Going with the flow, or being different?

Maybe I can gain some understanding here. Why is it so important to be a part of the crowd, and to be accepted by them. Why do our children adopt role models whose lives are filled with all the evils you can imagine, and why do the values of respect, integrity and honesty, carry so little value today. Is it because we ourselves have relaxed our attitudes, or is it something we have missed?I know all about the spiritual warfare we strive against and how our children become the frontline targets, but still, what attraction can there be which overcomes the rewards of eternal life in heaven rather than eternity in the fires of hell. How much more do I have to do to convince my children of the facts?All I can do is hope and trust in God that the few things I managed to teach them, will prevail and bring them to a point of sanity, before it is too late.

Proverbs tells us to "Train up a child in the way they should go and when they are old they will not depart from it." All you can do is pray and cry out to God that he will touch your children that the desires of this world will not overtake them but rather he would open their eyes to the Truth that there is more to life and it is in Christ Jesus.

Quote "How much more do I have to do to convince my children of the facts?"I believe taking time each day and Catechize them will help. There is no sure thing. I am only familiar with "The Westminster Shorter Catechism" Question #31 What is Effective Calling? Answer. Effective calling is the work of God's Spirit, Who Convinces us that we are sinful and miserable, Who Enlightens our minds in the knowledge of Christ, and Who renews our wills. This is how He persuades and makes us able to receive Jesus Christ, Who is freely offered to us in the Gospel.It is the Holy Spirit that convinces and enlightens a soul, so if they are now praying for that to happen to themselves you must do that for them, witch I am sure you are. Trust is God; Things might get worse before they get better. Pray your heart out now as if things were already very worse. My experience is after things get worse I say to myself I should of been praying harder before.Those are my thoughts thank you for taking the time to read this. I hope it helps.Also go through the 10 Commandment to give the a stong sense of the knowledge of sin.Romans 7:7 I would not have known sin exept through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, "You shall not covet."Romans 7:13 sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful.Galatian 3:24 Therefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

Let their role-models be you! or more better put Christ in you! The best thing we can do is live out our lives in Christlikeness as a model for our children. And love them unconditionally. I am not saying to be permissive but to let them know that they are loved and wanted no matter what they do. -- "If we are to be Christian parents, our focus must be on Jesus Christ, rather than on family dynamics or on parental procedures. We are to "fix our eyes on Jesus, who is the author and finisher of our faith" (Heb. 12:2), which includes our faithful parenting. When Jesus Christ is allowed to function in the family, and His life is lived out through the parent, then we will see the family function as God designed it to function; not by formula, but by faith which is the receptivity of His activity. As Christian parents we must recognize that "we are not adequate in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God" (II Cor. 3:5). Jesus said, "Apart from Me, you can do nothing" (John 15:5), and that certainly applies to successful parenting. When we acknowledge our inability and weakness, then the strength and power of Christ becomes operative, and the grace of God is sufficient (II Cor. 12:9) in our parenting. Many a parent has come to that exasperating point where they cry out, "God, unless you do something in this family, it is going to be a total fiasco and failure!" God loves to hear that cry, for then He can begin to function as He desires. Only God can do what really needs doing in the child's life anyway. Only God can convert and regenerate a child spiritually. Only God can save and sanctify a child, making them righteous and holy. Only God can make a Christian disciple out of your child, and develop His character in the child's personality. The essence of Christian parenting is the life of Jesus Christ lived out before our children. That expression of Christ's life cannot be orchestrated by techniques and procedures or by how-to formulas, but only as Christian parents are faithfully receptive to the divine dynamic of His activity. Christian parenting is primarily a life expression of "Christ, who is our life" (Col. 3:4; cf. Jn. 14:6). It is His life that we pray might be invested in and indwell our children, but we cannot effect that ­ only God can!"-J.F.Pray and model Christlikeness.Blessings, Chanin

Proverbs tells us to "Train up a child in the way they should go and when they are old they will not depart from it." Campbell Morgan used to draw attention to the fact that this verse is not a universal pattern but a pointer to individual training of each child. Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it. (Pro 22:6 KJV) The reference is to each particular child and the way that 'he' should go. Campbell Morgan writes: "Do we know what that means? The old idea was that it was the duty of father and mother, or teacher as the case may be, to make up their mind the way in which the child should go, and then to see to it that he or she went that way. But look at that a little carefully. In the Hebrew text there is no word 'go' There is one little word which be written 'peh' in English, and the statement here is, "Train up a child according to his own way." That may frighten some people. Does that mean that the child is to have its own way? Absolutley, but be careful. It does not say the child is to have its own wish or desire....Oh the horrible mistake of trying to take some child and make it like some other child. Every child has its own way, its own capacity."This was the basis of Campbell Morgan's great sunday schools and saw all four of his sons following him into full time Christian service.

