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consensus of SI preachers, when it comes to including spanking in child training (for or against)

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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

I am opening this thread, to get a consensus of what The Preachers presented on SI, teach or believe, when it comes to the inclusion of spanking, in child training.

Quotes or statements with the inclusion of the source from which they where derived is Preferred

this is not intended as a debate thread, but rather as a research thread.

(for or against) Statements or quotes are both welcome.

Every Christian Preacher presented on SI is obviously oppossed to abuse! so statements in opposition to abuse do not classify as statements opposed to Biblical discipline.

But statements or quotes from preachers presented on SI whom may directly oppose the traditional understanding of the rod of correction or oppose the traditional use of spanking in child training are welcome.

Again this is not a debate thread, If an issue comes up that one feels needs much disscussion please start a new thread.

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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

David Legge:

... "Thirdly, we are to discipline them. The word 'nurture' that you have is quite a weak translation, if I can say that, for a stronger translation is 'chasten'. It means instruction, and indeed in Hebrews 12 - you know the passage about disciples, the Lord's children, being chastened - it's exactly the same word. It's the idea of learning through discipline, and it's talking about correction that may be verbal, or indeed corporal. Now, we're getting onto a thorny issue here - for today some psychologists and educators, and children's workers and social workers oppose any corporal punishment at all. They see it as an archaic philosophy of punishment that's outdated, we have evolved beyond that in our mental state and physically speaking. The cry is: 'Let them express themselves! Let them do as they wish! If you discipline them, if you punish them, it will suppress their personalities and perhaps warp their characters' - and sadly even some Christians today now have swallowed this belief that their children will grow up scarred if they are punished.

Well, children are expressing themselves alright. I'm well aware of the backdrop of child abuse in this evil world, and indeed of parents who have taken this principle to Satanic extremes of abuse - but again, let us say this: beware that we do not opt for a knee-jerk reaction! We must beware that we don't throw the baby of biblical corporal punishment out with the bath water of brutality! You see, this is what the church does at times - because the world, or some evil people in the world, go in a certain direction we forget about the whole thing entirely! Now, let me say this, and let me be clear: that a heavy-handed approach to child discipline is forbidden by the word of God. 'Provoke not thy children to wrath' covers it; 'Love them not in anger', lest you injure the body or lest you injure the spirit and they turn away from you or turn away from God.

We're not talking about flying off the handle - and I support any efforts to eradicate such sinful behaviour - but to ban smacking is unbiblical, it is a denial of the word of God and those who ban it will reap what they sow in rebellious children. That's what you find within the word of God, and let me say this: you hear some comparisons of what smacking is like, and I want to say that it's like comparing extracting a rotten tooth with grievous bodily harm! Isn't it? To say that this is physical abuse? And let me go a further step: to say that this is wrong is to accuse God of sin! Now beware, for in Hebrews 12 verse 6 it says this: 'For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth'. Proverbs 13:24: 'He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes'. Is God wrong? Let's discuss this a minute (only I'm going to be the only one speaking, that's the only thing!). Let's think about it: is God wrong, is He? Why do we have to upstage God? Why do we always have to make a better idea? Now I'm not talking about using a cannon to squash a flea or anything like that - Evangelist Brady Wilson said of his mother that she had an old razor strap which hung on a nail in the kitchen and under it was the sign: 'I Need Thee Every Hour' - that's not what I'm talking about. In fact an over use of discipline will be useless at all, won't it? It'll lose the whole impact of the thing! And I'm not saying that if you discipline your child you'll have a model Christian or a model citizen on the earth, I'm not saying if your child has failed that you didn't do anything right - but what I'm saying here is: in the word of God there's a principle and it means this: if you want to give your child the greatest opportunity of development in every area of life, like the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, you'll discipline!

Speaking of disciplining your children, Susannah Wesley - the mother of 17 children, including John and Charles - said this: 'The parent who studies to subdue self-will', studying to subdue self-will, 'in his child works together with God in renewing and the saving of his soul. The parents who indulges it does the Devil's work, makes religion impractical, salvation unattainable, and does all that in him lies to damn his child, soul and body, forever'."

http://www.preachtheword.com/sermon/eph26.shtml

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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

Tim Conway : If you discipline your child right, guess what by the end they are hugging you. Oh the world does not believe such things, they think spanking is cruel but I tell you if you do it right and you do it in love, your child will qling tightly to you by the end, if you do it wrong they will go out resenting you...... http://illbehonest.com/what-does-discipline-from-the-lord-look-like-tim-conway

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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

Zac poonon :... and further in verse 15, and foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child but the rod of discipline will remove it far from him , isn't that interesting, their is foolishness in the heart of every child, but take a rod and hit him on the bottom and discipline him, their is a connection between that bottom and his heart, foolishness is driven out of the heart..,

https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/myvideo/photo.php?lid=3156


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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

David Servant:

"Child Discipline

The child who is never disciplined will grow up to be selfish and rebellious toward authority. Children should be disciplined any time they defiantly disobey reasonable rules that have been established beforehand by their parents. Children should not be punished for mistakes or childish irresponsibility. They should, however, usually be required to face the consequences of their mistakes and irresponsibilities, thus helping to prepare them for the realities of adult life.

Young children should be disciplined by means of spanking, as God's Word instructs. New babies, of course, should not be spanked. This does not mean that babies should always be given their own way. In fact, from the day of birth it should be clear to them that mother and father are in charge. They can be taught at a very young age what the word "no" means by simply restraining them from doing what they are doing or about to do. Once they begin to understand what "no " means, a small slap on their buttocks will help them understand even better when they don't stop those actions that the parent desires them to stop. If this is done consistently, children will learn to be obedient at a very young age.

