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America Asks For A King

K
KingJimmy Oct 28, 2008

I came across the following article "America Asks For A King" by Laura Hollis at TownHall.com. I thought this article was very insightful concerning the present political climate in America. I hope you enjoy:


"America Asks For A King" by
Laura Hollis

I am an attorney and professor of law and entrepreneurship, so I usually confine my commentary to matters of public policy, and leave theology to those who have chosen that field of study. But since today is Sunday, I will take the liberty of making an observation with a more Biblical bent.

As one who has taught entrepreneurship and entrepreneurial thinking for nearly ten years, I am distressed by the apparently overwhelming sentiment sweeping Americans that they must now be taken care of. I know from years of studying the matter that a society in which most members are – or can be – entrepreneurial, is a society where upward mobility is the rule; where wealth is created – not just “spread around”; where hope is common currency; where the inevitable problems are viewed as opportunities to find sustainable solutions, and where those solutions are typically new industries, new companies, and new jobs. An entrepreneurial society is a society where most people wish to, and know they can, take care of themselves, their families, and even others in need. Where charity and philanthropy are fellow-travelers with success.

Joe the Plumber’s exposure of Obama’s “spread the wealth” philosophy exploded like a flash fire, not only because that philosophy is utterly anti-American, but because it is shortsighted, and immoral. It is short-sighted, because in an economy that is a bit battered and fragile, what we need are more businesses, more workers, and more wealth creation in the private sector, not more government programs and more people dependent upon them. It is short-sighted because it is a failed business model. And, as we saw with the collapse of major lending institutions a few weeks ago, a failed business model, made larger (or “spread around,” if you prefer) by government, is not just a failure, but a catastrophic failure. So it was with the irresponsible lending practices foisted on American banks by the government, and so it will be with the irresponsible spending and doomed reliance on government largesse that Obama and the Democrats are peddling as salvation.

And the inevitability of its failure is why Obama’s philosophies are not just foolhardy, but immoral. It is immoral to deceive well-meaning people about what you intend to do with their money. It is immoral to take by force from those who produce, give to others who do not, and call it “charity.” It is staggeringly immoral to create an ever-larger class of dependent, helpless people who will be doomed to starve when the unsustainable system you have created collapses. And most of all, it is profoundly immoral to set yourself up as a secular messiah of sorts, assuring people that you will take care of them, eliminate hardship, heal the planet, and hold enemies at bay by the sheer force of your own hypnotic rhetoric.

Obama’s economic and social theories have been debunked and disproven (at great human cost) so many times over the past 100 years that it’s laughable anyone still believes in them. But at least his designs on the country are understandable. Those who crave power will use any tactic, as long as it works.

It’s the fact that it’s working that is inscrutable to me. And this is where the Biblical references come in. Americans’ attitude toward this posturing, self-important, political zealot remind me of the Israelites’ demand for a king, as recounted in the Book of Samuel:


When Samuel grew old, he appointed his sons as judges for Israel. The name of his firstborn was Joel and the name of his second was Abijah, and they served at Beersheba. But his sons did not walk in his ways. They turned aside after dishonest gain and accepted bribes and perverted justice. So all the elders of Israel gathered together and came to Samuel at Ramah. They said to him, "You are old, and your sons do not walk in your ways; now appoint a king to lead us, such as all the other nations have." But when they said, "Give us a king to lead us," this displeased Samuel; so he prayed to the LORD. And the LORD told him: "Listen to all that the people are saying to you; it is not you they have rejected, but they have rejected Me as their king. As they have done from the day I brought them up out of Egypt until this day, forsaking Me and serving other gods, so they are doing to you. Now listen to them; but warn them solemnly and let them know what the king who will reign over them will do." Samuel told all the words of the LORD to the people who were asking him for a king. He said, "This is what the king who will reign over you will do: He will take your sons and make them serve with his chariots and horses, and they will run in front of his chariots … He will take your daughters to be perfumers and cooks and bakers. He will take the best of your fields and vineyards and olive groves and give them to his attendants. He will take a tenth of your grain and of your vintage and give it to his officials and attendants. Your menservants and maidservants and the best of your cattle and donkeys he will take for his own use. He will take a tenth of your flocks, and you yourselves will become his slaves. When that day comes, you will cry out for relief from the king you have chosen, and the LORD will not answer you in that day."

