Ten Shekiels and A Shirt :An Observation

Quote From Paris Reidhead:Ten Shekiels and a Shirt.

(I have talked with people that have no assurance that sins are forgiven. They want to feel safe, before they're willing to commit themselves to Christ. But I believe that the only ones whom God actually witnesses by His Spirit and are born of Him, are the people, whether they say it or not, that come to Jesus Christ and say something like this, "Lord Jesus, I'm going to obey you, and love you, and serve you, and do what you want me to do, as long as I live even if I go to Hell at the end of the road, simply because YOU ARE WORTHY TO BE LOVED, AND OBEYED, AND SERVED, and I 'm not trying to make a deal with you!" Do you see the difference? Do you see the difference? Between a Levite serving for ten shekels and a shirt or a Micah building a chapel because God will do you good AND someone that repents for the glory of God.)

I have had time on my hands lately and have spent some of it listening to some sermons and writing some posts.I decided to listen finally to this Sermon.I realise I am going against the grain here but some of the sermon troubled me.So I went on to Paris Reidhead web and also got the text just to read it.
Paris Reidhead (born 1919)went to Africa in 1945 aged 25 or 26 on the unction of the Holy Spirit.He made a discovery after wrestling with God that in his own words:

(I was there not for the sake of the heathen. I was there for the Savior who endured the agonies of Hell for me. But He deserved the heathen. Because He died for them. My eyes were opened. I was no longer working for Micah and ten shekels and a shirt. But I was serving a living God. )

My point being Paris Reidhead was an assistant pastor aged 18 and was been led by the Spirit to go to Africa aged 25;
Did he consider himself a Born again Christian before he had this encounter with God?I presume that he was but that doesnt marry up with the first qoute up above about whom the Holy Spirit witnesses to and are born of him etc which was made much later because up to that point he also was working for ten shekiels and a shirt.

p.s I realise this is a great sermon from a great preacher and servant of God.I am genuine in posting this and am not looking to offend the great mass of people who downloaded this sermon,Staff

Staff, most if not all of us when we first come to Jesus Christ will have at least some part came because we wanted to be saved. There's nothing wrong with it, its biblical. In Acts 16, the jailer asked Paul what he must do to be saved.

BUT, ultimately the true believers are the ones that will be willing to serve God even if He cast them to hell. They may not truly realize it at all in their lifetime, but they will be willing to do so. Why do I say 'that they may not truly realize it in their lifetime'--its because they may not have thought about it at all. They may so firmly believe that they are saved, that they may not entertain such thoughts at all unless asked the question and even then may not entertain such thoughts because they feel its unnecessary to think such things.

Hi Learn,
What you have said seems totally correct and would be my view.However that still doesnt marry up what Paris has said.From listening to the Sermon it sounds to me that he wants us to be mature christians before we are babies.
The Sermon is great up until he brings salvation into it.
We were saved,we are being saved and in the end through death or rapture we will be saved.Paris seems to want to throw the first two together at the start.
Thanks Staff

[by staff on 2010/11/21 2:51:50

Hi Learn,
What you have said seems totally correct and would be my view.However that still doesnt marry up what Paris has said.From listening to the Sermon it sounds to me that he wants us to be mature christians before we are babies.
The Sermon is great up until he brings salvation into it.
We were saved,we are being saved and in the end through death or rapture we will be saved.Paris seems to want to throw the first two together at the start.
Thanks Staff]

Hi Staff,
Ok, I see where you are getting at. I heard his sermon quite a long while ago.

However, even if I cannot remember it, I am pretty sure that he doesn't expect us to be mature Christians straight up front. Its very difficult to explain what we truly mean at times and this may be 1 time. Sometimes, if we follow too closely, we may miss the true picture (ie seeing the trees instead of the forest) and this is 1 time if we take word for word of what he's preaching, we are likely to misread that he expects us to be mature Christian right up front. However, if we take the gist of it, we will know that we ultimately are supposed to serve Jesus for who He is.

Anyway, even if a person that is not saved yet take 'word for word' what he says, I don't really see the harm, in fact I can see the good in it. Why? Because that person who is thinking of accepting Jesus will then because of this sermon, consider more deeply whether he is willing to accept Jesus and serve Him. This will result in lesser false conversion (false born again cases).

