A Biblical Survey of Satanic Deception by Jesse-Penn Lewis

Truth of every kind makes free, while lies bind up in bonds. Ignorance also binds up, because it gives ground to Satan. Man's ignorance is a primary and essential condition for deception by evil spirits. The ignorance of the people of God concerning the powers of darkness, has made it easy for the devil to carry out his work as deceiver. Unfallen man in his pure state was not perfect in knowledge. Eve was ignorant of "good and evil," and her ignorance was a condition which lent itself to the deception of the serpent.

The devil's great purpose, and for which he fights, is to keep the world in ignorance of himself, his ways, and his colleagues, and the Church is taking sides with him when siding with ignorance about him. Every man should keep an attitude of openness to all truth, and shun the false knowledge which has slain its tens of thousands, and kept the nations in the deception of the devil.

A SPECIAL ONSLAUGHT OF DECEIVING SPIRITS
ON THE CHURCH
To-day there is a special onslaught of deceiving spirits upon the Church of Christ, the fulfilment of the prophecy which the Holy Spirit expressly made known to the Church through the Apostle Paul, that a great deceptive onslaught would take place in the "later times." Since the utterance of the prophecy, more than eighteen hundred years have passed by, but the special manifestation of evil spirits in the deception of believers to-day, points unmistakably to the fact that we are at the close of the age.

The peril of the church at the close of this dispensation is foreshown to be especially from the supernatural realm, whence Satan would send forth an army of teaching spirits, to deceive all who would be open to teachings by spiritual revelation, and thus draw them away unwittingly from full allegiance to God.

Yet in face of this plain forecast of the peril in later times, we find the Church in almost entire ignorance of the workings of this army of evil spirits. The majority of believers too readily accept everything "supernatural" as of God, and supernatural experiences are indiscriminately accepted because all such experiences are thought to be Divine.

Through lack of knowledge, the majority of even the most spiritual people, do not carry out a full and perpetual war upon this army of wicked spirits; and many are shrinking from the subject, and the call to war against them, saying that if Christ is preached it is not necessary to give prominence to the existence of the devil, nor to enter into direct conflict with him, and his hosts. Yet large numbers of the children of God are becoming a prey to the enemy for lack of this very knowledge, and through the silence of teachers on this vital truth, the Church of Christ is passing on into the peril of the closing days of the age, unprepared to meet the onslaught of the foe. On account of this, and in view of the plainly given prophetic warnings in the Scriptures; the already manifest influx of the evil hosts of Satan among the children of God; and the many signs that we are actually in the "later times" referred to by the Apostle; all believers should welcome such knowledge about the powers of darkness, as will enable them to pass through the fiery trial of these days, without being ensnared by the foe.

Apart from such knowledge, when thinking he is "fighting for truth," it is possible for a believer to fight for, defend, and protect evil spirits, and their works, believing he is thereby "defending" God, and His works; for if he thinks a thing Divine, he will protect and stand for it. It is possible for a man through ignorance to stand against God and to attack the very truth of God, and also defend the devil, and oppose God, unless he has knowledge.

KNOWLEDGE GAINED BY LETTER OF SCRIPTURE,
AND BY EXPERIENCE
The Bible throws much light upon the Satanic powers, which cannot fail to be discerned by all who search the Scriptures with open minds, but these will not obtain as much knowledge of the subject from the sacred record, as will those who have understanding by experience, interpreted by the Holy Spirit, and shown to be in line with the truth of the Word of God. The believer may have a direct witness in his spirit to the truth of the Divine Word, but through experience he gets a personal witness to the inspiration of Scripture, to its testimony concerning the existence of supernatural beings, and their works, and the way they deceive, and mislead the children of men.