But the people refused to listen to Samuel. "No!" they said. "We want a king over us. Then we will be like all the other nations, with a king to lead us and to go out before us and fight our battles." When Samuel heard all that the people said, he repeated it before the LORD. The LORD answered, "Listen to them and give them a king." (1 Samuel 8:1-22)


The comparisons are telling: Americans are understandably fed up with corruption, greed, and perversion of justice in our leaders. But till now, we have asked for no king, because we could take care of ourselves, and because we have always been a godly people. But look around now – our children languish in failing, crumbling, unsafe, and undisciplined schools, many of which are merely bastions of social experimentation. Our cities are riddled with crime. Our families are devastated by divorce, abuse, illegitimacy, absent fathers, and definitions of “marriage” that fluctuate with the sexual predilections du jour. Our culture – books, films, music – is saturated with violence and perversion that even the smallest child is exposed to. And of course, one cannot forget – the high watermark of freedom and femininity, and the litmus test of liberty for the Left is the unfettered right to kill our own children in our wombs (or leave them to die outside of them).

This is what we, as a nation, have brought ourselves to. These are problems that no amount of social spending will cure, and any promise to do so is a lie, because no amount of money will change people’s hearts. And yet, instead of reaching deep within ourselves to find the solutions, we now whine and mewl for someone to save us.

And here he comes, Barack Obama, on a “righteous wind.”

As with anyone who would be king, Obama will take our money and our property in ever-larger amounts. Our children will be saddled with debt and beholden to a bloated government that will enslave the very people it promised to help. We will be at the mercy of our enemies. And no matter how bleak or desperate our own lives becomes, the leaders in Obama’s government will always thrive; such people always do. Nor is any of this is unique to Obama; it is in the nature of every king, and every government, which is why our government was originally set up to be limited, both to protect us, and to ensure our own self-reliance.

John McCain will not be a perfect President. But it is not necessary for the leader of a free, righteous, and entrepreneurial people to be perfect. I can support John McCain because he asks only that I vote for him, not that I worship him. And I will vote for John McCain on November 4th, not because he would be a better king, but because he does not claim to be one at all.

Neither McCain nor Obama is a king who will save us; we must turn instead to the only One who can.

I
InHisGrace Oct 28, 2008

This article say it all .....


Jesus is the only King of Kings and Lord of Lords

C
crsschk Nov 1, 2008

Thought this was a very telling article and couldn't get the correlations out of my mind. The sense of a dependance created upon handouts and a sense of being owed something.

[i] For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.[/i] 2Th 3:10

The correlation to the present prosperity juggernaut which preached in it's plainest terms is something for nothing and faith as presumption, an unspoken obligation upon God to fulfill a promise never given.

If you fail, the expectation is that someone is supposed to come bail you out. It seems it is charity in reverse, an abuse of what used to be a sense of responsibility. It seems to have permeated the entire culture and many Christan's have bought into the ideal.

This is what we, as a nation, have brought ourselves to. These are problems that no amount of social spending will cure, and any promise to do so is a lie, because no amount of money will change people’s hearts. And yet, instead of reaching deep within ourselves to find the solutions, we now whine and mewl for someone to save us.

The original correlation to Samuel and asking for a king is remarkable.

[i]As one who has taught entrepreneurship and entrepreneurial thinking for nearly ten years, I am distressed by the apparently overwhelming sentiment sweeping Americans that they must now be taken care of.[/i]

G
ginnyrose Nov 1, 2008

I often think how the USA government has taken over the role of the church's function in society and made a big mess of it.

Consider education: it used to be the local church operated the schools. And see what mess the feds have made by taking over this job.

How about the medical? the church women used to go out and render assistance to the ill. Now you have health care commercialized and out of reach of many hard-working folks who now have to look for alternative methods of healing.

How about social services? Mike talked about it - the federal government had created a dependency by the handout of goods with no responsibility attached to its acquisition.

How about behaviour modification? Haul people off to the psychologists, psychiatrist, drug them...And many theologians promoted doctrines that dismiss the fact that Salvation does change lives which downplay the importance of the Gospel to change man.

