Go and sin no more

John 8:11
"She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more."

John 5:14
"Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee."

I guess the strongest argument is that impossible not to sin. But why would Jesus say, "Sin no more" in John 5:14 and 8:11. Is Jesus being facetious because He knew it was impossible to do? Does he mean, don't do a particular sin any more?

But there is no getting away from the fact, God expects us to stop sinning. God expects prefeection in our lives.

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."
Matthew 5:48

"Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you."
Philippians 3:15

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God."
2Corinthians 7:1

Sinlessness and perfection I rememebr talking to a Pastor about these things and he said it's impossible that we will never attain this in this life.

My belief is that it is possible to live a life where we "sin no more" although I cannot say it's a fact in my life, what do you believe and why?

1 Thessalonians 5:23  ¶And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24  Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it.

Would blameless and sinless be synonyms?

If he would preserve the Thesalonians blameless unto the coming of our Lord . . . why would he not do the same for us?

If perfect means fully mature, then surely none of us will be that until we awake in His likeness Psalms 17:15 on the other side.

If blameless means not guilty of willfully, knowingly disobeying His will, and repenting when we discover that we have unknowingly disobeyed . . . that state of life is not only possible, it SHOULD BE the norm.

1 Corinthians 15:57  But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

1 John 5:4  For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
5  Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

Galatians 2:20  I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Galatians 5:16  This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

prayforbob, Holy Ghost baptizm feels like a body your perfect size coming in, touch me and get shocked, lest, and then killed all day long persectution, and thats the Lord making me weak by manifold temptations like electricity causing itching on scalp, flowing on what I use bathroom out of, spiking, caressing, gum desease, terrified in visions, seeing Jesus in visions and him lauhging, at me, saying things like, run from me, backslide, perish for the bretherns sake http://www.prophetic.beep.com

The Good News is that God has already provided the solution for this in Christ. Christ crucified you when He died and you were buried with Him. When you were born again, the old you died and you received Christ's Life. If you are a Christian then you become one with Him. He made you a NEW CREATION. You were made 100% righteous and perfect. You are one with Holy Spirit or the Spirit of Christ. You are no longer a sinner; you now have a new pure heart and God's very Divine Nature.

I have put up this quote as to what I was taught as a Babe in Christ and this is what I belived but know I find myself challenging this teaching. Why because there seems to be a part of me that like a magnet which always aligns to the North, I find in me something that would always cause me to sin. I might try and resist but inside theres something that pulls me in another direction.

I found out that I was alive to Christ on my conversion, but as I went on I find that the old man did not die as I have been taught. It is him warring within it is him that is opposed to the things of God while he lives I can only dream of being able to fulfill Christs command of [b]"Go and sin no more"[/b]

Does the Spirit of Christ sin? Absolutely not.

Does the Holy Spirit sin? Absolutely not.

Where is the Spirit of Christ?

Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His.

Colossians 1:27-28 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

How are we perfect? "In Christ", by the Christ birthed of the Father in us.

We are perfectly saved in the Spirit of Christ.

We are being saved in our soul, where the Holy Spirit works bringing our minds to the Mind of
Christ, "predestinated to be conformed to the image of Christ".

1Co 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

Romans 8:29 For whom He did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren.

We are saved and without sin in spirit, by the Spirit of Christ in us.

We are being or doth save Present tense, us in our soul.

We will be saved in body on resurrection morning, until then it is quickened to contain the Spirit of Christ, the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of God our Father.

2 Corinthians 1:10 Who delivered us from so great a death, and doth deliver: in whom we trust that he will yet deliver us;

Jesus will never laugh and any of His brethren.

It is old sloo-foot, the dragon as an angle of light who is laughing at us who is saying there is Christ, Here is Christ, I am Christ, to take us away from the Christ that is in us and defeat the Fathers rebirthing of Christ in His born again son'.

Even Paul knew this very well and states it many times in his letters to the Gentiles... "Who will set me free from this body of death"?

In Christ: Phillip

I think what Jesus means is to leave your life of sin. Rigtheousness is now the standard and sin the regretful exception.

paulmcg1 wrote:
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Paul this was on another post the brother who posted it gives a very good answer to your question.

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Don't take that verse out of context.

