Pregnancy...having young children in the end days...

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carters Mar 25, 2013

Hi there,
After reading Matthew 24:19 and seeing what is happening in the world today, I was wondering whether it is not the best thing to be pregnant or have lots of children in these end days?

The natural world is starting the birth pains as per scripture.

Is it a wise thing to bring a child into this world at this stage?

The increase is autism among children is extremely worrying - it is not just the natural world that is falling apart but mankind's bodies are also becoming more affected too. There are so many other developmental issues affecting children.

I have friends who have children with developmental issues and it becomes such a huge thing in their lives, the main focus and dictates everything in what and how they live having to care for child/ren that have such special needs.

If the risk of having a child with developmental issues, which seem to becoming worse as time goes on, not be the wisest choice to make in the end times?

If the risks become worse as time goes on, would it be best to not have children and focus on spreading the gospel as single or married with no children, or few children?

I just wondered what the biblical answer is.

Thank you!

sermonindex Mar 25, 2013

HI Carters,

I have a child with Down Syndrome, well less a child now, more of a young man, he will be 20 in a few short years. To the man and woman who is focused on Jesus, a child such as mine only intensifies the focus. My life is not defined by my special needs child, it is defined by Jesus and on the narrow walk home. When our eyes are fixed on Him then every obstacle becomes an opportunity to be a blessing. When our eyes are fixed on ourselves, then every obstacle becomes an opportunity to deviate from the the narrow path. In the clearest words the Lord every spoke to me, He said , three days after my son was born " I have given you a perfect gift from the treasures of heaven." Brother, we never let the world define our circumstances. All is God. I see God everywhere and in everything. The steps of a righteous man are ordered of God and in this lies great peace. Every married couple should live in peace and joy, no matter the circumstances. Let not the world nor the state of the world dictate how we live our lives. And let not circumstances ever give us an excuse not to follow the Lord in all that we do. Be blessed bro Carters, I do agree with you that the season seems to have begun, but have faith and joy in the Lord and have children, unless he specifically speaks to you not to....................bro Frank

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ginnyrose Mar 25, 2013

Mrs. Carter,

You want a biblical answer to your question about the wisdom of birthing children in these troublesome times.

After God made man he commanded them to be fruitful and multiply and this command has never been withdrawn. The only stipulation is that the child's parents be married to each other! (OT and NT law).

After reading your post last night, I asked my husband what he thought. He observed that people have been having babies ever since the creation and there were a lot of troublesome times in all these years, but God's children still multiplied by birthing children. He went on to say that ungodly people still keep having babies, so why should Christians stop?

As a mom who birthed five and now have eleven grands, I share your concern. Actually, I am glad I am too old to have children anymore! My attitude towards birthing is totally different from a young woman's but this is part of the ageing process. I enjoy my post-menopausal era! lol

Anyhow...you expressed concern about birth defects in children which is a legitimate concern. I will add to it diabetes plus other ills that bedevil children. You know what? When I was a child growing up we rarely heard of diabetes! Back then - I was born in 1947 - I knew of only two who had it! Now it is everywhere! Why is this so? I suggest you do a lot of studying to see what some folks will say is causing it and then take measures to do what you can to prevent it. The more I read up on it the more I think one would do well to live in a remote place, growing your own food using heirloom seeds, raising your own chickens and animals. When sick, pray - asking for divine intervention and keeping visits to physicians to a minimum. As much as possible abstain from vaccinations.

I am concluding that many sicknesses we see today are man inflicted because of our culture. Since I believe this, I would urge one to study this carefully and order your life accordingly. One must never forget there is a health industry that works to separate you from your money and it is imperative to know which is legitimate and what is mere commercial.

As I consider the health issue - and it is a serious one - I would think the spiritual one should be of greater concern. How can one shield his children from evil influences? is the driving concern of many godly parents. This I think should be the greater and more serious issue. The physical, while important, is temporal; the spiritual is eternal.

