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To Robbie McGee/ The Coming Persecution

sermonindex Dec 6, 2004

Dear brother Robbie, This is in answer to what you posted in the "Philly 11" thread; I just brought it over here, coz I'm trying to be sensitive to what I presume the wishes of our brother Greg are, keeper of this cyber-temple, and that is to keep the threads in their appropriate places.I believe and am of the conviction that the coming presecution will not come from a militant pagancy, but from the "church" itself. Yes true the pagan's want to stifle Gospel condemnation of their sins, and they can pull this stuff about throwing sin denuciation into the "hate speech" bucket, but so what? Let them, then just speak out and let them TRY and charge you, and you can counterstrike with a 1st amendment defense. In the end, they really are toothless sinners whose only desire is to remain in darkened corners slinking in their sin, undisturbed.But really ,since when in recent times has the pulpit been a place where sin and repentance has been wholistically preached to the whole community in no uncertain terms?when?everybodys so intent on being "seeker sensitive", sometimes it feels like "seeker driven". Got those with "CEO think" in a preacher's frock fearfully bound with a desire to count heads, and woe if you offend or anger anybody.If we preach against sin, where does it stop?Does it stop at those within the body of believers who we know hew to a certain world view? Do you feel where I'm going with this?From the events of recent days in the fabric of this nation, I feel the seedbed of a "national" church being crafted, and if you do not nod your head in agreement to this beast, you will be persecuted.We are to live within the Boundaries of the Kingdom as outlined by the Sermon on the Mount. Thats a very tight balancing act. I'm kind of dancing with words, not really saying all that I feel, think or discern. But I can say that the coming persecution will come from what calls itself the "church", But it won't be the Church of Jesus Christ anymore.In Christ Jesus, Neil

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RobbieMcGee Dec 24, 2004

Hi brother Neil, I dont know where I was the day you posted this but I totally missed it. I was just looking through forum archives looking for something for someone else and happened across it. Anyways I find that we do agree on the idea of the coming persecutions. I believe and am of the conviction that the coming presecution will not come from a militant pagancy, but from the "church" itself.I agree that not only will it be groups already openly against Christianity but from the church even, because of reasons you'll see below and reasons that I am currently in right now.But really ,since when in recent times has the pulpit been a place where sin and repentance has been wholistically preached to the whole community in no uncertain terms?This is true, the vast majority of the masses are conforming to a new "Christianity". Its a theology of self and flesh. One that focuses more on prosperity and gain then it does trusting God to meet your needs and staying focused on the main calling to seek and save that which is lost. Its like I posted in a message somewhere it might have been one of our previous talks, I cant find the thread. Anyhow, I got a message a while back from someone that was supossed to be a inspirational message but was bothersome. He was going on a aproach that God was about to bless the church so much and raise them so high in wealth and status that this new "beautification" of the church is what will draw the masses to the kingdom and bring revival. When I responded and challenged the scriptural truth of this he became offended and ended our communication with one another. I have had multiple situations like this where Ive challenged teachings that seemed to be outright false and heretical and people have come against me comparing me to Miriam (Moses' sister) when she spoke against leadership and was struck with leprosy. I have been told this a few times because of a new doctrine with prosperity teaching that says you MUST not come against or challenge your leaders/pastors under any circumstances, even if they're wrong, because it generates division and undermines their leadership. Jesus himself didnt hesitate to criticise the religious leaders when they lost the plot even to the point of calling them names "'brood of vipers, serpents and hypocrites!" I have challenged the methods of a particular man who is a "deliverance" minister that casts out demons from people and along with it he pulls up these "little children personalities" that broke off in the person from a traumatic experience in life and leads the little child to Jesus and then "rejoins" them with the older person of now in order to make them whole, this being called "Inner Healing". I questioned and challenged the biblical basis and the fact that he could not present any scriptural basis for it and I was told I have demons for questioning him and he wanted to take me through his "delieverance"(seeing as how he calls himself the 'deliverer' of everyone that he takes through deliverance) so that I can be free from those spirits that were coming against his ministry. Anyhow it turned out that I was excummunicated from friends I was close to because they went through this "deliverance" and I would not open myself to this. I see it as nothing more than regressive hypnosis and being that I question if power of suggestion is not having a play in the reason of why all the people who goes through a meeting with him come out oweing alligance to him. If youve ever heard of Bob Larson then you will understand cause this guy is an avid student of Bob Larson and his "ministry" reports to Larson. However people who go through with Bob Larson dont come out calling him their deliverer and showing allegance like this guy has happen. I definitely see where persecution is going to be and is already coming from the church. I recently had a chance at receiving my Ministry Ordination but it was intercepted because the guy with this "delieverance" is good friends with people on the board that was to review my application because he has taken some of them through this inner healing delieverance. I cant say that I have come up against any physical persecutions but I have had my share some things in which I have not listed that would take a lot more time to explain plus it would get off the topic.

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dohzman Dec 25, 2004

You're dealing with a spirit in this man. A strong man , if you will. I was apart of a intercity church that was experiencing a real text book type revival in its beginings. The entire city was seeing its effects and there was some talk about the work going on. At the time I was a street evangelist and assistant pastor, there along with several other pastors.The senior pastor was a very intellectual person but didn't basically agree with the giftings of the Holy Spirit deliverence or demons ect.. Myself and the rest of the staff did ,how ever inorder to keep peace we all kept our doctrine very basic,along the lines to what D.L. Moody set forth in his doctrinal statements(Westminister Cats. being a part). A nun came and laid hands on him saying God had sent her.She prophesied over him (which was odd since it went against what he believed) and then the events of that ministry took some strange twists. First he removed all his staff. Then came the colar. Then Maryology. Needless to say the move of God's Spirit stopped. This man started teaching Catholic doctrine and has since stopped that ministry altogether and is now pursueing being a married catholic priest. He lost his following mostly when he wanted to re-baptise everyone in the name of the pope and make catholic converts. That nun went around to pray for thoughs who would let them.Most of us just left and started over again. I've always believed that there was a spirit in operation there that layed claim to though who submitted to it and like your friends , lead them. Hold your ground Brother and stay true to the Written Word of God and the God of the Written Word. "The spiritual man judges all things 1 Cor2:15

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