Parents can also establish their authority by not reinforcing undesirable behavior in their children, such as immediately giving them what they want every time they cry. To do so is to teach children to cry in order to gain their desires. Or, if parents yield to the demands of their children every time they throw a temper tantrum or whine, such parents are actually encouraging such undesirable behavior. Wise parents only reward behavior that is desirable in their children.

Spankings should not be physically harmful but should certainly generate enough pain to cause the disobedient child to cry for a short time. In this way, the child will learn to associate disobedience with pain. This the Bible affirms:

He who spares his rod hates his son, but he who loves him disciplines him diligently....Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child; the rod of discipline will remove it far from him....Do not hold back discipline from the child, although you beat him with the rod, he will not die. You shall beat him with the rod, and deliver his soul from Sheol....The rod and reproof give wisdom, but a child who gets his own way brings shame to his mother (Prov. 13:24; 22:15; 23:13-14; 29:15).

When parents simply enforce their rules, they do not need to threaten children to make them obedient. If a child defiantly disobeys, he should be spanked. If a parent only threatens to spank his disobedient child, he is only reinforcing his child's continued disobedience. As a result, the child learns not to be concerned about being obedient until his parents' verbal threats reach a certain volume.

After the spanking has been administered, the child should be hugged and reassured of his parent's love."


http://www.heavensfamily.org/ss/discipleship-teaching-21/child-discipline

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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

John Piper:

"Would Jesus spank a child? If so, where would you point someone biblically who can't imagine him doing this?

If Jesus were married and had children, I think he would have spanked the children.

The place that I would go to help a person see that he would, when they can't imagine that he would, is Matthew 5 where he said, "Not a jot nor a tittle will pass away from the Law until all is accomplished." In other words, all the Law and the Prophets stand until they're done. And the Law says, "Spare the rod, spoil the child." That's a paraphrase. The book of Proverbs says, "If you withhold the rod, you hate your son." Jesus believed the Bible, and he would have done it.

Now, that does not address the heart of the issue. The heart of the issue is: Why does this person feel this way? What worldview inclines a person to think that you shouldn't spank a child? Where does that come from?

Well it comes straight out of this culture, I think. There's a sign that used to be on the side of the 35W bridge, on the right as you go north. And the sign simply said this: "Never, never, never, never, never hurt a child." That's all it said! And spanking is equated with hurting children. It's against the law in Sweden to spank a child. And it's against the law, I think, in some states in America. I'm not sure.

Well, I will go to jail over that issue! Talitha is to the point where I don't think in terms of spanking my 13-year-old daughter anymore. But I did when she was little.

I could give a whole theology of spanking here, but maybe I'll just boil it down. Why does this person feel squeamish about spanking? My guess is that it is a wrong view of God.

Deep down, does this person believe that God brings pain into our lives? Because Hebrews 12:6 makes the direct connection: God disciplines every son whom he loves, and spanks everyone that he delights in (my paraphrase). And the point there is suffering. God brings sufferings into our lives, and the writer of the Hebrews connects it to the parenting of God of his children.

This is a wrong view of God! God uses suffering to discipline his children. So do we.

Now, you don't damage a child. You don't give him a black eye or break his arm. Children have little fat bottoms so that they can be whopped.

When my sons were three and four years old, at their worst stages, drawing with orange crayons on the wall, they knew what was going to happen. So one day, just to give you an illustration of how this works emotionally, I found an orange mark on the wall in the hall upstairs from a crayon. Just about Barnabas' height. And he's three or four.

So I get Barnabas. I say, "Come here Barnabas. Did you make that mark on the wall."

"Yes." At least he's honest.

I said, "We have a rule against that. You know you cannot draw on the wall with your crayons. You're old enough to know that."

"Yes."

"So what should happen?"

"A spanking."

I said, "That's right." So I take him in the room, and whop! And he cries easy, so he cries. And when he's done crying, there's a big hug. And I say, "Don't do that again, OK? Daddy loves you and we don't mark on the wall, OK?"

Three minutes later he is bouncing off the walls, happy happy happy.

Now if I had said to him, "You go into your room and you sit there and you stay there until you feel appropriately guilty, and then we'll see if you come out and do the right thing," what a wicked way to punish a child!

Spanking is so clean! It's so quick! It's so relieving! A kid feels like he has done atonement and he is out of there and happy.

To these modern ideas of timeout, or sitting in the corner, I say, "Bologna! Give me a spanking! I want to go play!"

I just think spanking is really healthy for children. It is a measured deliverance of a non-damaging act of mild pain that makes the child feel the seriousness of what he's done. It is not beating. It is not abuse. There is a clear difference. The very word "spank" exists because there is such a thing as a loving way to whop a child on his behind or his chunky thigh."

http://www.desiringgod.org/resource-library/ask-pastor-john/would-jesus-spank-a-child

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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

