselves for much of their struggles. I realize that there are exceptions and circumstances in life that would prevent some from schooling their children at home (I say this with tenderness and compassion). God knows this, and He will cause all things to work together for our good.


That's my $0.02 worth! bonni

sermonindex May 29, 2008

My kids attend a public school because my husband prefers the public school system over homeschooling. It's a challenge for me and for them and it takes alot of prayer but the enemy can put all kinds of roadblocks in your way no matter what you choose. Everything in life takes much prayer.

Most homeschool dads will tell you they didnt like the idea of homeschooling, and were against it at first. Most homeschool moms will tell you that they prayed fervently that the Lord would change their husband's heart toward homeschooling... and He did!

So pray for your husband if homeschooling is something you want to do. This "pre-ordained" stuff needs to be forgotten... thats just a cop out for most folks. I know hundreds of couples where God laid it on the WIFE to homeschool first, and then thru her prayers the heart of the husband was changed. Please dont just throw up your hands and say "God pre-ordained it, theres nothing I can do about it!" Thats a lie.

My battle at home right now is more with the television set. I won't watch it but my husband and kids enjoy it so it's a battle as far as devotions go. I get up to go to work every morning at 4:00 am so at the end of the day it's a major challenge for me. Every once in awhile though I am successful at steering them away but it's not easy.

I will pray that your husband will step up and be the spiritual leader in your home. I'm not trying to knock you husband because I dont know anything about him... but when a dad puts television (or anything else for that matter) above family devotions... he isnt leading as he should. So I will pray hard for him.

Being a spiritual leader in your home is hard work, which is why most men avoid it. But boy, once you get into the swing of it, it's the most rewarding thing in life.

Krispy

sermonindex May 29, 2008


KrispyKrittr wrote:
My kids attend a public school because my husband prefers the public school system over homeschooling. It's a challenge for me and for them and it takes alot of prayer but the enemy can put all kinds of roadblocks in your way no matter what you choose. Everything in life takes much prayer.

Most homeschool dads will tell you they didnt like the idea of homeschooling, and were against it at first. Most homeschool moms will tell you that they prayed fervently that the Lord would change their husband's heart toward homeschooling... and He did!

So pray for your husband if homeschooling is something you want to do. This "pre-ordained" stuff needs to be forgotten... thats just a cop out for most folks. I know hundreds of couples where God laid it on the WIFE to homeschool first, and then thru her prayers the heart of the husband was changed. Please dont just throw up your hands and say "God pre-ordained it, theres nothing I can do about it!" Thats a lie.

My battle at home right now is more with the television set. I won't watch it but my husband and kids enjoy it so it's a battle as far as devotions go. I get up to go to work every morning at 4:00 am so at the end of the day it's a major challenge for me. Every once in awhile though I am successful at steering them away but it's not easy.

I will pray that your husband will step up and be the spiritual leader in your home. I'm not trying to knock you husband because I dont know anything about him... but when a dad puts television (or anything else for that matter) above family devotions... he isnt leading as he should. So I will pray hard for him.

Being a spiritual leader in your home is hard work, which is why most men avoid it. But boy, once you get into the swing of it, it's the most rewarding thing in life.

Krispy

Thanks Krispy, I haven't given up. My oldest is turning 16 so it's almost too late for her but my youngest is 8, so there is still an opportunity there. What I meant by 'ordained' is that I'm under my husband but I know that public school is not the way to go if you can help it.

C
ccchhhrrriiisss May 29, 2008

Hello…

I appreciate all of the information that you provide about homeschooling. Like I said, my wife and I plan to homeschool our (future) children at least into junior high school. I can testify firsthand how the public school system slowly turned me from a belief in God as a child into an agnostic teenager. I was quite the scholarly student, and the tenets of evolutionary biology were instilled into our minds (even as alternatives were also taught in accordance to Virginia law at the time). However, evolution and chemistry just made too much “sense” to me – and I slowly began seeing Christianity as a fairy tale (especially given the compromise and worldliness of the large Assembly of God church that we attended at the time).

