REVIVAL: It REQUIRES OBEDIENCE by A W Tozer

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.
Farewell, my blessing season this in thee!

Hamlet Act 1, scene 3, 78–82

I am a sinner.

I've always had a problem with the word 'obedience', and even more so when used by my fellow Christians. If we were truly an obedient people, then Jesus died needlessly. For we would have kept the Mosaic Laws through our obedience to God.

God is not a cheerleader cheering for us to obey, obey, obey, and hoping some of us will do so that they may be saved.

Rather, God is a miracle worker who transforms our very nature to do the good through the redemptive work of His only begotten Son Jesus, that we will naturally do the good He created us to do, despite our current weaknesses and failures. Unlike us, God does not fail, and He will not fail us.

But some may object, now that we are Christians, we have the ability to be obedient, all we have to do is be willing to be obedient. I reject this absurdity. The only human I am aware of that was truly obedient to God for His entire Life is His only begotten Son, Jesus. All others - including all Christians, sin, and we do so regularly. I'm not saying we practice sin, though some do in their backsliding, nevertheless we all sin continuously.

Scripture confirms this truth:

1 Jn 1:5-10
A This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth; 7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin. 8 IF WE SAY THAT WE HAVE NO SIN, WE ARE DECEIVING OURSELVES AND THE TRUTH IS NOT IN US. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us. NASU

In my understanding of Scripture, sins are acts of disobedience. As Christians, we do not practice sin, nevertheless, we will sin continuously during our lifetime. But we will also be in fellowship with God daily, (read versus 1 John 1:1-4) and as we confess our known sins to God regularly, God is faithful to forgive our sins, and He will also be the ONE who cleanses us from all our sins. God is daily performing this work in us as we fellowship daily with Him and with each other. Know that God will accomplish all that He sets out to do. If God is for you, who is against you.

Thus we are saved by the Faith of Jesus Christ and His Laws of the New Covenant that transforms our very nature into a Godly loving people who will naturally do the good we were created by God to do. By these new Laws of the New Covenant we have in God through Jesus finished work on the cross, we are transformed into His likeness. That we may do the good that He created us to do. And all this is truly a gift from God to each of us, that none may boast. By the Laws of Jesus Christ of the New Covenant, God keeps us.

A.W. Tozer Speaks of God's Mercy and many other topics in his book 'The knowledge of the Holy.'

J.I. Packer covers this in his Lengthy book, 'Knowing God'. But I recommend the NT. Ultimately, I stand by the actual revelations of the New Testament, which are also predicted by the OT.

"It is almost unbelievable how far we will go to avoid obeying God. We call Jesus "Lord" and beg Him to rejuvenate our souls, but we are careful to do not the things He says."

True. But we can do even better than that, we can prove by doctrine that it is more spiritual to disobey Him than to do the things He says.

Or so we thought. Just on time He warned us of being a victim of our drive for superior absurdity that results from a dry intellectualisation:

Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein. Luke 18:17

Can a child trust Jesus that whatever He says it's the truth and nothing but the truth? Oh, absolutely. Our faith knows no second thoughts or limitations of time or space.

It is sadly true that: And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. Matt 24:12

but let's not be discouraged, let's mourn but also remember:

And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight. 1 John 3:22

Nice post A-Servant!

As I was reading the responses to this post of A W Tozer, I was reminded of the testimony of Brother Boris Sorokovsky in "A Call to the American Churches" (which is available in the forums here) and another sermon entitled "What is Prophesy?" He tells how through waiting on the Lord in prayer and fasting, and promptly obeying the revelation given, God created a revival through the obedience of His saints in pre-Communist Russia. This also involved the simple, childlike obedience to the Word through the observance of communion, baptism, simple dress, head covering of the women, the men lifting up holy hands unto the Lord and the holy kiss. I know that I find it difficult to do some of these things, even ones that do not involve others such as lifting up my hands and eyes to the Lord while in prayer. Others do it in worship but not in prayer. When I look at things like this, it becomes evident that to observe them, requires an utterness toward God and sincere love for the Brethren in Christ.

Here is the link to the second sermon, "What is Prophesy?" by B. Sorokovsky: http://www.vejvoda.com/WhatIsProphecy.html

Here's some more from Tozer on obedience...

The truth is that faith and obedience are two sides of the same coin and are always found together in the Scriptures. As well try to pry apart the two sides of a half-dollar as to separate obedience from faith. The two sides, while they remain together and are taken as one, represent good sound currency and constitute legal tender everywhere in the United States. Separate them and they are valueless. Insistence upon honoring but one side of the faith-obedience coin has wrought frightful harm in religious circles. Faith has been made everything and obedience nothing. The result among religious persons is moral weakness, spiritual blindness and a slow but constant drift away from New Testament Christianity.

