Leaving the Prophetic Movement Pt.2 (A. Strom)

Part 2 - "LEAVING the PROPHETIC MOVEMENT""NAMING NAMES?" - by Andrew Strom.I guess you will not be surprised to hear that I was flooded with 600 emails within 24 hours of my announcement that I was leaving the Prophetic movement. Many of them seemed to be highly supportive of the stand I had taken. (-A lot of people have seen alarming things in this movement). But I'm sure I will receive a lot of flak also.For many years, even when I was truly disturbed by somethingI usually avoided "naming names" as much as possible. I do notapprove of the 'Heresy Hunters' who seem to take such delightin maligning Spirit-filled ministries across the Internet. There is no delight in such things for me. Only grief and sadness that thename of Jesus is once again being brought down into the mud.We live in very sad times in the church today, don't we?After my previous article, many people asked me again to "namenames" and announce clearly who the leaders were at thisconference - even though that info was already at the top of my first email. For this one time, I am actually going to accede to their request - because we need to clear the air about theseleaders and also a number of others as well. But I have to tellyou, I have been totally heart-sick at having to talk about all this.The speakers at this KC 'Whitedove' Conference were Bob Jones,Paul Keith Davis, Bobby Conner, John Paul Jackson, Shawn Bolz - plus Jim Goll and one or two others. Sadly, I have to say that I have rarely felt so grieved or devastated as when I witnessed the carryings-on at this event. If you get the 'Elijah' List (-the mainProphetic email List) you will recognize most of the names above as being amongst the top "movers and shakers" of the whole movement.A number of people asked me about Rick Joyner and MorningstarMinistries. Where do they fit into all this? Well, seemingly Rick has always managed to keep himself at a slight distance from the worst excesses and controversies of this movement. (-Except for when he joined the Knights of Malta - an ancient Catholic Order. -By the way, that is probably what led to the fad of using swords to 'knight' people that swept through this movement a few years ago). I have read some of Joyner's books and enjoy some of thethings he says, but frankly, just because he has kept himself at a slight distance does not absolve him from the mess that the Prophetic is in today. The fact is, Mr Joyner is very close friends with almost all of the main leaders at this recent conference. He regularly ministers alongside them - and knows them very well. As a 'father' in the movement, if he had brought correction it would have been heeded, but he has clearly failed to do so. Thus, he has to be held accountable for the state of things as much as anyone else. And it would not surprise me if similar deception is finding it's way into Morningstar conferences. (-A number of the same people are involved). Sadly then, I have had to remove any articles or links to Rick Joyner from my web-site - along with all the others.And speaking of the sad and grievous state of this movement, I wonder how many of you received the following notice from the Elijah List recently about a forthcoming 'School of the Prophets':"God is releasing a new level of revelation that goes beyond just operating in the nine gifts of the Spirit." [Pardon me?? -ed.] "Sessions will cover topics like Hearing the Voice of God, Activating your Spiritual Senses, Third Heaven Experiences, and Exploring Spirit Realms." The advertised speakers are Todd Bentley, Stacey Campbell, Larry Randolph, Paul Keith Davis, and Bobby Conner.Now, I have come across Todd Bentley's teachings on "How to visit the Third Heaven" before, and I tell you, it is nothing less than'Guided Visualization' taken straight out of the New Age movement.Nothing less and nothing more. It is exactly the same. And I wantyou to know that if you attend these kinds of things, or allow thesemen to 'guide' you or lay hands upon you, then you are opening yourself up to all kinds of spirits and demonic counterfeits. As I have stated before, this movement has absolutely NO DISCERNMENT at all. It has sunk into such deception that it's leaders are opening people up to all kinds of demonic experiences on a daily basis. It has no idea that it is even doing it. -It behaves exactly like a movement that has been "given over to deception" by God. I urge again that everyone reading this would prayerfully consider CUTTING OFF all ties to this movement, lest you yourself become tainted by it.It is with great sadness that I make the above points. I haverefrained from saying such things in the past, but I can no longer do so, because untold people are being spiritually damaged bywhat is going on. Please understand my heart in this.For the same reason I also need to warn you about another 'prophetess' who is often featured on the Elijah List. Her name isJill Austin and I have personally witnessed her ministry in action.I would describe it as one of the most disturbing (by far) meetingsthat I have ever been in. There was definitely a strange "power"operating, but it certainly did not seem like God to me. She is also an expert at 'hyping' an