Eternal torment | SermonIndex

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enid May 25, 2010

Revelation 20v10, 'The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever'.

Also, in the same chapter, verse 15, it says, 'And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire'.

Do we realise what this means? Are we aware of eternity and what eternal torment involves?

Are we aware, that unless our families know Jesus Christ as their Lord, and Saviour, they face eternity in torment, in hell?

We can sit watching sports for hours, and yet people face an eternity without God, and we don't care?

We can read the latest novel, while our families live in blaspheme against a holy God, and it doesn't matter?

We put other things before God, seemingly unaware of the danger that is about to overtake us, and we make light of it?

Where is the sacrifice for souls? The day without food, the night of prayer, the time spent with God, rather than with the world?

Do we grieve God more than we please Him. Do we care one way or the other?

God help us.

G

ginnyrose May 25, 2010

Enid, good questions.

ginnyrose

sermonindex May 25, 2010

It's funny you should mention this. This thought has been on my mind for the last few weeks. Like, as a Christian, the reality of hell is something we all believe in. But the essence of what it truly is seems to have evaded many of us, myself included, for quite some time.

Japan (where I live) is a country of some 130,000,000 people if you round up a bit. Of that percentage it's estimated that MAYBE 0.5 percent of the population is a confessing Christian, that is Christian in name, though in actual reality, based on what I've seen, it's more than likely far less. Now the official poles say less than 1 percent, however they also include groups like Catholics and other "Christian" groups who the Bible would disqualify. So it's safer to assume it's less than 0.5%. Now the only reason I've prefaced with this is, with that in mind, the odds that at any given time I'd run into another Christian while out and about are staggeringly against me.

Maybe three or four weeks back I was riding the train around sunset on my day off, when all of a sudden a group of maybe 6 or so of the cutest elderly Japanese people got on the train together. They were all smiling and laughing and having the greatest time. They had to have been in their 70's or 80's, and it was just really cute to watch them all going around somewhere together and having a good time.

Initially the whole scene was rather surreal and heartwarming, and it really kind of brightened up the train ride for me, but after maybe a minute of observing them, another thought came into my mind. That thought being this; based on what I know of Japan, what are the chances that any of them know the Lord? Probably slim to non-existent. Now, just observing their age, how much time do I think they're going to have left on the earth? Probably not long. With those two thoughts in sight, when their time is up and they have to face their eternity, how much heartwarming laughter will be coming from them then?

This thought terrified me, and struck me very deeply, in a way that the thought of hell had never done before. My Japanese is somewhere in the region between non-existent and atrocious, but I've been furiously trying to study the language and understand it lately. If anyone thinks of it please pray for me regarding this. The thought I had while watching those people will never leave me.

sermonindex May 25, 2010

Satan has done a good job of keeping the reality of hell, and all that it means, from mankind... including most Christians. Thats why it grates on me when I hear Christians say "you should not scare people into salvation by emphasizing the existence of a literal hell."

Well... why not?? It's what did the trick for me. I knew without a doubt I was headed straight to hell on a very short and fast train.

Jesus saved me from hell.

Krispy

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enid May 25, 2010

I can identify with what you are all saying.

How in the world we ended up with, pardon the expression, this 'air-headed christianity' that we have, when thousands perish daily, is anyone's guess.

Since we have no fear of God, or too little to see, we don't fear for the future of the unsaved.

The road we travel is narrow, as Jesus has told us. And time is short.

How can we not have the urgency in us to warn others of that which defies imagination in its terror?

May God help us to have that urgency, and declare that which He would have us to declare. For the time is so short.

People perish daily without God, and are lost for eternity.

It bothers me.

It does.

D

davym May 25, 2010

Hi Enid

A very powerful and challenging post you have served up.

The doctrine of hell is a very difficult one to deal with even for truly born again believers. The thought of being eternally separated from God with no hope of redemption is indeed a terrifying one. It's not a thought we should dwell on. I agree with you though, that we should not lose sight of the reality of it.

Krispy's comment made me think of 2 Cor 4:4

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

This 'blinding of the minds' is so apparent in so many people now that as Christians it can leave us despairing. There is no getting away from the fact that hell is the greatest tragedy of all. We should weep and cry out to God.

It's one thing for the world to be deceived, but my deeper concern is for the many professing Christians who are bound for hell. They are harder to reach as they think they are saved. This is Satan's desire and the most dangerous place for anybody to be. This has resulted from the airy fairy Christianity you refer to.

Do we grieve God?

The modern church must break His heart.

But remember, we can't save anybody, all we can do is warn them and pray for them and it's up to them what they do with it. The question is, do we really have the guts to warn them the way they need to be warned?

B

Benjamin7 May 25, 2010

Last Sunday during my daily reading I came across this verse which I had never noticed before. I had always thought that hell was separation from God presence. Verse 9 challenged my way of thinking:

2 Thessalonians 1:7,8,9
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

In the French Ostervald Bible it literally says that everlasting destruction comes from being in the presence of the Lord and by the glory of his power.

A couple of days before I also ran into this verse:

Psalms 50:3
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

sermonindex May 25, 2010

Seperation from God... I've never understood how Christians can think that that is hell. Before we are saved we are all seperated from God. And to be quite honest, it didn't bother me in the least. So why get saved?