Our Lord made it very plain that spiritual truth cannot be understood until the heart has made a full committal to it. If anyone chooses to do God's will, he will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own? (John 7:17). The willing and the doing (or at least the willingness to do) come before the knowing. Truth is a strict master and demands obedience before it will unveil its riches to the seeking soul.

For those who want chapter and verse here are a few, and there are plenty more: Matthew 7:21; John 14:21; First John 2:4, 3:24, 5:2; First Peter 1:2; James 2:14-26; Romans 1:5; and Acts 5:32.

To sum it up, saving faith is impossible without willing obedience. To try to have one without the other is to be not a Christian, but a student of Christianity merely.

InTheLight on 2011/9/29 16:50:08

"The truth is that faith and obedience are two sides of the same coin and are always found together in the Scriptures. As well try to pry apart the two sides of a half-dollar as to separate obedience from faith. The two sides, while they remain together and are taken as one, represent good sound currency and constitute legal tender everywhere in the United States. Separate them and they are valueless."

Great, nice sentiment, IntheLight.

I have a question or two for you. How long has it been since you have you completely stopped sinning?

And here is my second question:

Is each sin you commit an act of disobedience?

I sin too. It is not my goal to sin, I wish I were 100% obedient to God by not sinning, but I am so imperfect that I sin regularly. I confess my sins that I know about (sometimes I do not even realize that I hurt someone through sin, but ignorance is no excuse). I confess my sins to God regularly and He always forgive me, and I seek to make amends with whomever I sinned against, including God, as best as I can.

In my understanding, sins by definition are acts of disobedience in God's eyes. My faith is not that I will myself perfect. My faith is that I believe God, accepted Jesus as my savior, and that through His death on the cross, and by His blood, He has already paid the price of my sins. And I believe what the Apostle whom Jesus loved, wrote:

1 Jn 1:8-10
8 If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us. NASU

"For those who want chapter and verse here are a few, and there are plenty more: Matthew 7:21; John 14:21; First John 2:4, 3:24, 5:2; First Peter 1:2; James 2:14-26; Romans 1:5; and Acts 5:32."

Let's look at these verses you posted.

Matthew 7:21

21 " Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven. NASU

And I have done the will of Father who is in Heaven. I accepted the blood sacrifice of His Son Jesus on the cross, bearing the penalty my sins, and His blood washes all my sins, one sacrifice of the perfect Paschal Lamb, that takes away all my sins, past, present. and future. This is my faith, I believed God for this very precious gift that I receive through the finished work of Jesus, His Son. I listened to Jesus and I believe Him.

1 Jn 2:3-11
3 By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 The one who says, " I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; 5 but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: 6 the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.

7 Beloved, I am not writing a new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning; the old commandment is the word which you have heard. 8 On the other hand, I am writing a new commandment to you, which is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away and the true Light is already shining. 9 The one who says he is in the Light and yet hates his brother is in the darkness until now. 10 The one who loves his brother abides in the Light and there is no cause for stumbling in him. 11 But the one who hates his brother is in the darkness and walks in the darkness, and does not know where he is going because the darkness has blinded his eyes. NASU

And I do keep the New Covenant commandments of Jesus.

I. The Royal Law of Love.

II. The Law of Liberty.

III. The Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus.

And through these Laws, God keeps me.

And these cover your other verses in 1 John

1 Pe 1:1-2

"To those who reside as aliens, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, who are chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, by the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to obey Jesus Christ and be sprinkled with His blood: May grace and peace be yours in the fullest measure." NASU

I certainly am cooperating with the Holy Spirit WHOM transforms my very nature that I will be pleasing before God in accord with the 3rd Law of the New Covenant, and it is the blood of Jesus that takes away all my sins, which I have received by the faith of Jesus Christ.

Romans 1:5 "Obedience of Faith" I have described that above, i accepted what God has done for me through His Son, and the Indwelling Holy Spirit, and I seek to implement the changes God is making in me.

I think very well of Tozer, I certainly believe he is a true Christian, and I consider myself to be obedient to God per the New Covenant of Jesus Christ as described above, but I am not obedient to The Mosaic Covenant which God has annihilated because it was useless in that it could never perfect or save anyone, but condemns all who put themselves under it. Christ has set me free from the Law of sin and death, I will not wear that yoke of slavery ever again.

Yes, Jesus-is-God, I do not like to use the word 'obey', it makes it look like we are saving ourselves. I much prefer the word conform much more.

In the OT, we had to obey God's commands, the Mosaic Laws.

In the NT, it is God who transforms our very nature that we may conform to His nature, through the work of the Holy Spirit that dwells in us.