audience. Please be very careful in such environments, my friends. -You can end up taking part in things that you would never normally do, just because you are part of a large crowd.Sadly, there seem to be many other ministries in this movement involved in similar deception. In fact, I hate to say it, but a general rule might be that if someone is featured on the Elijah List, there has to be at least an 80% chance that their ministry is "off" in some major way. I will say just one more thing about the Elijah List: I am convinced that they will one day give account to God for taking upon themselves the name "Elijah" and then doing what they have donewith it. Literally, by their own words they will be judged.How to AVOID DECEPTIONWhat a lot of people don't seem to recognize is the sheer level of 'peer pressure' and "crowd manipulation" that is going on at many of these events. They end up being led into doing things they feel uncomfortable with, just because "everybody else" is doing it. They squash down their discernment. They ignore the "little voice" or the tiny 'alarm bells' inside them that are trying to get their attention. And thus, multitudes of Christians are being led astray - and payingthrough the nose for the privilege. I urge anyone reading this who has ever squashed down their discernment and participated in such things, to get before God and REPENT of opening yourself up in that way. It is very important that you confess this before God and ask His forgiveness. RENOUNCE all deception in Jesus' name.One thing we don't have much time to discuss here is the MONEY issue. This is a huge problem in the Prophetic. Now, I do understand that ministries need finances to operate. I run a ministry myself. And as most of you know, about 5 times a year we put out a book or CD (available for any donation - or even just postage) to go towards the costs of keeping this ministry operating. However, the word itself is always free. It is terribly sad to see the charging of 'entry fees' to hear the word today, and the over-bearing emphasis on MONEY in the church. Did not Jesus clearly command: "Freely you have received, freely give"? Redefining "PROPHET"Just because I have cut myself off from today's Prophetic movementdoes not mean that I believe there is no place for prophets in the church. In fact, I believe we need true prophets now more than ever. But you will notice that there has been a subtle shift in the use of the term "prophet" over the last 25 years, and I believe we need to get back to the original meaning. It was not long ago that when you spoke of a 'prophet' you were usually referring to someone like Keith Green, Leonard Ravenhill or David Wilkerson - someone who was crying out to the lukewarm church, "REPENT." And if you lookdown the annals of history, you will find that there has never been a true Prophetic movement that did not have this as it's core message. Every true Prophetic movement, right from the Old Testament down through every Revival and Awakening that I have ever studied, has been a movement of REPENTANCE. And yet we find today a movement that calls itself "Prophetic" - but with spiritual'revelations' and words of knowledge at its core. -No piercing word.This is the precise reason why it has gone off the rails. -It has abandoned it's age-old message. It's 'word' has been corrupted.I am convinced that God IS going to raise up true prophets in thishour to cry to the lukewarm church "Repent". There is a movementcoming that is utterly different from that which we have seen. Godis coming to clean house. The "shaking" has already begun. Andthe "John-the-Baptists" whom God has prepared in the caves and wildernesses are about to arise and speak His word - just as inevery Great Awakening down through history.Some people asked me if I was going to shut down our web-sitesand email Lists. Not at all. The whole point of what we're doing isto call forth and encourage these "John-the-Baptists" whom God israising up in this hour. We will not stop crying aloud until we see a great 'Repentance' Revival sweeping this nation from coast to coast.As A.W. Tozer wrote of all true prophets down the ages:"God has always had His specialists whose chief concern has been the moral breakdown, the decline in the spiritual health of the nation or the church. Such men were Elijah, Jeremiah, Malachi and others of their kind who appeared at critical moments in history to reprove, rebuke and exhort in the name of God and righteousness... Such a man was likely to be drastic, radical, possibly at times violent, and the curious crowd that gathered to watch him work soon branded him as extreme, fanatical, negative. And in a sense they were right. He was single-minded, severe, fearless, and these were the qualities the circumstances demanded. He shocked some, frightened others and alienated not a few, but he knew who had called him and what he was sent to do. His ministry was geared to the emergency, and that fact marked him out as different, a man apart."To give us feedback on this article, please write to:revival4@pars.netAn extra big THANKYOU to those who have been praying for us during this sad time. Truly appreciated, my friends.God bless you all.Kindest regards in Christ,Andrew Strom.

