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Life or death:but not both!

sermonindex Jun 11, 2013

What are you going to do saints when your country comes after you because of what you believe? When the Lord calls you out of Babylon, will you be so enamored of the things of Babylon that you will be un-able to leave? What about when it was time to leave Babylon and return to Jerusalem?

After 70 short years, the majority decided to stay, it was only a remnant that returned. It seems that the comforts of Babylon was too much for most to give up , they chose the comfort of the world over joining their remnant brothers and sisters. We would do well to pause before we criticize those who refused to return to Jerusalem.

Can you put yourselves in their place? Leave a secure modern society to go to an abandoned place with broken down walls where you would be surrounded by enemies on every side? When our own world turns fully against us , what decision will you make? If following the Lord means giving up your place in society, will you be able and willing to do that? Recently, A Christian sportscaster gave an opinion on TV. He said that he did not believe that you could be a Christian and a practicing homosexual. Seems fairly straight forward and even five years ago it would have not raised too much of a fuss. Yet, he later had to come on and apologize for his statement.

Now this is a great example of what is to come for genuine Christians. The world will demand that you compromise what you believe in order to remain a part of it's system. In this man's case, it seems there is no doubt that if he did not apologize, he would have lost his standing in the world, along with his job and career and ability to feed his family. He would have become a pariah. Therein lies the choice, a microcosm of what is to become much worse.This is the generation that is going to have to make a choice.

Jesus's ministry lasted for three years and had many different facets. Sometimes he was highly popular and and the crowds flocked to hear Him and indeed on more that one occasion would have made Him their King. Yet as His time on earth drew to a close and He began to reveal to the world who He truly was, one by one and then by a flood in John 6, most abandoned Him until He was left with a few. Then the world had to choose between Jesus and Barabas. Barabas was a fighter, he fought for freedom, he fought against the Romans, he desired to see Israel rule themselves. The world chose its own and rejected Jesus.

When the time comes, will you choose the world and all it's comforts and security, or will you take your place with the minority, hated and rejected by the world, living in a place without walls, surrounded by your enemies on every side. It's no mean choice brothers and sisters, it's life or death. Die to this world and live eternally, or live for this world and die eternally. One or the other, but not both.

sermonindex Jun 11, 2013

When the time comes, will you choose the world and all it's comforts and security, or will you take your place with the minority, hated and rejected by the world, living in a place without walls, surrounded by your enemies on every side. It's no mean choice brothers and sisters, it's life or death. Die to this world and live eternally, or live for this world and die eternally. One or the other, but not both.

Can I ask you brother! Do you truly believe that the fate awaiting someone who believes in Christ is eternal destruction because in the hour of trial they preferred comfort?

sermonindex Jun 11, 2013

Brother Andrew, is that a rhetorical question? Is not the word " believe," a controversial word that would have to be defined otherwise would cause confusion and strife? If you can define what you mean by " believer," then we could have a better discussion. I am thinking of the " believers of John 8:31-59 who, before that chapter was over, picked up stones to kill Jesus and Jesus told them that their father was the devil.

I would have thought brother that the obvious implication is that there are those who " believe,' those who you call believers, who choose the comforts of the world over the calling of the Lord, and then there are genuine saints who give their lives to the Lord. When Jesus spoke a parable of the two houses, one with and the other without a foundation, only one survived the storm. Unless the storm had come, who would know that the house had no foundation? Unless the darkness came, who would know which of the ten vigins had enough oil in their lamps? What happened, according to Scripture, to the five foolish virgins? Yet, they were all virgins, they all had lamps and they all slept.

Just so there is no confusion, there are professors of Christianity who dwell in Christendom who are not Christians at all and it is the trials and the testings that separate what is real from what is not........bro Frank

sermonindex Jun 11, 2013

No Frank it wasn't a rhetorical question, although I take your point very well. I am asking for a simple reason brother. After a whole year on this site I have found a deep presentation which falls along the lines of the OP you have made. In seeking to understand it I have asked myself a great many questions and read a great many posts. I have even written over 20,000 words privately to explore its meaning. Not that any of this is necessary from the point of my own conviction on the centrality of the question, just that I want to formally understand what is really meant by the claim.

To that end the word "believe" is become a somewhat euphemistically veiled reality and would appear best avoided in its entirety. So much so that in the shadow of this argument "believe" becomes "works". In Europe at least this issue does not arise too often. In England almost no one makes this argument at all. It would be easy to say the English are more worldly or else given over to evolutionary theories and compromise than the USA (as one poster said to me) but I rather think that something else is driving its meaning. In seeking to find that meaning, I ask the question. Can a believer, one who is born again suffer eternal destruction, because in a given hour they have preferred to agree with the world (whatever that means) instead of taking their place in the remnant? Does the believer perish or not?

I realise that the simple answer to this is to say that "they" were not believers in first instance and so the question is controversial.