Per your request on the word obey in the NT, I will provide a good word study on the words that are being translated as obey.

It's late and I am going to bed.

It looks a bit as if you are re-negotiating Gods terms & laws, what once had a specified substance has now a new name with unspecified content. So as to not establish any personal commitment other than agreeing about the expression. Very much attorney like.

Now you are turning in circles trying to connect the pieces that can obviously not be taken at face value of any words' basic meaning, because of the pre-text of categorizing them in different covenants before regarding any of them as personally relevant. Mix that with a basic law and commandments phobia. I think it's not a definition issue, it's heart issue. You want conform to God's nature, but not His authority. Do I have to point out who else wants to be like God but hates His laws?

Let's ask a practial question Art: What is the least of Jesus' commandments ? Ist it part of your list? And why is that a kingdom relevant issue, and for whom? My take on "for whom" is : "Whosoever" - that's why it's relevant:

Matthew 5:19  Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Trust and Obey... for there's no other way!

I have been considering of late that true 'biblical' FAITH is simply defined as..'to Trust and Obey'. Not obedience to a list of written laws, but obedience to the Lordship of Christ.
Faith is always evidenced by works, which is in essence trusting what God says and obeying it. Isn't this what James teaches and also the testimony of those in Hebrews 11. Oh and what about what Jesus said: "Not every one who says Lord, Lord shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he that DOETH the will of my Father..." Are you a DOER? If not he will say "depart from me you who practice iniquity" (Matthew 7:21-23). Do we fail? Yes. Do we always obey? No, but should we obey? Obsolutely!

Trust and Obey, for there's no other way!

hupakouo - to hear under (as a subordinate), this is, to listen attentively; by implication to heed or conform to a command or authority: - hearken, be obedient to, obey.

This word is akin to our obedience toward a police man. He is to be obeyed within limits fixed by law.

hupotasso - to subordinate; reflexively to obey: - be under obedience (obedient), put under, subdue unto, (be, make) subject (to, unto) be (put) into subjection (to, under), submit self unto.

This word is akin to the obedience of a slave to his master, he owns you, you do what he tells you to do, no questions asked.

pi-tharkh-eh'-o: you defined it well, to be persuaded by a ruler, to conform to advice, particularly by one who is a master of that advice.

To replace any of the above definitions, simply with the word 'obey', does their meanings an injustice. And there are other greek words that get translated 'obey'.

So Paul writes these lists

We have the King James Bible to blame for this, but at that time they did the best they can do with the limited resources they had at that time period. Today we have a wealth early manuscripts and excellent Biblical scholars.

What is planet of Earth made of? Matter.
What are stars made of? Matter
What is light made of? Matter
What are the differences of types 1, 2, 3, 4, & 5 stars? Matter

These answers are all true, But the answers are worthless in understanding these phenomena. Their definitions must go beyond the word 'matter' if we want to have any true understanding of them.

The same goes for the KJV. Using the word 'obey' for words with differing shades of meaning loses what scripture is actually revealing.

Next, you convey long lists of do not 'behaviors' from the Apostle Paul from Colossians, 1 Corinthians, Galatians, Thessalonians,

I can only reason that you wrote these lists cause they help you to somehow obey them, that is, to not do them. Your check list of sins to be avoided, as you work to become completely obedient.

It must be good to be a rock or an Island, they never commit any of those things.

As for me, none of those things thrill me either. In fact, they are completely boring, vain distractions in a mad world. I do not need to obey, I have no desire for them, they are repulsive.

If I wanted something, it would be a good friend, with a heart to heart relationship, two kindred spirits. Companions who care for each other and enjoy each others company. Where is the Law against that? I'd like to know. I would love to break it.

Art,

It doesn't make sense to raise up the 'sinless perfection' straw man here. Neither of Tozer's articles argue for that nor do they promote the Law of Moses so can we just leave that straw man down.

What he is arguing is that there is no true faith that does not promote obedience. The New Testament declares this is many places, for example see Romans 15:18; Romans 16:19; 2Corinthians 7:15; and James 2.

To quote Matthew Henry, "The act of faith is the obedience of the understanding to God revealing, and the product of that is the obedience of the will to God commanding." (see the entry on Romans 1:5 in Matthew Henry’s Commentary on the Whole Bible.

In Christ,

Ron

InTheLight,

What is the 'Sinless perfection' strawman?

I never claimed to be sinless. In fact, i stated that I am sinner. As such, would I not still be disobedient since I continue to sin. And If 1 John 8-10 is true. then everyone on this forum sins just as I am, ongoing sinners, and presumably disobedient too. I've always been honest with God, So why would I go around claiming I am obedient to God, I would feel like I am lying.