THE WORK OF SATAN AS DECEIVER IN THE
GARDEN OF EDEN
If all that the Bible contains on the subject of the supernatural powers of evil, could be exhaustively dealt with in this book, we should find that more knowledge is given of the workings of Satan, and his principalities and powers, than many have realized. From Genesis to Revelation the work of Satan as deceiver of the whole inhabited earth can be traced, until the climax is reached, and the full results of the deception in the Garden of Eden are unveiled in the Apocalypse. In Genesis we have the simple story of the garden, with the guileless pair unaware of danger from evil beings in the unseen world. We find recorded there Satan's first work as deceiver, and the subtle form of his method of deception. We see him working upon an innocent creature's highest and purest desires, and cloaking his own purpose of ruin, under the guise of seeking to lead a human being nearer to God. We see him using the God-ward desires of Eve to bring about captivity, and bondage to himself. We see him using "good" to bring about evil; suggesting evil to bring about supposed good. Caught with the bait of being "wise," and "like God," Eve is blinded to the principle involved in obedience to God, and is deceived (1 Tim. 2: 14, A.V.).

Goodness is, therefore, no guarantee of protection from deception. The keenest way in which the devil deceives the world, and the Church, is when he comes in the guise of somebody, or something, which apparently causes them to go God-ward and good-ward. He said to Eve, "ye shall be as gods," but he did not say, "and ye shall be like demons." Angels and men only knew evil when they fell into a state of evil. Satan did not tell Eve this, when he added "knowing good and evil." His true objective in deceiving Eve was to get her to disobey God, but his wile was, "ye shall be like God." Had she reasoned, she would have seen that the deceiver's suggestion exposed itself, for it crudely resolved itself into "disobey God" to be more like God!

THE CURSE OF GOD PRONOUNCED UPON THE DECEIVER
That a highly organized monarchy of evil spirit-beings was in existence, is not made known in the story of the garden. Only a "serpent" is there; but the serpent is spoken to by God as an intelligent being, carrying out a deliberate purpose in the deception of the woman. The serpent-disguise of Satan is swept aside by Jehovah, as He makes known the decision of the Triune God in view of the catastrophe which had taken place. A "Seed" of the deceived woman, should eventually bruise the head of the supernatural being, who had used the form of the serpent to carry out his plan. Thenceforward the name of serpent is attached to him, the very name throughout the ages describing the climax action of his revolt against his Creator, in beguiling and deceiving the woman in Eden, and blasting the human race. Satan triumphed, but God overruled. The victim is made the vehicle for the advent of a Victor, who should ultimately destroy the works of the devil, and cleanse the heavens and the earth from every trace of his handiwork. The serpent is cursed, but, in effect, the beguiled victim is blest, for through her will come the "Seed" which will triumph over the devil and his seed; and through her will arise a new race through the promised Seed (Gen. 3: 15), which will be antagonistic to the serpent to the end of time, through the enmity implanted by God. Henceforth the story of the ages consists of the record of a war between these two seeds; the Seed of the woman--Christ and His redeemed--and the seed of the devil (See John 8: 44; 1 John 3: 10), right on to the furthermost point of the final committal of Satan to the lake of fire.

Henceforth it is also war by Satan upon the womanhood of the world, in malignant revenge for the verdict of the garden. War by the trampling down of women in all lands where the deceiver reigns. War upon women in Christian lands, by the continuance of his Eden method of misinterpreting the Word of God; insinuating into men's minds throughout all succeeding ages, that God pronounced a "curse" upon the woman, when in truth she was pardoned and blessed; and instigating men of the fallen race to carry out the supposed curse, which was in truth a curse upon the deceiver, and not the deceived one (Gen. 3: 14).

"I will put enmity between thee and the woman," said God, as well as between "thy seed and her seed," and this vindictive enmity of the hierarchy of evil to woman, and to believers, has not lessened in its intensity from that day.