Just to show you how difficult this issue really is what do you make of this passage of Scripture. It is the Lord Himself speaking through the prophetic voice in future tense by the prophet Isaiah.

He said, “Go, and tell this people:
‘Keep on listening, but do not perceive;
Keep on looking, but do not understand.’
“Render the hearts of this people insensitive,
Their ears dull,
And their eyes dim,
Otherwise they might see with their eyes,
Hear with their ears,
Understand with their hearts,
And return and be healed.”
Then I said, “Lord, how long?” And He answered,
“Until cities are devastated and without inhabitant,
Houses are without people
And the land is utterly desolate,
“The Lord has removed men far away,
And the forsaken places are many in the midst of the land.
Isaiah 10:9-12

Then I [Christ] said 'Lord [Father] how long'?

This speaks of a prophetic hiding of Christ from the people of Israel.

What made me ask the question was this:

"Yet as His time on earth drew to a close and He began to reveal to the world who He truly was, one by one and then by a flood in John 6, most abandoned Him until He was left with a few. Then the world had to choose between Jesus and Barabas. Barabas was a fighter, he fought for freedom, he fought against the Romans, he desired to see Israel rule themselves. The world chose its own and rejected Jesus."

This argument lies at the core of your post because it speaks of abandonment of Christ. Yet in Isaiah God tells the Christ to render the hearts and ears of Israel dull and insensitive. Had this not happened Christ would indeed have been declared King and we would all have perished. Can it be that rather than seeing the remnant as a self serving few, fleeing for their own eternal destiny, we could see the remnant actually remaining in the city and serving those who are too fearful to openly choose Christ? Do you think that such an option even exists? Perhaps the many fearful brethren who have taken their ease would be better served by the remnant who have been given to understand the times, by remaining! This is a sincere question brother not a rhetorical one either.

M
MaryJane Jun 11, 2013

Frank wrote: When the time comes, will you choose the world and all it's comforts and security, or will you take your place with the minority, hated and rejected by the world, living in a place without walls, surrounded by your enemies on every side. It's no mean choice brothers and sisters, it's life or death. Die to this world and live eternally, or live for this world and die eternally. One or the other, but not both.

_________________________________

Thank you for sharing this with us here. Very convicting and thought provoking. As I read through the last paragraph I found myself praying once more that as those days approach, as those storm clouds gather my actions will give credit to the many words I have spoken and shared over the years and my response will be to choose JESUS!! There are moments in my weakness when I fear that I will cower in the corner and choose the comfort of this world but then I think about your last post, about looking up to the cross and I am renewed! HE will strengthen me, HE will carry me. Yes the times will grow ugly and men who once proclaimed to love the LORD will be leading the charge to nail you to the cross but we know that in that time JESUS will be there with us. We know this is not our home and never was. Any comfort this world can offer will pass away, its all illusion, reality is eternity with HIM for those who seek to live with their eyes on the KING. Now is the time to keep focused on what truly matters, JESUS!

Thank you again for sharing, so encouraging and convicting because one knows that trails must come but the hope and comfort of knowing we do not face them alone is priceless!!

God bless
maryjane

C
Christinyou Jun 11, 2013

Praise God, He is still in charge of eternity and even when I give up He will remain faithful, making me faithful. "It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me". All is still in His hands, even unto what I will say at a time that I am unable to utter a word.

Luke 12:12 For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say.

How are we capable of this? Luke 12:7-8 But even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: ye are of more value than many sparrows. Also I say unto you, Whosoever shall confess me before men, him shall the Son of man also confess before the angels of God:

1 John 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Amen, and even He is come in my flesh, for it is He that is in me, He is the Hope of Glory.

In Christ: Phillip

How can we confess Him among men? Praise God by Him that has birthed Him in His own children, "offspring" and as He is that is in the World, so are we, in His strength, not mine.

By His love, now and forever.

1 John 4:16-17 And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him. Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

sermonindex Jun 11, 2013

Dear bro Andrew,

I appreciate your questions and of course they have merit. Yet, and this would not be you, what I do not want, in fact I do not want anything, I just wrote what the Lord laid on my heart and put it out there, is theological debate on the subject of OSAS.

So briefly and without getting into details or trying to convince anyone of anything I would say that a man can walk away from Jesus. I think it would be a rare thing, but I do not believe in OSAS. Now, take that and leave it to one side. The other aspect of this, and this is what was in my mind as I wrote it, is for those who have confessed Jesus and made some kind of break with the world but were never implanted into the vine. In fact the very thing that Jesus said to the believers in John 8 comes to mind.........

Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
Joh 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

This was so offensive to the believing Jews that they ended up wanting to kill Him. It seems like if you say to someone today that you must abide and continue to abide then you get the same reaction. pride and anger and a lesson on grace. Everything in the Kingdom is about continuing. Whether it is abiding in the vine, or in the Word or being filled and so on. The promises in Rev are made to those who overcome. Now in the question I raised in the OP, a very typical reaction I got on my other site , and you can read it there if you like ( https://www.facebook.com/#!/acalltotheremnant ) was from a mother worried about her daughter. She could withstand, she believed, what was to come, in Christ, but a very real stumbling block for her was her young daughter, could she expose her to persecution? And of course I believe that is exactly why we have this Scripture...........
Mat 10:37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
Mat 10:38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.
Mat 10:39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

So, in summation, there are those who are false professors which I would say are in the majority.And then there are those who have taken steps towards the Lord but never gave Him their lives and so there was no radical transformation. And then there are some who have been saved but may give up Christ for something they love more than Him when faced with the great challenge. What is it they love more than Him , or grew to love more than Him, God alone knows. I believe that the vast majority of every true and genuine saint will follow the Lord through persecution and beyond, even to their deaths, we have 2000 years to testify to that. Yet, does that make me presumptious? Do I beware when I stand lest I fall or become a castaway? Yes, I take the warnings of Scripture seriously yet still revel in the love and freedom of the assurance of my salvation. My job is to yield, to obey, to surrender to my heavenly Father.

One last thing to anyone who might read this, if you disagree with my positions that is fine, I respect your right to that. I would like this post to be an exhortation to ready ourselves and nothing more. If it does not bear witness in your spirit, then simply reject it.........bro Frank

sermonindex Jun 11, 2013

Dear sister MJ,

We always seem to be on the same page, praise the Lord. You wrote.........

"We know this is not our home and never was. Any comfort this world can offer will pass away, its all illusion, reality is eternity with HIM for those who seek to live with their eyes on the KING. Now is the time to keep focused on what truly matters, JESUS!"

Yes indeed, an illusion. I pray daily that the Lord would bind the reality of this world and open up my spiritual eyes to see the reality of the real world, the Kingdom of God that was and is and is to come, that dwells within my heart and the heart of all the saints, and which will one day be our eternal home. This Kingdom yet to come but already is, the eternal light which will outshine the sun but already does within our chest. This heart of a lion that beats within the chest of a lamb.............bro Frank

sermonindex Jun 11, 2013

Mathew 7:13-14
Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life and those who enter by it are few.

I like the ESV rendering of the above verses because they portray two kinds of people. They portray a choice for everyone of us in this forum. The choice is the world and the cross. The choice is the devil or Jesus.

Interesting only a "few"are going to choose the narrow way of Jesus. In Luke 14:24 Jesus says to strive to enter through the narrow door. Many will seek to enter it. But only s "few" will find it.

In John 10:7. Jesus says I am the door or the gate for the sheep. So in choosing to enter through the narrow gate one is choosing to follow Jesus. But note something else. The way is "hard" when one follows Jesus. Yes there is blessing and joy. But there is tribulation. In Acts 14:22 Paul and Barnabas encouraged new bievers to continue in the faith. For they said it is through many tribulations we must enter the kingdom if God.

There is a choice. The easy way that leads to destruction. It is a broad road to bell. It is the way of the devil. And many are going to choose that way.

The other way is a narrow gate. It is Jesus and the cross. This way is hard. There will be tribulation. But only a few will choose it.

As Bro Frank said you can't have both. Forum which will you choose.

Bearmaster.

sermonindex Jun 11, 2013

There are of course all manner of underlying complexities which fall within your frame of reference both as to why Jesus spoke as He did to Israel, or else His disciples, as well as what those same words of the Lord mean for those who believe in Him today. It would be simply too difficult to try and address every one of them to attempt to show that what happened in Israel and why, has little to do with those of us who have believed since the resurrection and especially since the sending of the Holy Spirit in Jerusalem which marks the beginning of the church.

As for OSAS that doctrine is flawed by reason of the very words. Mostly, because it is built upon a deformed understanding of the very meaning of salvation itself.

I can see what lies at the root of your post and accept that it is intended in simplicity as a call to readiness for a day of trouble. Yet even in that, given that you are writing with the USA in mind, there are distinctions which may have to be made. So that Europe in my own understanding is not included in what will happen in the USA, and therefore what will happen in the USA is not the end of the age. It is the beginning, a type of forerunner of evidence if you like, and not the end itself. The end is centred on Europe and not the USA. Having read many of the articles and listened to the persecution conference last year as well as having listened to some of the historical preaching which was presented in the USA in the last 50 years or so, I realise that arising from that certain individuals are now being presented as a prophetic voices for the USA and in that prophetic utterance is included this view that the majority of those who take the name of Christ in the USA are not Christ’s at all, but are in effect tares. Or as some prefer to call them, they are false believers. I cannot really say anything about that because although I don’t agree with the claim itself in fulness, it is without doubt true that the church in the USA has produced many of the developed heresies which have given rise to the particular circumstances which have made this possible in the USA itself. Whilst these heresies have by reason of false prophets found their way into the churches in Europe, as well as else where, no where are they more perfectly expressed in the fullness of their effect, than they are in the USA. This itself is being called apostacy. Europe made her beginnings in apostasy over 1700 years ago and the end of that is yet to conclude itself so far as the fullness of the age is concerned. Perhaps the USA is a shadow of things to come and not the fullness of them.