Many people will say that if you say the words "I accept Jesus as Lord and saviour", then I will be saved. Or a variant of "If you confess with your mouth and believe in your heart...". The thing is they do not stress/explain that confession is only when you truly believe and will follow through with it. So the word confession or Lord becomes just an empty shell without any weight to it.

Hi Learn,Got you again,I am with you on that.
I just think the definition of being (led by the spirit and born of him)is a criteria that he didnt live up to himself in his early years til he went to Africa.I also notice that when it came to repentence he qouted great preachers in the past like Wesley and Whitefield said rather than the examples of repentence in the Gospels And Acts to back up his views,Thanks Again Staff

Do you mean a faulty theology on repentance and salvation in a powerful sermon?

hi,It could be that yeah but I stand corrected if I am wrong.The majority of the sermon is really great.The way he disects the Judges account of the levite and the church history lesson shows how things have progressed up til todays Church.He explained pragmatism and Humanism which was great.
If the sermon was just for Christians it would be fine but I am not sure on the following quote in connection to non christians coming to Christ.At the very least it is incomplete.I dont think we have examples of the qoute below in Acts or the Gospels
(I'm going to say to you dear friend if you're out here without Christ, you come to Jesus Christ and serve Him as long as you live whether you go to Hell at the end of the way BECAUSE HE IS WORTHY! )
Ta Staff

But I believe that the only ones whom God actually witnesses by His Spirit and are born of Him, are the people, whether they say it or not, that come to Jesus Christ and say something like this, "Lord Jesus, I'm going to obey you, and love you, and serve you, and do what you want me to do, as long as I live even if I go to Hell at the end of the road, simply because YOU ARE WORTHY TO BE LOVED, AND OBEYED, AND SERVED, and I 'm not trying to make a deal with you!"

Luk 18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:

Luk 18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.

Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

Luk 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

Luk 18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

Luk 18:14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

I think I understand your concern very well.

Luk 22:31 "Simon, Simon, behold, Satan demanded to have you, that he might sift you like wheat,

Luk 22:32 but I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned again, strengthen your brothers."

Joh 13:37 Peter said to him, "Lord, why can I not follow you now? I will lay down my life for you."

Joh 13:38 Jesus answered, "Will you lay down your life for me? Truly, truly, I say to you, the rooster will not crow till you have denied me three times.

Mat 26:69 Now Peter was sitting outside in the courtyard. And a servant girl came up to him and said, "You also were with Jesus the Galilean."

Mat 26:70 But he denied it before them all, saying, "I do not know what you mean."

Mat 26:71 And when he went out to the entrance, another servant girl saw him, and she said to the bystanders, "This man was with Jesus of Nazareth."

Mat 26:72 And again he denied it with an oath: "I do not know the man."

Mat 26:73 After a little while the bystanders came up and said to Peter, "Certainly you too are one of them, for your accent betrays you."

Mat 26:74 Then he began to invoke a curse on himself and to swear, "I do not know the man." And immediately the rooster crowed.

Mat 26:75 And Peter remembered the saying of Jesus, "Before the rooster crows, you will deny me three times." And he went out and wept bitterly.

Joh 21:14 This was now the third time that Jesus was revealed to the disciples after he was raised from the dead.

Joh 21:15 When they had finished breakfast, Jesus said to Simon Peter, "Simon, son of John, do you love me more than these?" He said to him, "Yes, Lord; you know that I love you." He said to him, "Feed my lambs."

Joh 21:16 He said to him a second time, "Simon, son of John, do you love me?" He said to him, "Yes, Lord; you know that I love you." He said to him, "Tend my sheep."

Joh 21:17 He said to him the third time, "Simon, son of John, do you love me?" Peter was grieved because he said to him the third time, "Do you love me?" and he said to him, "Lord, you know everything; you know that I love you." Jesus said to him, "Feed my sheep.

Joh 21:18 Truly, truly, I say to you, when you were young, you used to dress yourself and walk wherever you wanted, but when you are old, you will stretch out your hands, and another will dress you and carry you where you do not want to go."

Joh 21:19 (This he said to show by what kind of death he was to glorify God.) And after saying this he said to him, "Follow me."