SATAN AS DECEIVER IN THE OLD TESTAMENT
When once we clearly apprehend the existence of an unseen host of evil spirit-beings, all actively engaged in deceiving and misleading men, Old Testament history will convey to us an open vision of their doings, hitherto hidden from our knowledge. We can trace their operations in relation to the servants of God throughout all history, and discern the work of Satan as deceiver penetrating everywhere. We shall see that David was deceived by Satan into numbering Israel, because he failed to recognize the suggestion to his mind as from a Satanic source (1 Chron. 21: 1). Job also was deceived, and the messengers that came to him, when he believed the report that the "fire" which had fallen from heaven was from God (Job. 1: 16); and that all the other calamities which befell him in the loss of wealth, home and children, came directly from the hand of God; whereas the early part of the book of Job clearly shows that Satan was the primary cause of all his troubles; as "prince of the power of the air" using the elements of nature, and the wickedness of men, to afflict the servant of God, in the hope that ultimately he could force Job into renouncing his faith in God, Who seemed to be unjustly punishing him without cause. That this was Satan's aim is suggested in the words of the wife of the patriarch, who became a tool for the Adversary, in urging the suffering man to "curse God and die," she, also, being deceived by the enemy into believing that God was the primary cause of all the trouble and the unmerited suffering which had come upon him.

In the history of Israel during the time of Moses, the veil is lifted more clearly from the Satanic powers, and we are shown the condition of the world as sunk in idolatry--which is said in the New Testament to be the direct work of Satan (1 Cor. 10: 20)--and actual dealing with evil spirits; the whole inhabited earth being thus in a state of deception, and held by the deceiver in his power. We also find numbers of God's own people, through contact with others under Satanic power, deceived into communicating with "familiar spirits," and into the using of "divination," and other kindred arts, inculcated by the powers of darkness, even though they knew the laws of God, and had seen His manifested judgments among them. (See Lev. 17: 7, R.V. margin "satyrs"; 19: 31; 20: 6, 27; Deut. 18: 10, 11).

In the book of Daniel, we find a still further stage of revelation reached concerning the hierarchy of evil powers, when in the tenth chapter we are shown the existence of the princes of Satan, actively opposing the messenger of God sent to Daniel to make His servant understand His counsels for His people. There are also other references to the workings of Satan, his princes, and the hosts of wicked spirits, carrying out his will, scattered throughout the Old Testament, but on the whole the veil is kept upon their doings, until the great hour arrives, when the "Seed" of the woman, who was to bruise the head of the serpent, is manifested on earth in human form (Gal. 4: 4).

SATAN AS DECEIVER UNVEILED IN THE NEW TESTAMENT
With the advent of Christ, the veil which had hidden the active workings of the supernatural powers of evil, for centuries since the garden catastrophe, is still further removed, and their deception and power over man is clearly revealed, and the arch-deceiver himself appears in the wilderness conflict of the Lord, to challenge the "Seed of the woman," as it is not recorded that he appeared on earth since the time of the Fall. The wilderness of Judea, and the Garden of Eden, being parallel periods for the testing of the first and second Adam. In both periods Satan worked as Deceiver, in the second instance wholly failing to deceive, and beguile the One who had come as his Conqueror.

Traces of the characteristic work of Satan as deceiver can be discerned among the disciples of the Christ. He deceives Peter into speaking words of temptation to the Lord, suggesting His turning from the path of the Cross (Matt. 16: 22- 23), and later on takes hold of the same disciple in the Judgment Hall (Luke 22: 31), prompting him to the lie, "I know not the Man," with the very purpose of deception (Matt. 26: 74). Further traces of the work of the deceiver may be seen in the epistles of Paul, in his references to the "false apostles," "deceitful workers," and Satan's workings as an "angel of light," and "his ministers as ministers of righteousness" among the people of God (2 Cor. 11: 13-15). In the messages to the Churches, also, given by the ascended Lord to His servant John, false apostles are spoken of, and false teachings of many kinds. A "synagogue of Satan" (Rev. 2: 9), consisting of deceived ones, is mentioned, and "deep things of Satan" are described as existing in the Church (Rev. 2: 24).