1. This passage must always be looked at in context. The entire book of John must be consulted, especially verses 1:7-10, 2:1. Those who isolate this passage usually twist its meaning to be contrary to the rest of the epistle which is about moral perfection. The meaning of a verse is always lost or misunderstood when scripture isolation is practiced. The immediately surrounding context gives us much clarity into this verse.

2. The phrase, "have no sin" in verse 8 could mean two things. It could mean "have no sin" in your present conduct, or it could mean "have no sin" on your record. Verse 10 is very clear that John is talking about those who deny having any disobedience on their record by saying "If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." None can deny that they have sinned or disobeyed in the past, but Christians can say that they presently obey God.

3. Verse 7 and 9 promise, not merely the pardon of sin, but also cleansing from sin. There is a proper distinction made between forgiveness and cleansing, “to forgive us our sins, AND to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” These passages promise not only forgiveness of sin but also freedom from sin. They promise freedom, not merely from some sins, but freedom from "all" sins, "to cleanse us from ALL unrighteousness".

4. The man spoken of in verse 8 is the man who had not yet experienced verse 9. That is, the deceived man who denies having any sin is the one who has not yet confessed their sins, been forgiven of their sins, and has had their sins cleansed out of their life. Verse 8 is directed to, or specifically talking about, the man who has not yet been forgiven and cleansed as described in verse 9. Verse 9 is written as the solution to the sin described in verse 8.

5. If 1:8 means that nobody can state that Jesus Christ has cleansed them from all sin, then saying that you have experienced 1:9 makes you a liar. This interpretation of 1:8 would mean that believing 1:9 would make you “deceived”.

6. If "have no sin" means that no Christian can state as Paul did that we are presently "free from sin" (Romans 6:22), then John immediately contradicts his purpose as stated in 2:1, "these things write I unto you, that ye sin not." This interpretation would mean that John was writing this epistle so that we would “deceive ourselves” and so that “the truth” would not be “in us”. Why would John write them so that they “sin not” if when they believe that they “sin not” they are simply “deceived” without “the truth”?

7. If 1:8 means that you are a liar if you claim to presently keep God's commandments, then 2:3-4 is a total contradiction. These passages state that "we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that saith I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him." Such an interpretation would amount to this: if you claim to keep God's commandments, you are a liar and the truth is not in you (1:8), but if you claim to know God but do not keep His commandments, you are a liar and the truth is not in you (2:4). So the truth would not be in the one who claims to keep God's commandments, and the truth would not be in the one who says they know God yet breaks His commandments. Then the only logical conclusion would be that nobody knows God, if the Bible teaches that everyone presently breaks God’s commandments and you cannot know God if you presently break His commandments.

8. If 1:8 means that we all always have sin in our lives, then we do not "abideth in him" and have "not seen him, neither known him" according to 3:6, we are all "of the devil" according to 3:8, and we have not been born of God according to 3:9.

9. If 1:8 means that you are a liar if you state that you no longer break God's commandments, then the Apostle John is a liar because he says "we keep his commandments and do those things that are pleasing in his sight" in 3:22. According to the popular interpretation of 1:8, this would make the Apostle “deceived”, it would mean that the Apostle was without “the truth” because he claimed to “keep his commandments”.

10. The difference between the children of God and the children of the devil, is that the children of God do what is righteous, but the children of the devil commit sin, according to 3:8-10. This could not be a proper or accurate distinction if 1:8 means that everyone converted or not has present disobedience in their life.

11. The meaning of this passage is clear: If a man claims that they have never sinned, that they have no sin on their record, they are deceived. But if they confess that they have sinned, their sin can be both forgiven and cleansed out of their lives, so that they will walk in holiness and righteousness.

narrowpath wrote:
I think what Jesus means is to leave your life of sin. Rigtheousness is now the standard and sin the regretful exception.

If Jesus meant we should leave our life of sin would that mean we should sin no more?

Quote by A.J. Gordon from "Born Crucified"

"Divine truth as revealed in scripture seems often to lie between two extremes…. Almost all of the gravest errors have arisen from adopting some extreme statement of Scripture to the rejection of the other extreme….. If we regard the doctrine of sinless perfection as a heresy, we regard contentment with sinful imperfection as a greater heresy."