Everyone in Church thought that I was a Christian and my parents were extremely involved in the Church. I was even baptized after taking a class that included a verbal test that was meant to affirm my faith and understanding of the meaning of baptism. No one suspected that – not only was I not a real Christian – but I was a true agnostic in heart. My AP science courses in High School simply affirmed the evolutionary biology that I was taught in Junior High School. I came to a point where I was quite convinced that Christianity would one day go the way of Greek, Norse and Roman mythology.

However, my faith blossomed one week at a Summer Camp when I was still a teen. One day, I had to find a verse or passage to share with our devotional “share group.” Since I wasn’t really a Christian, I really didn’t know any verses off hand outside of the obvious Sunday School memory verses that I had long since dismissed as meaningless religious babble. However, shortly before the share group that morning, I opened my Bible to some words in red that sounded like a song that I had heard once. So I bookmarked it and headed to the morning share group.

Our share group met at a swimming pool. I sat there with nervous anxiety to share a passage that I had never really read before (and with the audacity to claim that it was one that had “ministered to me greatly in the past” – as was our assignment). When the time came, I opened my Bible to Matthew 11:28-30. I recited the words, “[i]Come to me…[/i]” After finishing the verse, no one seemed to think that it was anything special. I was just relieved for having shared my “meaningful passage” and once again fool my fellow share groupers with my faux faith. But for the rest of that day – those words haunted me. “[i]Come to me.[/i]

That night, our service was held outdoors. As usual, I sat toward the back of the folding chair layout watching everyone else enjoy themselves in their zeal for the Lord. Yet this pounding in my heart wouldn’t go away. I was miserable. My faith had slowly, over the past few weeks, begun to bloom. A week earlier, I had even thought about what it would be like to really know God (if He truly existed). I wondered what it would be like to know Him, talk to Him and worship Him. I had long suspected that many Christians didn’t really believe in God (or were just putting on a show in Church). I thought to myself that if I ever truly met God – I would spend my entire life at His disposal. I remember thinking that I would sing and play music to Him like a song that I had in my head (and probably heard as a child even though I couldn’t place it – and turned out to be from Keith Green).

That night at Summer Camp, I was extremely miserable. I was dying inside. At the time, I could only describe it to myself as though I was extremely “dry” inside (with nothing soft left). I had never felt such misery before. I was a popular guy in school. I had good grades and came from a family that provided everything that we needed. I had planned my entire life – from graduating at the top to one day entering law school at Harvard, Columbia or some other Ivy League school. But that night, the entire emphasis of my life changed. I had an encounter with God (well, spiritually speaking).

Those words (“[i]Come to me[/i]”) kept playing over and over again deep inside of me. That night, I walked away from the “altar call” that was going on and walked out deep within this field there at the Summer Camp. For the first time in my life, I felt that I was truly standing before the Lord. I felt as if God spoke to me and told me, “[i]You don’t know me.[/i]” All of my masquerades were meaningless when I was standing before Him. I felt ashamed of who I was and for doubting His existence for so long. I told God that I would trade everything that I was – and everything that I would ever be – if I could just know Him and be His friend.

I remained out there in that open field for several hours (most of it spent either on my knees or prostrate as I lay out before God beneath the dark night and bright stars in the middle of nowhere in Texas. I remember feeling so “new” as I eventually walked back to the camp dorms (as the evening meeting had finished much earlier). I couldn’t stop weeping. I remember laying in my bunk that night overwhelmed with the knowledge that I actually knew and could communicate with the Creator of the Universe as His friend and child. I even longed to die so that I could already go and be with Him that very night – and see His face, and feel His arms hold me so tightly.

For the rest of the summer, I spent countless hours on my face before the Lord. I read the entire Bible through – more times than I could count (at least a dozen times). I just couldn’t get enough of the Lord! Everyone noticed the change – including my family and my local Church. It wasn’t that I did much differently (I had always been “forced” to go to Church while living under my parents’ rules); however, I eagerly sought the Lord. Instead of saying prayers, I prayed. Instead of singing songs, I worshipped. Instead of reading words, I learned from the very words of God as contained in the Bible. To live was truly Christ – and I couldn’t wait to one day breathe my last breath and finally see His face.