In closing I suggest you make this a matter of serious prayer but do not allow fear to impact your decision.

God bless.

ginnyrose

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SkepticGuy Mar 25, 2013

the greater questions is: who said we are living in the last days??

we must be careful not to let the headlines dictate our escatology. every single generation of believers since the time of christ have been convinced that THEY are living in the end of days. especially the believers of the disciple's generation! it would have blown their minds to consider that we'd all still be here 2000 years later.

if u listen to the christian music from the late 60's early 70's u would have thought jesus would return next week. but the 70's faded into the 80's, then the 90's and then the next century. the hippie jesus people grew up and put on suits and are now retiring and moving to florida, and still jesus has not returned.

jesus could tarry another 2000 years if thats god's sovereign plan.

so be fruitful and multiply.

sermonindex Mar 25, 2013

Sister Carter,

What a blessing to receive such loving concern and godly counsel from brothers and sisters in the Lord as you have received here on sermonindex forum. Praise the Lord. I will add just a note to the good edification that was already given. We have been declaring the return of the Lord for many years, yet we have three children and five grandchildren!

These two scriptures come to mind immediately as I consider your question. First, Philippians 4:4-9

“Rejoice in the Lord always. Again I will say, rejoice! Let your gentleness be known to all men. The Lord is at hand. Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus. Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy—meditate on these things. The things which you learned and received and heard and saw in me, these do, and the God of peace will be with you.” NKJV

Notice the apostle Paul clearly suspected that he was living during the time of the return of the Lord when he wrote, "the Lord is at hand." Yet he instructs to "be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving let your requests be made know to God."

Second, from James 1:2-8

"My brethren, count it all joy when you fall into various trials, knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience. But let patience have its perfect work, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking nothing. If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach, and it will be given to him. But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for he who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven and tossed by the wind. For let not that man suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways."

James, the brother of our Lord, was compelled to write that even in the midst of "various trials," that we should ask God for wisdom... and that we should fully expect to receive His wisdom in a matter if we fully believe.

In each case we find sufficient cause for anxiety to be stirred within believers, but in each case we find the instruction to pray and seek God's guidance. I would say that we should seek God's guidance / wisdom in all things, even in childbearing and especially in the last hours of this age. Yet procreation is a central part of God's purpose in marriage (Gen.1), in much the same way for example that bearing fruit is a central part of God's purpose in our relationship to Him through Jesus Christ. (Jn. 15) Thus, to a great degree those commands should be considered defaults for us.

At the same time, when we consider ways of bearing spiritual fruit unto the Lord, we should first and foremost consider our specific gift/s and call. To each one is given "a measure of Christ gift" (Eph. 4:7). So that whereas some may "win souls," very directly through preaching on the streets, others may serve in very important support roles. We see such a lead / support ministry relationship illustrated from Timothy to Paul for example. Each one is equally important in fulfilling the command (I Cor. 3:6).

IS CHILDBEARING A "LAW" COMMANDMENT? NO! IS IT AN ACT OF OBEDIENCE TO GOD'S COMMAND? YES!
As that example relates to childbearing, if we say that it is always and without exception a default command to bear children as the law to live "righteous" for example, some may interpret that to mean that they must bear as many and as often as possible. However, that was NOT the command God gave in Genesis, but only to "be fruitful and multiply, and fill (or replenish) the earth."

I knew of one family well that tried to do that believing that it was a law commandment, and after nine children straight, the wife and mother almost died. There family suffers in many ways to this very day, most of it due to a misunderstanding of that and other similar things put forth in the scripture. On the other hand, we are close to another family that has had seven children over about a twenty year period and the wife and mother (still in her mid forties) is very well and strong, able to support her husband in his gift and call as the head of the household; but they do not plan to have more children because they sensed the Holy Spirit telling them that was all for them. My wife and I believed the Holy Spirit led us to have three, and so we did. He has honored that in a great way because it was in obedience to Him.