Perhaps it would do the American people good if this manmade god would flat on his face, like Dagon...would we be ready for it? Maybe I will have to go hide my head in the sand...

ginnyrose

K
KingJimmy Nov 1, 2008

Indeed, I thought it was quite remarkable. Of course, the correlation is not perfect, as we have never been a theocracy.

However, the heart of this story here has to do with the heart and disposition of the people, and it seems people in all ages are always looking for a Messiah of sorts. We seem to have a "Messianic disposition" in us by nature. But sadly, when that disposition goes unfulfilled, false Messiah's appear to take that place.

C
ChrisJD Nov 1, 2008

Hi everyone,

I too have thought about this passage from Samuel and feel like it relates very much to us today. So much so that I've distributed literature in that regard.

But, I was wondering if I could make a few comments about something from the article that is important to me at least.

"An entrepreneurial society is a society where most people wish to, and know they can, take care of themselves, their families, and even others in need. [b]Where charity and philanthropy are fellow-travelers with success[/b]."(emphasis added)

When I read this, I was reminded how the children of Israel were instructed in the Law to not oppress one another and to treat one another fairly, even to the point where they were not to lend money on intrest to one of their own people(Ex 22:25).


"And if thou sell aught unto thy neighbor, or buyest [i]aught[/i] of thy neighbor's hand, ye shall not oppress one another:"

- Leviticus 25:14(KJV)

And I think about this, to say that, when I hear the calls for social justice in politics, or when I hear it in the voices and attitudes of people that I talk to on the street, I don't despise them for it, at least I don't want to. I try, or perhaps am trying, to take it as a reminder that there are alot of things which are important to God. Not just, for instance, our sexual morality.


Maybe that is something that we can be reminded of in this election time also.


And too, I was reminded how, when the children of Israel came out of slavery in Egypt, they often wanted to return. The author of the article said this in the qoute that I selected:


"An entrepreneurial society is a society where most people wish to, and know they can, take care of themselves, their families..."


But coming out of slavery is hard. I live in the black community. I've lived around black people, have had them as my friends, all my life. My wife is black. I don't know that there is such a general confidence in the black community that they can take care of their familes. When black people were freed from slavery in this country, they were not delivered into lands with houses they did not build and wells they did not dig and feilds they did not plant. Neither was their property returned to them in a year of Jubilee? But for [b]centuries[/b] in this county they have been sorely oppressed.


And where they somehow treated generally as equals by white Christians? Even 50 or 60 years ago? The sin of hatred and racisim among white people against those who are black, even by professing Christians, in America, is a disgusting and vile evil. Especially if it is among people that profess faith in Christ.

We do not live in a cookie cutter world where everyone knows and believes they can succeed.

The children of Israel were told to remember that they themselves were once slaves in Egypt and to treat others with that in mind(Lev 19:34).


R
RobertW Nov 1, 2008

Mike's: The correlation to the present prosperity juggernaut which preached in it's plainest terms is something for nothing and faith as presumption, an unspoken obligation upon God to fulfill a promise never given.

This is a remarkable statement. It concerns me that man is bent on serving Mammon or serving Mammon in the name of serving the one true God. At the end of the day it is a mixture of covetousness and laziness. The world has been looking for a 'messiah' that would usher in such a 'god' and accompanying moral ethic. I think they may have found him and if he be not the one- they will surely look for another.

Why? Because covetousness and laziness rules the day; hard work and contentment are out of style. In short it is saying "I want", but I "want not hard work and if I must presume upon God to get it- I will." I'm reminded:

[color=000066]If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings, Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself. [i]But godliness with contentment is great gain. For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. [/i](I Timothy 6 italics added)[/color]

R
RobertW Nov 1, 2008

And where they somehow treated generally as equals by white Christians? Even 50 or 60 years ago? The sin of hatred and racisim among white people against those who are black, even by professing Christians, in America, is a disgusting and vile evil. Especially if it is among people that profess faith in Christ.

This is very true. We cannot tolerate racism among believers. I think it is true in both directions.

[color=000066]And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation... (Acts 17:26)[/color]

What I have worked to do from an administrative point of view is to encourage others to give their life to Christ and allow Him to direct them. I think the most oppressive aspect of inner city life is a self-destructive impatient mindset that is not willing to allow a functional mode of success to develop- no matter how many people try to counsel or try to help certain ones caught in this.