THE FULL REVELATION OF THE DECEIVER IN THE
APOCALYPSE
Then the veil is lifted at last. The full revelation of the Satanic confederacy against God and His Christ, is given to the Apostle John. After the messages to the Churches, the world-wide work of the deceiver prince is fully disclosed to the Apostle, and he is bidden to write all that he is shown, that the Church of Christ might know the full meaning of the War with Satan in which the redeemed would be engaged, right on to the time when the Lord Jesus would be revealed from heaven, in judgment upon these vast, and terrible powers, full of cunning malignity, and hatred to His people, and as truly at work behind the world of men, from the days of the garden story to the end.

As we read the Apocalypse, it is important to remember that the organised forces of Satan described therein, were in existence at the time of the Fall of Eden, and only partially revealed to the people of God until the advent of the promised "Seed of the woman" Who was to bruise the serpent's head. When the fulness of time had come, God manifest in the flesh met the fallen arch-angel, and leader of the evil angelic host, in mortal combat at Calvary; and, putting them to open shame, shook off from Himself the vast masses of the hosts of darkness who gathered around the Cross, from the furthermost realms of the kingdom of Satan (Col. 2: 15).

The Scriptures teach us that God's unveilings of the truths concerning Himself, and all the things in the spiritual realm which we need to know, are always timed by Him to the strength of His people. The full revelation of the Satanic powers disclosed in the Apocalypse was not given to the Church in its infancy, for some forty years passed after the Lord's ascension ere the Book of the Revelation was written. Possibly it was necessary, that the Church of Christ should first fully apprehend the fundamental truths revealed to Paul, and the other Apostles, ere she could safely be shown the extent of the war with supernatural powers of evil upon which she had entered.

THE LAST OF THE APOSTLES CHOSEN TO TRANSMIT
THE REVELATION
Whatever the reason of the delay, it is striking that it was the last of the Apostles who was chosen to transmit, at the very end of his life, the full war- message to the Church, which would serve as a foreshadowing of the campaign until its close.

In the Revelation given to John, the name and character of the deceiver is more clearly made known, with the strength of his forces, and the extent of the war, and its final issues. It is shown that in the invisible realm there is war between the forces of evil, and the forces of light. John says that "the dragon warred, and his angels . . , " the dragon being explicitly described as the "serpent" from his guise in Eden--"called the Devil and Satan," the deceiver of the whole inhabited earth. His worldwide work as deceiver is fully revealed, and the war in the earth realm caused by his deceiving of the nations, and the world-powers acting under his instigation and rule. The highly organised confederacy of principalities and powers, acknowledging the headship of Satan, is disclosed, and their "authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation," all deceived by the supernatural and invisible forces of evil, and making "war with the saints" (Rev. 13: 7).

This article above is the forward to the very important book on Spiritual warfare written by Jesse-Penn Lewis and Co-authored with Evan Roberts from the welsh revival. It was written to help balance out the revival from many of the counterfeits they saw working in the movement early on. Many claim that this book helped stop the revival but in my mind it helped save the revival from falling into gross excesses that we see in very modern charismatic meetings.

The contents for this 1912 online edition are here: http://www.apostasynow.com/wots/Contents.html

I read this over 8 years ago from the same website I believe and it benefited me to have discernment with many new supposed "moves of God" and "men of God" with special anointing etc. Thank God for His protection over His flock in our day.

Amen.
What she wrote of "deliverance" in the chpt "Freedom for the deceived" is excellent. Not this scarey stuff that we've read about or seen from so-called deliverance ministries.

War on the Saints did need to be revised though and has been a few times, because of the wording - that Christians could be possessed not being true. Oppressed but not possessed.

Edit: In this link - the deliverance chpt is Chpt 8 titled "The Path to Freedom".

The latter revisions of this book have more notes from other teachers, etc. explaining the "possession" error and more of an Intro and Appendix.

You're OK Sister. That is why I mentioned the multiple Revised versions of this book.

I've read the 1977 version and the "possession" part bothered me but I knew at the time that possession was not a possiblity for a Christian, so I got what I could from the rest of it.

Then came the 1993 version that explained in the Intro that they had taken the possession part out.
I now have the 2004 Edition with much added to it.
I'd have to say that the 1993 version was best.