Ray Comfort:
" I read recently where mother from Texas was sentenced to probation, and lost custody of her children--for spanking her daughter! "Rosalina Gonzales of Corpus Christi pleaded guilty on Wednesday to injury to a child for swatting the two-year-old on her buttocks." More than 53 million babies have been murdered in America through abortion, and the law says that's okay. No crime has been committed. But a judge makes a criminal out of a mother who disciples her child, and then he takes her children from her, leaving them without a mother. Judge Jose Longoria said, "In the old days, maybe we got spanked, but there was a different quarrel. You don't spank children." What planet does this judge live on? In days of old we didn't have kids who murdered their parents, shot their schoolmates, lied daily, stole whatever they wanted, blasphemed as a normal part of conversation, or killed themselves with drugs and alcohol.How is a parent supposed to discipline a child? Andy Griffith used the woodshed. But that was in the days of old, when Americans didn't even need to lock their doors. Nowadays we do. Today our prisons are full of people who weren't given proper boundaries at home, and now they have immovable boundaries given to them by the government. In Psalm 1, Scripture gives us a clear picture of what a godly person should be, as well as the reward of this godliness."Blessed is the man who walks not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor stands in the path of sinners, nor sits in the seat of the scornful; but his delight is in the law of the Lord, and in His law he meditates day and night. He shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that brings forth its fruit in its season, whose leaf also shall not wither; and whatever he does shall prosper" (vv. 1–3).Let's meditate on these verses to truly understand their meaning and consider how they apply to parenting.God says that you are blessed (highly favored) if you don't listen to the world's advice. If you are tempted to heed the "counsel of the ungodly," consider that the world's "experts" believe mankind evolved from monkeys. A little thought on our part should help us see why it's wise not to listen to their ramblings, but rather listen to what the Creator has to say.The fruit of the world's godless advice is seen in the headlines of the daily news. Their counsel may sound right, but so often it proves to be wrong. For example, the world says that if you love your children, you will never physically discipline them. It says to seek alternatives rather than inflicting physical pain.In the Book of Proverbs, written by the wisest man who ever lived, God's Word gives the following counsel:"Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child, but the rod of correction will drive it far from him." (Proverbs 22:15)"The rod and reproof give wisdom, but a child left to himself brings shame to his mother." (Proverbs 29:15)It's commonly said that he who spares the rod spoils the child, but God's Word actually puts it more strongly:"He who spares his rod hates his son, but he who loves him disciplines him promptly." (Proverbs 13:24, emphasis added)So there's your choice: listen to what seems right, or do what God says is right.As parents, we should always do what the Word of God says to do, and often that's not easy. Applying the rod of correction (often called "the board of education") to "the seat of learning" takes resolution, as well as courage. But love will do it. The Bible says that in doing so you will save your children from hell (see Proverbs 23:13,14), and what parents want their children to go to end up in hell? We should value the eternal welfare of our children, rather than our own temporal anxiety when it comes to applying discipline. The contrast between God's ways and the world's ways were clearly demonstrated in an incident that occurred when our eldest son, Jacob, was six years old. We had a neighbor who would never even think of physically disciplining her six-year-old. When he refused to go to school, she would simply bribe him with candy.One day Jacob said a word to his mother that he wasn't supposed to say. I sent him to his room, and then followed him a moment later. I asked him if he knew that what he said was wrong. He admitted that he did. I then told him to bend over his bed, and resolutely gave him a swift swat across his rear with a small stick. He burst into tears. I went to get him a tissue, then left him for ten minutes. When I returned, I knelt down in front of him and we hugged. I then looked him in the eyes and said, "I want you to pray and ask God to forgive you, then go out to your mother and tell her that you are sorry." He did just that.A few minutes later I was helping Sue dry the dishes while Jacob sat at the table, thoughtfully holding a pencil and paper. Suddenly I felt a tug on my shirt. It was Jacob. He reached up and handed me a note. It read: "I love my dad."This made no sense to me. I had just caused him physical pain, yet even as a six-year-old he could discern that my motive was love. In contrast, the neighbor's six-year-old would point a toy gun at his mother and say, "I hate you, I hate you. I'm going to kill you!" Of course, he wasn't disciplined for that either.Tragically, the world refuses to use the rod of correction to drive "foolishness" from the hearts of their children. The foolishness therefore remains in their hearts as they grow (atheism is a case in point), and many children bring their parents nothing but grief by ending up pregnant, in prison, with drug or alcohol problems, or with broken marriages.
Adapted from How to Bring Your Children to Christ, and Keep Them There."

http://www.worldviewweekend.com/worldview-times/article.php?articleid=7288

sermonindex Jun 15, 2013

I write this with no rancor, but the world is on fire right now, and I get this thread with such deep bon mots from John Piper as:

"I could give a whole theology of spanking here, but maybe I'll just boil it down......Children have little fat bottoms so that they can be whopped."

oh that's a mighty revelation from John Piper. My precious Boomey, who is now 17, and in college AND working a full time jog being mentored by a powerful family friend in property management, AT MOST, received 5 "pop's" on his rear end, when he was a wee lad.

Why is it, that we never talk about what I viewed as CENTRAL to MY philosophy on child rearing, two fold...one: you can NEVER kiss a childs cheek and head TOO MANY times....between his dear mother and I, that boy was held and kissed and loved and valued beyond reckoning, to such a degree, that at 17 years of age, when so many children are in either active rebellion,or just outright disdain their parents.....last night at one in the morning, my son and I spent 2 hours on the phone, watching a HUGE thunder cell on the radar move over our ranch, laughing, whilst we chatted about a dozen other topics, ranging from Christ IN you, to what a bad path this nation is headed, with its lies and the populaces ignorance, etc

which leads to my second raising a child point, which is, from the SECOND the lad was born, I spoke to him with adult level vocabulary, which is why I have 17 year old in COLLEGE, and servicing realty accounts.

Parenting is all about showing, not telling, and I have been feasting for months now on what I will share with you all...six months ago, maybe more, his mother told me on the QT, that out of nowhere, our son asked her, "Do you know who I think is the most moral, upright and noble man I ever met?"

she asked "who?"

"Daddy" was his reply, I started crying joy, and two days later, I told him, I heard of this parise from him, how it blessed me, and told him this, "That what he witnesses is the Divine Reality of Jesus living IN me, and thru me"....to which he heartedly agreed, as he is a God fearing and well saved young man.

am I the "perfect father"? Heavens no! but I do kiss and hug him every chance I get.

hence the more profitable discussion is about those invaluable kisses freely given, than the five "pops" I had to give...or whether or not Jesus would have "spanked" his children, just foolish palaver.....ad I say that in respect PP, as it was Piper, who spoke as such.

with the ways things are going in Syria, and our foolish empire meddling and scheming there, we're two steps away from a direct face off with the Russians....which means the last thing you might see is the white hot chalky blinding light of a nuclear detonation. so hug those children while you still can.