No where in Europe can these heresies be found in such an embrace as they are in the USA. They are becoming similarly embraced in the UK, and even in Italy to my own knowledge they are just beginning to find an entry. Yet in the USA they have moved on from one layer of deception to another. What’s more they have all been resisted from within the churches in the USA at one time or another. In the end the sophistication of their effect is even found in those churches which once resisted them. The common denominator in all of this is not Babylon, but Egypt. It the love of the world and not simply mammon, religious self effort and sorcery. Whatever happens in the USA no doubt will be a matter for the USA and those who live there. I find it impossible to apply to the USA the same comprehension which is applied scripturally to the Mediterranean, the former Roman Empire as well as to Israel. Which is why I asked the question. Yet I already knew the answer. I have to tell you brother that is a woefully underdeveloped answer because it denies the very saving power of Christ in countless millions of lives. I would be surprised though delighted if someone could point to a truly developed understanding of things which are yet hidden and not the things which are visible. Saying that the majority of 120 millions of men and women who take the name of Christ in the USA are simply not believers, is just implausible. It is applying to eternity itself that which can only be true for the kingdom.

Perhaps you could read this article and let me know what you think of it. It is my own effort to understand the issues and answers at least in part. I hope to be able to complete it some time soon and include a sobering vision of an understanding of what persecution will look like in Europe for those who are able to stand in that day for the sake of those who cannot. It will not include writing anyone off as an unbeliever. It will mean comforting them in an hour of distress in which they are able to lay hold of Christ who was always near at hand, but not fully comprehended. I would hope that the same type of ministry would be found in the USA as well as those other countries which will fall into its effect and consequences. If you cannot read it or have read it before then thats just fine.

http://blog.ichabod.eu/home/articles/tares-talents/

sermonindex Jun 11, 2013

Andrew whether you live in England, Europe, the US, or N. Korea. The choice is the same. Will you choose the broad easy way to destruction. Or will you choose the narrow hard way that leads to life.

To put it simply. Will one choose Christ or Satan.

Bearmaster.

sermonindex Jun 12, 2013

HI Andrew,

You write........

"It will not include writing anyone off as an unbeliever"

Brother, I am simply not getting caught up in that provocative and inflamatory statement. Perhaps if you want to explore the issues you talk about in your article, you should simply post it and discuss it. This OP is written as an exhortation to the saints. You may choose to characterize in another way, but that would not be true nor helpful. God bless you Andrew as you write what the Lord has laid on your heart, I pray that it blesses those for whom it is intended. Your brother in Christ.............bro Frank

sermonindex Jun 12, 2013

It ought not to be provocative or inflammatory given that it true. Perhaps you and those who make that claim could just have some evidence that it is true and that would settle the matter. What manner of exhortation includes the destruction of millions in its train? What I just wrote unless you missed it Frank was intended for yourself. Hence why it was in this post of yours. If it is a provocation it is not without good reason when those of us who have life simply cite the narrow way as an anthem and the broad way as a song of lament.

sermonindex Jun 12, 2013

Brother, let me respectfully suggest that not everything has to devolve into a debate. You have your opinion and you call it true, I spoke to what I wrote and what spirit it was written in. Please do not be offended at this, but if you look at sister Maryjane's reply, you will see someone who simply read the OP ,then then wondered if she was prepared herself, a very humble reply. This is me signing off from this particular thread. God bless the saints...........bro Frank

P
proudpapa Jun 12, 2013

Here is a very strong exortation, That I sometimes have pondered, written by THIELEMAN J. van BRAGHT in preface of the Martyrs Mirror:

OF THE GREATER DANGER THERE IS AT THIS TIME, THAN IN THE BLOODY AND DISTRESSING TIMES OF THE MARTYRS*
These are sad times, in which we live; nay, truly, there is more danger now than in the time of our fathers, who suffered death for the testimony of the Lord. Few will believe this, because the great majority look to that which is external and corporeal, and in this respect it is now better, quieter and more comfortable; few only look to that which is internal and pertains to the soul, and on which everything depends,"for what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?" Matt. 16:26.

These times are certainly more dangerous; for then Satan came openly, through his servants, even at noon-day, as a roaring lion, so that he could be known, and it now and then was possible to hide from him; besides, his chief design then was to destroy the body: but now he comes as in the night, or in the twilight, in a strange but yet pleasing form, and, in a two-fold way, lies in wait to destroy the soul; partly, to trample under foot, and annihilate entirely, if this were possible, the only saving Christian faith-- partly to destroy the true separated Christian life which is the outgrowth of faith. Ps. 9l:5, 6.

