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Theology

Speaking in tongues

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neemia Oct 18, 2011

Do you still believe in the speaking in tongues?

How do you see this?

sermonindex Oct 18, 2011

I do, I do not see anything in scripture to suggest it ceased with the apostles. However, the writings of the church leaders in the 2md & 3rd centuries do suggest there was a dramatic decrease in tongues.

Now, I believe most of what we see in the church especially in America and other western countries in regards to tongues is foolishness. But I believe there is a legitimate gift of tongues. I do not believe in a "heavenly prayer language" because that is not found in scripture.

Tongues are not given to every believer, and tongues are not the initial sign of being "baptised by the Holy Spirit". Paul, when arguing that there are different gifts for different purposes, all given by the Holy Spirit according to His purposes… he says “Do all speak in tongues?”, and contextually the answer is obviously “No.”

Those Christians who claim to speak in tongues are not more spiritual or mature or special than those who do not. I’ve known of some very hideous people who “speak in tongues” (Benny Hinn and Todd Bentley), and I’ve known of some saintly people who never have. (Billy Graham has never spoken in tongues, neither did Charles Spurgeon)

Some are going to want to argue with me on these points. Don’t waste your time, I know all the arguments back and forth… this is where I landed on this topic, and there is grace enough for other thoughts on it. I could be completely wrong about this, and so could you.

So there ya go.

Krispy

M
mguldner Oct 18, 2011

Speaking in tongues is an active gift of the Holy Spirit. I believe it is not a Sign of Holy Spirit baptism as many Pentecostal claim but it is a gift given to some. The signs of the Holy Spirit should be the Fruits of the Spirit.

I take a fairly strong stance on this because growing up as a Pentecostal I fell victim to the social pressure of "Speaking in tongues" and so gave simply spoke jibberish to be accepted. This still goes on today and people fail to look at the inner man. Now I don't ask, do I speak in tongues of men and angels? but Do I speak with a controled tongue of faith, hope and love. This is not to say that everyone that speaks is tongues is doing it out of social obligation or falsity because I have meet many who spoke in tongues and their life was full of the fruits of the Spirit. Likewise I have met many who didn't speak in tongues yet still showed the same fruits of the Spirit without the speaking in tongues experience.

Should the Lord bless me with the gift I would take it gratefully but the Lord has blessed me with other things which He has me use for His Glory.

sermonindex Oct 18, 2011

Amen, bro... good word.

Krispy

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mguldner Oct 18, 2011

Amen to you too bro,

When I came to this conclusion I came under fire for saying such craziness that was "unbiblical." I was really uncertain if I was right or wrong but the more I studied the Word the more I couldn't deny this belief. Brother Zac Poonen was somebody I really enjoyed listening to on the subject because I finally found someone who was greatly experienced in the scripture that taught the same thing. For a while it was like I was the one on crazy pills and everyone else was normal, but God also taught me in that time He is not always in the "normal way of things" that society and tradition push on us.

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Enochh Oct 18, 2011

mgulder......being on crazy pills aint always a bad thing...:)

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neemia Oct 18, 2011

Yes. A person who is filled with God's spirit will have the fruits of the Holy Spirit.

In the Eastern countries, I had seen the speaking in tongues more than in the western side. Most of those people are Godly people.

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Lysa Oct 18, 2011


I believe in all the gifts of the Spirit in operation in the church today! I use this gift when I pray and when I lay hands on and pray for other people.

Allowing the gift of tongues to operate in my life is like breathing air, it comes naturally! And I praise God for every bit it. To God all the glory!!

*How do I see it?*

God gave the gift of the Holy Spirit (Holy Ghost) to the church before they could make a theology of it; and today man gets so caught up in the theology of it all that they won't accept the gifts that God has given them.

God bless,
Lisa

S
Sree Oct 18, 2011

Speaking in tongues is a gift of Holy Spirit. It is true but it has to be used in public only if there is an interpreter. Else use it in your private prayers. You get gifts when you purchase something worthy from a shop. The same way the holyspirit gives you gifts when you receive it. The gift is not the main thing but what you purchased is the main thing. So the filling of spirit which should be reflected in a godly life is more important than the free gift that you get with it. Also the presence of a gift does not mean a person is still filled. God does not take back his gifts just like how we do not take the gifts that we give to others. A true man of women of God will never advertise their gifts if they did they either lost their anointing or they have fake gift.
So simply saying that I pray in tongues in front of others by laying hands is not tongues at all.
Gifts are given to people who are parts of a body of Christ. If you are not a part of a body and you have an unsubmitting spirit then I wont believe that you speak in tongues.

M
mikey2 Oct 18, 2011

The Baptism in the Holy Spirit is the doorway to the "deeper life." It is the beginning not the "END."

People camp out there and never move on, but it is given so that you will be Jesus' disciples with bold conviction and real love for others.

Don't waste it.

Mike

sermonindex Oct 18, 2011

Yes. A person who is filled with God's spirit will have the fruits of the Holy Spirit.

Umm... there is a difference between the "fruits of the Spirit" and "spiritual gifts".

God gave the gift of the Holy Spirit (Holy Ghost) to the church before they could make a theology of it; and today man gets so caught up in the theology of it all that they won't accept the gifts that God has given them.

