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The One Pastor System - Quotes by Watchman Nee

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AbideinHim Jul 3, 2009

Today God is doing a work of recovery within the Church. There is so much that has been instituted and established by man that has become a part of the Church. I read a book by Watchman Nee several years ago entitled "Revive Thy Work". This book is all about how over the years the truths that were lost through the church being plunged into darkness are gradually being restored.

This is what Watchman Nee said concerning the "pastor system" that we have in today's Church. "We must reject the pastor system, for the single pastor arrangement is wrong; even a ten pastor arrangement is wrong. There should not be one person, nor should there be only a few persons." Nee goes on to say a few pages down: "Because there are so few Pauls, we must not wait for such spiritual giants to appear. We believe that the time has come for the whole church to work, to save, and to preach the gospel. THE WAY OF THE INDIVIDUAL IS OVER. Indeed, this is the day to follow the way of the body. We must be one heart with God. We criticize denominations, and rightly so, denouncing their brand of sacerdotalism; but we are no different in principle from them if the service of the church is monopolized by a worker plus a few elders in the place of all of the brothers and sisters laboring together."

Here are some other quotes by Nee that are very interesting and enlightening: "The fundamental principle of church service is that the members be of one accord. The Bible does not teach majority rule. It teaches one heart and one mind."

Brother Nee talks a lot about the need to get the "one talent members" to participate in the church. These one talent members are the members of the body that are not necessarily in the fivefold ministry, but each member has a gift, to build up and edify the body. The leadership of any church needs to see the body as a whole and to activate the gifts and callings of each individual member of the body. It is because of only a relatively few members participating in the church that there is such lack. The ones that do participate are often overworked and involved in doing things that God has not called them to do to fill the void. Nee says this about the one talent members: "The principle of the church service is to involve all the one-talent people. But as we have said before, when the one talents come forth, the flesh will also be present. Hence for the church to be a church, all the one-talent brethren must participate and authority must be exercised. Everyone needs to contribute, and everyone must obey. To have the exercise of authority but without the one-talent members participation does not constitute the church. On the other hand, to have the one talents' contribution but without the practice of authority and submission will cause confusion. The problem with the church lies in not encouraging the one-talent saints to function, though in fact the church is composed mostly of such saints. The ruin of today's church is due to the burying of her one talent members."

"Authority alone is empty; and to have only the one-talent people is confusion. But the presence together of both the one-talent factor and the exercising of authority constitutes the church. In obeying authority the fullness of authority comes to us. If people really know how to set aside their self life, there will be no problem in obedience."

"The Church has been on the earth for a long time now. Yet God has never once asked anyone to manage a church, neither has He called upon a few more advanced brothers to set up a church. To the contrary, the services of the local church are all governed by the Holy Spirit." "Let me say to each of my beloved brethren in the work, that notwithstanding how strong your ministry may be, how rich may be your gift, and how useful you are, you are a Nicolaitan if you monopolize all services. You have nothing to boast of; rather, you must confess your sin. Your personal piety will destroy the church instead of building it up. The right and correct way of work is to lead all the brothers and sisters into service. More service or less service is not the issue here. The pressing issue before us is that everyone must serve. Unless all serve, there is no church. Here, then is today's way: the work must be done by the entire church; it is the church and not just a few individuals, that preaches the gospel. No matter how well you each work, you become a Nicolaitan if you are a substitute for other people in the body of Christ. You may have a ministry but do not, as a consequence, have the church in reality. However successful may be certain so-called spiritual giants or great revivalists, their works are a failure if they fail to bring in body ministry."

"What is Nicolaitanism? (Revelation.2:6, 15 ) "But this you have, that you hate the deeds of the Nicolaitanes, which I also hate... So have you also those who hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate" The meaning of the word Nicolaitane is quite revealing. It means "conquering the people." Nicolaitanism developed into the clergy- laity system that we have in most of the church today. What is wrong with this is that the Lord never intended that one group of people in the church (clergy) would rule and reign over another group.(laity). The following scripture is addressed to Shepherds and overseers in the church of God: "Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight therof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre (greed for money), but of a ready mind; Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being examples of the flock." (1Peter 5: 2, 3).

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rbanks Jul 3, 2009

I very much enjoy much of Watchman Nee’s writings but how do you reconcile this teaching with the other scriptures.

Acts 2:14 (KJV) But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:

Ephesians 4:11-13 (KJV) 11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Hebrews 13:17 (KJV) Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

Blessings to you!

