I have a long time brother in Christ who met a woman who is agnostic who he is going to marry. She is not a true God Fearing believer. Is this sin? he saids it is not, because according to him she has Godly Character.
I told him the scripture clearly state we are not to be unequally yolked with unbelievers, but he saids i'm standing on one scripture, and that goes against the law of hermeneutics? what do you say??
HELP
Is there a single verse anywhere that tells us to use hermeneutics to interpret the word?
Well if you want more scripture to stand on there are tons of scripture that point and back up the unequally yoked thing, Look at Esau and Jacob, Esau saw that marrying Cannaanite women was displeasing to his father and mother and Jacob went to Laban and married a member of the same family this is a shadow of marrying outside of Christianity. There are many other examples of Men of Faith marrying women from other nations and being completely turned from God because of their foreign wives. Like King Solomon in 1 Kings 11. Love will rationalize anything even straight out going against what the bible says, If they already plan on getting married its probably to late to persuade the guy from marrying her in which case God will chastize him in a manner that he chooses, but all of God's chastizements are for conforming us to the image of Christ Jesus
II Cor. 6:
14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
see also: II Cor. 6:16
Does that say it clearly enough?
If not consider:
II Cor. 6:
15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
[The name of Belial is one of the (many) Hebrew synonyms for Satan. This one aspect of the accusing adversary says,"I WILL have no master (aka:lord) over me. I am my own ruler of my own considerations and my own actions.
The words 'an infidel' might better be translated as 'one- who-reserves-their-confidence-for-whatever-is-their-own-choosing-and-completely-without-trust-in-God]
The word agnostic means:
>...a=.................gnosis=
>(I) don't - know (what i will believe).
A real agnostic changes like the weather. They cannot be trusted because they cannot fix their trust in or on anything permanently.
Here is (the) why we should never join ourselves to unbelievers:
II Cor. 6:
17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.
[if God recieves you for being seperate from among them, what becomes from not coming out from among them? ]
Hope this helps that you may help.
g
Acts 20:32
"The kingdom then is not for weaklings, waverers, and compromisers... It is not for Balaam, the rich young ruler, Pilate, and Demas... It is not won by means of deferred prayers, unfulfilled promises, broken resolutions and hesitant testimonies. It is for strong and sturdy men like Joseph, Nathan, Elijah, Daniel, Mordecai, and Peter... Stephen... and Paul. And let us not forget such valiant women as Ruth, Deborah, Esther, and Lydia"
~William Hendrickson~
Marriage is built and founded upon the
rock; who is Christ. Christ must be the
center and Lord of marriage; or it is sure
to fail.
Godly character???
Apparently he is clueless as to what godly actually means.
When used in scripture, it refers to the person who is in constantly walking and talking with God as He is always known to be present with you. This is the character(istic) of godliness.
In any era, we have been and are considered quite off kilter.
>
Ps. 127:1
ok?
g
edited
"Take good heed therefore unto yourselves, that ye love the LORD your God. Else if ye do in any wise go back, and cleave unto the remnant of these nations, even these that remain among you, and shall make marriages with them, and go in unto them, and they to you: Know for a certainty that the LORD your God will no more drive out any of these nations from before you; but they shall be snares and traps unto you, and scourges in your sides, and thorns in your eyes, until ye perish from off this good land which the LORD your God hath given you." - Joshua:11-13
I told him the scripture clearly state we are not to be unequally yolked with unbelievers, but he said I'm standing on one scripture, and that goes against the law of hermeneutics? what do you say??
Are we living under the law of Paul?
If the man loves the woman, he can do whatever he wants to do, there is no way your going to change his mind, let him be.
Both men and women can be agnostic and still have some good moral ways about them. The tree that Adam ate from wasn't completely evil, it was both Good and Evil, there is both Good and Evil in fallen man. However, that was corrected at the cross and God concluded all to be under sin regardless of any good that man does in that state.
Love, lust, infatuation, sexual sins, are the most difficult situations to find yourself in because when your in love, the ability to reason is non existent. A man's mind is on this one thing, to obtain, and bible or no bible will convince him of that.
He will, like the prodigal son, will have to experience this on his own. And who knows, she might be a good woman after all. We just don't know. God may even be in this, we just don't know enough about this situation.
