Why the English Standard Version ?

sermonindex Apr 15, 2011

1. Does Translation Philosophy Matter?
2. Gender Neutral Translations
3. Helpful Links
4. English Bible History

A legitimate question is whether the world is truly served with another English Bible translation. Since the middle of the 20th century, English language translations have proliferated. Presently, there are more than 25 English translations.

The English Standard Version (ESV), in contrast to most modern translations, is not entirely "new." The ESV is the product of a rich translation legacy which spans some 500 years. The beginning of this heritage was William Tyndale's New Testament (1526). The starting point for the ESV was the 1971 Revised Standard Version (RSV). Over 90 percent of the RSV is retained in the ESV. The RSV was regarded by many as the best modern translation in terms of precision and literary elegance.

http://evangelicalbible.com/why.htm

H

HeartSong Apr 15, 2011

I tried the ESV for awhile - but something was missing. Then one day I realized that it was different than the King James Version that I had read in my past. When I switched back to the KJV, it was like coming home to a place that I had not realized that I had left.

O

Oracio Apr 15, 2011

I recently switched from the NASB to the ESV, due to the NASB's watered down translation of the Greek word "porneia" in many places. It translates that word to "immorality" without specifying sexual immorality. I am liking the ESV so far.

The NIV was my first Bible as a believer 13 years ago. Then the NKJV. Never could get into the KJV, or understand the logic of holding so tightly to such an outdated form of English which hardly anyone can understand.

H

HeartSong Apr 15, 2011

Never could get into the KJV, or understand the logic of holding so tightly to such an outdated form of English which hardly anyone can understand.

Well, I suppose it is because "it" got a hold on me.

W

White_Stone Apr 15, 2011

Heartsong said: Well, I suppose it is because "it" got a hold on me.

The Word sustains us.

Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, it all boils down to Jesus.

Never could get into the KJV, or understand the logic of holding so tightly to such an outdated form of English which hardly anyone can understand.

What part of

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

is not understandable?

Not speaking to any one person, in particular, the people of this generation are spoiled and seek shortcuts. They are not willing to simply take things on faith they want to completely understand every word. I believe much is not understandable because sin lays in front of our eyes. Our hearts are not clean enough to hold the Truth. Pray for forgiveness and ask for Wisdom, then be grateful for even the crumbs of understanding you receive, they are infinitely more then we deserve - we deserve nothing, all that we receive is a gift. That some receive different gifts is explained within the Book.

kindly, white stone

sermonindex Apr 15, 2011

I tried the ESV for awhile - but something was missing. Then one day I realized that it was different than the King James Version that I had read in my past. When I switched back to the KJV, it was like coming home to a place that I had not realized that I had left.

I have used the KJV for 15 years and the NIV. I started with the NIV and went to the KJV quite quickly. I used to hold to the fact of the textus receptus manuscripts being correct and therefore every other modern translation was wrong. I feel now that was a very narrow view and not true. Many new findings show much earlier manuscripts that add to and take away from the authority of the textus receptus.

We have much more clear a picture of the whole of the bible now with manuscripts and see all the manuscripts that 98% all agree. Thus new translations working off these.

The ESV is in the lineage of the KJV version I believe as the RSV was the continuation of the KJV and the ESV is not the continuation of the RSV.

It is just simply not fruitful to read a translation in our day that is very hard to understand for the normal reader. Many cults and abherant groups use the KJV simply to keep people in the dark, including:

Work faith teachers, TV evangelists, Faith healers, prosperity Gospel preachers, mormons, and 100's of other cult groups or extreme christian groups.

I am not condemning anyone that is using the KJV, it is a great translation but I feel for many people especially younger who want to reach this generation for Christ the ESV is a great way to go.

W

White_Stone Apr 15, 2011

Dear Greg,

Many cults and abherant groups use the KJV simply to keep people in the dark

Please give me chapter and verse for this statement. Are these 'people in the dark' illiterate? Is there some shield that prevents God Almighty from opening their understanding?

I believe it is God Himself who blocks understanding because of lack of faith/sin through failure to accept Jesus as Saviour. Also, I feel it is a watered down Gospel being preached that is responsible, not the words on the page.

Awaiting the examples,
white stone

O

Oracio Apr 15, 2011

Amen Greg, well said.

Whitestone, I was referring to words like "hitherto", "witherto", etc. Such words will have many, especially new believers, waste time looking into dictionaries when they can avoid that by reading modern English words.

sermonindex Apr 15, 2011

Many cults and abherant groups use the KJV simply to keep people in the dark
Please give me chapter and verse for this statement.

????????????????????

It wasn't like a statement of doctrinal faith. It was just an observation he made (one that rings true I must agree). That's all.

sermonindex Apr 15, 2011

It is just simply not fruitful to read a translation in our day that is very hard to understand for the normal reader. Many cults and abherant groups use the KJV simply to keep people in the dark, including:

You are telling me that even though it has been fruitful for my children and my wife, I am really deceived? I sure would like to know where you get that data, concerning "cults and abherant groups using the KJV to keep people in the dark".

Do you know that there are many men and women of God using the KJV Bible to bring people into the LIGHT?

This is one of the severest examples of marginalizing KJV readers that I think I have ever witnessed.

I am not condemning anyone that is using the KJV, it is a great translation but I feel for many people especially younger who want to reach this generation for Christ the ESV is a great way to go.

Now, I am really confused!