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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

RE: ///hence the more profitable discussion is about those invaluable kisses freely given, than the five "pops" I had to give...or whether or not Jesus would have "spanked" his children, just foolish palaver.....ad I say that in respect PP, as it was Piper, who spoke as such.///

I have asked that this not to be a disscussion thread, If you would like to find a quote, statement or artical pertaining to spanking in child training (for or against) made from any preacher presented on SI, please include it.

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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

John MacArthur :

"The subject of spanking is baffling to many parents. Part of the problem is the confusion of the times in which we live. It has been popular for more than half a century to decry corporal punishment as inherently inappropriate, counterproductive, and detrimental to the child. Psychologist, mother, and well-known anti-spanking activist Penelope Leach distills the typical humanist perspective on corporal punishment: "I believe that spanking--or tapping, or slapping, or cuffing, or shaking, or beating, or whipping--children is actually wrong. I also believe . . . that far from producing better disciplined people, spanking makes it much more difficult to teach children how to behave" (Online Source). Notice how she equates spanking with slapping, cuffing, shaking, beating, whipping, and "tapping." But those are not all the same thing, and they should not be likened to the rod of discipline administered in love.

Opponents of corporal punishment will often cite surveys and statistics that seem to support their findings, but precisely because they begin by equating brutal acts of violence against children with properly administered corporal discipline, their results are skewed. Of course cruel punishment and brute violence against children is wrong, counterproductive, and unbiblical.

But, Scripture does nonetheless prescribe the rod of discipline as a necessary aspect of parenting. In fact, Scripture flatly contradicts modern opponents of corporal punishment: "He who spares his rod hates his son, but he who loves him disciplines him promptly" (Proverbs 13:24). "Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child; the rod of correction will drive it far from him" (22:15). "You shall beat him with a rod, and deliver his soul from hell" (23:14; see also 10:13; 19:18).

Moreover, according to a 1998 article in U.S. News and World Report, "parenting experts" have based all their findings against corporal punishment "on a body of research that is at best inconclusive and at worst badly flawed" ( Online Source ). According to the article, some recent studies indicate that spanking, when used appropriately, does indeed make children "less likely to fight with others and more likely to obey their parents." In fact, in one very thorough study, Psychologist Robert E. Larzelere, director of residential research at Boys Town in Nebraska, found that no other discipline technique, including timeout and withdrawal of privileges, had more beneficial results for children under thirteen than non-abusive spanking, in terms of getting children to comply with their parents' wishes.

Many who oppose corporal punishment simply are not willing to look at the facts and statistics rationally. One critic of spanking bluntly states that as far as he is concerned, "Hitting children is not a subject to which rational debate applies. It is another manifestation of American's unique exploitation of children as models for absolutist behavior standards and austere punishments that grown adults would not impose on themselves" (Mike A. Males, The Scapegoat Generation, 116).

Christian parents should not be duped by such "experts." Scripture itself prescribes corporal discipline and cautions parents not to abandon the use of the rod. In the end, the facts will be found to agree with the Word of God. And in that vein, the U.S. News article actually offers some tidbits of very sound advice: "One lesson of the spanking controversy is that whether parents spank or not matters less than how they spank. . . . A single disapproving word can bring a sensitive child to tears, while a more spirited youngster might need stronger measures. Finally, spankings should be done in private to spare children humiliation and without anger" (Online Source).

It might be worthwhile to reiterate the fact that parental discipline should never injure the child. It is never necessary to bruise your children in order to spank them hard enough to make your point. Spanking should always be administered with love and never when the parent is in a fit of rage. That sort of discipline is indeed abusive, wrong, and detrimental to the child, because it shatters the environment of loving nurture and instruction Ephesians 6:4 describes.

Furthermore, spanking is by no means the only kind of discipline parents should administer. There are many other viable forms of punishing children that, on occasion, can be used in addition to the rod. If the child responds immediately to a verbal rebuke in a given situation, a spanking is probably not necessary. Other punishments, such as withdrawing privileges, can also be used as occasional alternatives to spanking if the situation warrants it.

Much of our parental discipline should be totally positive. Parents can and should provide guidance for their children by rewarding them for positive behavior, as well as by punishing them for wrong behavior. Both sides of the equation are important. Positive motivation is entirely legitimate and can often be an effective means of getting children to obey. Notice, in fact, that the promise God Himself attached to the Fifth Commandment is a positive motivation. The commandment was reinforced with a promise, not a threat. It is often appropriate to say to your child, "If you do this, I will reward you in this way."

Balanced discipline involves both negative and positive reinforcements. In fact, we might sum up all discipline by saying it means giving the appropriate reward for the conduct. When the conduct (including both attitudes and actions) is good, a positive reward is warranted. When the conduct is bad, a negative reward is in order. It's really that simple.

Yet parents seem incurably confused about these issues. Even many Christian parents I know are practically paralyzed with fear about whether, when, how, and how much to discipline their children. But what Scripture says is straightforward: You have a depraved and foolish child, and if you want him not to be so foolish, spank him (Prov. 22:15). You have a solemn responsibility before God to provide an environment of nurture and instruction where your child will constantly be exposed to God's truth (Deut. 6:6-7). In short, you need to be careful not to provoke your children to wrath, but bring them up in the training and admonition of the Lord (Eph. 6:4).


http://www.gty.org/resources/Articles/A216/Parenting-in-an-AntiSpanking-Culture

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proudpapa Jun 15, 2013

A.W. Pink:

"Discipline Your Children

Third, instruction and example is to be enforced by correction and discipline. This means, first of all, the exercise of authority-the proper reign of law. Of the father of the faithful, God said, “For I know him, that he will command his children and his household after him, and they shall keep the way of the Lord, to do justice and judgement; that the Lord may bring upon Abraham that which He hath spoken of him” (Gen 18:19). Ponder this carefully, Christian fathers. Abraham did more than offer good advice: he enforced law and order in his household. The rules he administered had for their design the keeping of the “way of the Lord”-that which was right in His sight. And this duty was performed by the patriarch in order that the blessing of God might rest on his family. No family can be properly brought up without household laws, which include reward and punishment, and these are especially important in early childhood, when as yet moral character is unformed and moral motives are not understood or appreciated.