Thank you, Chanin!Andrew Strom has written well. This will be forwarded many times, I'm sure.My husband read from Lamentations on Sunday and my eye was drawn to 2:14--"Your prophets have seen for you false and foolish visions; And they have not exposed your iniquity so as to restore you from captivity, but they have seen for you false and misleading oracles." :-o Mrs. Fred

We need to look into the Word for the guidelines of how to know if someone is a true prophet. All through the Old Testament and in the New Testament a sign was given by the prophets as proof of their hearing from G-d. Even the disciples ask Jesus for a sign, which he gave them. G-d have placed an order and authority in the church, but we have left that order. Just as most have left the G-d given order for the family. [Father is the head, Mother is to submit, then the children are to obey] The order for the church the 5- fold ministry. We need all five offices, the church has repeatedly gone to seed with each seed as it became a 'fad'. The office of the prophet is no different. G-d will bring forth His Apostles who will set up the governments of the church. We've proved over and over again in the church community that we need governing.

Asking for prayers for Andrew and all that are invovled. May the Lord give wisdom.

G-d will bring forth His Apostles who will set up the governments of the church. We've proved over and over again in the church community that we need governing.Hello Diane,I have deep concerns with this line of thinking. Down through the centuries men have appointed themselves leaders in various churches, movements, etc. and 'proved' they were 'from God', appointed by God. Yet their fruit was death, destruction, confusion, and most importantly, CONTROL over other people's lives. First mildly, then increasing, until the most horrendous sins take place and nobody blinks an eye. This violates all of the Sermon on the Mount and the testimony of Jesus! We are FREE, dear sister, free to choose to enslave ourselves to One, and only One --- the True and Living God who made us.Yes, we are to be godly wives and mothers, law-abiding citizens of our nations, and support those who lead our congregations. We are to walk in humility and brokenness before God, together with all the saints, just as the holy people of God have always done, whether they were apostles, teachers, single women, married women, children, or slaves. Look closely at the lives of the apostles --- none of them had ANYTHING. None of them promoted themselves -- the exact opposite. They were too busy being persecuted and giving everything to their spiritual offspring!The minute somebody says 'I'm an apostle / prophet / healer etc. and you'd better listen to me because I speak for God', then I'm out the door. It's a one-man show.Mrs. Fred

s I would request that prayers be made for Andrew Strom specifically that he would have wisdom from above in these matters. Also that he would strive after God and Him alone, not the approval of men or ministries.Amen! With the latest developments this could be a very critical time. I add my agreement in prayer.

G-d will bring forth His Apostles who will set up the governments of the church. We've proved over and over again in the church community that we need governing.I have to agree with mrs. fred that this line of thinking is dangerous. Is Jesus the foundation of the church or are these modern day apostles?(1 Corinthians 3:11) For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.True Christianity and the real Church will never change their shape. Our Lord promised that He would build His Church and the gates of Hell would not prevail against it. If Christianity and the Church are changed, then the gates of hell have prevailed and our Lord was wrong. Isn't this some of the same type of heresey that the Roman Catholic church has fallen into by saying that the church is founded upon Peter?In Christ,Ron

Quote: G-d will bring forth His Apostles who will set up the governments of the church. We've proved over and over again in the church community that we need governing.Inthelight wrote; I have to agree with mrs. fred that this line of thinking is dangerous. Is Jesus the foundation of the church or are these modern day apostles?This is the underlying eschatology that I find so disturbing. This is just another version of Latter Rain/Manifested Son/Omega Man. It claims that some contemporary phenomena is the precursor of the final harvest; it has no basis in scripture.