Without the grace of God we can do nothing.

hi Alive to God,
Yes thats what seems to have happened to Paris Reidhead when he went to Africa God used this time to give him a fresh more complete theology.
My point I suppose is that he seems to disown his previous understanding as useless even in relation to salvation.In so much as he seems to doubt that anyone is really born again unless he believes his fresh more complete theology.
If I were to follow his logic it would mean that he was not born again before he went to Africa,
I hope I am not been too confusing but I think its a subtle but important point when it comes to evangelism,staff

hi snufalapagus,
I seriously pondered about it for a while because of the importance of the sermon before I posted and am threading carefully.Their may or may not be a nugget of error in Paris Reidheads Sermon.I think that all sermons should be open scrutiny and any errors corrected or highlighted and I think Paris Reidhead and the moderators of this site would aggree with that.Once it is done in the right spirit.
Staff

Thank you for reminding brother.

Well, this is not actually about Paris Reidhead, or about discrediting him. He fought his fight well and had been used mightily in the kingdom.

His footsteps is very hard to follow, his ministry can easily dwaft and shame us.

I tremble as I post in this thread, but there were statements made at some point of his ministry, and very popular as they were, that some of us think can be a stumbling block to weak souls.

And these statements were being used by some in their preaching and doctrine about repentance and salvation.

The ways of the Lord is so mysterious and mighty and He will not fail to save nor lose any of the elect in spite
of the imperfections of his servants.

The Lord bless you all. Thank you for bearing with us.

Most people come to God because they are convicted of their sin by the Holy Spirit and see their need to be saved.

Howevever, much of the church is given messages on God wanting to meet their needs, and never do see God's purpose for them in getting saved, which is to conform them to the imgae and likeness of Christ. It is absoultely essential that we see God's purpose in salvation.

Mike

Hi Abideinhim,
Again I am in agreement,in fact he achieved this brilliantly in his sermon.I think however to those not in Christ the Law and Judgement need to be preached and people need to know their destination without Christ.So for the church yes and for the unsaved I am not sure.

(Howevever, much of the church is given messages on God wanting to meet their needs, and never do see God's purpose for them in getting saved, which is to conform them to the imgae and likeness of Christ. It is absoultely essential that we see God's purpose in salvation. )

I was there not for the sake of the heathen. I was there for the Savior who endured the agonies of Hell for me. But He deserved the heathen. Because He died for them. My eyes were opened. I was no longer working for Micah and ten shekels and a shirt. But I was serving a living God.

This statement separates a humanist from a christian. The christian first of all is a friend and a servant of God, his thoughts, affection, and loyalty is for Him.

Joh 21:15 So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.

Joh 21:18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdedst thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry thee whither thou wouldest not.

Joh 21:19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me.

Peter loved the Lord and served Him unto his death.

Hi Staff,

I've gotten this understanding and hopefully its the right one.

Reidhead was sharing his burden.

Imagine you are so full of enthusiasm in sharing Christ with them and you believe that you will bring people to Christ--after all wasn't it God that called you there.

But instead everytime you share with people, the response goes something like this--well, if you can assure me that I will be saved, then I will accept him. If not, I have a lot of things to do, maybe later I will reconsider it. (doesn't this sound a bit like Luke 14 where a man gave a great banquet).

Imagine hearing this over and over again for who knows how long. One thing is that you will develop at least a grief and in that grief, you will realize that only those that are willing to serve God for who He is will really be saved.

These people that he was witnessing to wasn't really interested in 'really being saved'. They were looking for their well-being (getting as much things including salvation for themselves without giving anything up that might cost them dearly. Oh, they may be willing to give a few trinkets here and there but something valuable, something that they have to persist and persevere in--no way)--something that Reidhead wasn't aware of at that time but God already knew. In his sadness and realization, I guess he may have penned this sermon or at least develop this thinking. It may not be exactly 'right to the letter' but that was not God's point. God's point was to get us to understand the gist of it.

And the gist of it is at least 3 things which I can see so far (usually there's more reasons from what I've learned in my walk with God) ie :

1) that ultimately we serve God because of who he is.

2) it will cause people to consider more before 'commiting' to Him. Both in reducing the 'false conversions' and also for the true believers that will be to 'count the cost'. (counting the cost is also in the bible)

3) for Reidhead and for us to understand God better. God does want us to understand Him--that's 1 reason for the bible. When we are apt to think that its God's fault or God don't care enough/doesn't give any chances for certain people, God shows us that its not because He doesn't care/didn't give them a chance--He gave, but they rejected Him.

post edited

The thing is one needs to understand the 'heart of the message', not the 'letter of the law'. The pharisees understood the 'letter of the law' but the fail to understand the spirit/general/gist/purpose of it. That's why they did not accept Jesus.