Rules should be simple, clear, reasonable and flexible like the Ten Commandments – a few great moral rules, instead of a multitude of petty restrictions. One way of needlessly provoking children to wrath is to hamper them with a thousand trifling restrictions and minute regulations that are arbitrary, due to a parent who is a perfectionist. It is of vital importance for the child’s future good that he or she should be brought into subjection at an early age: an untrained child means a lawless adult-our prisons are crowded with those who were allowed to have their own way during their youth. The least offense of a child against the rulers of the home ought not to pass without due correction, for if it find leniency in one direction toward one offense, it will expect the same towards others, and then disobedience will become more frequent till the parent has no control except that of brute force.

The teaching of Scripture is crystal clear on this point. “Foolishness is bound in the heart of the child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him” (Prov 22:15; and cf. 23:13,14). Therefore God has said, “He that spareth the rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes” (Prov 13:24). And again, “Chasten thy son while there is yet hope, and let not thy soul spare for his crying” (Prov 19:18). Let not a foolish fondness stop you: certainly God loves His children with a deeper parental affection than you can love yours, yet He tells us “As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten” (Rev 3:19 and cf. Heb 12:6). “The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to shame” (Prov 29:15). Such severity must be used in their early years, before age and obstinacy have hardened the child against the fear and sting of correction. Spare the rod, and you spoil the child: use it not on him, and you lay up one for your own back."

http://www.raisinggodlychildren.org/2011/07/word-to-parents-by-arthur-w-pink_04.html

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proudpapa Jun 16, 2013

"As you train your children, make sure that you maintain a constant fear of being an over-indulgent parent.

This is the one point out of all the rest on which you have the most need to be on your guard. It is natural to be tender and affectionate towards your own flesh and blood, and it is the excess of this very tenderness and affection which you have to fear. Be careful that it does not make you blind to your children's faults, and deaf to all the advice that I am giving to you. Be careful that your love for them does not make you overlook their bad conduct, rather than you experiencing the pain of inflicting punishment and correction.

I am very aware that punishment and correction are disagreeable things. Nothing is more unpleasant than giving pain to those we love, and causing them to cry. But so long as hearts are what hearts are, it is vain to suppose, as a general rule, that children can ever be brought up without correction.

Spoiling is a very expressive word, and sadly full of meaning. Now the quickest way to spoil children is to let them have their own way—to allow them to do wrong and not to punish them for it. Believe me, you must not do this, whatever pain it may cost you unless you wish to ruin your children's souls.

You cannot say that Scripture does not specifically speak on this subject, listen to God’s Holy Word:

"He who spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is careful to discipline him." [Proverbs 13:24]

"Discipline your son, for in that there is hope; do not be a willing party to his death." [Proverbs 19:18]

"Folly is bound up in the heart of a child, but the rod of discipline will drive it far from him." [Proverbs 22:15]

"Do not withhold discipline from a child; if you punish him with the rod, he will not die. Punish him with the rod and save his soul from death." [Proverbs 23:13, 14]

"The rod of correction imparts wisdom, but a child left to himself disgraces his mother." [Proverbs 29:15]

"Discipline your son, and he will give you peace; he will bring delight to your soul." [Proverbs 29:17]

Oh, how strong and compelling are these verses! How sad it is, that in many Christian families they seem almost unknown! Their children need reproof, but it is hardly ever given; they need correction, but it is hardly ever employed. And yet this book of Proverbs is not obsolete and unfit for Christians. It is given by the inspiration of God, and is beneficial. It is given for our learning, even as the Epistles to the Romans and Ephesians. Surely the believer who brings up his children without paying attention to the wisdom of these verses is making himself wise above that which is written, and greatly errs.

Fathers and mothers, I tell you plainly, if you never punish your children when they are at fault, you are doing them a grievous wrong. I warn you, this is the great mistake made by saints of God, in every age, and they have suffered greatly because of it. I beg you to be wise, and avoid making such foolish mistakes. We can see it in Eli's case. His sons Hophni and Phinehas "made themselves contemptible, and he failed to restrain them." [1 Samuel 3:13] He gave them no more than a tame and lukewarm reproof, when he ought to have rebuked them sharply. In one word, he honored his sons above God. And what was the final result? Eli lived to hear of the death of both of his sons in battle, and upon hearing the news he fell over and died, taking the sorrow with him, down to the grave [1 Samuel 2:22-29].

See, also, the case of David. Who can read without pain the history of his children, and their sins? Amnon's incest—Absalom's murder and proud rebellion—Adonijah's scheming ambition: truly these were grievous wounds for the man after God's own heart to receive from his own house. But was he not at fault? I fear there can be no doubt that he was. I find a clue to it all in the account of Adonijah in 1 Kings 1:6, listen to the Scriptures, "His father had never interfered with him by asking, ‘Why do you behave as you do?’" That was the foundation of all the evil. David was an over-indulgent father—a father who let his children have their own way—and he reaped according to what he had sown.

Parents, I plead with you, for your children's sake, beware of over-indulgence. I call on you to remember, that it is your primary duty to consult their real interests, and not their whims and fantasies—to train them, not to humor them—to train them for their benefit, not merely to please them.

You must not give way to every wish and whim of your child's mind, no matter how much you may love him. You must not let him assume that his will is all-important, and that he has only to desire something and it will be done. Do not, I beg you, make your children idols, lest God should take them away, and break your idol, just to convince you of your folly.