Two and a half months later, I returned to my public school. I made an effort to let every former friend know that I was different. It didn’t take long for my conversion to spread throughout my school. I had Varsity Basketball practice in the morning before school. Before practice, one of my friends told me about his trip to the Philippines during the summer. He asked, “[i]What did you do this summer[/i]?” I smiled and told him, “[i]I met God[/i]!” He looked awkward and confused. By the time I made it to the locker room, everyone on the basketball team knew. Most of the guys on the team were puzzled. Some of them had said that I was “the smartest guy that they had ever met.” Some of them had idolized me because of my grades, the amount of girls that liked me, the fact that I stood up for “nerds” and those others made fun of (I guess I was a “moral sinner”) and my general carefree attitude. Even on that first day, a couple of guys ridiculed me by saying that I had become a “Jesus freak,” but it actually scared most of them. I noticed that they tried to change the subject almost immediately. Before the year was over, I was able to lead 10 of the 15 guys on the team to the Lord.

I am glad that I attended a public high school as a Christian teen. While I might have never strayed from the Lord if I had been homeschooled as a child into my adolescent years, I think that I was able to be an important light in a dark place. My faith was pretty evident throughout the school. The students, teachers, administration – and even the janitors – were aware of my faith. Some people ridiculed me and called me names like “the walking Bible” or one of the leaders of the resident “God Squad.” For the most part, however, I was able to rise above any temptation that the devil wanted to throw at me. For me, Jesus was all that mattered. I still made good grades (and eventually graduated as #2 in my class). I was accepted at each of the schools for which I applied. However, my plans changed. I no longer wanted to be an attorney. I wanted to earn a degree in order to have better opportunities to provide for my eventual family, but I wanted everything that I did to be for the glory and honor of God.

I eventually attended public universities where I maintained my faith. I was awarded scholarships that paid for most of my undergraduate and even graduate education. I met my wife at a Christian student organization (Chi Alpha Christian Fellowship) while we were working on our bachelor’s degrees. I was able to help share the faith throughout my campus (even sharing the Gospel and praying with professors and administrators). Through my education, I was able to intern and eventually coop with NASA. While at NASA, I was chosen to attend several governors’ conferences – and was able to share my faith with governors, congressmen and officials in government. I even attended a private prayer meeting hosted by a Congressman and attended by several politicians. By the grace of God, I eventually graduated with honors with my two undergraduate degrees (including one in Electrical Engineering) and then went on to graduate with a perfect 4.0 from graduate school. I am currently completing my dissertation for a PhD in Public Policy at a respected university. Deep in our hearts, my wife and I know that we have a calling upon our lives. While we are waiting for this to come to fruition, we still have the opportunity to share our faith to everyone we come into contact with.

If I could do it all over, I would certainly change a few things. I have made some mistakes in my life that I wish that I would have avoided. I sometimes wonder what would have happened if I had been homeschooled by my parents. Would I have continued believing in God as I did as a child? Would I have avoided all of the mistakes that I made as a teenager?

I have met some wonderful homeschooled children who grew into very godly young adults. Some of them may have lacked as wide an education as they might have received in a public or private school, but they more than made up for it with pureness of heart. I guess this is the dilemma. Some of the homeschoolers that I know are so detached from the world that they just seem to struggle with the thought of eventually entering the workplace. Their hearts are so clean and innocent of the knowledge of this world and its system (“LIFE 101,” so to speak) that I wonder just how well that they will integrate into society with a job, family, etc… Of course, I know some other homeschoolers who are probably better prepared than anyone to face the trials and tribulations of life. I think this really has to do with the parents (the teachers) within each homeschool.

My oldest sister attempted to homeschool her young children, but lacked the time and perseverance necessary to do an adequate job. Don’t get me wrong – she really tried. But it is a huge commitment, and would require the complete dedication of both parents. Every day has the possibility of becoming a lazy day. It is up to the parent(s) to ensure that the day is not wasted. My sister was unable to make such a commitment, and she eventually enrolled them in a strict and highly competitive Christian school. They are doing extremely well.