Just wanted to make sure this was clear. The statement that Mrs. Fred is talking about was made by "Donna" (Avigayil) and not Dian (spitfire). Didn't want any confusion there.In Him, Chanin

I'm sorry Donna, I had your name wrong! forgive me :roll: Mrs. Fred

Yes, we need to keep Brother Andrew in prayer.As I as read this thread I was reminded of a couple of verses in Romans 12 "3For by the grace given me I say to every one of you: Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought, but rather think of yourself with sober judgment, in accordance with the measure of faith God has given you. 4Just as each of us has one body with many members, and these members do not all have the same function,"None of us have positions in the body of Christ, only functions. I believe this thread, as well as a couple of other threads on this same topic are ample reminders of that.

This sort of is in reference to the Storm in the tea cup, parts 1&2. :-D From what I have read God starting restoring truth to the church in the reformation and has been ever since. God never intended his church to stop at the healing or charismatic or prophetic or the apostolic restorations. Its the same as Peter blurting out that he wanted to build a tabernacle on the mountain. The attitude of, we need to remember this momment because God is never ever going to do anything else. Which boxes him in a tad.These are not seperate truths existing on there own, it is to fulfill the ultimate expression of church that...to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, for ever and ever! Amen.Eph 3:21 Every new move has always been persecuted by the proceeding one. I don't have the exact dates and times, but I will look for it. These truths have always existed but God has been blowing through his church wanting her to coming to maturity, and highlighting them to be restored as normal church life. Quote: G-d will bring forth His Apostles who will set up the governments of the church. We've proved over and over again in the church community that we need governing.Paul saw himself as an expert builder laying christ in peoples hearts. 1 cor 3:9,10 So he was deffinitley building something.Coming from a church background which is this: http://www.ncmi.net/ I would have to agree with this statement. I encourage you to look at the site and listen to the SA LTT audio files from 2004 especially to the ones of Dudley Daniel. The irony of it all. ;-) NCMI would calls itself an apostolic/prophetic team, but alomost knowone on that team would claim to be and even let themselves be called an apostle. Even though though team does apostolic work. The team breaks open new territory and establishes effective bases of ministry through which we can disciple the nations. I really rate this site, there are good people here with solid theological input, but one thing I have noticed is the total disillisionment with church and church leadership. Especially with the excesses that occur. Jesus is coming back for a pure spotless bride, so he will build his church with or without the likes of the coalition of apostles or this and that prophetic network.Inthelight wrote:Is Jesus the foundation of the church or are these modern day apostles?Modern apostles or not :the church is still... built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. Eph 2:20 NIV We need apostles and prophets to lay foundations and/or repair existing "cracks" in those already laid.If you had to meet an apostle would know what he looks like? Would it be that he had nothing, lots of people have nothing. So it can't be that. Would it be that he would have scars all over his body, lots of people have scars for their faith, so it can't be that. I will start a seperate thread on this issue.Blessings,

Modern apostles or not :the church is still... built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. Eph 2:20 NIV We need apostles and prophets to lay foundations and/or repair existing "cracks" in those already laid.Yes we do still need to be equipped for ministry, edified, and built up;And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:(Ephesians 4:11-12)But I think it's important to note a difference between Ephesians 4:11 and Ephesians 2:20. Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner [stone]; (Ephesians 2:19-20)These verses refer to the work and witness of the apostles and prophets of old, who pointed to Jesus in what they said and wrote. In Ephesians 2:20 we have a group of men with a special task of laying the foundation of the church, that task is complete and cannot be repeated. They established the faith, any ministry afterwards contends earnestly for that faith, it doesn't add something new.In Christ,Ron