And I do not believe it is a color thing- I think it is a destructive and defensive sub-culture that assumes the world is their enemy and they have to get theirs no matter how they have to do it. Right now I have 4 young family members in prison and one that is near to it and all of them are white. I have worked hard and helped many of these people financially as well as other areas. But the destructive mindset (that I believe is demonic) overrides and real sense of change. They have the same mindset as many other ethnic groups that have been oppressed, but they have never really been oppressed. They are their own worst enemy. It is almost like they are bent on destruction and they have no one to blame, nor history to cite as the cause. So I am not convinced that the problems that we see carrying on have a historical context otherwise I would not be seeing identical behaviors across multiple ethnic groups with very different histories.

C
ChrisJD Nov 2, 2008

Hi Robert, hope you are well?


Thank you for your thoughts here. I think you raised some great points.


"I think it is a destructive and defensive sub-culture that assumes the world is their enemy and they have to get theirs no matter how they have to do it."


I know what you mean and had my own experience of this when I was younger, doing destructive things that I had no reason to do. But, I'm not sure that because some white people identify themsevles with that same mentality in order to justify their own evil inclinations, that this means there are not genuine social and historical roots to the problems that black people have in our society.


This seems like cutting off the foot of a newborn child, calling him a worthless cripple all of his life, and then latter, when he becomes an adult, giving him a prosthesis and saying 'now why can't you sprint like the rest of us'.

H
HeartSong Nov 2, 2008

I have become convinced that there is something special about the black people in the eyes of God - primarily from all of the persecution that they have experienced.

My brother in law is black. When I talk to him, it is as if we are on different planets - I think this is due to differing viewpoints - a different way of seeing. I do not think that there is anyone that I know that has a larger heart, and maybe this is where the difference comes in - and also, this may be one of the reasons for their persecution. They have a largeness of heart that makes them vulnerable - and if bitterness sets in, it is a large bitterness.

From what I have seen, and from sermons that I have heard (primarily Art Katz), God blesses the coming together of things that are opposite - as is black and white, male and female, young and old. These are the places that Satan seeks to implant a dividing wedge, for in these divisions he can wreck much havoc.

God has me focused on black and white lately. Black is the absence of color. White is the combination of all color. Grey is not a color in and of itself, but only a combination of black and white. Black absorbs light. White reflects light...

sermonindex Nov 2, 2008

It is staggeringly immoral to create an ever-larger class of dependent, helpless people who will be doomed to starve when the unsustainable system you have created collapses. And most of all, it is profoundly immoral to set yourself up as a secular messiah of sorts, assuring people that you will take care of them, eliminate hardship, heal the planet, and hold enemies at bay by the sheer force of your own hypnotic rhetoric.

I believe this is exactly what the last beast will want to do in order to make the people of the world receive its mark: put them in a place of total dependence upon their government, which, as the author states, will bring them down on their knees to ask that same government for deliverance when the system fails. Then people who have trusted in their leaders will have nowhere to turn to because the alternative to accepting the proposed "solutions" will be starvation and despair. Therefore, people will be prone to sacrifice their liberties for the promised "salvation" and "security". Of course, such a policy as Obama's is staggeringly immoral, but what can we expect from servants of Satan himself, from false messiahs? And the wicked will not understand anything, and will welcome the solutions. But those of understanding will instruct and help many.

What saddens me is that largely the church is so unprepared and a number of Christians who have, wittingly or not, made the government an idol will be brought on their knees at the end and thus depart from the faith, while others the Lord will chasten and deliver. I am not talking just about America here, but also about Bulgaria and the rest of the world.

Brother Mike made a good point:

If you fail, the expectation is that someone is supposed to come bail you out. It seems it is charity in reverse, an abuse of what used to be a sense of responsibility. It seems to have permeated the entire culture and many Christan's have bought into the ideal.

It is so important that we are obedient to the voice of God that we may be used for His purposes in the serious times we live in. Perhaps it will be our correct response to suffering and trials which will prepare us for the times ahead.

sermonindex Nov 2, 2008

I suppose we get what we deserve because it is taught to vote for the lesser of two evils. There is eight total candidates on the ballot. Shouldn't we vote our conscience? Instead of voting between two men? Won't change occur when we break party line and vote for the one who will best serve America, not what pop-culture and the media focus on. I regret that I failed in this, I voted and went for the lesser of two evils. I felt grieved after this. I didn't care for either main candidate. There was one man who I strongly considered to vote for, but new he wouldn't stand a chance. But isn't that how we should vote? What if we all take that attitude to the ballot, a cast our vote for the best man to serve. That would more than likely get these career politicians out of office, we would strike a cord in politics. Could you imagine a underdog winning, an independent!