He reveals himself on the one hand as an angel of light, II Cor. 11:14, 15, as a kind, pleasant, yea, even divine messenger, with humble countenance, downcast eyes, plain garb, and living in seclusion from the throng of the worldly-minded, even as the holiest people, yea, the martyrs of God, formerly did. His words are modest, trembling and full of contrition-seemingly coming from deep meditation, inward fear and apprehension, lest he might speak amiss or untruthfully. Meanwhile, and before one is aware of it, he seizes hold and tears like a wolf in sheep's clothing, robbing the innocent lambs of Christ of their precious faith, which, he pretends to be of small importance, but without which faith it is impossible to please God, Heb. 11:6, nay, without which we, according to the words of Christ shall be condemned, Mark 16: 16; for (says Paul), whatsoever is not of faith is sin, Rom. 14:23.

It grieves us to the heart that we must live to see these times, and therefore speak in this wise. O Lord, strengthen our faith! help Thy weak, trusting lambs, that they may not be led into error, nor moved from the foundations of the most holy faith.

On the other hand, through his instigation, the world now reveals itself very beautiful and glori-


* When Israel under Pharaoh, in Egypt, had to burn brick, and to perform other hard labor, for the king, they remembered God, yea, cried unto the Almighty, so that God was moved to compassion Ex. chap. 1, 2, 3, etc.; but when God had delivered them, anti brought them into a goodly land where it went well with them according to the body, they forsook the Lord, and became wanton. Dent. 32:15. This difference is found to exist also between the times of oppression and the times of freedom.
Page 9
ous, more than at any preceding time, in a threefold pleasing form-the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eye, and the pride of life.* Almost all men run after her, to worship her as a queen supreme; but all are deceived thereby; yea, many who have drunk of the poisoned wine of her lusts from the golden cup of her iniquities and deceptions, die a spiritual death.

As the first design is aimed at the faith, so this is directed against the true Christian life. Here lies great danger. Who shall escape these snares? He that would at no time be taken unawares by it, must indeed be cautious and watchful. But our very flesh seems prone to it. Here must be fasting, watching, praying, and calling upon God for help, otherwise there is no escape.

Many of the ancients who supposed that they had been circumspect and observed their duty, were deceived hereby-; some were lulled into a careless sleep, so that they paid no heed to themselves or to their vocation; others were brought to despair of the divine truth; others were drawn away totally from God; some died a spiritual death; others died both spiritually and bodily; and some have plunged themselves helter-skelter into the abyss of the disfavor of God, to be punished by Him soul and body and forever.

These things which we tell you are no riddles or blind speeches, for we speak the truth, or the Word of God must be false; but as the Word of God cannot lie, what we have said is certain and infallible since God in His Word bears witness of it, yea, declares it emphatically and abundantly. Other histories which make mention of this, we pass by in silence and dismiss them altogether, because we do not hold them in equal estimation with the holy Scriptures. It was the world and its lusts that of old caused all the great calamities of which we have spoken; and not only this, but it has also caused thousands who live in various cities, countries, kingdoms, empires, yea, on the face of the whole earth, to mourn, weep and wail, on account of their natural misery as well as on account of their experiencing the wrath of God in their souls because of the magnitude and enormity of the sins perpetrated by them.

It certainly was through worldly lusts that the old world perished; that Sodom, Gomorrah, Zeboim, and Admah were consumed, overthrown and totally destroyed by fire from Heaven; that in forty years, through serpents, fire, and other plagues, the wanton and lustful people of Israel perished to the number of over six hundred thousand in the wilderness; and that the mighty mari


*" John, the friend of Christ, has presented the deceptive, beautiful appearance of this world in its threefold view of the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. I John 2:16. Solomon portrayed the same as a harlot or wanton woman, who allures young men unto her; who is loud and stubborn, and whose feet abide not in her house; but whither those who follow her are led, as an ox to the slaughter, to certain destruction, nay, to death and hell. Prov. 7.
* The following and other misfortunes which were caused by worldly and carnal lusts cannot be numbered. O, that Solomon, the wisest among the children of men, might have known, conquered, and taken care of himself in this respect. ime cities, Zidon and Tyrus, whose ships were trimmed with embroidered, silken sails from Egypt; whose rowers sat upon benches of ivory; where incalculable riches were bought and sold and, from carnal incentives, almost inconceivable arts practiced were reduced to a heap of stones and so leveled to the ground, that the fishermen stretch out their nets to dry on the rocks upon which these cities stood. Gen. 7; Matt. 24:37, 38; Luke 17:26, 27; II Peter 2:5.-Gen. 19:24, 25; Isa. 13:19; Jer. 50:40; Hos. 11:8; Amos 4:11; Luke 17:28, 29; I I Pet. 2:6; Jude 7.-Compare Num. 1:2, 3, 46 with Num. 14:22, 23. Also Num. 11:1 and 16:31-35; 21:6; Jude 5.-Isa. 23:4, 5; Ezek. 27:26-28; 28, the whole chapter.
I will not now speak of Jerusalem, Chorazin, Bethsaida; Capernaum, and other mighty licentious and luxurious cities, which, with all their inhabitants who had in this respect sinned against God, have borne His-wrath, and felt, to their destruction, the plagues of His afflicting hand; for this would consume too much time.* O awful judgments of God! O pernicious worldly-mindedness 1 O corroding and cankering luxury, that draggest after thee such a train of unspeakable miseries! Help, Lord, that our soul be delivered from all these dangers.

