Street pastors/ healing on the streets- gospel less evangelis

Good admonition deltatom.

In England we have the street pastors and healing on the streets movement that go out on the street to help people without preaching the gospel to them, it breaks my heart as they are worried about there physical health but not there eternal souls.

What is wrong with what these people are doing, would to God that everyone was doing this.

Didn't Paul say, 2 Corinthians 3:2 Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men.

Matthew 5:16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

Acts 9:36 Now there was at Joppa a certain disciple named Tabitha, which by interpretation is called Dorcas: this woman was full of good works and almsdeeds which she did.

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

1 Timothy 6:18 That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate;

1 Peter 2:12 Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may by your good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.

Jesus would say, "Let them alone, if they be for us, they certainly are not against us".

Thank God that this group of people are doing this work. God Bless them, and I hope doors will open up from the community to give them food and clothing to help the needy.

FOR THIS IS THE GOSPEL.

Are these credible healings taking place? Seems like this would authenticate the gospel message. Mormons and other cult embers cannot duplicate the work of the Holy Spirit. They cannot call on miracles to authenticate their message.

Bearmaster.

@wijnand

Exactly.

Moslens are brought to Jesus Christ through dreams and visions. This is occurring in the 1040 window. In India people are brought to Christ after a healing miracle has taken place. Yes you can argue that false signs and wonders will take place in the end times. And because of that fear you relegate the gospel to nothing more than a polemic belief system. Nothing more than a belief system among many.

Jesus authenticate his ministry by miracles. The New Testament church authenticated the gospel by miracles. Paul wrote to the Corinthians that he did not come to them in eloquent speech but in the power of the Holy Spirit. And that was the miracle working power of the Holy Spirit

The fact is most of us on this forum are from a Western nationalistic mind set. Mainly in North America. We know nothing of the power of God . We certainly know nothing of the miracle working power of God. Our understanding of God is still rooted on reformation doctrine that has no power of the Holy Spirit.

When we speak of signs and wonders we cry false prophets. If you are going to decry every sign and wonder as false. Then you better call every report of Moslems coming to Christ through dreams and visions as false. Then you better call every report of healing out of the third world as false. But Jesus said wisdom is judged by its fruit. The fruit being people are coming to Christ.

Some are saying we need to get back to reformation doctrine. I disagree. We need to get back to Jesus and what he did in the first century. The third world church has the Spirit. We don't.

Posted by Bearmadter.

I don't think anyone is saying that miracles don't/aren't happening today. But they are saying that they are not, and should not be the litmus test of anyone's ministry.

Jesus said an adulterous generation seeks a sign. Signs were given as the Lord saw fit. Though we see many saying that they did signs and wonders in Jesus's name, yet never having salvation to begin with. etc. etc.

The test of orthodoxy is the purity of the Gospel message as it was delivered. God has, does, and will use miracles if He sees fit to use them, but they're not the standard we judge any ministry by. If one withholds the Gospel and instead presents only good works, it's no different than a doctor withholding treatment from a sick person well within their means to give life to, and instead buying them lunch and sending them on their way, thinking they've done them some sort of favor, because the person was also hungry.

The fruit is not people converting. Jesus never said to make converts. Jesus said make disciples. The fruit would be people being discipled into and persevering in the truths of Christ, as it does them no good to be "saved" into a lie. That is if they're getting saved at all.

"God has chosen to save men through the foolishness of preaching"

The root word for "preaching" means to open ones mouth and declare publicly.

Yes, signs and wonders shall follow apostolic ministry of them that believe. Our preaching should not only be in word, but in demonstration of the Spirits Power!

HOWEVER, if the Gospel isn't preached (that means the saving message of faith in Jesus Christ through what he did in bearing our sins on the cross), then where is the power in feeding people only? Red Cross does that (& the Red Crescent, by the way). And, if we only perform miraculous signs and wonders and no Gospel is preached, how will men be saved? That's a major set up for "lying signs and wonders" spoken of in scripture (The Todd Bentley, gold dust, angels wings, gold teeth, halo garbage).

