Plagiarism or Common Place?

I am aware of a pastor who lifts ideas from others for his sermons.Some stories are almost word for word. Is this something worthy of concern,or is it common?

He recently told this story as his own:(He shortened it yet said it happened to him. I found the story on the internet)

Several years ago, a woman came to see me, a clandestine meeting in another place besides the church. She did not want to be seen with the pastor because she was a significant woman in the community and she asked me a question, the question was simple and to the point, what sin have I committed in my life that God would give me cancer. I challenged her assumption that God was punishing her with cancer. "You see, when I was growing up as a little girl," she said, "I was in a parochial school. The teachers of that parochial school would say, if you aren't careful, if you don't do the right thing, when you grow up, God will make you get sick. So you'd better do the right thing." She said, "I can't get away from it, it's a part of the deep part of my soul, it's a sense that I've done something and God will judge me with cancer." I run into this theology way too many times. From Christians who will publicly say, God is love, and quietly think, God is getting me for past sins.

From when I went to church, it was common practice. The pastors joked about referencing it once and then after that it was theirs to quote freely. I no longer go there.

I think it's a shame and shows a bent for lying; imho.

God bless,
Lisa

Sadly, this happens on a regular basis.

It is standard procedure to "borrow" sermons from Spurgeon, Campbell-Morgan, F.B. Meyer, etc. After all, who's going to know? Who reads those guys anymore? Well, I do, and I've caught preachers lifting sermons wholesale from old preachers - especially pastors of small congregations who work full time jobs and have families to raise and not much time for sermon preparation. This practice is actually encouraged at pastors' conferences. The rationale is, "The Word of God is the Word of God, and if God could use the message to bless Spurgeon's people, He can use it to bless your people."

"Power Through Prayer" by E.M. Bounds demolishes this philosophy.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/2437481/POWER-THROUGH-PRAYER

I wish every pastor would read it.

"The kingdom of God is not in word but in power."

Of consideration, a lot of these classic preachers were not against this practice. Ravenhill testified of doing it, even saying that if he preached another man's message twice it became his. Many others have certainly quoted other classic preachers and/or used their ideas, even Spurgeon.

JiG, I totally agree with you but at the same time have been so blessed by modern men, like a Michael Brown or John Piper who have used 3 points filled with quotes (and unction).

*Edit

Sometimes, I wish that pastors would "borrow" from men who actually had something to say.

After all, I once knew a pastor who had a filing cabinet where he stored his sermons. He would sometimes just take one of those messages out of his filing cabinet and preach it again.

One Sunday, I couldn't find my notebook, so I grabbed an old notebook so that I could take notes from the meeting. As the pastor spoke, I thought that it sounded very familiar.

Eventually, I flipped back a few pages and discovered that the pastor had preached that same sermon -- verse by verse, line by line, and even the anecdotes, sermon illustrations and jokes -- just six months prior.

Even worse: No one else seemed to notice (or care).

:-P

BTW, I don't think that it can be called "plagiarism" if the person states WHERE or FROM WHOM he gathered those things. Unfortunately, quite a few "Christianese" type of clichés came from one minister failing to mention that he heard those things from someone else.

"After all, I once knew a pastor who had a filing cabinet where he stored his sermons. He would sometimes just take one of those messages out of his filing cabinet and preach it again."

I guess my former pastor was a bit more modern he had all of his on a thumbdrive, and would commonly use sermons from conferences he had been to. A lot of his messages lacked unction and conviction, though he would openly say preaching was his weak point. He was also a self proclaimed "mover and shaker"

I also wanted to add, where I live most churches are very small in number on top of the wrong mindsets of leadership and individuals. The common mindset of people is since the pastor is paid then He gets to do everything we ought to be doing ie hospital visits, volunteering, etc, etc. leaving minimal time for prayer and sermon preparation and really get alone with God for a message He wants. A pastor who is a strong biblical pastor will equip and diseminate responsibility as it comes but it seems some pastors choose to just do it themselves either out of perfectionism or lack of motivated individual to help. Its quite interesting the different pressures you see from behind the scenes of things. Its not uncommon for a pastor to put in a 60 to 70 hour work week and only get paid for 40 hours. I think that is why the "professional" pastor model is a poor one IF the pastor isn't clear on the boundaries which he sets. I mean we see in Acts the Apostles didn't say okay we need to take care of these widows and their disputes and THEN pray and get into and expound scriptures rather they said we have a different function perhaps we can give this responsiblity to others who are capable.

A well balanced church is a beautiful thing.

We have three men pastoring in our church. Two are similar in their delivery. All may quote others, identifying the source. The other one often will read what another person has written, but none will preach another man's sermon.

It is not uncommon for a preacher to preach a sermon he had done earlier.

I am like some others mentioned: I like for a preacher to preach what the LORD has laid on his heart. Only then can he preach with passion and conviction. To borrow sermons from others and have the audience believe this is their own sounds just like "business as usual".

My opinion.

Now I need to go get ready for church...

mguldner wrote:
I guess my former pastor was a bit more modern he had all of his on a thumbdrive, and would commonly use sermons from conferences he had been to. ...

In the early 90’s I had received David Wilkerson’s Pulpit Series mailing that week and then that Sunday I went to church and the pastor preached ‘word for word’ Wilkerson’s mailing without any credit to Wilkerson or Times Square Church whatsoever; and then afterwards, I watched people shake his hand and tell him what a great word from God that was and he accepted their praise.

I might be wrong but to me, could this be where sin lies? Granted, using another person’s sermon may not as big a sin as Lisa perceives it to be BUT in accepting all the hoopla and praise as your own.... could this be a sin?

Just saying or asking...

God bless,
Lisa

by ccchhhrrriiisss
Sometimes, I wish that pastors would "borrow" from men who actually had something to say.

God bless you,
Lisa

In college the common saying was that

if you take it from one or two sources it is plagarism. However, if you take it from eight or ten sources it is research.

I have also known ministers to "preach another man's sermon" largely intact because they simply felt it was a far better job of sermon CONSTRUCTION than they were able to produce. They then prayed over it..changed some illustrations to ones they knew..but it was still largely the other persons research..but DELIVERED by the second man (or woman) in his/her own way. I have been very "grace extending" in this situation as I know their reason for doing it was to produce a higher caliber message, and overall spiritual food, for the congregation they loved. In essence they felt they were feeding their sheep better in this way than they had the skill to do on their own.

Just another side of the coin to consider.

Blessings!