But what danger would there be, if none but the open enemies of God and His holy truth were guilty in this matter? What harm could be done, if they alone, and no others, would arouse and call down upon themselves the wrath of God? For then every pious and serious soul would beware of their example as of a savage beast, venomous serpent, or deadly basilisk. But now such is the state of things that many commoners and such as are not total strangers to religion or the worship of God; who, as they say, would fain be saved; and who, therefore, though they are not truly enlightened, glorify and praise God and His Word with their mouth, show nevertheless (to the seduction of the simple) that the world is their dear friend, yea lies nearest to their heart, since most of their works are directed to its service, that they may thereby partake of its glittering but deceptive reward.

Hence arises that shameful and vast commerce which extends far beyond the sea into other parts of the world, Ezek. 27, but which notwithstanding cannot satisfy those who love it, but, on. the contrary, brings great danger, that that which has already been gotten, may be lost, others defrauded, and they themselves, both in soul and body, stripped and robbed of their possessions.

Numerous large, expensive and ornamented houses, countryseats of splendid architecture and provided with towers, parks magnificent as a paradise, and other embellished pleasure-grounds, which are seen on every hand indicate this in no small degree. Dan. 4:29, 30.

* See Josephus on the Jewish wars; also Egesippus, Eusebius, and Pamphilius.


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The wearing of clothes from foreign countries, whether of foreign materials, uncommon colors or of strange fashions as obtain in the course of time according to the custom of the openly worldly-minded (which are as changeable as the moon), and which custom is followed by many humble and seemingly plain people, confirms greatly what we have before said. Gen. 35:2; Zeph. 1:8; Isa. 3:16-24.

The giving and attending great dinners, lavish banquets and wedding-feasts (though one may never be found in taverns or tippling-houses), where everything is in profusion, and where the beneficent gifts of the Lord which should not be used otherwise than with great thankfulness, and of which a portion naturally belongs to the poor, are squandered and consumed without the least necessity, even by those who are considered sober and temperate, is an incontrovertible evidence of a sensual and wanton heart; and proves also that those who have much to do with these things, cannot be exculpated from living after the flesh; for which carnal life certainly has no promise of salvation, but on the contrary, many severe threatenings of the wrath and displeasure of God, nay, of eternal damnation, are recorded in the blessed leaves of the Word of God, which contains nothing but the truth. Esth. 1:3-8; Dan. 5:1-3; Luke 12:19, 20; 16:19.

O how different is this from the life of a true Christian, who has forsaken himself and his lusts. How great the step that is between their walk and that of the holy martyrs, who delivered up, not only their carnal desires, but also their bodies and lives, unto death for the Lord's sake! But how great a difference will also be between the two classes afterwards I When the former, having had their good things in this life, shall be shut out from the true, heavenly riches, but the latter, because they have love to God, renounced and abandoned their possessions, which might have led them into sin, be admitted to the true enjoyment of the heavenly riches and pleasures, and that for ever and ever I Mal. 3:18.

Here shall obtain what is recorded concerning the end of the luxurious rich man and that of poor Lazarus: that the rich man, when he saw Lazarus in Abraham's bosom, while lie himself was in hell, received this answer to his doleful lamentations, "Son, remember, that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented." Luke 16:25. Appropriate is here also Wis. 5:1, 2.

Nevertheless, these and similar evil examples are constantly presented to our eyes, and they are the more pernicious and dangerous for the reason that some worldly-minded people pronounce them to be non-essential, unimportant for either good or evil, and therefore, allowable; while it is the same with them as with the fruit from the tree of knowledge, which stood in the midst of Paradise, and was pleasant to the eyes, but deadly in the use, for whoever ate of it, had to die, Gen. 2:17; or with the apples which grow in the land of Sodom, on the border of the dead sea; which possess a beautiful red appearance, but contain, as some have written, only dust and ashes, and are inedible, nay, even deleterious to health. Bijb. Naemb. edition 1632, fol. 881, Col. 2, concerning the name Sodom, ex Philippo Melanchthone. Also Bernh. Bredenb. in Tract, super Siddim. Also H. Buntung, Itinerarium sacrw scripturoe, edition 1642, lib. r, pag. 62, col. 2, etc.