In the last [i]Homeschool[/i] thread, I also asked about homeschool curriculum. Which curriculum is the most recommended? My wife had a bad experience with a particular curriculum (ACE - Accelerated Christian Education) that was used at a local private Church school and for homeschoolers from the same Church. My wife found that the curriculum was greatly outdated and insufficient of meeting normal educational goals, and the children easily cheated on their “PACEs.” One of my former churches used the same curriculum and it was a disaster for those who attended the high school. The average ACT score was a 15 (while the national average is a 21). One student even scored an 11 (which seems almost impossible given the ability to guess on every problem). The SAT scores were just as poor. The writing sections for each test displayed that the students from the school very vastly unprepared for college level essays. Yet all of the school’s standardized tests supposedly showed “above average” results for nearly every student in the school.

The ACT and SAT are the basis for entrance in most colleges and universities. Most schools, however, use a formula for determining entrance. While the scores on college entrance exams are one of the most important criteria, there are other criteria that also play a role. At my undergraduate school (which is respected but has an easy admission policy), a student must score at least a 21 on the ACT in order to be admitted – if he or she graduated from high school in the top 10%. If the student graduated in the top 25% of his/her high school class, then the student must earn a 22 on the ACT. If the student did not graduate in the top 25%, then he or she must earn a 24 on the ACT. The national average for the ACT is a 21. If I remember correctly, all students from non-accredited high schools must earn a 24 on the ACT to obtain unconditional admission. There is a similar criterion when using the SAT.

Like I stated earlier, my wife and I are almost certain to homeschool our children through elementary and junior high school. The development of children is so important at such a young stage. As Krispy affirmed previously, you would have to spend just as much time (or more time) sifting through all of the information that they are given (in classes, in between classes, on the bus and even in the cafeteria). This is probably just as time-consuming as the dedicated homeschool hours itself. I do know some children who attend public schools that are doing well. My wife is a public school teacher. Six of her siblings are public school teachers. However, they each attend very, very good school districts. All of my wife’s nephews and nieces attend public elementary schools. Yet their parents are extremely strict and do their best to instruct those children in the ways of the Lord. They also follow their children’s attitudes, beliefs and education very closely. Of course, they are all extremely concerned with the dire possibilities that could result.

I guess it comes down to personal preference. My wife and I would like to homeschool our children at least while they are young. Once they reach high school, however, we will likely allow them to be enrolled in a public high school. There is just so much that needs to be taught effectively in preparation for college. We realize that the education differs between college-to-college. A community college or an “open admission” public university does not always provide the same quality as a more scholastic-minded public school. We also feel that such things (including the name of the university upon the diploma) matters to potential employers or grad school admissions. Since this matters to us (regardless of how others view this as right or wrong), we think that a good public school or accredited private school might be better than one of us serving in such matters. Hopefully, however, we will have instructed them well enough in “the ways that they should go” as children that they will be able to shine the light of Christ as teenagers.

Anyway, I am extremely interested in the thoughts of others regarding the extent of homeschooling into high school (whether or not that is a good idea), the recommended curriculum for homeschools, and the ACT/SAT scores for high school homeschool graduates. Are there any statistics available to show this? I worked in a college admissions office during a freshman (work study) job. Some of the Christian School and homeschool scores were downright embarrassing. However, there were some homeschool scores that were pretty good. Are there independently verified statistics regarding the college entrance scores and admission statistics of students that were homeschooled throughout high school?

Thanks!!!

:-)

sermonindex May 29, 2008

I see you did well in your English Lit class too! :-P

Krispy

sermonindex May 29, 2008

Some of the homeschoolers that I know are so detached from the world that they just seem to struggle with the thought of eventually entering the workplace. Their hearts are so clean and innocent of the knowledge of this world and its system (“LIFE 101,” so to speak) that I wonder just how well that they will integrate into society with a job, family, etc… Of course, I know some other homeschoolers who are probably better prepared than anyone to face the trials and tribulations of life. I think this really has to do with the parents (the teachers) within each homeschool.

This is not as much a dilema as some think it is. We have folks in our family who insist we need to expose our children to the things of this world (i.e. [b]sin[/b]) because after all, they reason, they'll be exposed to it eventually anyway! What awful parents we are because our kids arent allowed to read or watch Harry Potter, or some wretched TV show.

Where is the Biblical principle for that?

This does not mean that we dont teach our children about sex, or other issues that the world has perverted. But scripture tells us in no uncertain terms that we are to be seperate from the world. That does not mean seperate as in holed up in the house. (I wish my wife and kids were home more! They're always running off to homeschool events, 4-H, etc etc... poor unsocialized souls!) We need to engage the culture we live in, but we are not to participate in the culture's sinful behavior.