REAL LIFE ILLUSTRATION:
Finally, I have been preaching the soon return of the Lord for many years, and the calamities that surround it. My children have heard that since they were born, and they are thankful. They all inquired of their mother and me, as to whether they should attend college, marry, have children and so-forth, seeing as the Lord is coming soon and the world will be filled with unprecedented tribulation. The Spirit of the Lord led me to tell each of them to seek the Lord concerning these things just as they would anything else. They did, and the Lord has honored that.

A BIG SURPRISE!
Well, in the last few years, we have punctuated this message of sudden destruction and disaster with emphasis (as the Lord has led). In other words, there has been plenty of room for the possibility of anxiety. Our youngest daughter and her husband were very concerned about having children in light of our times. But they prayed and the Lord showed them that He would care for them and their children, and that they should bear children. As a result, they had triplets! Surprise! Well, to them, and to Debbie and me, as well as others close to us - the Lord made clear that He DOES WANT HIS PEOPLE TO CONTINUE CHILDBEARING just as He designed us to through our marriage relationship until He makes clear otherwise (if He ever does).

That being said, I would pray earnestly with your husband on the matter, but unless the Lord tells you not to bear children, I would rejoice that He has brought you together for that central purpose and be fruitful and multiply. Then expect the Lord to lay hold of their lives early, as you train them up in Him so that they may serve Him well!

NOTE: The reference you made from the Olivet discourse in Matthew's account, was specifically an admonition to Jews in Jerusalem during the time of the Abomination of Desolation, and the immediate aftermath of horrendous war, when the Jews would need to escape rapidly. He did not say, "not" to bear children, but to "pray" that you would not be pregnant or nursing small children during that moment. By that, you might conjecture that He was indirectly instructing that prayer should be a part of the time for childbearing, especially during these last days; but He does NOT want us to have fear or anxiety about it, and with none, or with few, or with many, He is still Lord, and He will make the way for the fruit of His people born through living faith!

M

MrBillPro Mar 25, 2013

SkepticGuy.....the greater questions is: who said we are living in the last days??

We have been in the last days for over the past 2000 years. I wonder if in 2000 years into the future, if folks will still be saying the same thing? My guess is yes!

sermonindex Mar 25, 2013

I realize this matter is was not the intended subject of this post, but these comments demand a response.

SkepticGuy and MrBillPro, I would caution you and even warn you not to be too skeptical, or casual about your evaluation of the Word of the Lord to His people, and to all the world, warning of His soon return and the judgment to come - certainly not to be flippant as your comments reveal. Our Lord Himself, began this example of proclaiming judgment in such a way that every generation should be warned of His soon return, and the need for spiritual readiness. The Holy Spirit continued to do so through the apostles, and down through the ages through those who were called from among the remnant. It is the Word of the Lord for this hour that you play with so lightly. It is not a little thing that you should do this.

THIS WORD THROUGH ZEPHANIAH SPEAKS SPECIFICALLY TO THOSE WHO MOCK THE SOON-COMING JUDGMENT OF THE LORD, MORE THAN TWO THOUSAND YEARS BEFORE THE ACTUAL "DAY OF THE LORD"
"And it shall come to pass at that time That I will search Jerusalem with lamps, And punish the men Who are settled in complacency, Who say in their heart, 'The LORD will not do good, Nor will He do evil.' Therefore their goods shall become booty, And their houses a desolation; They shall build houses, but not inhabit them; They shall plant vineyards, but not drink their wine." The great day of the LORD is near; It is near and hastens quickly. The noise of the day of the LORD is bitter; There the mighty men shall cry out. That day is a day of wrath, A day of trouble and distress, A day of devastation and desolation, A day of darkness and gloominess, A day of clouds and thick darkness, A day of trumpet and alarm Against the fortified cities And against the high towers." Zep 1:12-16