O that Satan would show himself, as he really is, and that the world, too, might come forth without disguise or mask; then certainly no one possessing reason would allow himself to be deceived by them. For in Satan nothing would be seen but deadly snares, traps and murdering daggers for the soul, poisoned arrows wherewith to destroy everything good in man, through unbelief, apostasy from God, impenitent obduracy, and despair; which are followed by a train made up o~ the fears of hell and horrors of damnation. In the world men would perceive nothing but vanity, mingled with much vexation, sorrow, grief and misery, and this in such abundance, that if as many tears could be wept over it, as there is water in all the sea and all the rivers, yet the weight of the true sorrow that springs from them it could not be adequately expressed, for they draw after them not only temporal but also everlasting miseries.

But, O how lamentable! all this is hid under a beautiful appearance. Satan appears to be a prince or king, and the world a noble princess or queen. The servants and servantmaids who follow them as pages and maids of honor, appear as cavaliers and ladies, reveling in joy and delight; though, as regards the soul, they are poor and deformed; yea, meaner than beggars, and without the true joy which delights the upright soul in God.*

There is, therefore, great danger of being deceived. O, ye upright children of God, be on your guard.** Let your simplicity be coupled with prudence. Your faith as well as your life are the objects aimed at. If Satan gain the mastery over you, your precious faith which has been commended to your keeping as dearly as your soul, is ruined. If ye are overcome by the world, it will soon put an end to your Christian and virtuous life, without which latter the best of faith is of no avail. Care, therefore, my dear friends, equally well for both, for the one is as important as the other. Faith


*" It is a very lamentable fact that the things fraught with danger are not as they appear, and appear not as they really are. Is not the fish caught with a bait, in which is concealed the hook? Are not the birds ensnared in the net, in which berries or grains of corn are scattered for them to eat? Certainly. Is it to be wondered then, that blind, carnal and worldly-minded men are deceived and led into perdition by the wiles of Satan and the alluring lusts of a deceitful world?
* Meanwhile the prudent knight and valiant champion of Christ must be on his guard and constantly in arms, that he may neither by the one nor by the other be diverted from his noble watch over his soul, which has been entrusted to him, and thus be led away and cast, either in soul or body, or according to both, into the direful abyss of perdition.
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without the corresponding life, or the life without the faith, can, will, and may not avail before God. They are like two witnesses, who must agree, and of whom the one cannot stand or be received without the other.

Knowing, then, that we must care for both, there remains nothing for us but to do it, however, this work must certainly not only be begun, but also finished, according to the example of the steadfast martyrs of God; with which finishing, whether it be brought about in a natural or a violent manner, according as liberty or persecution brings about we must comfort ourselves, since it is certain that the crown is not to be found in the beginning or in the middle, but at the end.*

But as necessary as it is to finish well, so necessary it is also to begin well, and, having begun, to go on well; for without a good beginning and a good progress it is impossible to attain to a good end.

We speak to you, then, most beloved in the Lord, who have begun with us; received the same faith with us; and with us as a token of this have been baptized.

Surely, we have made a vow to the Lord, which we cannot recall, as David sings, "Offer unto God thanksgiving; and pay thy vows unto the most High." Ps. 50:14.

We have, through faith, received Christ, the Son of God, as our Prophet, Priest, King, Shepherd, Friend, and Bridegroom; and in this we must go on and grow stronger. This, Paul teaches us, saving, "As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught," etc. Col. 2:6, 7. Hereby we have come from the darkness of ignorance to the true light of knowledge; which we are commanded to keep in perpetual remembrance. In this direction tend the words, "But call to remembrance the former days, in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions;" etc. Heb. 10

32. In short, "Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing." Phil. 3:16."Building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost, keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life." Jude 20, 21."Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, to the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen." Verses 24 and 25. Isa. 40:30, 31; Phil. 4:13.

We would now commend you, beloved brethren and sisters, to the Lord and to the word of ,His grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified. Our work which has been done for your benefit, is now finished in this respect; that you


*" O that this would be considered, as it should! may make good use of it, is our friendly desire Remember us always in your prayers, until we de part this life; Phil. 1:23, that God may be gracious unto us now and in eternity. We hope, on our part, to do the same for you. O that God would grant, that we all, without one missing, might behold one another, face to face, in the kingdom of God! I Cor. 13:12.
Meantime we rejoice in the salvation of the Lord; for it sometimes seems to us, as if Heaven had come down upon earth; or that we were ascending from earth to heaven. II Cor. 12:1-12 etc; or that we, who are still among men, held communion with God and His holy angels; or that eternal heavenly joy and glory were offered to us; nay, that we had a foretaste of those thing which mortal eye hath never seen, nor ear heard, nor heart experienced, in this life.*

We walk no longer upon earth. with our thoughts; nevertheless, we are still encompassed by a cloud of earth, a body of clay, a heavy load of the soul. O, that we were free from it, and that our soul, liberated from this load, might return to God in heaven, her true origin! like a freed dove which has been confined in a strange place, returns to her nest and abode. But we must wait for this until the time which God has appointed, comes.