Learn to say "No" to your children. Show them that you are able to refuse whatever you think is not right for them. Show them that you are ready to punish disobedience, and that when you speak of punishment, you are not only ready to threaten, but also to perform. Do not threaten too much. Seldom punish, but when you do, make it sincere and firm—frequent and light punishment is truly a wretched system of discipline.

Some parents have a way of saying, "Naughty child," to a boy or girl on every slight occasion, and often without good cause. It is a very foolish habit. Words of condemnation should never be used without real reason.

As to the best way of punishing a child, no general rule can be laid down. The characters of children are so vastly different, that what would be a severe punishment to one child, would be no punishment at all to another. I am emphatically opposed to the modern notion that no child ought ever to be whipped. Doubtless some parents use bodily correction far too much, and far too violently; but many others, I fear, use it far too little.

Beware of letting small faults pass unnoticed under the idea "it is a little one." There are no little things in training children; all are important. Little weeds need plucking up as much as any. Leave them alone, and they will soon be large and overpowering.

Friend, if there is any point which deserves your attention, believe me, it is this one. It is one that will give you trouble, I know. But if you are not willing to put forth the effort, it will take, to discipline your children when they are young, then be assured they will give you plenty of trouble when they are old. Choose which you prefer.

By: J.C. Ryle"

http://www.raisinggodlychildren.org/search/label/The%20Duties%20of%20Parents

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proudpapa Jun 16, 2013

"Patiently submit to the correction which your parents lay upon you. Consider, that God hath commanded them to do it, and that to save your souls from hell; and that they hate you, if they correct you not when there is cause; and that they must not spare for your crying, Prov. 13:24; 22:15; 29:15; 23:13, 14; 19:18. It is not their delight, but for your own necessity. Avoid the fault, and you may escape the correction. How much rather had your parents see you obedient, than hear you cry! It is not long of them, but of yourselves, that you are corrected. Be angry with yourselves, and not with them. It is a wicked child, that instead of being better by correction, will hate his parents for it, and so grow worse. Correction is a means of God's appointment; and therefore go to God on your knees in prayer, and entreat him to bless and sanctify it to you, that it may do you good."

http://www.raisinggodlychildren.org/2013/01/childrens-obedience-by-richard-baxter.html

http://www.raisinggodlychildren.org/2012/02/13-duties-of-parents.html


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proudpapa Jun 16, 2013

"Ironically, Christians are repeating in the church the same error which conservatives recognize and oppose in government and education. The American educational system, the world' s most costly, is an international disgrace, with our students ranking last in most academic comparisons. There are about 500,000 violent incidents each month in our schools, including serious injuries to 1,000teachers. We have 15 to 20 times as many students in special education classes as other developed countries. Psychologists increase their influence by inventing new "scientific" labels tar what used to be known as laziness, selfishness and disobedience. Spanking is now "child abuse" and correction of any kind is avoided as "negative" and harmful to a "positive self:image," which is the key to all "behavior modification." The same delusions have come into the church through "Christian psychology."

http://articles.ochristian.com/article6872.shtml

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proudpapa Jun 16, 2013

". Add physical discipline to moral instruction. I have referred to this subject before, but wish to say in addition, that it is doubtless one of the greatest errors, in the education of children, to overlook the fact, that at that early age the discipline of the rod, will often present to them a more powerful motive than can be brought to bear upon them by moral truth, presented to their uninformed minds. The rod cannot safely be laid aside, until the powers of the mind are so fully developed and the mind so thoroughly instructed, that the whole range of moral truth may be brought to exert its appropriate influence upon the mind, without the infliction of pain. It seems to me, that some parents effect to be wiser than God, in taking it upon them to decide, that it is not wise to use the rod upon children. Prov. 19:18: & 23:13, 14: "Chasten thy son while there is hope. and let not thy soul spare for his crying." "Withhold not correction from the child; for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell."

http://www.gospeltruth.net/children/let_to_parents_cgf_toc.htm

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proudpapa Jun 26, 2013

//Upon this, I bid the child kneel down before me, but he would not till I took hold of his two feet and forced him down. I then bid him say the Lord's Prayer (being informed by his mother he could say it if he would); but he obstinately refused, till at last, after I had given him several blows, he said his prayer as well as could be expected, and I gave him some figs for a reward. And this same child, though not above four years of age, came tonight on deck, and when the other children came to say their prayers to my friend Habersham, he burst out into tears, and would not go away till he had said his too. I mention this as a proof of the necessity of early correction. Children are sensible of it sooner than parents imagine. And if they would but have resolution to break their wills thoroughly when young, the work of conversion would be much easier, and they would not be so troubled with perverse children when they are old//

George Whitfield, George Whitfield’s Journals (Carlisle, PA: Banner of Truth, 1989), p. 146.

http://www.albatrus.org/english/living/discipline/george_whitfield_spanking_with_figs.htm

ps. I am not advocating all that is being posted, I am just researching and giving a consensus of what SI preachers have said on the subject.

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proudpapa Jun 26, 2013

1. Is it not necessary on some occasions for parents or those in charge of children to chastise them?

Yes there are few, if any, families in which it is not necessary at times to resort to some kind of punishment. Severe punishment, however, is not necessary with all children-very far from it-seeing that a firm and decided training from the birth, will, as a rule, secure uniform obedience. When children know that you are determined to be obeyed, and that nothing will move you, they will usually yield such obedience, and that with pleasure.

Nevertheless, there are exceptions. Some children are so naturally obstinate and wilful that they must be dealt most firmly with, and more frequently chastised than others, else their wills will remain unsubdued, and they will neither obey God nor man. It is safe, perhaps, to say that there will be times in the history of all children when at least some mild form of chastisement will be necessary.

