The role of purose of Baptism

I engage in conversation with an older guy at work on this topic. He goes to the Church of Christ and adamantly says that baptism saves the soul as long as a person has repented of their sins and turned away from them. He knows I don't agree with the baptism for Salvation. He goes by the words of what Jesus says and seems to pay no attention to the words of Paul on this subject.

So, while I bring it up I would like some input into this subject. What exactly is the role of baptism when it comes to Salvation? Why did Jesus say that it fulfilled all righteousness? Why, in the book of Acts, did some have to get baptized in order to be saved but that isn't stressed as so in the church today? Have we missed something with it?

Lastly, I the thief on the cross seems to be an exemption to the baptism for Jesus said he would be within Him in Paradise.

What are your thoughts?

Just as with the mouth confession is made of things stirring in one's heart, so also Baptism is something that can be publicly recorded and personally remembered- it really happened on such and such a day.

On that day I publicly knew in my heart and spoke with my mouth that I was a believer in Jesus, accepting his death as mine, his resurrection as mine also.

Then one day the wheels came off, the doubts crowded in and the dark unconfessed sin reclaimed their right to my soul. I spun out of control, confused and unstable, yielding to emotions and pangs of guilt.

And then I remembered. As the psalmist says, "I was like a beast toward You!" (73). Until I entered the Sanctuary of God!

There was a day, an hour, when I said yes to God and yielded to His baptism. I reclaim that day, "Father hold me in your grip, and keep that which I have committed unto Thee against that day!"

All that to say the purpose of my baptism is for my own remembrance, to recall as often as necessary the covenant I have with my eternal Father.

When Jesus was baptized, He heard the Word of the Father, a Word He needed to record in His spirit. He is a forerunner for us, a model of our relationship with God, and He heard what we all need to hear from God.

"You are My beloved son/daughter, and with you I am well pleased."

watchman nee has a great booklet on water baptism. jimp

Hi Deadn,
I agree with you that Baptism doesnt effect your ultimate salvation from this world into heaven.It is a sign to the world that "I am dead to sin" and I think it affects your salvation while you are living.
Jesus went to get baptised not because of sin but to fulfill a prophesy thats why he said the words "fulfilled all righteousness",(thats what we have missed-its a fulfillment of scripture)
yours staff

Staff

How does Jesus Baptism fulfill all righteousness and how does it fill Prophecy? Why was it so important especially if we view it just as symbolism? If it fulfills righteousness it seems to me it should be more than just mere symbolism. What do you think?

Essentially, I would like to scripture support scripture with this otherwise we get into a thought for thought dialog and that doesn't necessarily prove anything except our own thinking.

hi, in the book that i touted,he said that in eastern culture baptism is stating that i am no longer one of you for i have died to being an iraqi and am now part of the family of God. it is the separation from as much as it is the entrance into.jimp

Jimp I believe it is a result of the false gospel and testimonies that speak to cleansing the outside of the cup that the act of baptism has suffered.I do believe baptism is the testimony of two statements in the life of the believer. One, that God has changed me and made me a child of His Light.. Two, that the murderer, idolater, sexually immoral, greedy, cheat, abusive rebel that you use to know me as, has died and is no more. I come to testify that the person you use to know has been changed. I was cleansed by Christ's Blood. The water is purely symbolic of these things for it is His blood and His blood only that has made possible my new birth. Maybe a big lesson can be gleaned from the eastern culture baptism.

I just realized that I really chopped up the English language with how I typed of the topic of this thread. OUCH!!! Excuse my lack of proofreading. It makes me look bad. I am finite ,lol!

How does Jesus Baptism fulfill all righteousness and how does it fill Prophecy? Why was it so important especially if we view it just as symbolism? If it fulfills righteousness it seems to me it should be more than just mere symbolism. What do you think?

First of all Water Baptism is an act of faith.

1 Peter 3:20-who once were disobedient, when the patience of God kept waiting in the days of Noah, during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through the water. Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who is at the right hand of God, having gone into heaven, after angels and authorities and powers had been subjected to Him.

Here Peter compares the water baptism to entering Noah's arc. What saved Noah and his household? Was it the Arc or God who closed its doors and also prevented the arc from sinking. I saw a documentary that explained that there is no way a person could build such a big arc with just wood without any Iron bolts that will not sink. I agree with it. It is God who saved them by making the arc float. But it was an act of faith that Noah and his family showed by building an arc and entering into it. He did not rebel against God's command saying 'if you have already decided to save me then why should I build this arc?'. He instead obeyed it with an act of faith. Which God appreciated by saving him from flood.

Same way though Jesus was absolutely sinless he still obeyed God and went through water baptism and only after that he received baptism of Holy Spirit. If Jesus would have rebelled against God and said that he will not go through water baptism then he would never be baptised in Holy Spirit which was needed for his ministry (for miracles).

So though water baptism does not actually makes us saved. We still do it as an act of faith and also as an appeal to God for clear conscience towards him.

Hi Deadn.
When he says fulfill all righteouness he means "to do all that is right".Jesus knew that it would be "right" to get immersed in water by John the Baptist.Its not about his own rigtheousness but about doing something that he was expected to as the messiah.If you study John rather than just baptism it becomes clear that jesus was fulfilling prophetic typology,
Staff

Hi Deadn,
I am answering the question why was Jesus baptised not baptism in general,Staff