AGAIN, THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD IS SPEAKING HERE TO THOSE WITH A FLIPPANT ATTITUDE TOWARD HIS SOON RETURN
"knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation." For this they willfully forget: that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of water and in the water, by which the world that then existed perished, being flooded with water. But the heavens and the earth which are now preserved by the same word, are reserved for fire until the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance. But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up." II Peter 3:3-10

Mark Case

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SkepticGuy Mar 25, 2013

thank u, mark, but just becuz i think its possible that jesus may not come back for another 2000 yrs duz not mean that i am being flippant about anything. nothing in what i said was flippant. christ could come back 2nite or in the yr 3013. the fact is that every generation has thought "this is it! he's coming now!", yet here we are and they were wrong.

2 things people are passionate about: speaking in tongues and end times. depending on which side u are on, the opposing side considers u 'flippant' or close 2 heretical if u dare not agree with them.

this ought not to be. unfortunately the 'left behind' series has tainted a lot people's theology instead of the bible.

personally i hope he comes back 2nite. i think we will all be here 2morrow tho, writing away on the forum.

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SkepticGuy Mar 25, 2013

1 more thing, mark, if i may.

fortunately we are not saved by our eschatology. every1 here could be competely wrong about the end times, and yet we will all go to heaven if we have been regenerated by the spirit of god. if god has revealed himself to us and given us the gift of faith and we surrended our hearts to him and put our trust in jesus christ we are saved. how we think about end times has nothing to do with salvation. i dont know mrbillpro, but i think he is a true believer and brother in christ. i know i am. neither of us used flippant words, nor intended what we said to be perceived flippant.

if we begin 2 make subjectional doctrines and interpretations of scripture the litmus test for whether sum1 is a true believer in christ then we are abusing the word of god. that in itself is 'flippant' according 2 the definition of the word flippant, brother.

there is grace in these things, particularly the end times. there has 2 be! i promise u no one will be 100% correct in their eschatology. how can they be? parts of it are so cryptic.

practice grace, brother.

C

carters Mar 25, 2013

THANK YOU all so much for your replies! They were amazing and so full of God's wisdom. Bless you all.

It really does help when we get others in our spiritual body to give insight to an issue.

If I may ask a further personal question:

We have a child who is now 7 years old. When I was pregnant with her I suffered from a debilitating pelvic condition that towards the end of the pregnancy made me unable to walk. I was in alot of pain. The pregnancy was extremely difficult. After the birth I also continued with this problem. Pain problems and also mobility problems. It took me about 10 months to learn to re-walk and then at least 2 or so years to become pain free again.

Medically speaking I suffer from a condition called Symphysis Pubis Dysfunction SPD - and I was one of the unlucky ones who had this condition post pregnancy.

There is no *fix* for it. I have been to many different type s of medical people, physios, osteos etc and they have done the best they can. I still have a slight pain in that area every now and then, but I am pain free and able to be mobile.

Medical advice and opinion is that this condition generally comes back with each subsequent pregnancy, but sometimes not. It is caused by the relaxin hormones in the body.

Our concern is that we have not had any more children because of the risk of it would bring to us as a family and me personally. There is the risk of possible permanent disability. There is also the chance that I may be fine.

We have given this over to the Lord and spoken to each other that we would put this to Godly counsel.
I have been praying that God would speak directly to us on this issue and so far we have not heard.

What would your Godly counsel be in regards to us taking this risk or not, and please can you stand with us in prayer on this issue.

Thank you!

sermonindex Mar 25, 2013

Dear Sister,

My wife and I, will pray this evening in agreement with you both that the Lord will show you His perfect will in this matter, and that ultimately He will heal you completely.

He is faithful.

R

rufnrust Apr 2, 2013

Children are still arrows in the hand of the mighty! We need a generation growing on into, and declaring the kingdom of God.

Just a note here. The Muslims are not afraid to keep having children by the numbers. How about a righteous generation to declare the glory of God.

I have 5 children. I hope that helps a little.