Next thought, should we even vote? AS believers. I am for one going to consider this for next time I need to vote.

K
KingJimmy Nov 2, 2008

I'm an independent, who typically votes "for the Republican of your choice" (my Dad's philosophy). But this year while I voted Republican most of the time, there were a couple times where I voted with the Libertarian party. I voted Bob Barr for President.

Will he win? Not a chance. As it is, the electoral college is made up of mostly (if not entirely) Democrats and Republicans, who are mostly going to vote along party lines as it is-- which leaves no room for a third party candidate to emerge victorious.

The issue is ultimately that of power. The two party system we have in place now swings in the favor of those in power staying in power. That's why a lot of Senators are able to make a life-long career out of being a Senator. A decent sized--but not quite large enough-- third-party candidate (like Ross Perot from back in the days of the first George Bush) also more-or-less furthers the two party system. For such a candidate always seems to undermine at least one of the parties from whose "base" they come. Thus, while many people are open to a third party, they ultimately look at a vote for a third party as "wasted," because when push comes to shove, failure to vote "for the lesser of two evils" results in what one deems to be the "greater evil" winning the election. Thus, had many of the Republicans voted for Bush instead of Parrot back in the 90's, it is possible Clinton never would've won office. As a result of his winning of office, a lot of laws and appointments were made that Republican-minded voters did not care for over the course of 8 years.

It's really all a sad state of affairs. I've said all this because I ultimately believe the Devil is very glad there are only two "powers" (politically speaking), for it is much easier to consolidate two powers into one power. For the Devil is intoxicated with power, and wants political "unity," through which he can ultimately rule as an arrogant oppressor. A one-party system, which tends to exist under socialist states-- and absolutely under communist ones-- allows him the most leverage to accomplish what he seeks to accomplish in history. Patriotism and nationalism then come together to make for a deification of the state. Alternative messiahs, instead of Jesus Christ (anti-Christ), thus become a very real possibility over night.

Sadly, the thing that is supposed to drive men to God, the "eternity established in their hearts," that God-sized question mark as it were, when it does not find its fulfillment in God still seeks its fulfillment just the same. The absolute dedication of some Obama supporters is almost without precedent here in America. I've literally heard people say that if Obama is elected, they'll not have to work and struggle to pay for this, that, and the other... rather... the State will simply take care of it. I've yet to come across anybody, though I'm sure they exist, who have such a "worshipful" spirit in regard to any of the other candidates. A "change" is most definitely coming.

C
ChrisJD Nov 2, 2008

Hi everyone,


"A one-party system, which tends to exist under socialist states-- and absolutely under communist ones-- allows him the most leverage to accomplish what he seeks to accomplish in history.Patriotism and nationalism then come together to make for a deification of the state."


We had a missionary serving in China come make a presentation not too long ago. He spent some time speaking to us about the conditions in North korea. He indicated that the government there amounts to a form of religion and worship: of the deceased father and his son(who is the current leader) and of the spirit of the form of Communisim that they have in place. Voice of the Martyrs also had a section about North Korea in their latest Newsletter(October 2008). A striking illustration of what KingJimmy suggested there.

"A "change" is most definitely coming."

I was reading this week a somewhat lengthy article that I printed off the internet about a professing Muslim that was elected to an office in the US, and how he had made a point of using a Koran to take his oaths. The article gave some perspectives on this and a bit of history about our conflict with Islamic terrorism. The point was made of how the founders left the possibility of this open and left the decision of who should lead us, regardless of their ideological backgrounds to the voters. But those who are qouted in that regard also express doubt that anyone would ever become elected to high offices who were not Christians, unless, as one put it '...the people themselves be of the same opinion'.


The article is [url=http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissuesArticles.asp?id=384]here(Spring 2007 Newsletter of WallBuilders)[/url]

R
RobertW Nov 2, 2008

Hi Chris,

All is well on my end at this time. Hope all is well with you and yours also.