The old idea was that it was the duty of father and mother, or teacher as the case may be, to make up their mind the way in which the child should go, and then to see to it that he or she went that way. But look at that a little carefully. In the Hebrew text there is no word 'go' There is one little word which be written 'peh' in English, and the statement here is, "Train up a child according to his own way." That may frighten some people. Does that mean that the child is to have its own way? Absolutley, but be careful. It does not say the child is to have its own wish or desire.My parents raised me up in the way where "They were my Boss" and it done great for me. Spank them kids. Proverbs also tells to "spare not the rod"...unless somebody is going to say, that's not what the original Hebrew text meant either. :-) The Evangelist

I also grew up with strict discipline but balanced with fairness. It made me into a person with respect and high standards. But in todays lifestyle, this same method is regarded as child abuse, and we are left to simply let the child go his or her own way.Is this how the evil one has influenced society so that our worst enemy lies within our own homes?What is better, to be the enemy who controls with strict discipline to achieve an end, or to be the friend who compromises his own beliefs to remain a friend?What would Jesus have done in the same situation?

S. Chanin wrote:The essence of Christian parenting is the life of Jesus Christ lived out before our children. That expression of Christ's life cannot be orchestrated by techniques and procedures or by how-to formulas, but only as Christian parents are faithfully receptive to the divine dynamic of His activity. Christian parenting is primarily a life expression of "Christ, who is our life" (Col. 3:4; cf. Jn. 14:6). It is His life that we pray might be invested in and indwell our children, but we cannot effect that ­ only God can!"-J.F.I fail all the time. But I have pointed my children to discern the intents of their heart. My son asked my wife recently, Do you have a voice that speaks to you? My wife said, that if the voice speaks of things of Jesus, listen to Him. The only way to discern, is to know the word of God. This we must teach our children. Our children can see the intents of our hearts. Sometimes it is the flesh, and they point it out to us. If our love of Christ flows like a fountain out of us, our children will know the truth. My son also sees the ways of the world. I help coach a youth football team. The head coach will profess to know Christ, and yet he will compromise his faith for the pursuit of winning. Kids are very preceptive. Teach them about the futility of this world. "Let him not trust in futile things, deceiving himself, for futility will be his reward." Job 15:31In ChristJeff

What would Jesus have done in the same situation?I know this is a serious subject, but I like a little humor, so my answer is...um, Jesus didn't have kids. Ha ha, I'm just trying to liven up the conversation. anyway, you're right. The public school systems tell children to scream child abuse if a parent corrects them. the immoral landslide of filth has corrupted many of our children today. The only thing I can say is raise your child the best you can in knowing the Lord. Apply the blood over them, fill their minds and hearts with God's precious Word. Through them learning and knowing God's word, they themselves will be able to discern what's right. My personal opinion isn't to just let the kids go out into the world of sin and find out themselves what it's about or until they get tired of it, in which case many Christian parents allow their kids to do. It's sad because you'll never know if you'll lose one of your kids to that eternal hell fire. But I'm an old-fashioned Pentecostal. I like what Joshua said. "Choose ye this day whom you will serve; as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord." That's what I believe.

Hmmm... well, I'm not a parent yet so... I can't tell you what I've done or even what I think I will do when I have kids someday, if the Lord wills.I am however, well, a kid still, sort of. A young adult at least. I think the biggest... struggle young kids go through especially through their teens, is being accepted. I think everyone can admit that they like to be loved and have someone to love. NO ONE likes to be the one left out, with no friends.I can't tell you how it's supposed to work. Everyone is different. I could tell you how I was in high school, but your kids are probably slightly different than me. I do however think that love is the key. Love is what... well, constrained me to NOT go with the flow as a young believer (got saved when I was 12). I came to a point, as a young teenager, where there was a battle in my heart between the importance of God, and the importance of having friends. I had tasted and seen that the Lord was good at that point, so there was NO WAY I could turn my back on Him to keep my friends. You know, when you love someone, you care to a degree what they think of you. If God is the one you love the most, you'll care mostly about what He thinks about you, not people. As soon as your love for people and of people becomes more important, then you'll start going with the flow. I think that's just misplaced love. So I think your kids need to experience God's love for themselves personally. It's the love of Christ that will constrain them to be set apart; sanctified. I guess that's one of the things you can be faithfully and fervently praying for your children. The Holy Spirit is interceeding on their behalf as well. Maybe you can take some comfort in that.