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AbideinHim Jul 3, 2009

Brother, I do not understand your question, because the scriptures that you listed do not contradict Brother Nee's teachings at all.

Watchman Nee wrote a book entitled "Spiritual Authority". He is not anti-pastor. He taught that every member in the Body of Christ has it's place. In Ephesians 4 the purpose of the fivefold ministry is to equip the saints to do the work of the ministry. Every member of the Body of Christ should be a functioning member and should be holding fast to the Head.

I have been in protestant churches that were set up much like the Roman Catholic church. Instead of having a priest though you had a pastor. Just as the priest stood between God and the people, the pastor did the same. We should be submitted to authority but we do not have to go through any one man to have access to God. Nor does God speak to us exclusively through any one man. Every believer is a king and a priest unto God. There is only one mediator between God and man, and that is Jesus Christ our Lord.

Mike

sermonindex Jul 3, 2009

ORIGINAL THREAD: I like this post, and agree with it. I printed it out to be read at our little home group this Saturday. I am not sure though if I see it entirely as Nee does, for without Godly Elders the Church will perish. They stand to feed, protect, and assure that the Holy Spirit is not quenched in any way, and especially by, "burying the "one talent members".


Nee is right. The clergy laity, individual, "one man show" has destroyed the function of the body, and thereby the church, and Paul spoke of greater grace given to the weak, that all could partake of, and by quenching their function, you quench love itself, and hamstring the church through non-function, and she dies.


The great passages about communion in 1Cor:11 are essentially a warning; to examine one's self lest judgment come to you by your disregard of any brother or sister, and then bring Judgment upon yourself.

[i]for he who eats and he who drinks in an unworthy manner, eats and drinks judgment to himself[/i][b].....NOT DISCERNING THE LORDS BODY![/b]"


"FOR THIS REASON MANY ARE WEAK AND SICK AMONG YOU, AND SOME SLEEP!"


So, we see that if we do not receive the weak and "lesser", non professional in our meetings , we risk receiving a curse instead.

"As much as you have done it to one of these, the LEAST of My brethren, [b]You have done it unto me!"[/b]


We're one body in reality, in spite of what the Clergy laity, "PASTOR" system has sold us. Yet, there must be Shepherds, ordained by God, to nurture and protect, and to ensure that He himself is not rejected.

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ChrisJD Jul 3, 2009

Hi everyone,


The right and correct way of work is to lead all the brothers and sisters into service.

A portion of one passage in Galatians 5:13 has stood out to me recently, it says:


[i]...by love serve one another.[/i]

[b]Edit[/b] Another thing that came to mind recently was that Joshua was called the minister of Moses. That he served Moses and not that he taught Moses. He served and helped him.

E
enid Jul 3, 2009


One thing we need to realise is, whether we like to one pastor system or not, it is here to stay.

Whether we gripe about it or accept it, it's not going away.

Amos, 3v7, Surely the Lord God does nothing unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets.

Are all prophets? Are there any prophets anymore?

Not just talking about "Thus saith the Lord", but I mean the man who will proclaim that which God's word says, boldly.

Eph 4 has been quoted, concerning pastors, evangelists etc.

Why are they even mentioned if everyone and anyone can contribute during church?

Verses 12 - 16 tells us that they are there for

The equipping of the saints
The work of the ministry
The edifying of the body of Christ

Not tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine

To speak the truth in love...

You get the picture.

Also 1 Tim 3 tells us of the requirements of bishops, who if they cannot rule their own home, how will he take care of the church of God?

I could write more, but I hate long posts.

C
chapel Jul 3, 2009

Found and interesting discussion and teaching on the subject here:

https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=9881&forum=36&start=80&viewmode=flat&order=1

sermonindex Jul 3, 2009

Hi Enid, while of course there are pastors and teachers(and one is not neccacarily the other) in the New Testement and Bishps, the earliest church was run by elders. Several men "Full of the Holy Spirit," and apostles. And you are right about verses 12-16. If an elder rules well then he is worthy of double honor. I think that the point of some of these posts is that, in general, they are not ruling well in as much as the saints are not being equipped, they are being shackled. For instance, in any large body of believers there will be several with the gift of teaching.Other will be called to pray, others to worship and so on and all within the context of the gathering. Now Paul corrects in Corinthians because there was no order, but the basic structure of more than one sharing, be it a word of knowledge, a Scripture, a hymn, is correct and left in place. Many modern churches resemble the movies. There are actors and there is an audiance. It was never meant to be this way. As far as the Pastor system being here to stay, I believe that it is already disolving and that God is bringing radical change to the remnant church.