There are many women in the world that are not Christian but have godly ways about them. She knows how to run her house, she's kind, gentle, given to hospitality. She may even be one that gives to charities. I know of people that are not Christian that put us to shame easy by the way they live.
no, I dont think there is. He is a lonely believer who has found someone, and he believes with all his heart, it is of God. He used the scripture., that it is better to marry than to burn.
God knows..
thank you for your word..
@ zionseeker,
have you personally met this woman already, is she a real agnostic or just a very confused immature Christian.
II Cor. 6:
14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
This one scripture should be all the answer that is necessary. I am not judging the man, but he does not seem to be in a good place spiritually. The Holy Spirit will convict us as we begin to step off the path like this. If he were my friend, I would be in much prayer for him.
No, I've not met her. I hope to soon. It is hard for me to answer your question without knowing her or talking to her, i can only go by what is told to me by my friend.
they have a long distance relationship, they met online on facebook playing farmville, and now talk on the phone daily for hours..2-3 hours daily.
My friend now tells me he is marrying her, and does not want to burn as the word saids better to marry than to burn.
I pray God will make what the devil means for evil, into good.
We all fall short, i pray my friend will be led by Christ alone. They are not married yet.
thank you for your response.
by snufalapagus on 2010/5/5 16:51:08:
If the man loves the woman, he can do whatever he wants to do, there is no way your going to change his mind, let him be.
g:
Yes, if you are apethetic towards this dear brother, by all means, show your hate for him by not clarifying the consequences of actions contrary to God's way.
snuf:
Both men and women can be agnostic and still have some good moral ways about them. The tree that Adam ate from wasn't completely evil, it was both Good and Evil, there is both Good and Evil in fallen man. However, that was corrected at the cross and God concluded all to be under sin regardless of any good that man does in that state.
g:
The tree was "the knowledge of", and eating from it was the sin. Just because you know what's good and bad, does that mean that there is good and evil in everyone? Are you implying that because everybody has a conscience resulting from this one infraction in the garden, that the cross straightens things out whether you rely on Jesus Christ or not???
s:
Love, lust, infatuation, sexual sins, are the most difficult situations to find yourself in because when your in love, the ability to reason is non existent. A man's mind is on this one thing, to obtain, and bible or no bible will convince him of that.
g: sorry, wrong again, when you are 'in lust' -(aka:passionate desires to satisfy your carcass)-, NOT love, whether that urge of want(oness) is for eye satisfaction, carcass satisfaction, or keeping up with the jonesez, the issue is not about any reason but purly the desire of the human heart. Only the Word of God by the work of the Holy Spirit can change this.
s:He will, like the prodigal son, will have to experience this on his own. And who knows, she might be a good woman after all. We just don't know. God may even be in this, we just don't know enough about this situation.
g: Mt. 19:17...YOU "just don't know enough about this situation."
s:He will, like the prodigal son, will have to experience this on his own. And who knows, she might be a good woman after all. We just don't know. God may even be in this, we just don't know enough about this situation.
g: apparently you have redefined the Biblical meaning of godly?
You are speaking about ethics and morals and have this idea of everything being relative.
YOU sound just like an agnostic couching hypocritical double speaking duplicity in religious sounding words.
You have no valid words that are of help in that post.
You need to read your Bible; but before you do, repent and throw away completely any silly notion that you are being obedient to God's Spirit in this. Aren't you only considering things from your perspective and ignoring God's completely?
Consider yourself!
Mt. 12:36
II Cor. 13:5ESV
Rom. 1:28,29,30,31,32
thank you Travis, my husband and I are praying for him. I've also Sounded the alarm to other fellow brothers and sisters in Christ from my church, and those who know him outside of our church. He currently, is not a member of a church, though he communicates with people via online. My concern for him is he has isolated himself, and has no spiritual head over him right now. He tells us, that Christ is our Head, and teacher.
I pray, and we will pray. For them both,
God Bless,
He really needs our prayers, only God can change his current disposition. Is there any way for you or your other christian friends to personally visit and talk to him.
