Trouble by some guests

I am very troubled by some guest speakers that we have had at our church and they are coming again. Their names our John Crowder and Chris Dunn.

Here are some links:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5YJPGaH_n0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNdlexU4eT4

I have spoken to our leadership about my concerns and without saying it directly, they think I'm being religious. They said they they would NOT have them again, but they didn't keep their word. My family & I don't go when they come.

Who do you think?

They get people to imitate getting high on drugs & getting drunk. They use terms like "god-ka" instead of vodka and "toking the ghost."

They says it gets you into God's glory zone.

I have recently asked a ministry to take me off of their mailing list because they were promoting John Crowder's materials.

I consider what he is doing to that which the Word says "turning the grace of God into lascivousness." This is about as carnal as is gets, and I don't understand why any pastor would let this man minister in his church if he knows what he stands for.

If the enemy can get Christians to seek after experiences, then he surely can deceive them. The reason why many moves of God have been sidetracked is because Christians have gone after the manifestations, and it became all about what makes me feel good. The presence of God was compared to a drug high, and it was even encouraged by some of the leaders to seek after being drunk in the Spirit.

I have seen that Christians that seek after these experiences are some of the most carnally minded people that you will ever meet, and are not growing spiritually.

I am not against spiritual experiences, and have experienced many manifestations of the Lord's presence, but I do not seek after these things or encourage other Christians to do so.

Mike

They get people to imitate getting high on drugs & getting drunk. They use terms like "god-ka" instead of vodka and "toking the ghost." They says it gets you into God's glory zone.

Not one soul will speak like this on the day of judgment. Not one.

Except perhaps those that are cursing on their way to the lake of fire. No one who speaks like this and does not repent will be permitted to remain in the presence of God for eternity.

I agree with what has been said. State what you believe with love, humility, and clearness and then depart. Yes, get away fast. Remember what God said to Moses and the Israelites? Get away!

Amen and amen to all of your posts brethren. I'm so shocked right now that I don't think there would be words to describe my reaction when I viewed their blasphemous disrespect of my Jesus.

If my unsaved Mom saw them, I have an idea of what she would say. Enough said.

Kathleen

Amen, flee from them with all haste. Do not look back, there is nothing there to see.

Praying for you and all the members of this forum (and you unregistered guests, too). Pray for God to direct your way to His paths.

Kind regards,
white stone

There are many revivals today that are false revivals, false fire.

If my unsaved Mom saw them, I have an idea of what she would say. Enough said.

What a good point. Unbelievers all the time rail and scoff and mock the church. From goofy cartoon characters to talking about God in a way some godless people would never even dare to, the "church" is a shame today. My mother is an unbeliever with no excellent moral record, but she is appalled and full of complaint about what happens in "Christianity". As she says, "that religion of yours" :roll:, even though I make clear that I do not identify with any of those things. To her, this type of junk is what Christianity produces or leads to. Anyone can see this type of shame on Christ everywhere.

I hear my mother's words right this minute: "Those boys need to be smacked in the mouth for talking like that." That is exactly what she would say. She would be offended such people are tolerated. I am not saying that is the right response, of course, just that when the world knows that what is happening is wrong and it is morally offensive even to them, then Satan has gotten his foothold in that place and is probably Lord of the manor.

"turning the grace of God into lascivousness."

That may be the best and only way to address it. Had to go and Google this and it is even worse, not only those that were mentioned but a big banner assault - "Drunken Glory Tour". As hard as it was to keep down the indignation read the proverbial "Controversy" explanation\\defense that seems to always accompany these things ...

What it boils down to inevitably is "We don't care". The clever dismissals of any concern is met with the same as was forwarded to you; "Being religious". It's all very galling and ridiculous. I wonder what might become of all these similar, interconnected aberrations if one day all of a sudden they woke up to the reality that there is no substance to their 'releasing' and 'glory realm' vernacular. They will not hear it because they cannot endure sound doctrine, cannot even take that confrontation without a rise in the defenses.

Everything to excess and extremes, cleverness and dismissal, contorting, force fitting fallacious, imaginative schemes into the bowels of scripture to justify their actions. It is quite pathetic.

[i] Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter![/i] Isa 5:20

This they would deny naturally but practice it nevertheless.

It is as kind as I can be as one who once was both a drunkard and a addict to suppress what I might really launch off on from this absolute idiocy. They are fools of the highest order to make light, make merry, make compressions of those things that are devastating, turn it around so that they are supposedly denouncing it by promoting it as equivalent to some ecstatic, sought after experience ...

Brother, you stand your ground and if they will not hear you, shake off the dust ...

I have some good news.

My church has cancelled and they are NOT coming.

