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Did Christ teach moderation?

sermonindex Feb 23, 2005

I wonder...did Christ teach moderation? I would say no. We like to teach moderation because we don't want to let go of this world...we'll follow Christ but we won't get too carried away (heaven forbid - that might revive this world). Jesus said: "If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it."Jesus preached a radical message. Paul continued that message. He said "I am crucified with Christ" and he told us that when we become Christians we DIE and then Christ's love compels us in all we do(1 Cor. 5:14)! Wow! Do any of us really think that when we stand before the judgment seat that Christ will say: "you really should have watched more TV. You really should have enjoyed yourself more...you needn't have spent so many hours in prayer - you needn't have spent so much time sharing Christ with your neighbors..."?I've heard the message of moderation preached all my life - and i think we've got a good handle on it...we know all about moderation - it fits right in with our self pleasing nature. But where are the fanatics for Christ? Where are the people who will forsake all pleasure so that this world can be reached? Where are the people who love God so much that they'd rather spend time at his feet then go to a football game?I don't think anyone can get too enthusiastic for Christ...no there's too much of self in us. I say away with moderation - let's get radical for Christ.A thought: moderation is a well travelled road that leads to a complacency. I look forward to your feedback. God bless you.

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Gideons Feb 23, 2005

Excellent observation. I agree with you.How can I have the world and Jesus too. That's really what we're saying. I don't believe there's any moderation in being sold out to Jesus but that's what he has called to.Ed

sermonindex Feb 23, 2005

amen and amen. I agree with you so so much.Jesus is all and all.

sermonindex Mar 12, 2005

Stephen2,Certainly, I would agree that Christ's message to "Follow Me" was not one of mediocrity nor moderation. It was intense and radical. But his message of.."If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it."Taken in context is more of an admonition to accept the Gospel message and then to discipleship. The denial of self happens when we accept Christ and his gospel. Certainly, we must then "..consecrate ourselves daily.." which is the taking up of our cross. But denial of self is part in parcel with the acceptance of the Gospel message upon the moment of salvation.I can agree that in this country there are many "lazy" Christians but that does not make one any "less" of a Christian but rather a Christian that God is either dealing with or will soon deal with in some way or another through the orchestration of their circumstances. God is faithful to chastise his own and he will be equally faithful to "conform us into the image of his Son".Certainly, God is sovereign in the dealings and development of his children. I'm sure you would agree with that statement! If you are initially unwilling to "go" then he will MAKE you willing to "go" through his methods of crushing the outer man in order to let the Spirit of God be released in the believer's life. You must have faith brother that God is continually dealing with ALL of his Sheep and will not forsake even a one.Just a couple things that jarred me a bit about your post brother is that you are talking about "us" (the rest of your family in Christ) as if we are not living up to the standard that you are living at. I would challenge you to look into your own heart and life to see and realize that you yourself cannot live the life you are requiring of the rest of Christendom. Also, your statement, (heaven forbid - that might revive this world)This sentiment, though lofty and praiseworthy, is not a biblical view of the future. WE are not going to revive this world through our evangilization efforts. Christ himself will revive it for himself. WE, on the other hand, will witness the further delving of this world into deeper and deeper darkness with less and less regard for the Gospel. This will continue until the coming global persecution of the Saints. Now, the dicotomous thing is that this coming persecution will cause 3 things, 1. The separation of wheat from tares2. The Great Apostasy3. A true and legitimate revival of the church.Basically, before you condemn the rest of the Body of Christ and request that they remove the speck from their eyes, first remove the aircraft carrier from your own eye.In Christ,Picky400

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AgesofWar Mar 12, 2005

There is one kind of Christian those in the body and those outside the body.Those who know the Fire of the HOLY SPIRIT and those who know there own thoughtsBrother Stephen you are correct in saying that some who would call themselves by the name of Christ are in fact nothing more than life insurance holders. They will agree up into the point when called to make that faith filled decision to turn from there sins with the Help of the UNSEEN ONE.Upon realizing that they have to stop watching there IDOL(TV). They say words like Legalism and there is nothing wrong with it.If you asked them to give up sports they would laugh at you, and this is because they worship at the temple of the CUBS.I know I have seen them praise the god of the homerun or the god of the triple play or the goddess of the foul ball.You test yourself you who are called by his NAMEYou test the spirits and find out how far you are from the truth.Who do you worship more the TV or your GOD?There is but one type of Christian that is the one who know JESUS is the SON of GOD and who lives it.Your right Picky no one can be perfect but all christians are called to be Perfect. The HOLY SPIRIT perfects us daily so that we are not what we were and we are conforming to the IMAGE of CHRIST.