Yes, we have talked with him, he is a good friend of ours, my husband and I, and he wanted us to be with him, as Best man, and maid of honor, we said no, based on the word of God, that saids he is not to be marrying an unbeliever and we could not support him in that, we told him it was sin. He did not agree, he was upset we are using one scripture.
we still entreat him as a brother of course, We have made our point and stick by it, he does not like the fact we wont support him in this. We prayed and heard from God, and spoke to our pastor, who is our spiritual covering, and he concurred with us.
so for now we continue to pray.
My concern for him is he has isolated himself, and has no spiritual head over him right now. He tells us, that Christ is our Head, and teacher.
I agree with him in this area however we are also told to not forsake the fellowship. Many people view the pastor as the spiritual head of the church when in reality the pastor was given to the church as a servant to the people not as an authority. We have but one authority and that is Christ Jesus through the Word and Spirit. We also see the establishment of Elders or Overseers in the Church there is generally more than one in the church and I would consider them the shoulders of the church because they hold up the head as high as they can and are still subject to the head.
Ephesians 4:11-16
11It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, 12to prepare God's people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.
14Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of men in their deceitful scheming. 15Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will in all things grow up into him who is the Head, that is, Christ. 16From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.
But as you can see this verse also calls us the Body of Christ Jesus and no arm can live long and healthy detached from the body. We need each other as a whole body to grow fully and properly in Christ Jesus, Believers tend to hold each other accountable as in such cases as this one.
It could be one of two things; he got emotionally involved with her BEFORE he found out OR (and I don't mean to hurt your feelings zion by being so blunt but), he doesn't care because his own walk with the Lord is not on sure ground. If the latter is the case then there really isn't any "sin" to speak of to either of them and well, you might as well be talking to a wall.
It doesn't sound like you can stop this, Zion (he's already providing excuses); but it does sound like she is going to be part of your (extended) family. Show them both the love of the living God and pray for them in secret and you will be rewarded openly.
God bless you,
1Corinthians7:39
39. A wife is bound by law as long as her husband lives; but if her husband dies, she is at liberty to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord.
40. But she is happier if she remains as she is, according to my judgment—and I think I also have the Spirit of God.
"MARRIED TO WHOM SHE WISHES; BUT ONLY IN THE LORD!"
.........................................................
You add this to the "unequally Yoked" word;
2Corinthians6:14-15
14. "Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness?
15. And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever?"
"WHAT PART HAS A BELIEVER WITH AN UNBELIEVER?" using the comparison with Christ and the devil; ["Belial"]
...and you come up with an obvious and clear warning!... "Do not do this!"
I wonder who is really the the agnostic?
YOU sound just like an agnostic couching hypocritical double speaking duplicity in religious sounding words.
Nice comeback!! :o)
However, it's my experience by observation that men who are emotionally connected to a woman have a hard time listening to reason, even if that reasoning is from the bible.
To the bible thumpers the word of God is cut and dry. To God, and thanks be to God that it's not cut and dry. Mercy, Faith and Judgment are three principles to which few men dare to venture into, because here is where one begins to understand God's ways of dealing with man. I said "begins" not knows entirely and completely.
We don't understand Gods ways and yes we all speak religious sounding words from time to time. We like the way it sounds, we think we are judging correctly and we throw in pointing words like, "YOU". And we quote scripture as if that is the law to which we should live by. And that is so wrong. We live by that and we die, we walk after the Spirit and not the letter. We walk in the Spirit not the law of sin and death.
As for this man, he is walking after the flesh, according to his desires, according to what he wants and there is nothing anyone can do for him accept that we pray that God get a hold of him or he "might" end up in a messy situation and later come to his senses and regret it and wished that he had of heeded to godly counsel.
As for being unequally yoked, most times this just falls on deaf ears. Men and women who are fixed upon one another just won't hear anything but their own voices.
I recently told my Sister who is dating an Agnostic that she should not be unequally yoked with this fella. She considered it for a moment but rejected the counsel to which I gave and now they are sleeping together. She says she loves him.
Now, I could look at this situation and cause fire to come down from heaven and consume them if I had a cut and dry attitude. However, she is God's child who is fallen into sin and I must give the matter over to the Lord to let Him deal with this and make reconciliation for iniquity. I would be lying if I told you that I wasn't angry, for I was. But there was nothing I could do. Love Lust or how ever we look at it, is a difficult thing to overcome, especially if it's something we like to hold unto.
This discussion is locked.
