American Churches | SermonIndex

sermonindex Dec 24, 2009

I've been 6 months in this great land of America, and have yet to find a living church. Been to Evangelical, Reformed, Baptist, Methodist, Presbyterian, C&MA, Charismatic, whatever denomination you call it...but almost all of them invariably have no LIFE. The presence of Christ is utterly absent.

The Sunday church service is usually about an hour & a half, at the most 2 hours. The main & only message is usually a powerpoint presentation (what you call a lecture; certainly not a sermon). The speaker is unaware of what they used to call 'divine unction'. He tries to impress with his knowledge of doctrine, and usually fails. There is a terrible smugness in the Reformed churches, sad to say.

The pastors who are from the big seminaries (say, Dallas Theological Seminary) are the ones who know very little about the living Christ. To them Christ is doctrine. They have knowledge in their heads and hardness in their hearts. They are so self-righteous in their 'knowing it all', that it is almost impossible to bring them to repentance.

I say this with deep sadness. I have yet to meet a humble broken preacher or pastor (except maybe one or two in passing). I keep telling Americans: "Have you heard of DL Moody? Harry Ironside? EM Bounds?" Shockingly, few evangelicals have bothered to read their sermons/messages.

The knowledge of the Bible among evangelical Christians in America is abysmal. Many have not read the Bible through even once!

May God have mercy on this nation.

M

Miccah Dec 24, 2009

procyon wrote:

I've been 6 months in this great land of America, and have yet to find a living church. Been to Evangelical, Reformed, Baptist, Methodist, Presbyterian, C&MA, Charismatic, whatever denomination you call it...but almost all of them invariably have no LIFE. The presence of Christ is utterly absent.
The Sunday church service is usually about an hour & a half, at the most 2 hours. The main & only message is usually a powerpoint presentation (what you call a lecture; certainly not a sermon). The speaker is unaware of what they used to call 'divine unction'. He tries to impress with his knowledge of doctrine, and usually fails. There is a terrible smugness in the Reformed churches, sad to say.
The pastors who are from the big seminaries (say, Dallas Theological Seminary) are the ones who know very little about the living Christ. To them Christ is doctrine. They have knowledge in their heads and hardness in their hearts. They are so self-righteous in their 'knowing it all', that it is almost impossible to bring them to repentance.
I say this with deep sadness. I have yet to meet a humble broken preacher or pastor (except maybe one or two in passing). I keep telling Americans: "Have you heard of DL Moody? Harry Ironside? EM Bounds?" Shockingly, few evangelicals have bothered to read their sermons/messages.
The knowledge of the Bible among evangelical Christians in America is abysmal. Many have not read the Bible through even once!
May God have mercy on this nation.

It is pretty sickening. But please remember that just because you may have run into some pastors from DTS that may not be walking correctly, that fact should not disqualify the other pastors who are from DTS that are walking.

Blessings my friend. I pray that you find what you are searching for. If not, you may need to look at places that you may not expect...in order to find what you seek.

sermonindex Dec 24, 2009

Thank you for responding. I am glad you responded about DTS. I believe that knowledge of doctrine does not translate into 'experience of life'. Those illiterate fishermen (who were Christ's first disciples) had a deeper experience of Christ & life than most seminary-educated graduates of today.
I have seen some of these DTS pastors presiding over what I may call 'dead churches'. And I was deeply saddened. Some of them are in charge of 'prosperous' Reformed-Mennonite churches (what they call Bible Fellowships) in this little state on the East Coast.

H

HeartSong Dec 24, 2009

I am in the so called "bible-belt" and it is the same here. Finally I have realized that the Lord would have me to be one of the sparks that brings forth life - which is what we are all called to be.

S

shadyg Dec 24, 2009

You should give it serious prayer. Maybe the Lord brought you hear for the purpose of calling pastors and churches to repentance.

we speak so much about what's wrong with the church but where are those who who actually go about doing something about it.

sermonindex Dec 24, 2009

I agree that earnest intercessory prayer is needed.
But I am from another part of the globe, and I can say definitely that American evangelism is wishy-washy, and almost totally devoid of the Spirit. I know of instances where American evangelical Christianity has ruined the true work of the Spirit in different parts of the globe, notably, Nepal and East Europe.