I believe it was the Apostle Paul who delivered the theology of it... just sayin'...

You make it sound like anyone who loves and studies theology is incapable of exercising spiritual gifts or is against them, and that simply is not the case. Thats a mischaracterization.

It's not theology that quenches the Spirit. If that were true then Paul was a Spirit quencher.

People confuse theology with legalism.

The reason why the "church" is in the shape it's in is NOT because of too much theology, but because of a lack of theology and sound doctrine.

Krispy

Krispy

T
twayneb Oct 18, 2011

Given the topic of the thread I thought I would include an account of a recent event. The 14 year old daughter of a friend of mine recently went on a missions trip to the Dominican Republic. She had previously received the baptism of the Holy Spirit. She is somewhat shy about social interactions where she does not know the people she is talking to as most 14 year old girls seem to be. She was on the street with her group when they encountered a man in need of healing in his back. Many bilingual teens were following them hoping to be paid to interpret so she asked one of them to interpret and, against her own human nature, laid hands on the man to pray for him. She said she had not prayed a sentence or two when she felt the anointing of the Holy Spirit and began to pray in tongues. When she finished she opened her eyes and saw the man and the interpreter staring at her wide eyed. She asked what was the matter. The interpreter told her, "You just prayed for this man's back to be healed in perfect, fluent Spanish and we both understood every word you said." She had no clue what she said and knows almost no Spanish at all.
Praise God for the gifts of the Spirit.

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neemia Oct 18, 2011

Great example. Same thing happened to my grandfather. After a prayer, someone approached him and told him, "You prayed so beautiful in the German language." He had no idea he prayed in German.

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neemia Oct 18, 2011

@KrispyKrittr

I know. I didn't say they are the same :)

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dietolive Oct 18, 2011

I would agree dear Brother

The same Spirit that inspired Paul's theology inspires the Spiritual Gifts too. They are always in complete agreement, (Theology and Spiritual Gifts), because the Author of both is the one and the same Spirit.

Consider the apostle:

I recall that Paul was a brilliant intellect; from a rich and cosmopolitan city. His father must have been wealthy, and he was evidently brought up well-to-do, as is evident from his being "born" with the privileged status of "Roman Citizenship."

Furthermore, with is family's connections, he must have received the best education available, both from the Greeks and from the Jews.

And then, when Jesus got a hold of him, he had to give up all of his attainments and every bit of his prestige. But one thing he did keep was his mind, and God would use every bit of it in Paul's later ministry.

The same apostle who was mighty in word, who was mighty in theology, was mighty also in the Gifts. And he taught us that the gifts are given to all believers, individually, as the Holy Spirit chooses:

**********************************

"But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;

To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;

To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:

But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will." I Corinthians 12:12-13

**********************************

From I Corinthians 12:12-13, we see that all true believers have already been baptized by the Spirit, and yet the Scripture above prove that all do not speak with tongues:

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"For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.

For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit." I Corinthians 12:7-11

**********************************

The apostle tells us all to first desire the "more excellent way", which is "LOVE", or as it is elsewhere called: "the Fruits of the Spirit", (for we are promised every one of them), and rather submissively wait upon the Lord, and accept whatever Gift He may decide to give us, trusting in His infinite and benign wisdom to give what is best suited for each of us.

Be well,
Doug

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rufnrust Oct 18, 2011

Amen Lisa

Ruf

sermonindex Oct 18, 2011

I beg to differ. The letter kills, the Spirit gives life. The church abandoned the Holy Spirit when they turned to men called the 'church fathers' for their life. The church became an organization, not the organism she was in Acts. The living, dynamic church became a dead institution of religion. Ecept for a few bright spots which were snuffed out the church was dead.

We see in other parts of the world a vibrant faith that burns bright for Christ. What we have in America is a dead church that theology has killed. What do you think cessation is? A desd theology to kill the Spirit. We got correct theology and doctrine coming out the wazoo. But ain't got no power.

Blaine

sermonindex Oct 18, 2011

Twayneb… excellent account. I have read of similar accounts from missionaries around the world. That is the gift of tongues that we see in Acts 2. We also see it elsewhere when they “spoke in tongues and prophesied”, which simply means that they declared the truth… the word. They were not standing there prophesying the future or something like that, that would not make any sense. No, they were declaring the truth about Jesus in an earthly language.

Krispy

sermonindex Oct 18, 2011

We see in other parts of the world a vibrant faith that burns bright for Christ. What we have in America is a dead church that theology has killed. What do you think cessation is? A desd theology to kill the Spirit. We got correct theology and doctrine coming out the wazoo. But ain't got no power.

Acutally... with Biblical illiteracy at an all time high, and Biblical ignorance at an all time high... how you can believe that the church is dead because of an over emphasis on theology is beyond my comprehension.

One of the gifts of the Spirit that Paul says is much more important than tongues is "teaching". And all of Pauls letters were theological thesis.

Granted and agreed, knowledge without love is dead. No argument there. But the church is dead because it's full of so-called "love"... but no truth!

With commands such as "study to show thyself approved" all over the NT I dont know how we can ignore it and say theology and sound doctrine is not important. Read 1&2 Timothy and Titus.

Read Romans...

Krispy

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dietolive Oct 18, 2011

Amen Brother Krispy. This is wisdom.

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