Is anyone here claiming that one can still commit sins and also be called obedient to God.

And can anyone here explain how a Greek word that plainly means 'attentive listening' is translated to be 'obedient'? God has my ear, but I am not sinless.

As far as I can see, the only way I may be counted as obedient to God, is by my accepting Jesus blood shed on the cross has washed away all my sins, past - present- future, for all time. By accepting this 'gift' from God, God sees me as obedient through His Son's innocent blood shed obediently on the cross, and because I by faith I believe this.

If you all are willing to accept this explanation, only then could it be that I have been obedient to God because I believed Him. And I do believe Him, His words and His WORD.

What do you say? Anyone?

Brother,

It is important for me personally to be obedient to the commands of Jesus because he says to me "For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments. And his commandments are not burdensome"(1 John 5:3).

So I pray for the opportunity to obey his commandments and he fills me with his Spirit so that I can love others as Christ loved me and "by this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and obey his commandments" (1 John 5:2).

What a privilege to obey the Lord of Lords and the
King of Kings!!!!

"This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you.Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends. You are my friends if you do what I command you (John 15:12-14).

Jesus is my best friend and I just want to do
what he tells me to do.

Love,

Travis

Nice post Travis:

Have you stopped sinning completely?

I am not being Facetious. I have not stopped sinning, not that I am proud of it, it simply is true. I believe your post to be very good, you hit the nail on the head.

I know you love God and I believe just about everyone who posts here also loves God and seek to please Him.

There are Three Laws of Christ in the NT.

Jas 2:8-9

I. THE ROYAL LAW OF LOVE

8 If, however, you are fulfilling the royal law according to the Scripture, "YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF," you are doing well.

Jesus stated it partially in His Sermon on the Mount:

Mt 5:43-45
YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR and hate your enemy.' 44 "But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.

Jesus states it in full as His earthly ministry is nearing His crucifixion:

Mt 22:34-40

34 But when the Pharisees heard that Jesus had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered themselves together. 35 One of them, a lawyer, asked Him a question, testing Him,

36 "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?"

37 And He said to him, " 'YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.' 38 "This is the great and foremost commandment. 39 "The second is like it, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.' 40 " On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."

The 2nd Law is called the perfect Law,

II. THE LAW OF LIBERTY:

Jas 1:25
But one who looks intently at the perfect law, the Law of Liberty, and abides by it, not having become a forgetful hearer but an effectual doer, this man will be blessed in what he does.

Here are the axioms of the Law of Liberty:

Mt 5:7 "Blessed are the merciful, for they shall receive mercy.

Jas 2:11-13
Now if you do not commit adultery, but do commit murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. So speak and so act as those who are to be judged by the law of liberty. For judgment will be merciless to one who has shown no mercy; MERCY TRIUMPHS OVER JUDGEMENT.

If you want God to forgive your sins, and yes - we all sin, be kind and forgive others of their sins, and God will mercifully forgive you of your sins.

Jesus says this too:

Lk 6:37-38

37 " Do not judge, and you will not be judged; and do not condemn, and you will not be condemned; pardon, and you will be pardoned. Give, and it will be given to you. They will pour into your lap a good measure — pressed down, shaken together, and running over. For by your standard of measure it will be measured to you in return."
NASU

III. THE LAW OF THE SPIRIT OF LIFE IN CHRIST JESUS.

ROMANS 1 THROUGH 7 IS ONE LONG ARGUMENT LEADING UP TO CHAPTER 8. THE SPIRIT OF LIFE IS THE INDWELLING HOLY SPIRIT WHO IS OUR HELPER, THROUGH WHOM GOD TRANSFORMS OUR VERY NATURE SO THAT WE MAY DO THE GOOD THAT GOD CREATED US TO DO.

Ro 8:1-8
Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh, so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

THE DESCRIPTION OF THIS 3RD LAW GOES ON THROUGH CHAPTER 8.

The amazing thing about these three laws is they do not burden us, but rather, they are fun and most profitable to keep. By them, God keeps us. These are the Laws of Jesus Christ and the New Covenant.

I. The Royal Law of Love.

II. The Law of Liberty.

III. The Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus.

Embracing these LAWS is my obedience. And they are not burdensome in any way. But pure joy to keep.

Brother,

I don't really know if I've stopped sinning completely. Or if I will sin tommorrow. Or ever again. I only know about today. I was really upset when the books fell out of my backpack today. I don't believe I handled the situation in my heart perfectly. So I told God I was sorry and repented, I have faith that he will graciously provide his Spirit so that my heart will remain repentant and I will not sin like that again.

God Bless,

Travis