So we teach our children how to live holy and godly lives... to hate sin and obey God... and there isnt anything the world has to offer in the way of temptation that isnt covered in the Bible. There is nothing new under the sun.

If we teach them the Bible cover to cover, and if they are truly saved... they will be more than prepared to go out into the world... and engage the culture.

The ultimate goal of homeschooling for my wife and I is not to raise kids who score high SAT scores, or read on a higher level than public school kids... altho that is one benefit of homeschooling. Our ultimate goal is to raise godly men who will win souls to Christ, and one day hear Him say "Well done good and faithful servant. Enter into My rest."

If we raise hyper smart kids, but they dont reach the above mentioned goal... she and I will have failed.

Krispy

B
bonni May 29, 2008

I also think that there should be a distinction made between sons and daughters when the time comes to make decisions concerning the work place or college.


What our sons may be equiped to handle or be able to "hold up under" may not be the same for our daughters. I believe that God has ordained that our daughters stay under the protection of their parents until they are given in marriage to another man. I realize that there are some exceptions, but they should be just that, not the rule.


There are some excellent videos on Vision Forum concerning this, if anyone is interested. The actual video is called "The Return of the Daughters."

I guess the most important thing to consider is "is this the will of God for my son or daughter, or am I more concerned about them being wealthy than I am that they be where God has called them and fullfil His purpose for their lives."

Blessings bonni

B
BenBrockway May 29, 2008


KrispyKrittr wrote:
Some of the homeschoolers that I know are so detached from the world that they just seem to struggle with the thought of eventually entering the workplace. Their hearts are so clean and innocent of the knowledge of this world and its system (“LIFE 101,” so to speak) that I wonder just how well that they will integrate into society with a job, family, etc… Of course, I know some other homeschoolers who are probably better prepared than anyone to face the trials and tribulations of life. I think this really has to do with the parents (the teachers) within each homeschool.

This is not as much a dilema as some think it is. We have folks in our family who insist we need to expose our children to the things of this world (i.e. [b]sin[/b]) because after all, they reason, they'll be exposed to it eventually anyway! What awful parents we are because our kids arent allowed to read or watch Harry Potter, or some wretched TV show.

Where is the Biblical principle for that?

This does not mean that we dont teach our children about sex, or other issues that the world has perverted. But scripture tells us in no uncertain terms that we are to be seperate from the world. That does not mean seperate as in holed up in the house. (I wish my wife and kids were home more! They're always running off to homeschool events, 4-H, etc etc... poor unsocialized souls!) We need to engage the culture we live in, but we are not to participate in the culture's sinful behavior.

So we teach our children how to live holy and godly lives... to hate sin and obey God... and there isnt anything the world has to offer in the way of temptation that isnt covered in the Bible. There is nothing new under the sun.

If we teach them the Bible cover to cover, and if they are truly saved... they will be more than prepared to go out into the world... and engage the culture.

The ultimate goal of homeschooling for my wife and I is not to raise kids who score high SAT scores, or read on a higher level than public school kids... altho that is one benefit of homeschooling. Our ultimate goal is to raise godly men who will win souls to Christ, and one day hear Him say "Well done good and faithful servant. Enter into My rest."

If we raise hyper smart kids, but they dont reach the above mentioned goal... she and I will have failed.

Krispy

I agree with you Krispy, but I have a "but," or what if" to what you have said - Like I mentioned in my earlier post, I ended up growing much stronger in the Lord being exposed to more junk then a fairly innocent guy could handle (going into the public school system)
Would it be totally off to relate the "going into the world" experience of public schools to that of Peter walking on the water? Sure, there is the fear of what could happen, but what about faith to overcome those fears and obstacles?

Yes, you can look at all the bad that could maybe take place in the public school system, but are you overlooking the potential good that could also take place? What if the "bad" never happend? Or take the example of Daniel going into the lion's den.


I think it would be a testiment of faith for a child (young adult) to stand strong in his/her faith in the midst of a fallen world.

I don't know. I see your point, but I've also experienced both worlds, so I see the advantages and disadvantages of both sides I s'pose.

Blessings Krispy!

Ben

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