A.J. Gordon also said, “

‘If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves,’ the unconscious justification for a low standard of Christian living. It were almost better for one to overstate the possibilities of sanctification in his eager grasp after holiness, than to understate them in his complacent satisfaction with a traditional unholiness. Certainly it is not an edifying spectacle to see a Christian worldling throwing stones at a Christian perfectionist.”

I read all of 1 John this morning.

As one preliminary thought, John Wesley is known for addressing this issue. To sum it up briefly, Christian perfectionism vs. sinless perfection. John Wesley believed in perfectionism as, the best I know how to describe it, as a journey to perfection, and the complete surrender of oneself in every aspect to God, giving no inch to the devil; he would never accept the idea of sinless perfection though, as "...sinless perfection is a phrase I never use, lest I should seem to contradict myself." Apparently the ideas do not necessarily relate.

What I'll do here is I'll lay down some of my thoughts from reading 1 John. Murrcolr, I'm most interested in your thoughts.

On 1:8 through 2:1, I considered the idea that it was someone who had only previously sinned, but does not now sin. John uses "we" quite frequently, so I would guess he would include himself in this passage, as if to say, for example, "Even if I claim to have no sin, then I prove that the truth is not in me," unless the use of "we" is just his peculiar writing style, and he does mean sinless perfection.

I move on to 2:1, an he says he does write these things so that we don't sin. Makes sense. Then he says, "But if anyone does sin," and in context I assume that he means his audience, whom I assume were Christians and believers, and in case any of these believers do sin (still sounds like it should be the exception), they have the advocate to the Father, Jesus Christ. Given context so far, from my interpretation, "Get rid of all sin. Have none of it. I write these so that you don't. Yet unless someone does, which I hope would be the exception, you have your advocate of forgiveness, Jesus Christ."

Then I get to Chapter 3:6 - Everyone who remains in Him does not sin; everyone who sins has not seen Him or known Him. Do we mean this as a habit, or do we say that even a single sin proves that you do not know God? Once again, how do I read this correctly? Going to the Greek, the first instance of the word sin, "hamartei," sounds exactly how it does in English; doesn't sin. The second, in the "everyone who sins," the word is "hamartAnwn." It's a present active device, though also a participle, where something acts as an adjective and as a verb. Young's Literal Translation probably gets closest to the Greek out of any translation, and it puts it this way: "every one who is remaining in him doth not sin; every one who is sinning, hath not seen him, nor known him." As a matter of fact, looking through the whole of 1 John 3:1-12, looking at my Greek text in front of me, much of what's in here is participle in nature, expressing an ongoing thing, and not one-time incidences. I'd look at the YLT for 1 John 3 to get an idea. From what I can tell (though I admit my Greek experience is quite young), it's a right translation. I notice too in v. 5 where it says "take away sins," the footnote in my Bible, and the YLT, and the Greek say "our sins," meaning those specific to us.

Then of course I get to John 5 and the rock gets heavy again. By verse 16 through 17, do I assume that any sin whatsoever robs a believer of life? What then is the sin that brings death, and the sin that doesn't? What is the need for God to give life to that person if the sin isn't unto death? What does that life entail? Life to not repeat the transgression, or to bring the brother back into grace after falling? But then why isn't it called the sin unto death? Or should we assume that any sin by default takes you from grace, and the sin that brings death just seals it, like blasphemy of the Spirit?

Perhaps the main question in my mind, if a person does not reach sinless perfection, then does this mean he'll be sentenced to hellfire?

If you want some sense of the questions going through my mind, there they are. I hate sin, I want it weeded out, and if the Bible says that I should be 100% sinless perfect, then I will do it, as it's what He commands. However, I do not want to put a weight on the back of a person that God never commanded us to carry. If the most I am ever to tell someone is to contend for holiness in every way, chance and form possible, to get as close as possible though they never reach it, then I will gladly tell them, though I would not add to the words of God.

Anastasis wrote:
I read all of 1 John this morning.