I agree, our Gospel should be preached and when God ordains, demonstrated with power TO CONFIRM THE WORD PREACHED, but just feeding the poor and signs/wonders with no Gospel preached? The devil would love to gladly allow those imitations to occur, especially since "there is no other name under heaven by which men must be saved" & "God has ordained to save men through the folloshness of PREACHING (that means declaring the Gospel message of Christ on the cross paying the penalty of our sin, which we can believe and receive justification by faith). Take that away, and you've taken everything.

In love, are we reading our Bibles, or chasing around "wow" ministries?

I ask again are these authentic miracles taking place? Are people being healed in the name of Jesus Christ? If so then this would be the grace of God in England itself. Because England is in that same nationalistic mind set. The gospel is a polemic belief system that appeals to the intellect but has no power to back it.

I am reminded that Jesus told Phillip in John 14 believe on the evidence of the miracles them selves. This is what is taking place in the third world. Miracles are taking place in the name of Jesus. Because of the miracles people are brought to saving faith and life in Jesus.

Would that God deliver us from our theological arrogance. And we walk in humility before him doing signs and wonders in his name. And testifying of his love and sacrificial death and resurrection for the sinner.

Posted by Bearmaster.

The greatest miracle has and always will be the saving of a mans soul, the transformation and regeneration of a former sinner into a saint and a child of God. Signs and wonders will follow that. The declaration of the Gospel, of the Truth, has always been and will continue to be the front line of the battle. It does take courage to stand and tell a person that they have an eternal destiny with hell outside of Jesus. It takes as much courage to tell them just how much Jesus loves them despite the fact that they are so far from Him.

There is a balance in this and the balance comes from the Holy Spirit and abides in love. Yet in all of that there is a requirement of boldness and an unashamedness of the name of Jesus. If the name of Jesus is not being lifted up, no matter where in the world, then physical miracles are meaningless. Its the Gospel that is the power of God unto Salvation.

We see from history that Wesley and Whitfield and others were often physically attacked when proclaiming the truth of Jesus publicly. As one who travels home to Scotland every couple of years and knows what is going on locally in this movement and others, it is my opinion that it is powerless. I agree with Delta's assertions, and I do so with sadness. As for verifications of actual miracles from Britain, this verification process is always murky at best.

In the Scriptures we see blind eyes open, we see paralytics stand and walk, we see the dead raised to life. I personally have not heard of nor seen these kind of miracles either happen or authenticated in the West. I believe if they did happen, God would probably keep it hidden from general view because of the circus we may make of it. In the West we would bottle it and sell tickets to the show. We have all seen the circus shows like Benny Hinn and the claims that he and others had made about seeing the dead rise in places like India and so on, only to fall apart when these claims were closely looked at. There has been a deep fascination with signs and wonders for some time now, I personally believe that this is so we will fall foul to the anti-christ and lying signs and wonders when he comes. In these circles, all I hear is talk about signs and wonders. Yet there is no greater wonder than the love of God expressed through Jesus on Calvary and the victory we have because of Calvary. Lets see that march forward every time and whatever follows that we shall praise God for............bro Frank

Great word brother Frank.

Agreed that the saving of a man's soul is the greatest miracle that can take place. But is God using the miracle power of the Spirit to bring people to saving faith and life in Jesus Christ? Are we going to call that false? I posted earier Jesus told Phillip, believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves.

I state again God is bringing Moslems to Christ through dreams and visions. People are coming to Christ through healings. Yet we in our rationalistic western mindset say show me proof. The thing is our arrogance will prevent us from having the faith that God can do miracles. This is why the hucksters and the false prophets are coming forth. Because we are denying the power of the Holy Spirit. We have relegated miracle power to the demonic.

Jesus, the Messiah of Israel went into his home town. He was despised and hated by his own people. Be could not do many miracles in his home because of tbeir lack of faith. Is this not what we are doing to Jesus today? We are despising his power, even excoriating those who believe in miracles. And because of our lack of faith we are not seeing the miracles of God in the American church.

And we wonder why the power of God Is being displayed in the third world and not in the west.

Posted by Bearmaster.

@Bearmaster

Most respectfully, I'm not sure if you're seeing/understanding the position that's being presented. I don't think anyone is discounting or dismissing the miraculous. They're just not saying that it's any selling point.

The OP was talking about a specific movement in the UK where miracles were the focus, and not the preaching of the Gospel. Not all the other stuff.