Let us be patient together, then, most beloved in the Lord, till the day come, which, if we remain faithful unto the end, will assuredly bring us that which we here wait for in hope. Then the tears, which we, sighing and longing for the highest salvation of God, have wept here, shall surely be wiped away from our eyes; then shall we no longer see through a glass, darkly, but face to face; then shall the heavenly be shown us no longer in thought or in spirit, but it shall be given us, and we be made participants of it, by experience alone, in truth and in deed. O great and precious subject! we can go no further: our reason cannot comprehend it; our earthly tongue cannot express it!

Yours very affectionally in the Lord,
TH. J. VAN BRAGHT.

Dort, July the 25th, 1659.

http://homecomers.org/mirror/martyrs001.htm#6


sermonindex Jun 12, 2013

Andrew whether you live in England, Europe, the US, or N. Korea. The choice is the same. Will you choose the broad easy way to destruction. Or will you choose the narrow hard way that leads to life.

To put it simply. Will one choose Christ or Satan.

No one chooses Satan. No one. You make the question of eternity sound like a bag of sweets. Do you not know that Christ is the One Who chooses? What man chooses Satan comprehending Christ? It is a complete fallacy.

sermonindex Jun 13, 2013

Brother you love to find argument in everything. Man's choice of Satan goes back to the garden itself. Even in a state, not tainted by sin, Adam and Eve chose to listen to Satan's wiles and not God's commands.

This thread started with a choice. Life or death. Jesus or the devil. You cannot have both. This is what the verses of Mathew 7:13-14 set before you. A choice. The question. Which will you choose. The narrow way of life. Or the broad road to destruction.

Brother this is the choice we each must make. And that in a daily basis.

Bearmaster.

sermonindex Jun 13, 2013

Brother you love to find argument in everything. Man's choice of Satan goes back to the garden itself. Even in a state, not tainted by sin, Adam and Eve chose to listen to Satan's wiles and not God's commands.

This thread started with a choice. Life or death. Jesus or the devil. You cannot have both. This is what the verses of Mathew 7:13-14 set before you. A choice. The question. Which will you choose. The narrow way of life. Or the broad road to destruction.

Brother this is the choice we each must make. And that in a daily basis.

It is very easy to say that someone finds argument in everything, but it ought to be understood that some brethren have more intimate knowledge of this subject than others. For myself I do not hold to sayings and theological arguments or ideas which though they sound scriptural, in reality have little to do with spiritual deception, which lies at the heart of the problem of believers failing to walk in the spirit in this day. This is not the first century in Jerusalem or Corinth.

I find it difficult to understand how anyone is expected to really address the problem of worldliness or the love of the things of the world, by simply saying "choose Christ or Satan". It is really a misconception at its root. Those who believe have already chosen Christ or else they have not believed at all. If they have believed, being worldly minded does not set them on another way. In the flesh no one has to make any choice whatsoever regardless of how we imagine things, because the flesh is by nature opposed to God, cannot be subject to God or His laws, and is always inclined to do those things which at very least serve Satan's purposes as the author of sin and death. Given that this discussion can only have any merit for those who are in fact the Lord's people the claim "choose Christ or Satan" is difficult to understand. Except however if at the back of it lies a claim that worldly believers are not believers at all. Which of course is precisely the claim being promoted. I don't have an argument with that I simply reject it. It lacks understanding and compassion. It is also no use as an observation in teaching men how to walk in the spirit.

Similarly what happened to Adam and Eve are themselves very different things. They are two people and they responded to the deception of Satan in the garden in very different ways. Not least that Adam was not deceived. In persisting with this vulgar analogy that the narrow way does not simply mean Christ, but means Christ and a total comprehension of sin, the flesh and the devil, as opposed to the broad way which means a life of self interest, fleshiness and worldliness, lies just one more way to express the same lie. The lie is a simple one. It is this. "Serve Christ perfectly or else you are not Christ's". To that end I say there is no such choice as "choose Christ or Satan". It all adds up to a pharisaic burden and no benefit whatsoever. Its no wonder that so many believers are minded to liberal thinking when the alternative is "you are either of Christ or Satan".

If all of that seems to you to be argumentative then by all means say so. You will be just one man among others that feel inclined to say so.

C
Christinyou Jun 13, 2013

I cannot choose Christ, for He has chosen me first.

I did not choose satan to be my father, but he was.

Joh 6:70 Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
Joh 13:18 I speak not of you all: I know whom I have chosen: but that the scripture may be fulfilled, He that eateth bread with me hath lifted up his heel against me.
Joh 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
Joh 15:19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.

He that lifted up his foot against the Lord could do nothing more or less, for it was written.

In Christ: Phillip

A
allaboard Jun 13, 2013

fifteen

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