We need apostles and prophets to lay foundations and/or repair existing "cracks" in those already laid. That foundation is laid.This Ephesians text is declaring that the saints have already been built on the foundation which has already been laid. So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints, and are of God's household, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone, (Eph 2:19-20 NASB)The gentive case in the original, represented by the preposition "of" frequently has an objective sense instead of the appositional. That is to say, in the present instance the meaning would be, not that the apostles and prophets were themselves the subjects, forming part of the foundation, but that the foundation was the object laid by their agency, and this is a fact. W E Vine; The Church & The Churches. That is just making it plain that the foundation was laid by their agency; they are not the foundation.Eph 2:20 uses the Aorist tense, best regarded as a simple past tense. This cannot be 'was being' (that would be the imperfect tense) or 'is being' (that would be the present tense), it can only mean 'was'. The NASB gets the sense just right. The foundation was already in place when Paul wrote Ephesians and, in fact, when he wrote 1 Corinthians. For no one is able to lay any other foundation beside the One having been laid, who is Jesus Christ. (1Co 3:11 LITV)

In HymnI'm always suspicious when we talk too much about ourselves. Somebody pointed out that hymnody took a downward trend when we left the great objective hymns that talked about God and began to sing the gospel songs that talk about us. There was a day when men sang "Holy, Holy, Holy," and "O Worship the King," and they talked objectively about the greatness of God. Then we backslid into that gutter where we still are where everything is about "I." "I'm so happy," "I'm so blest," "I'm so nice," "I'm so good," always "I." The difference between heaven and hell is the difference between God and I. Jesus Christ, by canceling His "I" was the Christ of God, not as I will, but as Thou wilt. The devil by magnifying his "I" became the devil-when he said, "I will arise, and I will raise my throne above the throne of God." --A.W. Tozer (1897-1963) "Tozer on Worship and Entertainment," Camp Hill,PA: Christian Publications, Inc., 1997, p. 96

InTheLight wrote:These verses refer to the work and witness of the apostles and prophets of old, who pointed to Jesus in what they said and wrote. In Ephesians 2:20 we have a group of men with a special task of laying the foundation of the church, that task is complete and cannot be repeated. They established the faith, any ministry afterwards contends earnestly for that faith, it doesn't add something new.Not all the Apostles wrote scripture, so the inference that to be an Eph 2:20 prophet/apostle is to have the ability/right to add to the cannon of scripture, which is not the emphasis at all. it is not adding something new to our base line of truth(the Bible) it is laying line upon line of that truth in a systematic fashion in the church so that it can be a holy habitation for God.It is all about the embracing of truth not only at a personal level, but at a corporate level(the church) and a trans-local level (outside our church locality). You know and I know that the major difference between a new Christian and a mature believer is the amount of truth(Light) that they are walking in. It is the same at a corporate level, The Eph 4:11 giftings are involved in laying foundations of truth in the very life of the church. Hence Apostolic teams. Sent teams to train and equip the saints. It is interesting to read the rest of that chapter to see we difinitley need these giftings to have/experience what he is saying. For what I have read on this site about different groupings of interest it certainly isn't the case.so that the body of Christ may be built up 13until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ. 14Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of men in their deceitful scheming. 15Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will in all things grow up into him who is the Head, that is, Christ. 16From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work. He is taliking about the whole body, thats everygrouping that emphasises a certain truth, every denomination, which I believe is in the thousands. If that is the case we certainly need the whole five-fold ministry to do that.tbc-ed,

philologos wrote:That is just making it plain that the foundation was laid by their agency; they are not the foundation.i agree, the emphasis is more on what they do and there function. Not Gods man of power for the hourFor no one is able to lay any other foundation beside the One having been laid, who is Jesus Christ. (1Co 3:11 LITV)And he is the truth, it not about adding something other than Christ to the foundation of the church.And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, 23which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way. Eph 1:22.23