But, I'm not sure that because some white people identify themsevles with that same mentality in order to justify their own evil inclinations, that this means there are not genuine social and historical roots to the problems that black people have in our society.

Good point here and well taken. Sometimes I find a very destructive mindset that I cannot quite get my head around. I have seen it manifest in various ethnic groups and on various socio-economic levels. Truly I think the root of the problem is [i]selfishness[/i].

I'm thinking now of two young men, both white. One from a poorer background and one from a wealthier background. Both of these young men have been in and out of prison. The poorer young man I spoke to in 1994 in his cell headed back to the big house. He told me almost boastingly that he had 4 children all from different moms and while he was out on parole got a 5th woman pregnant. The second young man I know has 5 children by 4 different moms and is headed back to prison now in 2008.

What is going on in the minds of these people that refuse to take responsibility for these children and complain that the state would force them to support them? To me, it is selfishness of unprecedented proportions. To me, this is the greatest problem that exists right now here in our inner city and low income- drug infested areas. How do we see repentance on this most fundamental level?

R
RobertW Nov 2, 2008

Jimmy's: A "change" is most definitely coming.

[color=000066]This matter is by the decree of the watchers, and the demand by the word of the holy ones: to the intent that the living may know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will, and setteth up over it the basest of men. (Daniel 4:17)[/color]

I had the fortune of trying to remove a tree stump from a yard yesterday and thought how Nebuchadnezzar had been cut down by God and what the experience taught him. Having gone temporarily insane by the hand of God, eating grass like oxen, laid out in the field like a circus act- when his mind finally returned Nebuchadnezzar had a revelation:

[color=000066] And at the end of the days I Nebuchadnezzar lifted up mine eyes unto heaven, and mine understanding returned unto me, and I blessed the most High, and I praised and honoured him that liveth for ever, whose dominion is an everlasting dominion, and his kingdom is from generation to generation: And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou? At the same time my reason returned unto me; and for the glory of my kingdom, mine honour and brightness returned unto me; and my counsellors and my lords sought unto me; and I was established in my kingdom, and excellent majesty was added unto me. Now I Nebuchadnezzar praise and extol and honour the King of heaven, all whose works are truth, and his ways judgment: and those that walk in pride he is able to abase. (Daniel 4:34-37) [/color]


K
KingJimmy Nov 3, 2008

I am responsible for the short-sayings that are put up week after week at my church on the marquee in front of our building. This week, in light of all the political happenings going on, I offered this thought:

"Jesus: Change You Can Believe In"

:-)

K
KingJimmy Nov 3, 2008


We had a missionary serving in China come make a presentation not too long ago. He spent some time speaking to us about the conditions in North korea. He indicated that the government there amounts to a form of religion and worship: of the deceased father and his son(who is the current leader) and of the spirit of the form of Communisim that they have in place. Voice of the Martyrs also had a section about North Korea in their latest Newsletter(October 2008). A striking illustration of what KingJimmy suggested there.


Karl Marx once said that religion is the opiate of the masses, and was strongly against it. Yet it is very interesting that even though communist states are atheistic, they manage to produce a cult of the state. I think such is so telling of human nature and God's design. Fundamentally, we were created to worship. We are religious creatures by nature. Yet, even the sternest of atheists turn their hearts towards something and serve it.

Even in a Capitalist society such as we are (or used to be??), even the hardcore atheist bows before the almighty dollar. In a Socialist society, the hardcore atheist bows before the state. In a Capitalist society, since the dollar is worshiped, then we simply toss money at all our problems in an attempt to fix things. In a Socialist society, where the state is worshiped, another government program becomes the solution to everything, since after all, the government can fix everything.

Both systems, because of man's fallen nature, tend towards some form of idolatry. Man is designed to worship, and will worship something even if it is not God. Personally though, if I was able to choose which system I'd rather live amongst, I think I'd rather have everybody worshiping the almighty dollar than the state.

C
crsschk Nov 3, 2008

[i]And when the people saw that Moses delayed to come down out of the mount, the people gathered themselves together unto Aaron, and said unto him, Up, make us gods, which shall go before us; for as for this Moses, the man that brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we wot not what is become of him.[/i] Exo 32:1

Doesn't take long ... Great observation KJ, would add Robert's note of [i]selfishness[/i] as that 'something' if it is not God and is ultimately where even the money would be a lesser god.