I too do not like giving more attention to the enemy (our defeated foe) than "what is written".
I've seen first hand, when I was young in the LORD, the excesses of focusing on demons and 'deliverance ministries'.

This original version, I had never seen until this link. I mean no harm, but after posting, I too read some and it didn't read like the latter revised versions. That's why I came back to add the Edit.

I had no problem with the 1993 version. When you've dealt with all sorts of strange phenomena in pentecostal churches and have personally known people who have suffered under "deception" or extreme condemnation brought about by believing a lie - in those who had not seen where we stand in Christ and have experienced first hand "ministers that come posing as righteous ministers of light" but are truly like Balaam or what Paul describes in 2 Tim 3 - this book came in helpful to me years back and even now when I see people caught in the bondage of always feeling the need to 'spontaneously' confess their sins in public, that which should be kept between trusted mature Saints that can minister to that person.

I wouldn't throw the book out, but I prefer the updated revised additions.

There's some good teaching about "the perils of the passivity or the passive mind". "Victory in Conflict" also is helpful to discern conviction rather than condemnation of the enemy and pointing to The WORD as our weapon - bottomline. That's Truth and The Truth - His received WORD, 'will' "set us free" from deception, by His Spirit opening the truth in His Word to us.
Always prefer Scripture over Any author - on that I fully agree. It is the Only writing that can claim to be "Living" and "Spirit" that does not go out void and cuts straight to the problem - if the person is desireous of the true truth in their lives.

One section within a chpt talks about "feelings injected by the enemy" - that too was useful in that, many believe or look for "feelings".
Also in this book is "The need of differentiating Accusation from true conviction."

In a way, yes, this book is about the deep things of Satan - and is more suited to those who are more mature in their walk and experiences witnessing the many deceptions that people buy into, that trouble their minds and walks with GOD.

If it brings paranoia instead of insight - then it's not for that person to read and Always - The WORD of GOD and His Spirit of Truth is all one will ever need - so there isn't a book on earth that is "essential" reading - Amen - but some do give insight to some of the false teachings that have surfaced within certain periods of time when the enemy of true truth would come in like a flood on the heels of a move of GOD.

To call this Author a "Jezebel" is a bit over the top though. I believe that because of the depth of it - and because it can cause a shakiness at first, when not read in it's entirety in the later versions of it, that may have been just a reaction generated by a fear. But like I said - no book is "essential" for any of us to read except His Book.

His Light, Strength and Mercy to you and to all of us.

I will reply regarding "Christians being possessed" only.

When a human being is "possessed" - spiritual beings enter the "spirit" of a human. THAT is possession.

In a truly regenerated, Holy Spirit filled Christian - The Holy Spirit WILL NOT cohabit with a demon in the same spirit of a human being.

How on earth could anyone think otherwise?

Well, I signed out and shut the browser and prayed - besides taking 40 deep breaths.

Never will I ever believe Scripturally that a Child of GOD can be "Possessed" - why - because I've read the whole Bible and I don't care what books you read by falible humans - it is just an excuse to sin and give others who believe this "Flip Wilson Heresy" a chance to feel they have it over another child of GOD.

We sin and are tempted by "our own lusts" - by "choice"!

Maybe some don't know Flip Wilson, but he was a comedian back maybe 40 years ago on TV and his biggest joke was - "The devil made me do it!" - he was moking Christianity - just as this doctrine of Christians being Possessed mocks Christ's work on The Cross.

A person can be "deceived" or "oppressed" and that is why I did Amen Greg's post - but you cannot tell me that sin is not the work of anything other than a man's freewill if he is SAVED. I'm not yelling. I don't yell at anyone nor have I ever yelled but this is serverely important.

How do I know? When I first got saved, I believed this heresy and the torment that it puts a human through, if they're SAVED, and especially if they have a sensitive conscience is non-ending.