Hi ZekeOSent teams to train and equip the saints. It is interesting to read the rest of that chapter to see we difinitley need these giftings to have/experience what he is saying.There are some key things pertaining to the prepositions in this passage which have powerful impact on the way we interpret this passage.And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, [/u]for[/u] the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: (Eph 4:11-13 KJV) This is the familiar translation but some other versions distinguish between the prepositions translated 'for' in the KJV;for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Christ: (Eph 4:12 ASV)The first 'for' in Eph 4:12 is 'pros' which means 'towards'. In other words the goal of the four-fold gift-men of verse 11 is the 'perfecting' of the saints. The preposition 'pros-for' denotes the ultimate purpose of the gift-men. The verb 'perfecting' is unusual it is used to describe the 'fitting out of a ship' or the 'furnishing of a house'. The sense is of getting something ready; ready for what?The second and third 'for's in Eph 4:12 is the preposition 'eis' which can also signify purpose. However in this context it is not the 'purpose' of the four-fold gift-men, but the purpose of the 'perfected saints'. It is the 'perfected saints' who are to accomplish the 'work of service' and the 'building up of the body of Christ', not the four-fold gift-men of verse 11. The 'perfected saints' are to continue their 'work of service' and to continue 'to build up the body of Christ' until we all come into the unity of the faith etc.The local church and its function is not in view in Ephesians; the focus is the universal church. The four-fold gift-men were not given to local churches but for the whole church of individual saints, not just trans-local but global horizontally and eternal vertically. The apostles, prophets, evangelists and pastor-teachers of every age continue their work of 'perfecting the saints'. SermonIndex is a thrilling outworking of this concept.The New Testament has no apostolic-teams; it has apostles and their support groups. I like the look of your website; the function of men linked together in relationship is a powerful gift to the whole church. However, I still see the concept of stratification and its tendency to look towards the fourfold-giftmen for direction which makes me uncomfortable. A hundred years ago Roland Allen wrote a book called the Spontaneous Expansion of the Church. This book is now widely regarded by mission organizations and should be on the must-read list of any who are interesting in missionary work or church planting. One of his theses is that at every moment of its development the local church should be capable of being self-sustaining. Anything other than this inevitably produces a dependence upon the 'regular' input of others. Dependence upon the fourfold-giftmen as a regular input pattern of local church life can only frustrate the development of the 'perfected saints' in their work of service and building of the body. We have all seen well-meaning western missions who pour money into emerging local churches in less developed countries. The consequence is always a dependence upon the outside agency. This financial dependency is often the mirror of a spiritual dependency. This is not conducive to the 'saints' doing their job. I do not see the fourfold-giftmen as being permanent elements of any local or trans-local setting. They are occasional and itinerant in their role, although I do agree that they could well be one thing at home and another elsewhere. It is the tendency to dependence on agencies outside the local church which is the skeleton of denomination no matter what fresh labels it is given.

Hi Ron,The sense is of getting something ready; ready for what?To get all your eschatological red flags waving, For Jesus’ return. :-) …but global horizontally and eternal vertically. Trans-local, pretty much sums it up However, I still see the concept of stratification and its tendency to look towards the fourfold-giftmen for direction which makes me uncomfortable.You of all people know that titles given in New Testament describe more the function of that person, but with that title came the Godly authourity to exercise that particular gifting. I believe our perspective of who and what the gifting represents, should be our basis for understanding. These are all manifestations of our Lord and hence these things can by tied directly to him and not to the men who are used to fulfil them. It is the leadership in the church that has allowed the sheep to place the 'supermen' on pedistles, Paul said that the Apostles were the scum of the earth, refuse, rubbish put on public display for everyone to see. Anything other than this inevitably produces a dependence upon the 'regular' input of others. Dependence upon the fourfold-giftmen as a regular input pattern of local church life can only frustrate the development of the 'perfected saints' in their work of service and building of the body. I think the key thought is the word ‘dependance’. I think in relation to an Apostolic team that word strays on the side of the negative effects of greek style government upon which most modern churches base their leadership structure and style. Church at its core is a family. To stretch your line of thinking is to say to a parent ‘leave you child alone and let him find things out by himself, because I fear lest they become to dependant upon you.’ As a parent, my heart would be that I want my child to experience the best out of life. The relationship is at its core based upon the love that the father has for the child and vice versa. The same with the Churches, planting, raising, equipping, releasing are all characteristics of a healthy growing body. These five/four-fold giftings are gifts that Jesus has given to his church, based not on wanting people to be in bondage, but on wanting them to live in all the truth.The reality of human nature is someone is always following someone else.