S

shadyg Dec 24, 2009

not trying to be confrotational ....humbly ... what are you going to do about it? Are you willing to be open to God's will for your life?

sermonindex Dec 24, 2009

Humbly...there is a great malaise afflicting the evangelical churches in America. Perhaps, the seminarians need to spend time in Asia, South America and possibly Africa or the remote isles...before they take up pastoring churches. What is lacking is a deep inward experience of the cross. People are caught up with techniques and formulae, rather than with Christ and His cross. Gal 2.20, Phil 3.10, Phil 1.29 :-(

T

twayneb Dec 25, 2009

Procyon Wrote: Humbly...there is a great malaise afflicting the evangelical churches in America. Perhaps, the seminarians need to spend time in Asia, South America and possibly Africa or the remote isles...before they take up pastoring churches. What is lacking is a deep inward experience of the cross. People are caught up with techniques and formulae, rather than with Christ and His cross. Gal 2.20, Phil 3.10, Phil 1.29

Procyon: Welcome to SI. I would have to agree with you that if you look at the church overall in America as well as in some other nations in Africa and Asia, the American church falls behind in manifestation of the Holy Spirit. However it is not that way in every local body in America. There are those who not only live out of a deep work of the cross of Christ in their lives, but also walk in the accompanying power of the Holy Spirit. I pray right now that God will connect you with one of those bodies. God placed my wife and I in such a place.

May God richly bless you.

Travis.

M

murrcolr Dec 25, 2009

HeartSong wrote:
I am in the so called "bible-belt" and it is the same here. Finally I have realized that the Lord would have me to be one of the sparks that brings forth life - which is what we are all called to be.

God wants you to be more than just a spark....

Heb 1:7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

A flame of fire..........

G

Giggles Dec 25, 2009

murrcolr wrote:

HeartSong wrote:
I am in the so called "bible-belt" and it is the same here. Finally I have realized that the Lord would have me to be one of the sparks that brings forth life - which is what we are all called to be.
God wants you to be more than just a spark....
Heb 1:7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
A flame of fire..........

Cute and correct, in some degree, but clearly Hebrews is speaking of literal angels, not humans.

G

Giggles Dec 25, 2009

For the topic of this thread: As has been said by men far wiser and spiritual than me:

Please be careful how you speak of God's Church. There may be different goats and tares mixed in with the sheep and wheat, but the true Church is alive and well in God's Spirit. Christ's Bride is spotless and pure, and has been bought by His blood. Choose your words carefully when speaking of her. I'm sure any solid husband here on the forums would not approve of us bad-mouthing his wife. May we act accordingly with Christ's.

S

shadyg Dec 25, 2009

still haven't answered the question? All you're doing is bashing the bride of Christ.

sermonindex Dec 25, 2009

Thanks, Travis. I appreciate your prayers. I did find a good church in South Jersey, however. Chinese-American. :-)

sermonindex Dec 25, 2009

I don't know what is meant by 'bashing the Bride of Christ'. (Sounds like a cultish phrase; perhaps from the Kingdom Cults? :-) )

I guess you've misunderstood my simple point that I have yet to find a living church in the USA. But I am still trying... :-) With prayer help from Travis & others.

sermonindex Dec 25, 2009

I don't know about 'goats & tares mixed in with sheep & wheat', but aren't you mixing your metaphors?

Too much spiced wine? :-)

G

Giggles Dec 25, 2009

procyon wrote:
I don't know about 'goats & tares mixed in with sheep & wheat', but aren't you mixing your metaphors?
Too much spiced wine? :-)

:) I appreciate the humor. Properly, goats are mixed with sheep and tares with the wheat, that is, sinners with the saints.

Now I don't do much spiced wine, I find His love to be much better ;)

W

wayneman Dec 25, 2009

I visited a different church every day for two-and-a-half years, trying to find one that wasn't silly. In the end, I gave up on the idea of getting anything out of church and instead started thinking in terms of what I could contribute. "It is more blessed to give than to receive." So I joined the neediest church I could find, an inner city mission. Less than half the congregation actually lived in the neighborhood; the majority were suburbanites like me who wanted to be part of a "front lines" fellowship!

It was a good experience, but now I live in a different town and it's hard to find even a Skid Row mission that's not commercialized, or pastored by some crazed clergyman who thinks he's Prophet Elijah or one of the Two Witnesses or something.

J

jimp Dec 25, 2009

hi, i live in a city with many living churches where thousands get saved and filled with Gods Spirit.one started with 5 people years ago and when i started to attend 140 to 200.many miracles and moves of God later...15000 to18000 with no membership and no offering for the church.i have seen a hole convent of nuns get saved and baptized in one service. we have ministry for unwed moms ...a home adoption center etc. there are others in this city that preach the cross with power and are also greatly used by God .. i think if you cant find one keep your murmuring to yourself and start one...jimp

W

wayneman Dec 25, 2009

jimp wrote:
hi, i live in a city with many living churches where thousands get saved and filled with Gods Spirit.one started with 5 people years ago and when i started to attend 140 to 200.many miracles and moves of God later...15000 to18000 with no membership and no offering for the church.i have seen a hole convent of nuns get saved and baptized in one service. we have ministry for unwed moms ...a home adoption center etc. there are others in this city that preach the cross with power and are also greatly used by God .. i think if you cant find one keep your murmuring to yourself and start one...jimp

Well, if your Apostolic Super-Duper Church is composed of non-members, then I am a part of it, since I am also a non-member. For that I offer up a murmur of thanksgiving. Please PM directions to the hockey arena you meet in.