If you are unable to have more, sharpen the one you have and disciple others as you have opportunity.

Ruf

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pilgrim777 Apr 2, 2013

I know someone who told his wife 36 years ago that he did not want children because they were living in the end times. This was very difficult for his wife who loved children and desired them. He is now alone as his wife passed away last year. Though she loved children and they would be in their thirtys now she was denied them because of fear as we now know.

Many thought WWII were the last days. We would not be here today, if our parents had the mind set of "no children". Jesus says, "Occupy till I come".

I understand the hesitation and the careful thought that people want to give to the matter, but let not the decision be one of fear. Fear will cripple a person and prevent one from functioning as they should.

As with most things in life:
Matt 9:29 ...According to your faith be it unto you.

T

ThyKingCome Apr 2, 2013

Dear Sister, God bless you. I won't be able to add much to the wisdom that has already been shared by many precious people, but I do want to add a brief testimony.

My wife and I also had similar doubts and fears about having children. We wondered what would be most expedient for the Kingdom of God, or if it was prudent to raise a family in such a dark hour of history! The Lord began to speak to us from the lives of various families in the Bible.

The time of the children of Egypt in Exodus was very scary, and Pharoah wanted to kill all of the male children because he feared the growing power of the Israelites.

Here are a few verses from Exodus 1.

"15 Then the king of Egypt spoke to the Hebrew midwives, of whom the name of one was Shiphrah and the name of the other Puah; 16 and he said, “When you do the duties of a midwife for the Hebrew women, and see them on the birthstools, if it is a son, then you shall kill him; but if it is a daughter, then she shall live.” 17 But the midwives feared God, and did not do as the king of Egypt commanded them, but saved the male children alive. 18 So the king of Egypt called for the midwives and said to them, “Why have you done this thing, and saved the male children alive?”

19 And the midwives said to Pharaoh, “Because the Hebrew women are not like the Egyptian women; for they are lively and give birth before the midwives come to them.”

20 Therefore God dealt well with the midwives, and the people multiplied and grew very mighty. 21 And so it was, because the midwives feared God, that He provided households for them."

Such an amazing account of God not only protecting the mothers, but even the mid-wives who feared God. "He provided households for them". The Lord began to put questions into our hearts such as "What if Moses' parents had decided to not have any children? Where then would be Aaron, Miriam and Moses"? They could easily have decided not to have children in such an intense time.

God even showed us that in the time before the Babylonian captivity the land was dark, and Daniel's parents could have decided not to have children in fear that they would become servants of a foreign king. But look how the Lord used Daniel...Nehemiah and other men in such a troublesome time! God wants to raise up deliverer's "for such a time as this" as He did with Esther.

We didn't want to withhold a "Daniel" or a "Nehemiah" from the Lord or from this generation. (we have two boys now and are preparing and praying for baby #3).

Now regarding your health sister, as it has been said by brother Mark and others we are free in the Spirit of liberty to be led by the Lord. God would not give you a physical malady that hinders childbearing and then turn around and condemn you for not having more children...He is not the author of confusion. It may be that He wants to show you His grace during the process if He so leads you to have another child naturally, or He may completely surprise you with a healing! God is also a huge fan of adoption, He has begotten a few kids Himself this way :)

However you are led, please do take to heart the counsel from the rest of the brethren that the times we live in are not to dictate how we shall follow the Lord. God is with you and He certainly knows how to take care of His own. You are very precious to Him. Bless you.

Kevin Bruce

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pilgrim777 Apr 2, 2013

There have been many dark times in history. In fact, people in every century were of the opinion that their tribulation was "Great Tribulation" and no other generations would exist.

I am glad that Esther was born.

Est 4:14 For if thou altogether holdest thy peace at this time, then shall there enlargement and deliverance arise to the Jews from another place; but thou and thy father's house shall be destroyed: and who knoweth whether thou art come to the kingdom for such a time as this?

I can look back and name many saints whose birth I am grateful for.