I'm an independent, who typically votes "for the Republican of your choice" (my Dad's philosophy). But this year while I voted Republican most of the time, there were a couple times where I voted with the Libertarian party. I voted Bob Barr for President.


:-)

Couldn't help smile at that, my father would add "Vote NO on everything" to the list of initiatives. Of course that's being sarcastic, found this year that the way these things can be written (which always leaves you with a sense of recognition that both sides are exaggerating the truth) a "YES" vote often means "NO" - Leave it alone, don't add more bloat to the debt, no you cannot redefine marriage, etc.

Will he win? Not a chance. As it is, the electoral college is made up of mostly (if not entirely) Democrats and Republicans, who are mostly going to vote along party lines as it is-- which leaves no room for a third party candidate to emerge victorious.

Precisely and such is my disdain for politics as it now functions.

It's really all a sad state of affairs.

It's incredible to me that what we have right now is a popularity contest and again the correlations to the church. The best sellers, the big name charismatic ... well, there's the word right there. Flamboyant, eloquence of speech, even [i]carefulness[/i] not to offend and ride the road of popularity, the "cult of personality".

The disclaimer is noted in regards to these political forays here but I do think it is the heart disease that we are examining. What does make this even more sad is to go back and look at the history and the character of men that began this country. We have already gone over the "Christian nation" aspects but there is no denying the foundations and fundamentals - What is striking is that character that seems so far from us in this day; There was a time when doing the right thing over ruled the pettiness and surface level, face saving, career enhancing aspects. I would forward that there was less selfishness and a certain nobility towards the greater good and doing what was needed. To [i]serve[/i] as an honor.

At any rate, to come full circle back to the origins of this post ... "Work-ethic" is what I cannot get out of my mind and that I believe is what is at bottom that Robert was getting at with the two comparable youngsters - whatever their circumstances and upbringings. It is what made this once great country what it ... is.

sermonindex Nov 3, 2008

Capitalism, socialism, nor democracy are the cure for the ills of this world. With greed and corruption abound in what is most definitely a sin problem, the real problems can only be exposed by the Holy Spirit through the church. Otherwise there is just blame and figerpointing. The world has all kinds of solutions but no revelation. The greatest validation to socialism is a failure in capitalism and vice versa. There were many quasi-socialists on Wall St. when a government bailout was announced. It had nothing to do with ideology at that point, but had everything to do with money. Despite which 'ism' one chooses, the greedy and powerful will still elevate themselves at the expense of everyone else. In this world the first will be first and those willing to pay the price of greed and lack of conscience will get there first. I believe God has shown us some things the last 16 years and this is what I've gleaned:

The failure of each party has had everything to do with the rise of the other...this has been a back and forth issue for some time. But one thing has remained constant.....greed and corruption. Money has been behind it all whether it be through lobbyists,embezzlement, or simply billions of dollars in 'legal' funding. The jockeying of power is an ideological one but it is still those who sell out to power and greed who remain influential despite what ideology got the most votes or gains control.

The church has tried in vain to exert its influence, the worlds way, and now we may be heading for a pendulum swing of ideology to the contrary side of the last terms. We'll see what folly God will expose regardless of whose in charge.

They say that in the midst of outright oppression in China, the underground church flourishes. And they don't get to vote. Perhaps the church in America has been more forceful in its own influence than devoted to the One who could have truly made a difference. Perhaps we've been trying to fit the square peg of selling out to political influence in to the round hole of God's perfect and mandated way. If oppression comes here, I submit that we look at ourselves as part of the problem rather than any ideology that God has allowed to rule. Leonard Ravenhill preached endlessly of trying moments coming to America because we choose to trade our Bibles in the home for mere stones on government property and creationism in our schools. If we fought as hard to turn the tv off, forgo year around soccer, and train our children up in The Word as we do to keep stones on goverment property and God in our schools perhaps the influence in America would come as a BYPRODUCT of our total devotion and faith to God. It seems to me that the more we exert influence in activism the more influence we have taken from us. Ravenhill would say that God is more concerned about the 'prayer office' than the 'oval office'. I think he was speaking prophetically in many ways in these pointed sermons.

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