Maybe , prior to the reformation, it would have been impossible to forsee a day when the Catholic chuch would be challenged and that a new movement or movements would emerge. Yet it did. Maybe God will work within the existing system, or maybe it is so defiled that He will sweep it away or leave it in its deadness, either way, I think we would both agree that He is a big enough God to do whatever pleases Him, despite human systems.........Frank

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AbideinHim Jul 3, 2009

I appreciate the comments and legitimate concerns of all that have contributed to this thread.

I am thankful that Jesus is building His Church. He is the chief cornerstone that the Church is to be built on.

We need to see what He is doing, and co-operate with Him, because what He is doing is going to be through His many membered body.

Many pastors are more concerned with building up their own churches numerically than in building the kingdom of God. I have been in churches where the pastor's ministry was the main focus, and the sheep existed to fulfill his vision.

The Word says that pastors are to be servants. We are to follow the example of Jesus and to serve others. If we are not willing to serve, but only want to be served then we are not fit for the ministry. If this is the case then we have not submitted ourselves to the dealings of God and the work of the cross.

We need to see that the kingdom of God is much larger than the church that we are in or our own individual ministries. Every born again believer is a member of the Body of Christ and has a ministry to fulfill. The pastors as well as the Apostles, prophets, evangelists and teachers are ordained by God to equip the saints to do the work of the ministry.

Mike

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hmmhmm Jul 3, 2009

in this thread there is extremely much good...

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=26547&forum=40&438]Just who IS responsible for this state of affairs?[/url]

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narrowpath Jul 3, 2009

I wonder that on the last day many pastors will come forward saying that they laboured for ten and want to claim their reward and Jesus has to tell them that they confined their congregation to infancy. He will show them how much they actually prevented rather than facilitated. Whenever I read the last chapters and greetings in Pauls letters I am reminded that there were many people abounding in all sorts of ministries and services.
Authority is a godly principle that the church has to observe and display.
Perhaps we have to wait until a persecution arises that scares the hireling pastors into flight and allow the true shepherds to emerge.

sermonindex Jul 3, 2009

Wow, narrowpath: a very clear word; prophetic and absolutely true. I think you are right. When your life is at risk, and you must "pay up ", now and then, as it is in China right now....where the hirelings and professionals have vamooshed, or been "called" into another line of work.


Jesus said; "The hireling flees when the WOLF comes, but the good Shepherd does lay his life down for the sheep."

"Perhaps we have to wait until a persecution arises that scares the hireling pastors into flight and allow the true shepherds to emerge."
narrowpath.


"Jesus has to tell them that they confined their congregation to infancy. He will show them how much they actually prevented rather than facilitated."...narrowpath


The present clergy/Laity....One Pastor system actually isolates the body into a priest class, and a common, or lay class. The Priest wears a snappy suit, stands behind a barrier, and becomes the highly spiritual one, given control and power over all, and of course the CASH. The rest linger, in a semi conscious state , as drones, eagerly awaiting approbation and the Sunday handshake. The great T. Austin Sparks called them, "DISH CHRISTIANS", who need perpetual watering to survive, as a hydrated plant grown upon a coffee plate.


I went to the underground church in China, [ 1000 miles inland away from the cities ]where it may cost you severely to honor fellowship and Godly love. The men that were left, would not reveal themselves to me, and I didn't care. I understood; they did not know me; the cost was to great to chance it. The many precious women there told me that most of the Pastors had fled. They were real.


We too will be given an opportunity to prove our devotion to Jesus alone.


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ADisciple Jul 3, 2009


enid wrote:
One thing we need to realise is, whether we like to one pastor system or not, it is here to stay.
Whether we gripe about it or accept it, it's not going away.

I think I know what you mean, Enid. This arrangement has been around for a long, long time.

But it is definitely not here to stay. More and more Christians are restless about this man-made order, and are not content to be mere pew warmers anymore. More and more Christians are leaving that system, recognizing it as something that is decaying and growing old. I think the way they feel is something God Himself has produced in their hearts. It is He who has stirred them up, has caused the discontent. He is preparing many hearts for something new, of which He intends them to be, each and every one of them, VITALLY a part.

And so, if we could see around the corner, we would see this present system is definitely not here to stay. It is history.

It's God's word that is here to stay. And His word concerning church reveals an entirely different order.

God has shown Himself a very patient God in many ways over the centuries. It seems He is able to wait a long time for the desire of His own heart. But He always-- ALWAYS-- has His own way in the end, has things the way HE wants them to be.

AD

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