It was not until I understood what hell really was, and that was what my reward would be after I died for offending a holy God that I started to be concerned about my eternal destination.

If someone had told me back in the day that if I kept living the way I was I would spend eternity seperated from God... my reaction would have been: "Ok! ...at least I won't be dragged to church anymore!"

Krispy

D

davym May 25, 2010

Hell is not spatial separation from God, it cannot be because God is omnipresent. No, Hell is separation from the comfortable presence of God. It is the unshielded experience of the presence of God in his holiness and just wrath, and the absence of his mercy and grace.

sermonindex May 25, 2010

It is also a lake of fire with eternal burnings. Jesus, in fact, called it a lake of fire several times... and I think He would know.

I'll take His word for it.

Krispy

M

MaryJane May 25, 2010

Paul Washer did a teaching on this and in it he talks about Hell being a place totally and completely devoid of Gods presence.

You look around and you see sin in the world but think about how it will be, how deprived and utterly wicked and evil hell will be because of God withdrawing Himself completely from there. Right now even though this is a fallen world, God still has light shining forth, He has his restraints on the wicked to some degree, when those restraints are gone when He with draws Himself completely and utterly that will be Hell, and eternal separation from Himself, and from all of His attributes as well as all that is from Him, such as light, love, mercy, kindness, joy laughter, ect. What will be left, will be darkness that is not even imaginable, pain, suffering, torment, gnashing of teeth, crying out and anguish. The reality of hell is complete and utter separation from God and His restraints on the wicked suffering and torment that does not end.

People who are lost say so what I don't care, or I have lived this life and it has been a real hell so what? They have no clue or understanding what they are saying, they are deceived into thinking that what they have gone through in their life is hell but its not even a glimpse of what hell will be. hell and the torments of hell will be eternal.
It does not end and there is no way out.

sermonindex May 25, 2010

not meaning to dicker or dither, nor argue, nor fuss, i saw a brother below, write about something called "the doctrine of hell"......and i might be coming at this all from a different perspective, but those four words just don't ring right in Jesus Messiah...to me.

i was in John this morning, and this particular verse struck me: (among many others, as i'm finding great fruit in the High Christology of John's Gospel)

"And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me" John 12:32

i actually read it in the ESV, but so as not to anger some, or stumble some, i quote it in the KJV.

just to share with you all, one time, well several times deep in thought, and speaking with the Holy Spirit, God the Holy Ghost put this thought in my heart and soul, if i KNEW that God would deliever ALL MEN (and Women) from being seperated from God, if i, little ole me, would be prepared to be tacked to a cross, and to die a horrible torturous death, would i drink that cup?

but the "rub" was this, after dying such a death, i would be consigned to the fire not quenched, would i agree to such?

and the answer is and was, yes Lord.

that all might seem childish to you all, but the Holy Ghost spoke to me and in no uncertain terms said, "the Kingdom of Heaven is near you"....He knows my heart, which begs the question; would we be prepared to LOVE JESUS, REVERE GOD, ....even if the only reward was to dwell in Gehenna?

Is not Loving Abba Father reward enough, or is it just that everybody needs that "get out of hell free" card, just to go along with the romanized program thats preached at so many ecclestiastical formations and building every Sunday, and sometimes Wednesdays?

just sharing my heart, thats all

M

MaryJane May 25, 2010

Hi Neil
Its funny you should mention this because I was thinking this the other day and posted some about it in another thread. I was thinking how often I speak about loving God because of all He as done for me and it came to me what about who He is? I mean loving Jesus because of who He is, it is a desire in my heart that I pray and seek to become more and more a part of my walk and life and relationship with HIM.

I have to run its my sons birthday and we are off to the shops, but I will post more later. Hopefully what I shared above is not to confused:)

God bless

T

twayneb May 25, 2010

I am reminded of John G. Lake's testimony. He was a very successful salesman, but found himself unable to escape the thought, "What of this man's soul?" when he sat across the desk to transact business. He would begin to share Christ. Before long he felt he was not being fair to his employer as he was spending more time winning the lost at work than working. I believe it was at this time he quit and went into full time ministry.

I know I personally get involved in my own pursuits so often and fail to feel the weight of the lost. Challenging post Enid. Thank you for posting it.

sermonindex May 26, 2010

Is not Loving Abba Father reward enough, or is it just that everybody needs that "get out of hell free" card, just to go along with the romanized program thats preached at so many ecclestiastical formations and building every Sunday, and sometimes Wednesdays?

Exactly. Ten Shekels and a Shirt anyone?

J

jlosinski May 27, 2010

"but the "rub" was this, after dying such a death, i would be consigned to the fire not quenched, would i agree to such?"

Neil,
I don't know, this seems similar to another question that was posted on here a couple years back "would you be willing if God condemned you to hell?" or somthing like that. To me it's like one of those questions that atheists ask "Can God make a rock He can't lift?"; it's logically inconsistent with Gods nature so to answer in the affirmative belies a fundamental misunderstanding of God. I'm not saying that's what you are doing, but such hypothetical questions never make sense to me.
Joe