As one preliminary thought, John Wesley is known for addressing this issue. To sum it up briefly, Christian perfectionism vs. sinless perfection. John Wesley believed in perfectionism as, the best I know how to describe it, as a journey to perfection, and the complete surrender of oneself in every aspect to God, giving no inch to the devil; he would never accept the idea of sinless perfection though, as "...sinless perfection is a phrase I never use, lest I should seem to contradict myself." Apparently the ideas do not necessarily relate.

My view on Sinless perfection if Adam was perfect, sinless and he still fell. So we can never get to a place where we will never sin. Now do I believe we can get to a place where can resist the temptation to sin again yes I do.

1 John 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

Jesus was at all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. Heb 4:15

We should be like Jesus although tempted in all points we should not sin.

What we have in the world today is Carnal Christianity; with this type of Christianity it's impossible for us to resist the devil in all points.

What I mean is that our spirits are renewed but our hearts are not pure, so we have a disability in us we find that in our inner man we love the laws of God Roms 7:22 but in our members there is another force at work Paul calls it a another law Roms 7:23.

So we need a double cure one for the spirit the other for our members. When I speak about "our members" I need to clarify that our flesh and bone the body will not be changed until we meet Jesus in the air. So when we think "our members" I mean our souls which is our mind, will and emotions we could call our personality or character. This is the area where the friuts of your life will be evident for others to see.

In the Soul we have lusts Rev 18:14 we can also have unbelief and hopelessness Pslams 43:5 bitterness is also in the souls Job 21:25 I could go on but hope you get the point.

Know lets look for the double cure Ezekiel 36:26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you. I will remove your stubborn hearts and give you obedient hearts. A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

It says here A New Heart [b]and[/] a New Spirit it goes on to say in Ezekiel 36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. This is what Paul speaks about in Rom 7:22 loving God laws in the inner man the Spirit. So we need God to take away the heart of stone and give us a heart of flesh.

God will do this so he can be sanctified in us Ezekiel 36:23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes.

So this double cure is the work of sanctification of God in us why because he wants us to be Holy like he is Holy so we don't bring any reproach on his name.

When we read this we need to think of 2 types of sin, inbred sin and the sin we have committed.

1 John 1:5-10 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

God is Light

6If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

What is the truth God is Light there is no darkness in him, if we walk in darkness and say we fellowship with him then we lie.

7But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

If we walk with him in the light (remember there can be no darkness when we walk our we lie) we have fellowship with each other and the Blood cleanses us from [b]all[/] sin.

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

This sin spoke of here is Inbred sin

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

This is the sin we have committed in our life.

10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

This is sin we have done in our life. Why would John say the same thin twice unless he was talking about two different types of sin. Sin and Sins.

1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.

John writes this so we sin not this implies that we don't have to sin, but he also says if you do sin we have an advocate so. We can fall in temptation like Adam did but we can also walk like Jesus and be tested in ever point and did not sin but there is always the risk of falling.

I think I better see what you're saying, and correct me if I'm wrong. You're talking about the opposite of the carnal Christianity where we treat sin as a passive thing, almost--if not exactly like--antinomianism where we make no strive for holiness. However, since Christ has given us a new heart and mind, He has put it in us to overcome temptation, and has given us the ability to be successful, so we should never treat our condition like there's nothing that can be done about it; otherwise, why give us the clean heart? Why take out the heart of stone and put in its place one that desired obedience? Therefore, what excuse do we have not to strive for holiness? The point is to learn not to sin; though if you do, you have an advocate. It's not sinless perfection, but it's to have a heart, mind and spirit that abhors sin [u]and acts accordingly[/u]--and should it fall, has the grace of 1 John 2:1.

murrcolr wrote:

I have put up this quote as to what I was taught as a Babe in Christ and this is what I belived but know I find myself challenging this teaching. Why because there seems to be a part of me that like a magnet which always aligns to the North, I find in me something that would always [b]cause me to sin[/b]. I might try and resist but inside theres something that pulls me in another direction.

I found out that I was alive to Christ on my conversion, but as I went on I find that the old man did not die as I have been taught. It is him warring within it is him that is opposed to the things of God while he lives I can only dream of being able to fulfill Christs command of [b]"Go and sin no more"[/b]

The flesh will give pleasure because of the senses. The flesh is amoral; it takes pleasure in what ever & however, good or bad, morally or immorally for it has no mind to discern.
This is unchangeable, it will remain this way even after we are saved; the flesh needs to be done away with. That will happen in the resurrection.