2. But ought not parents to seek to make their children obey them and be good from motives of love rather than fear?

Of course they ought. We have already shown this, and shall do so again. When the prevailing spirit in the home is that of fear, that home is radically wrong. Nevertheless, fear has its place in the government of children as in the government of men. Noah was moved by fear to build the ark, and so saved himself and his family. Just so, children will not only be moved by love to keep your rules, and so be good children, but they will often be sensibly assisted in doing so by a seasonable fear of your anger and the punishment which they know you will inflict upon them if they disobey.

3. What are the principal motives that are likely to influence children to obedience?

There are five distinct feelings natural, that is to say common, in the breasts of children to which it is perfectly right for the parent to appeal.

The first and highest motive of obedience is that of AFFECTION. That is, children should obey their parents and those in authority over them because they love them, and they will do so when real affection exists.

The second is that of RIGHTNESS. The child should be taught to obey because he ought to do so; and he should have no choice or feeling in the matter, but simply to find out whether he ought to, and then he should do it because it is right.

The third is that of GAIN. We suppose it is allowable, especially in the case of very young children, for you to help them to do their duty by rewards. We have seldom found any very great advantage ourselves from this (indeed not having practised it very often with our children), but no doubt the promise of books or little treasures of various kinds is helpful in some cases. Sundry lawful and agreeable indulgences, such as holidays, and the like, are quite a legitimate, and even healthy, inducement to children to obey-not as bribes for which they are to do their duty, but as rewards when they have done it.

The fourth is HAPPINESS. It is quite allowable to show the children that to be good is the only way in which they can be happy.

The fifth is FEAR. It is, as we have seen, perfectly permissible for you to appeal to this instinct, and to show the child that if he will not be good he must suffer. Sin and suffering are as closely united as righteousness and happiness, and if he will not obey you it is your duty to make him suffer.

4. But is there not a danger of parents using too much severity in the management of their children?

Yes, there is. Some parents get a notion that if they are to make their children obey, nothing will do but a stern, inflexible, and severe course of treatment, and therefore they are constantly appealing to the principle of fear, and working on it as the means to this end. "Mind you do this!" is the constant cry of one parent or the other, " and if you do not, you shall be whipped, you shall be sent to bed, you shall have some dreaded infliction of some kind," until the poor children's lives are a burden! As we have already seen, fear is a useful and necessary principle in all government. God uses it in appealing to men. But it should not be made the prevailing motive. For the whole house to be constantly filled with an atmosphere of dread, and to be always ringing with threats and mutterings, for faces to be ever covered with gloom, and for punishment in some shape or other to be always hanging over the heads of the little ones, is most injurious to the dispositions of the children. It is also utterly destructive of the happiness of the home. Threaten seldom, and when you have threatened, and the penalty is deserved, inflict it, unless you can find out some way to forgiveness which will make the child equally fear doing wrong in the future.

Chastisement should be the last resort-every other method should be acted upon, and if punishments be regarded as solemn matters, to be seriously inflicted when they are necessary, there will be little necessity for them.

5. Is it a mistake to threaten children with chastisement without any serious intention of inflicting it?

Yes, a most serious one. Parents should make it an unalterable rule never to threaten that which they do not intend to carry out. There are parents who are always saying what punishments they will inflict upon children if they neglect their duty, but who seldom or never carry out their threats. Children soon find this out, and the little punishment, if any, that is inflicted upon them is of no avail, because of the uncertainty they feel regarding it. If father and mother are always threatening to punish, and seldom, if ever, doing it, the children will come to think it does not matter what they say, they will not keep their word.

6. Ought not parents to be fully satisfied in their own minds that the child is really guilty before the infliction of any punishment?

Yes, most certainly they ought. And if there be any room for doubt, the child must have the benefit of it. We have known most serious consequences follow from parents allowing themselves blindly to be possessed with the notion that the children have been guilty of some wrong-doing of which they were innocent, and punishing them because they would not confess to it. Such mistakes are most serious, and calculated to leave marks not only in the memory, but on the nervous system, enduring for a lifetime.

7. Will you name some of the most important considerations that should be borne in mind by parents in inflicting punishment?

(1.) In chastising a child the parents should mind that they are not influenced by selfish anger. No parents are capable of rightly training children who have not the ability to govern their own tempers when their children grieve and offend them.

It is to be feared that with many, not only is the character of the punishment inflicted made to depend upon the humour of the parent at the moment, but the question whether there shall be any punishment at all.

If mother or father happen to be "put out," and be, consequently, in an "irritable " condition when a child commits itself, then the punishment will be prompt, and often far greater than deserved. But if, on the other hand,. the parent is in a good humour, the same offence will as likely as not be passed over altogether.

All this the children soon come to understand, and they soon come also to associate with such punishment the idea of injustice. We need not say that with children, as with older persons, it is utterly in vain to expect any benefit to arise from the infliction of punishment if they are smarting under the feeling that the penalty is out of proportion to the offence committed, or not deserved at all.

Parents should never punish their children while in a state of irritation. If they do, the children will be likely to conclude that they are being chastised, not because they have done wrong, but because father or mother is "in a bad temper."

Better far pass by offence-for a time at least-and wait until you are in a mood sufficiently calm, not only to deal justly with your child, but to make him understand that it is painful to you to inflict punishment, and that in doing so you are actuated solely by desire for his highest good.

(2) Punishment, when deserved, should always be certain. That is, it should never be possible for children to calculate that they will be able to do wrong without being punished. If they can reckon on the chance of escaping the just consequences of naughty conduct because of any peculiar circumstances, such as the presence of company, the extra good humour of parents, the being from home, the being out of health, or any other reason whatever, the effects will be most disastrous.

A child who can reckon upon being able to "can't" his mother into overlooking sins, or wheedle his father round by caresses and excuses, will not be likely to regard with salutary fear any threatened punishment. The child should be made always to associate suffering, or what is equivalent to it, with the idea of wrong-doing.