M

Matthew2323 Apr 3, 2013

Mrs. Carter,

There are three ways that I know of that Father uses to speak to us: The Bible, His Spirit and wisdom.

In your situtaion, there is no specific Bible verse telling you and your husband to have another child at this moment in time.

Second, according to your testimony, Jesus has not spoken to either you or your husband through His Spirit that now is the time for you to have more children.

That leaves your family to walk in the way of wisdom. I concur with the others who have posted that we are not living in the "end times" as it is commonly called. Both Paul (1 Corinthians 10:11) and the writer to the Hebrews (1:2) referred to the first century as the "last days." Therefore I would not base any decision on this type of hypothetical scenario.

From your second post, what I believe you and your husband should consider is the medical condition of which you spoke. Of course, God "could" prevent any problems from occurring but we are called to step out in faith, not step out in "could." In other words, Jesus knows full well the condition of your body and if He spoke to you (or your husband) that now is the time for you to have another child, you would then want to follow Him in faith. However, absent any such epiphany, I would encourage you to listen to your body. Not all of God's guidance comes through a personal revelation as there are times when the way that He created us keys us in to how we should act: we eat when we're hungry, sleep when we're tired, etc.

If you don't mind sharing, how have your close friends counseled your family? Are you two leaning in one direction or the other at the moment?

Grace and peace,
Matthew

sermonindex Apr 3, 2013

"Then I will gather the remnant of my flock out of all the countries where I have driven them, and I will bring them back to their fold, and they shall be fruitful and multiply." Jeremiah 23:3

"And God said to him, “I am God Almighty: be fruitful and multiply. A nation and a company of nations shall come from you, and kings shall come from your own body." Genesis 35:11

"Arise, go to Paddan-aram to the house of Bethuel your mother's father, and take as your wife from there one of the daughters of Laban your mother's brother. God Almightybless you and make you fruitful and multiply you, that you may become a company of peoples. May he give the blessing of Abraham to you and to your offspring with you, that you may take possession of the land of your sojournings that God gave to Abraham!” Genesis 28:2-4

"And God said to him, “Your name is Jacob; no longer shall your name be called Jacob, but Israel shall be your name.” So he called his name Israel. And God said to him, “I am God Almighty: be fruitful and multiply. A nation and a company of nations shall come from you, and kings shall come from your own body. The land that I gave to Abraham and Isaac I will give to you, and I will give the land to your offspring after you.” Genesis 35:10-12

if i had not been a sin soaked fool, i would have had my wife back, and we, God willing, would have had more than our one son. But, though i was a fool, i am SO THANKFUL to God Almighty for that dear boy, and as a testimony to his mother of my enduring love for her, i have not, nor will i EVER "remarry"...maybe one day, she will come back to me, though we cannot bear any more children...fore she is precious and beloved of my heart...(and i'm crying while i write this...in 2 days, she turns 45, i've known her since she was 12, and we were always brother and sister in our hearts...even to this day)

What does the LORD say to you sister?

G

ginnyrose Apr 3, 2013

______________________________________________________________
QUOTE:
"I am glad that Esther was born."
______________________________________________________________

And do not forget Esther was an orphan. And do not forget the maiden, a slave girl, who ministered to Naaman. She was carried away from her home land, a captive. Her parents did a fantastic job with that girl that she maintained her faith in a pagan country.

We do not like to think of our children being deprived of our parenting, but sometimes God sees fit otherwise but will use them to his honor and glory. Hard pill to swallow for parents who have strong parenting instincts...

sermonindex Apr 3, 2013

human beings.....sometimes i wonder how God can even BEAR with us.....which to me, just UNDERLINES His Merciful Forebearance and Love for us.

obviously 'something else' just engendered this post, and i will gracefully leave it at that....or to put it as the world does, "it takes two to tango". God bless His children, and have Mercy on us....or one of the greatest prayerss the disciplines uttered:

"Increase our Faith!"

neil