Thank you for all of you who prayed for us.

LoveGodsWay2

"If the enemy can get Christians to seek after experiences, then he surely can deceive them. The reason why many moves of God have been sidetracked is because Christians have gone after the manifestations, and it became all about what makes me feel good. The presence of God was compared to a drug high, and it was even encouraged by some of the leaders to seek after being drunk in the Spirit.

I have seen that Christians that seek after these experiences are some of the most carnally minded people that you will ever meet, and are not growing spiritually."

Wow you can actually read people's heart like that?

I have been in those meetings you speak evil of and I have to admit they weren't perfect,but the anointing and presence of God was so intense I know I will never forget it.

I was there,I saw some wrong things. They like you didn't know what to do.
And you weren't there to show them what to do.
I sincerely hope if another revival comes you can show up to tell the leadership exactly who is manifesting purely and those that manifest with incorrect motives.

You don't and I dont know what they seek.
They say they seek God and you say they are liars.
I am sure this was said of the upper room crowd too.

"they just met in the upper room to get those flame things and get that reeling around drunk feeling."

I saw the 2 threads locked criticising the SI revival.

Kinda stings dont it?

psalm1,

I am sorry, but I don't understand your last entry in this thread.

Thanks,

LoveGodWays2

I have been in those meetings you speak evil of

David, can you clarify? Are you talking about John Crowder and Benjamin Dunn meetings?

Wow you can actually read people's heart like that?

These are men who call themselves "brothers"; according to the Apostle Paul, it is our duty to judge those who are "within" our ranks (I Cor. 5:12), and the Lord judges those who are "without". It is our saintly duty to do this in a spirit of grace, this I certainly agree with. I am only able to watch these videos for about 30 seconds before my spirit is too grieved to continue. Is this the normal experience surrounding genuine Christian ministry?

I have been in those meetings you speak evil of and I have to admit they weren't perfect,but the anointing and presence of God was so intense I know I will never forget it.

Abraham's dialogue with God;
" 23And Abraham drew near, and said, Wilt thou also destroy the righteous with the wicked?

24Peradventure there be fifty righteous within the city: wilt thou also destroy and not spare the place for the fifty righteous that are therein?

25That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?

26And the LORD said, If I find in Sodom fifty righteous within the city, then I will spare all the place for their sakes.

27And Abraham answered and said, Behold now, I have taken upon me to speak unto the LORD, which am but dust and ashes:

28Peradventure there shall lack five of the fifty righteous: wilt thou destroy all the city for lack of five? And he said, If I find there forty and five, I will not destroy it.

29And he spake unto him yet again, and said, Peradventure there shall be forty found there. And he said, I will not do it for forty's sake.

30And he said unto him, Oh let not the LORD be angry, and I will speak: Peradventure there shall thirty be found there. And he said, I will not do it, if I find thirty there.

31And he said, Behold now, I have taken upon me to speak unto the LORD: Peradventure there shall be twenty found there. And he said, I will not destroy it for twenty's sake.

32And he said, Oh let not the LORD be angry, and I will speak yet but this once: Peradventure ten shall be found there. And he said, I will not destroy it for ten's sake.

33And the LORD went his way, as soon as he had left communing with Abraham: and Abraham returned unto his place."

I wonder if modern day Abraham would pray for revival?

Peradventure Lord if thou find 50 things incorrect,will thou still come in power to revive?
"yes I will"

Peradventure if thou find 100 things wrong will thou still descend on your church in power?

"yes I will'

peradventure if one man manifest for show in the flesh will thou still come in power?

Yes I will"

Peradventure if 50 manifest in the flesh ,will thou still come in power?
"yes"
Peradventure if 100 manifest wrong will thou still come and revive?

"yes I will"

Peradventure if 101 manifest.........

"Abe who you listning to?"

My simple answer is how do you know it was God you were "feeling"; is anointing verified by visceral sensations?

Jesus said ;

"M8For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

9Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone?

10Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent?

11If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him? "

Jesus said;
my sheep hear my voice

I am of the household of God almighty God is my father
I know his voice.

See the scripure above and also see the devil can not answer my prayer.

Paul west;
"Actually, yes, you can. It is out of the heart that the mouth speaketh. Judging from the antics of these men, the blasphemy, the colossal embarassment they project on the world's view of Christianity with the unwholesome speech they exhibit - yes, we can know their heart."

Well you misread what I said (kinda funny since you can see everybody's heart)
I said Christians,not leaders.
also kinda funny you use elementary. I learned many years ago not to try and judge someone's heart.

You are not God and need to leave thee heart judging to him
Go back and look at the post again and stop trying to look at everybody's heart