None the less, [b]the flesh is not the "[u]cause[/u]" of your sin[/b]! The cause is that you still have sympathy for the unlawful affections of your flesh.
The answer is to PRAY for deliverance and present your body a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service (Rom 12:1 and renewing your mind (Rom 12:2).

Hope this helps.

murrcolr wrote:

paulmcg1 wrote:
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Paul this was on another post the brother who posted it gives a very good answer to your question.

I'm glad to see some people actually read what I have to say> :-P

I had to look it up

Antinomianism:- is the idea that members of a particular religious group are under no obligation to obey the laws of ethics or morality, and that "Salvation" is by predestination only.

I am talking about Entering His Rest Hebrews 4:1 Hebrews 4:11 "He brought us out, that He might bring us in"--two parts of God's work of redemption--"He brought us out from Egypt, that He might bring us into Canaan." And that is applicable to every believer. At your conversion, God brought you out of Egypt, and the same almighty God is longing to bring you into the Canaan land.

[url=http://www.fullbooks.com/The-Master-s-Indwelling1.html]The Masters Indwelling By Andrew Murray[/url]

1 Peter 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently.

Peter lets us know here that thse christians souls had been purified but he also ties that in with having a pure heart.

1 Peter 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Hebrews 4:9-10 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

There is a rest for Gods people.

10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

He that enters the rest hath ceased from his own works that to me means a complete surrender to God's will.

Here is brief testimony of mine.

It starts with me walking out of the only church I had attended since I have known God. Now because of various reason and much praying which I won't go into here I decided to leave.

I had just crossed the street after leaving the church for the last time. I prayed Father, I know what you spoke to me about.........(My Calling), I believe what you have said, I don't know how you'll do it but I believe you'll do it. Mid step the Holy Spirit spoke to me "you'll be like Job". This as you can imagine was not what I wanted to hear.

Five years later in back slidden state while I was working in West Africa there I caught a viral infection this infection causes blisters to appear on the skin.

I needed to hear from God and decided to Fast and Pray. After my time of fasting and praying ended it was around the same time I was going back to work, I had this question in my head "what makes a great man of God great". So I went searching the internet to find out about the men of god to get a insight into their lives, I came across Duncan Campbell’s testimony on sermon index and (that's how I became a member on here) downloaded it onto my IPod to listen to it on the plane.

After having my meal the light was dimmed I got out my IPod and started to listen to Duncan's Testimony when I got to the point where Duncan says "Go for God whatever it takes" these words cut through me with tears streaming down my face I went to the toilet got on my knees (As best I could in a small toilet) and prayed. The sobs and tears just kept on coming I asked God to help me.

For my whole month while in Africa every time I had on my own with God he turned up all I seemed to able to do was weep. During this time God had been talking to me about Holiness and the need to be Holy, he should me that there was a system still in me that needs to be removed. This system is evil and it’s so wrapped up in your personality that you believe it's you, the reason you are who you are is because of this system, it controls, it manipulates, it lies, and it affects every part of you, your mind, your will and emotions.

When I got back to Scotland, I got a book from a woman who had not put it to print yet it was called Revival the Call of Holiness this was God confirming to me what had been speaking to me about in Africa.

From there I have started studying and reading up on the subject. I AM NOT sanctified (Made Holy) yet no but my faith level are increasing as I study the subject of Holiness.

John is making it clear that believers are sinners that need to confess thier sins when any have been committed. When Jesus told people to go and sin no more , He was revealing what God's will was for our lives but not revealing that it was possible to fulfill perfectly. I believe He knew that there is no way that people could live a totally sin free life especially when He had not even died and rose again yet when he told these people that. Also , these people did not even have all of the new testament scriptures and tools that we have today , and christians today still cannot rid their lives of sin completely. I notice two things about christians that tell other christians that they can be totally sinless. The first thing is these christians are not even sin free themselves in thier own lives , and the second thing is that they conveniently never quote any of the many scripture references by Paul and John that clearly reveal that we all still have an old sin nature that we can still give into in the flesh , yet still be considered saved and have the Spirit at the same time. " It is no longer I that do it , but sin that dwelleth in me "