I could give you case after case of the torment that people have gone through 'after' they were "delivered of demonic possession" by some zealots of this heresy.
One Christian got home and heard "We're still in here."
I know of a few that had to be put in a mental institution because of this abominable belief... that a truly Spirt filled Christian can also be inhabited, in their spirit, by a demon.

The other extreme, as I mentioned, is those who blame "the devil" for all their own unsurrendered lusts - Jas 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

Lusts come from "self-love" over Love for GOD!

The instances you gave from Scripture dealt with un-saved people. When the demons left - they got Saved.

There is not one Scripture that will prove that man is not responsible for choosing pornography and all the etc sins that you've mentioned.

Yes, a person can "buy the lie" and from that point on be deceived or oppressed - but if they are genuinely inhabited by The HOLY Spirit - they are not "possessed".

What does the WORD of GOD say, from Old Testament to New about "sin"? Does it not just say, "Don't".

If a person lives in continual sin, then I doubt their Salvation.

If a person is struggling constantly with porn, etc., then they have not used the WORD of GOD and prayer and discernment to fight to the Victory that Christ won for us.

This heresy makes a mockery of Christ's attoning work. That is why this heresy should anger us. Not at those who believe it - but at the borderline blasphemy that it is.

With this heresy, again, you will either have people scared half out of their minds or give them reason to constantly struggle with one sin after another, blaming "the devil."

I pray that GOD's people would just read their own Bibles and stop taking man's words as innerent, infallible, omniscient or anywhere equivlent to HIS WORDS. GOD forgive those who do not and help them.

Sola Scriptura or I for one of many do not want to hear it.

We don't learn from a thousand books - we need desperately to just learn One.

Your post wasn't there when I typed mine -

"Jesse never said that." At this point, as many times as I've read her book and passed it on - I don't care "what Jesse said" - please, let us go Sola Scriptura with this vital topic. To be "possessed" by a spirit = "spirit enters spirit" - just as the HOLY Spirit enters our spirit. These are spiritual beings that only have the power to lie to Christians. If they, "by their own lusts" open a door to being tormented by a demon or demons, then even as Jesse said - they need to renew their minds and be washed with the cleansing of The WORD.

Casting OUT demons is for the unsaved's deliverance.
We can pray with a genuine Christian against a spirit that has somehow fooled them into thinking that demon has more power than GOD/Christ over them.

The way to deliverance is HIS WORD - for a true Christian.
His WORD is Truth and Satan is the father of lies.
We put on the full armor of GOD - NOT so that we won't be possessed, but that we can fight with His WORD, as Jesus did in the wilderness, with full Authority of His Victory for us on the Cross.

Quote: "Tell me what a Christian will receive when he fears man to the point of debilitating? What does a Christian receive when he goes over to the homosexual lifestyle? Can you answer that? What does a Christian receive when he lies continually to his wife or congregation about his porn addiction?"

He risks his salvation! By his own freewill. Period, according to SCRIPTURE.

You don't seem to understand the difference between "possession" and "oppression" or being 'deceived' by believing a "lie" or a FALSE DOCTRINE/Teaching.

What will open the door to "oppression or believing a lie" which opens the door to more lies from Satan or demons is not knowing The WORD of GOD and where His Sheep 'stand' by His finished work on the Cross or the person not "putting their flesh to death", "deeming themselves dead onto sin".

I can understand a person being tormented by believing a lie about where they stand in Christ because they are new in the Faith of Jesus and being 'fearful' as a result, and GOD help the one who teaches these lies.

But we are and always will be responsible for what we do, once we are Saved. And Pastors, teachers or any mature Christian should always lead people to the Bible Only.

Repentence for opening these doors to demonic influence is what is in order here. And sometimes, it's the teacher of these false doctrines that need to repent seriously and not the Babe in Christ who believed them and thus suffered the fears or stumbling that these teachings have caused.

Keep blaming the devil for Christian's sins and check it against what Scripture says about sin and see where it leads to. I already know.