Yolanda,these comments are very true- about love, unconditional love. One thing I have learned the hard way (from the lack of unconditional love from my own parents) is to make sure my kids know I love them no matter what. When they sin or don't do things the way I would like them, I still let them know that they are loved and CHERISHED. All kids need to know they are cherished.On another note, every child is so different. I have 3 that are so different and my husband and I handle their discipline, etc.. very differently. One is very sensative but more of a follower, one is independant but sold out to the Lord, and another is a bundle of fire wrapped in love (but the fire gets the best of her many times:).It takes time, and more time to pray and figure out what each one needs. My one who is sensative and more of a follower- he has never needed a spanking in his life. (just some slaps on the hand when he was very small). You just look at him the wrong way and he goes crying to his room and locks himself in his room. But he does tend to do what the other kids do. So I have to talk to him over and over about how the things of this world are really meaningless. Does he care? Probably not right now, he's only 8. But I also make sure from the time he (and the others were small) that they know what 'fear of the Lord' is. When they sin or follow the crowd or whatever. I always remind them that it makes the Lord very sad- it grieves Him. If they learn this early, they'll never forget it. It is not our children's fault that there is temptation. We can't get angry with them about the fact that there is that temptation to be 'someone' in the eyes of others. They want to be someone to somebody. Let's make sure they are someone to us. Someone important and cherished. We can discipline and get upset with their wrong behaviors- but not the fact that they want to be someone. Each one has such a different temperament and personality. I think that phariseeism and hypocrisy from the parents is the quickest faith smotherer. As Jeff, mentioned, kids see through adults in a second. What we say we believe, we better be doing- because as soon as our children see that we don't 'love our neighbor' like we claim to- they reason to themselves "why should I do such and such?" If we are critical of others, they know we are critical of them and are not being like Jesus. It must seem like we are picking and choosing what we, as adults obey. If we as parents, are fully surrendered and obey the Lord in everything- then hopefully the children learn this as a lifestyle.Just more thoughts.In Him, Chanin

Hello Swani,Swani how many children do you have? How old are they? It sounds that you are very concerned about them. You have been praying desprately for them haven't you? I will pray for your children as if they were mine!

I have four children.Yo know, as nature teaches us and as the bible says, there comes a time when we as parents have to let go and trust to the teaching and training that we have given. There comes a time when we have to open the doors and let the little ones free. As with the prodigal, God showed that we have to let go sometimes, even knowing of the dangers and hazards out there.But most of all we have to prepare with love and expectation for the return, and keep on our knees, for times will change again, and the kids will become parents.It is our strength, combined with Gods love and mercy, and our faith in His ability to be true to the ones close to us, which will win the day.It is not for us to try to build our offspring into the images we aspire to have been, but rather to lay the foundation and let them build in the direction they wish to go.What would this world be without new ideas, new blood, new directions and new innovations? And to get there, we sometimes need to consider the new direction as an improvement, and not a threat, and be prepared to accept that which we consider to carry no threat.This is maybe why Paul says, to consider on the good things, and to judge all things in the measure of goodness and compassion.No matter how you look at it, life and the lives of those you love, still remains the best teacher, doesn't it?????

Yes, we have all failed, but I have learnt from the failures of others, and changed the path I walk, so as not to fall into the same holes. I hope that the children can see the failures of the parents as an example of what not to do, and do not instead use it as excuses for also failing at life.It is a bit scary that it has become so easy to fall back on excuses instead of putting your shoulder to the wheel and making it work for you.In days gone by, there was a pride in hard work and achievement, and a shame in running from your responsibilities and tasks. When our kids can hold us as parents to task for failing them, and they can be the judge of where we failed, then how can any escape the judgement of the inexperienced and the uneducated. Not much to look forward to as we grow older and supposedly more experienced!!!

Hello everyone. I have been reading this thread today. I have 3 children, two of them are grown. A daughter, 25, and a son 24, and a son 8. My two grown children are loving and serving God faithfully. They have never made one decision that disappointed me. Whenever they have been asked by people how they turned out so good, they both say they were taught to love God by their parental models. Also, they both say that were made accountable to God at a very early age. And last but not least, they say they were taken to a church where they experienced the presence of God regularly and they never forgot it. I'm talking about that awesome presence that is so overwhelming in corporate worship. Once a person experiences it, they are changed.

Maybe, just maybe, the biggest hurt we can do to our children is to spoil, pamper, and do things for them instead of allowing life to be the teacher, and being there to give advice and direction only??????Maybe by learning the hard way which some of us did, we allow the building of character, perseverance, and we teach commitment and focus. After all, is this not what God does for us as well??Why are our children so privilaged?Just because a child has wealthy parents, does this mean he or she is then exempt from the lessons of life?Maybe this is why the world we live in today is slowly dying, why people are so lost, why values have been so corrupted, why committment, morals, respect and love, have become slmost like swear words.Who will pay the ferry man?The child?The parent?Who will stand and take the consequence of our foolish wisdom?Just a thought!!