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MarkDaniel Mar 12, 2005

I look forward to your feedback.Here is mine...AMEN.;-)

sermonindex Mar 12, 2005

Dear Picky400,You are right - i'm working on that aircraft carrier... ;-) I actually apologized recently for posting this thread...it was written in a spirit of pride and it was divisive. The aim and the attitude were wrong... Please know that my desire is not to condemn the church - my heart breaks for it...Thank you for your thoughts Picky400! I would really appreciate your prayers this weekend (see prayer thread).Anyone else who happens along this thread...i apologize once again for the spirit of that initial posting...and please see thread on prayer (i need your prayers!!) :)God Bless,Your brother in Christ

sermonindex Mar 12, 2005

Stephen2,I'm glad to hear that you have reconsidered this post. This shows your humility and I'm sure that Christ is pleased with you altogether. Not that you have given in to me, but simply because you have the maturity to admit your failings. I appreciate that from any believer. I will remember you in prayer and encourage you in the faith. Sincerely,Picky400

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DaBookman Mar 12, 2005

No, we can't be perfect but the bible does show that we can have a perfect heart. I beleive that wanting to be perfect is the perfect heart.To agree with the Spirit that everything that is not like Christ has to Go by the power of the Holy Spirit and continually asking the Holy Spirit to search your heart to see if there be any wickedness there and to deliver you from it.Just a thought from a baby in Christ.

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ZekeO Mar 12, 2005

With many of the 'commands' that are not written clearly in the bible. If we preach them as such they can bring the body under so much bondage, that we could get back to wearing suits as an expression of holiness and respect for God.

sermonindex Mar 12, 2005

Dabookman,If you're suggesting that we can have perfect intentions of the heart, I'm sorry to disappoint you but even our own hearts condemn us. Our only salvation and hope is in the rigtheousness of Christ "that is from God and is by faith."Picky400

sermonindex Mar 13, 2005

Brother Frank, As we discussed the other day about Paul coming to perfection in regards to Christ living out his life. That his faith Christ perfected or finished and now, though living in the shell (flesh) he was living by the another kind of faith, a higher faith that is no longer limited to a measure.Paul said "Let us move unto perfection" meaning that perfection is attainable and that is the goal the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. It was also the Joy that was set before Christ before His passion.Now alot of people get this wild idea that perfection is attainable in the flesh, this is not true. Perfection will never come by way of the flesh thus the flesh has no part in this, as the outer court was left out when it was being measured.Perfection has nothing to do with YOU or I. It all has to do with a SEED called Christ. It's Christ in you the hope of glory that is being perfected. We have for years looked down upon ourselves and we say, "I am not worthy", etc.. Yes, we are not worthy, but HE is and we need to feed ourselves the sincere milk of the word because that seed that is in you desires it, because it's babe. Now we grow in grace and in more knowledge of the LORD Jesus Christ. Christ in us is growing to maturity, then you see the power of God in demonstration. Sometimes the power of God is demontrated at an early start in our Christian expirence but that doesn't mean that that person has reached perfection, nor doesn't mean that he has any wisdom or understanding, most times they don't have any. But I am not talking about those things, but the perfection. That is why we decrease as we move closer and closer to this goal, I don't have to say anything about this those who are reading this post understand fully what I am saying. They have done many things for the LORD but when they look back at the things they have done, it would seem they have done nothing. And rightly so, because they are seeing that Christ has done it all.NEVER think that that you in yourself will ever come to perfection, remember it has nothing to do with you, it has to do with seed investment that God placed in you, Christ. The things the Holy Spirit see in our lives he purges out, because they are not apart of the refitting. We are being renovated, every aspect of our being is being looked over carefully, every nook and cranny will not be left unnoticed, "He will thoroughly purge His floor". And Praise God for this, because I can't do it, I can't do it, I can't do it! Christians who go about saying they are perfect are only fooling themselves. This damnable heresay called the Word of Faith movement has many sincere people doing this very act right now. But you see, perfection doesn't come that way, perfection is LIFE. You won't have to say you are perfect it will be resident in your being, people will feel it, know it. People will jump in your shadow to be healed.Jesus said, I am the resurrection and the life. Two things He is presenting here, Resurrection and Life. "That they might have life and life more abundantly". Again, two things He is presenting, Life and Abundant Life. Every word that Jesus spoke was like Samuels words they didn't fall to the ground, they had meaning and if you pay attention to the wording you will begin to understand something. I have very little faith, if any. I think your faith Frank is great. I know that God has many things for you and I know that you are confident that He has. And being a babe in Christ, you have grown much and and have endured much. I envy you in some ways, your simplicity of life something that I have longed to be again. And yet God has blessed me financially and If God told me today to leave it all I would without a forethought. And perhaps that is why I am blessed this way, because He knows that I would.It would be nice to look in that mirror the mirror of the perfect law of liberty so that we can all see how far Christ has grown in our lives. Perhaps He is twelve, and beginning to ask questions, that would be a sign to the believer who is getting into the deeper things of the Spirit by asking questions he feels in his spirit.We have all done it, we have laid upon our beds and we have asked deep questions to the LORD. Where do those thoughts originate? From deep within, "Deep calleth unto deep". God puts those ideas there, and when we are alone and quiet enough we hear them, and we speak His will into His ears, because "he knoweth what we have need of before we even pray".God be with you, amen.Karl

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