Edit:

No point in going on. Discernment is advised,

What Paul was talking about in 2 Corth 11:4 was receiving of other "men" who preach another gospel and operate through "another spirit" - such as we've seen in this generation with Bentley, etc. ---- the people "received" him.
2Co 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
2Co 11:4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

In that chpt Paul had to defend his ministry against these others who were coming into Corinth with another Jesus and another/counterfeit spirit and not the Holy Spirit which Paul operated in. Just as we see now, in these days with these false teachers and "miracle workers".

Paul again is saying that they would "receive the man" who gives them what Paul hadn't given them which was The Truth and the Spirit of Truth. He was trying to catch them from "believing lies" -- 2Co 11:12 But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we.
2Co 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
2Co 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
2Co 11:16 I say again, Let no man think me a fool; if otherwise, yet as a fool receive me, that I may boast myself a little.
2Co 11:17 That which I speak, I speak it not after the Lord, but as it were foolishly, in this confidence of boasting.
2Co 11:18 Seeing that many glory after the flesh, I will glory also.
2Co 11:19 For ye suffer fools gladly, seeing ye yourselves are wise.
2Co 11:20 For ye suffer, if a man bring you into bondage, if a man devour you, if a man take of you, if a man exalt himself, if a man smite you on the face.

I've answered all questions. Just as the Corinthians were about to believe a lie from a man - so men believe lies --- Anything that is the opposite of what is Written is a lie.

You cannot blame demons for men's choices and The WORD of GOD states plainly that to sin is to "choose to" sin. You would rather blame "a spirit of this or that".

I will not "just say their theology is confused" - I will say again what James says - Jas 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. Jas 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

I think you need to define "Christian" much better than you have in your own mind, lest you be swept away in these excuses.

A backslider can repent and turn back to the LORD, but Jesse was not talking about homosexuals - she was discussing people taking a passive mind and opening oneself to demonic influence. She was not talking about Blatant sin.

We're discussing your/her belief in CHRISTIANS being "demon possessed" - not those who are struggling with this or that.

btw - what happened to Evan Roberts after all of this teaching? I am beginning to believe that our Sister who posted here earlier was on to something here.

Any "Christian" who is being tempted by 'anything' is still in need of the same solution - His WORD and prayer! Not to have "demons cast 'out' of them."
We can pray against any enemy involvement in what they are going through but it is more important to first find out what lie they have bought/believed that is contrary to His Word, If they are Christians.
The Truth will set them free from the lie(s) - not telling them that they're "demon possessed".

You have a "spirit" for everything - I don't find that in His WORD. I find people that prefer a lie or due to ignorance of His WORD, believe a lie about themselves or how GOD feels toward them or what He's said in His WORD or through Rebellion, they 'choose' to believe a lie against His Word... but the fault will always remain in the mind not receiving or being fed The WORD and believing IT. Sometimes it's just due to being young in the LORD and not having proper discipleship - but with those who deliberately sin against His WORD - the same holds true ... they will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven unless they repent.

I truly feel that you need to quit blaming demons for what GOD calls willful rebellion in responsible Christians.

We can cut some slack to the babes in Christ but anyone who's had a Bible and Jesus long enough to have at least read most of the N.T. realizes that they can't blame the devil or demons for their own choices to sin.

I still say that there are good points in her book about allowing ourselves to get into a "passive mind" state or accepting "physical feelings" as from GOD without Testing that, but I have been through this enough to know that and stand firm on the fact that 'Christians' cannot be demon "possessed".

My reply to your last sentence - Yes, I 'will' just tell them "the Truth" and pray with them that they'll receive it. Then I will read to the Christian all the verses that explain what Christ accomplished for us, because of His Great Love for us and that we are seated in Heavenly Places with Him, etc from His Word.

Suicide is a choice. It's the epitome of self-love. Those who are thinking of no one else but themselves. They want out of their pain regardless of what it does to others who know them. Thou shalt not kill - covers suicide as well - so suicide is "a sin".

In this last post you wrote: Quote: "I have never blamed demons for man's choices. You cannot find that anywhere in print. I have been very clear."