A777

T

That-guy0010 Apr 15, 2011

From my experience, the KJV, for me, is easier for me to understand than a translation that uses today's version of English, but for those who can't understand, or find it difficult to read the KJV, I encourage you to read a translation that makes sense to you. This is just my line of thinking.

sermonindex Apr 15, 2011

Edited because I didn't realise I'd deleted the beginning of my post during a correction. end edit.

The ESV does indeed read well, but I think I gain more from a forensic examination of the language in the KJV, than from a modern version where meanings have been narrowed down too far, over-simplified or graded for a new believer.

Gal 1:16 is a (good) test verse for ALL translations, and it should be clear why, to anyone who has been apprehended by Paul's gospel, who therefore understands that Christ dwells IN us, revealing Himself THROUGH us to the world. If Christ remained always outside us, then 'to' would be appropriate.

RSV Galatians 1:16 was pleased to reveal his Son to me, in order that I might preach him among the Gentiles, I did not confer with flesh and blood,

ASV Galatians 1:16 to reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the Gentiles; straightway I conferred not with flesh and blood:

Greg said

We have much more clear a picture of the whole of the bible now with manuscripts and see all the manuscripts that 98% all agree.

With respect due to you Greg, while it is true we have more manuscripts, where sound doctrine is significantly altered by the fraction of those 2% differences which matter, they make all the 'difference' to a Church against which hell will not prevail, and a church which falls far short of Christ's intentions for her.

I was shocked to find 'doctrine' mentioned forty eight (48) times in the New Testament (KJV). Paul shed his blood many times for doctrine. Doctrine REALLY MATTERS.

O

Oracio Apr 15, 2011

The sad thing with this discussion is that the ones causing division are the KJV only advocates. The rest of us are not calling you a heretic for using the KJV. If you want to use it fine, but dont condemn others for preferring another translation. Can't you respectfully agree to disagree.

sigh

W

White_Stone Apr 15, 2011

Can't you respectfully agree to disagree.

Should I agree to seeing other believer's led down a dangerous path? NO! It is my duty to warn them of the danger?

If it is the KJV readers who are the division why is it they were here first? (I am not discounting there were other translations before and around the 1611 printing, just that the KJV is the Bible of the common man.) I believe the authors of these newer translations brought on the divisions when they changed God's word.

white stone

sermonindex Apr 15, 2011

Can't you respectfully agree to disagree.

Disagreement is the essential ingredient of all tolerance. It's usually okay to express that. I haven't noticed any disrespect so far. Division is unavoidable.

O

Oracio Apr 15, 2011

Disagreement is the essential ingredient of all tolerance. It's usually okay to express that. I haven't noticed any disrespect so far. Division is unavoidable.

Alive-to-God, maybe I should clarify. If you prefer to use the KJV and do not see it necessary to divide over it, I apologize for my blanket statement. That said, there are some who feel so strongly about it that they disrespect others by stating they have an incomplete or demonized version of the Bible. How can we fellowship if you are going to say that the version of Scripture I use is influenced by satan? Aren't statements like that a cause for division?

sermonindex Apr 15, 2011

Oracio,

Come on man. Many hold beliefs that are influenced by Satan and we still fellowship. For the record, I fellowship with people that use Modern Bible Versions.

Oracio,

Do you think Satan who counterfeits everything from God, the Holy Spirit and Jesus, would attempt to counterfeit God's WORD. Simple question. Yes or No?

A777

sermonindex Apr 15, 2011

Greg, you wrote:

I am not condemning anyone that is using the KJV, it is a great translation but I feel for many people especially younger who want to reach this generation for Christ the ESV is a great way to go.

i read the ESV as my main Bible. my mentor, pastor T, was using the NIV, when i first apprehended Messiah, so i bought a copy of the NIV Study Bible, (as well as a KJV, NKJV, NASB, etc) then he started using an ESV.

in no way, did he "force" anyone to make the switch, i did, because i trust his discernment, and my trust was not in vain.

Much Fruit i've reaped from daily devotional Bible study.....and i dont know about you, but i do write in my Bible....notes, revelations, etc....so its a bit beat up.

W

Wordizlife Apr 15, 2011

I myself started with the NIV @ age 17. I believed in Jesus @ 19 and began devouring the bible in the NIV format and proceeded to memorize certain passages.

Eventually I tried to read a KJV format around the same time (age 19) and i'll just say it was not the same as reading the NIV. I had to look up certain words and get used to the way sentences we're arranged in the older style. Also the KJV I was using didnt have passage titles so it was harder to pick up in the middle of a gospel passage if I wanted to.

Now in days I can read a KJV like any other translation but it took me a bit to get used to.

Zac Poonen reads from "the message" translation, which my friend told me it's the bible in "slang" format, which made me laugh. I been looking into that translation for when I want to quickly go through a passage or something.

O

Oracio Apr 15, 2011

Come on man. Many hold beliefs that are influenced by Satan and we still fellowship. For the record, I fellowship with people that use Modern Bible Versions.

777, good to hear you are not one who feels so strongly about it so as to break fellowship. But by the tone of some of who have posted recently on this issue, including you, it seemed as if you feel that strongly about it.

Do you think Satan who counterfeits everything from God, the Holy Spirit and Jesus, would attempt to counterfeit God's WORD. Simple question. Yes or No?

Of course he would try. The same would apply to the KJV. The question to me is, what is the evidence for or against each version and the manuscripts they are based on?. We can respectfully agree to disagree with some of our understandings on the matter without being so condescending toward each other.