But what did you write about the sin of suicide?

Quote: "And why for that matter would a Christian contemplate suicide? Oh, I forgot, he received a lie. Not a spirit of suicide or a spirit of rejection and self-hatred. Ok, let's just tell him the truth and everything will be ok."

Not a "spirit of suicide" or a "spirit of rejection or self-hatred".

hmm. Is this not blaming "spirits" for man's choices?

Suicide is a choice.

Yes, I will tell him the Truth. "No man hateth his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it..."

"Love your neighbor AS yourselves" since Lev 19:18 on.

GOD is saying that humans don't "hate themselves" - the problem is and always will be, that we love ourselves more than we love GOD. We love ourselves too much.

Suicide is "self" pity. Self pity over "rejection" is just pride. I'm talking to Christians now. "Self hatred" is also a form of pride.

We're to die to self and not look to self for anything but to look to the Love of Christ.

That is why "Love" is the First Commandment from Lev and Deut 6 - "Love the LORD your GOD with all of your heart, mind, soul and strength." and this HE was saying to His people who did not have the Cross to look back on, nor the indwelling Holy Spirit, nor the regeneration that we have, nor the NT Scriptures.
Jesus told the Pharisees that if they had "loved GOD" they would have loved Him.

If we Love GOD the way we should, we wouldn't entertain what we do and if we loved our neighbors 'as' we love ourselves - well, how would our neighbors benefit by seeing a Christian kill themselves?

Hey, I wish you HIS Peace that passes All Understanding! Amen.

You can march to which ever drummer's beat that you want to.

From the first - my argument is against using the phrase - "Christians can be possessed." Apples and oranges indeed.

You said - "The possession of a person's faculties"

THAT is not what we read in Scripture below. That is demon possession when a person's "faculties" are controlled by, owned by, possessed by" demonic spirits.

"Influence" - yes. "Lie to" - yes. "Oppress" - yes. "Possess" - NO.

"Possess" means "to own". "Possession" implies "ownership". Satanists are demon "possessed".

Who possesses you and your faculties?

δαιμονίζομαι - look it up.

Matt. 12:43-45, “Now when the unclean spirit goes out of a man, it passes through waterless places, seeking rest, and does not find it. 44 “Then it says, ‘I will return to my house from which I came’; and when it comes, it finds it unoccupied, swept, and put in order. 45 “Then it goes, and takes along with it seven other spirits more wicked than itself, and they go in and live there; and the last state of that man becomes worse than the first. That is the way it will also be with this evil generation.”

Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

1Co 3:16, 17 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Rom 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
Rom 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Rom 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
Rom 8:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Rom 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Rom 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Rom 8:31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
Rom 8:32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
Rom 8:33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
Rom 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
Rom 8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
Rom 8:36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
Rom 8:37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
Rom 8:38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Rom 8:39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

1Co 6:19 What? know ye not that YOUR BODY is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

2Co 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Eph 2:22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

1Jn 4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

"Choice"

Jos 24:15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.

you wrote:

I won't continue this discussion, because it is ceasing to be a discussion.

and yet after that declaration, you proceeded to write another 4 posts on this thread.

so just let your yes be yes, and your no be no.

i've read your 16 posts since you descended upon this forum. normally i would take this up in a private message, but your tenor in post, tells me that is not wise.

and i say that because, in all of the now 16 posts you've wrote, i've never seen the Words, "love" and "mercy" in any of them.

the fruit of your keyboard sir, and all this emphasis on demons, and dark accusations leveled against what you see as followers of Jesus that don't measure up to your standards.

so i will make a predication, unless you learn to play nice with the "other kids", show some humility, grace, mercy and Jesus' love in you, you will not be long for this forum.

please forgive my sharp post, but i must be true to what i see and read. This forum is a precious cyber ministry in a sea of internet darkness, and as for me, i will not sit idly by and let any flesh, including my own, corrupt it.

so please beloved, pray before you post, as John wrote, God is love, he who lives in love, lives in God and God in Him.

neil