It should be made impossible for a child to presume on being able to do wrong without suffering, by the quick and uniform infliction of chastisement, unless there shall be such a repentance as shall render it right and just for the offence to be forgiven. But even then, no such exemption should be made if there is any likelihood of a repetition of the offence.

(3.) Parents should watch against allowing any affection for their children to hinder them from inflicting such chastisement as the real interests of the child require.

How common it is with parents, when a child does wrong and they feel that all the interests of the child require that he shall be punished, for their feelings to rise up and protest against the infliction of this pain! If they could benefit the child by suffering themselves, they would gladly do it. But they cannot bear to make the little darlings weep, whom they so idolise. How can they endure their screams, and see them broken-hearted! No! It is more than they can stand, and so they let them off.

If there were anybody else who could punish them, without their seeing the effect of the pain, or hearing their cries, they would perhaps allow it to be done, as the interests of the children require it; but they cannot do it themselves. So the little ones are allowed to go on hardening in their disobedience and naughty ways in order that the parents' feelings may be spared.

All this will be seen, on a little consideration, to be the sheerest selfishness. It is really not to spare the feelings of as child, but their own, that they neglect this duty. To rightly train children there must be deep in the soul of the parent the conviction that the child must be made good; and if this cannot be done without inflicting pain, that pain must be inflicted, however harrowing it may be to those who have to administer it.

(4.) Parents must always aim to make punishment deterrent, or reformatory. Your aim in punishing the child must not be to be revenged on him, by making him suffer, as it were, for having disobeyed you or done something wrong, but to create in his heart a feeling that he has done wrong. He must feel that to do wrong is a very serious thing, and means suffering; and, more than this, you must seek to make him resolve, if possible, not to offend after the same fashion any more.

8. Do not children sometimes, under such circumstances, refuse to confess that they are wrong and to promise amendment?

Yes, and it is very mournful when they do, because for you to give in without securing a real repentance would do the child incalculable harm. You must win, however painful the controversy, or however long the struggle.

In such a case, if your victory be complete, the child's will may be so subdued that in all probability it will never be set up again in opposition to yours. Whereas, if, through any tender feeling on your part, you give in or make a compromise, the same battle will have to be fought over again, and perhaps on far more disadvantageous terms so far as you are concerned.

Mind, the child must be conquered, and made to feel that he is conquered; and woe to you, and woe to the child, if you accept any other than a whole-hearted confession and submission!

This is most important, both to you and your children, and therefore we again say, that the end of all punishment is that the child shall be brought to see the evil of his doings, confess it, and resolve never to offend again in a like manner.

The following incident of such a contest, given by a modern writer, will illustrate our meaning:-

A gentleman, sitting by his fireside one evening, with his family around him, took the spelling-book, and called upon one of his little boys to come and read. John was about four years old. He knew all the letters of the alphabet perfectly, but happened at that moment to be in rather a sullen humour, and was not at all disposed to gratify his father. Very reluctantly he came as he was bid; but when his father pointed to the first letter of the alphabet, and said, "What letter is that?" he could get no answer. John looked upon the book, sulky and silent.

"My son," said the father pleasantly, "you know the letter A."

"I cannot say A," said John.

"You must," said the father, in a serious and decided tone, "What letter is that?"

John refused to answer. The contest was now fairly commenced. John was wilful, and determined that he would not read. His father knew that it would be ruinous to allow him to conquer. He felt that he must, at all hazards, subdue him. He took him into another room, and punished him. He then returned, and again showed John the letter. But John still refused to name it. The father again retired with his son, and punished him more severely. But it was unavailing. The stubborn child still refused to name the letter, and when told that it was A, declared that he could not say A. Again the father inflicted punishment as severely as he dared to do it, and still the child, with his whole frame in agitation, refused to yield. The father was suffering from the most intense solicitude. He regretted exceedingly that he had been drawn into the contest. He had already punished his child with a severity which he feared to exceed. And yet the wilful sufferer stood before him, sobbing and trembling, but apparently as unyielding as a rock. I have often heard that parent mention the acuteness of his feelings at that moment. His heart was bleeding at the pain which he had been compelled to inflict upon his son. He knew that the question was now to be settled who should be the master. And, after his son had withstood so long and so much, he greatly feared the result. The mother sat by, suffering of course, most acutely, but perfectly satisfied that it was their duty to subdue the child, and that in such a trying hour a mother's feelings must not interfere. With a heavy heart, the father again took the hand of his son to lead him out of the room for further punishment. But to his inconceivable joy the child shrunk from enduring any more suffering, and cried, "Father, I'll tell the letter." The father, with feelings not easily conceived, took the book and pointed to the letter. "A," said John, distinctly and fully.

"And what is that?" said the father, pointing to the next letter. "B," said John.

"And what is that?"

"C," he continued.

"And what is that?" pointing again to the first letter.

"A," said the now humbled child.

"Now carry the book to your mother, and tell her what the letter is."

"What letter is that, my boy? "said the mother.

"A," said John. He was evidently perfectly subdued. The rest of the children were sitting by, and they saw the contest, and they saw where the victory was. And John learned a lesson which he never forgot. He learned never again to wage such an unequal warfare. He learned that it was the safest and happiest course for him to obey.

But perhaps some one says, it was cruel to punish the child so severely. Cruel! It was mercy and love. It would have been cruel had the father, in that hour, been unfaithful, and shrunk from his painful duty. The passions he was then, with so much self-sacrifice, striving to subdue, if left unchecked, would in all probability have been a curse to their possessor, and have made him a curse to his friends. It is by no means improbable that, upon the decisions of that hour, awaited much of the destinies of that child's future happiness. It is far from improbable that, had he then conquered, all subsequent efforts to subdue him would have been in vain, and that he would have broken away from all restraint. Cruelty! The Lord preserve children from the tender mercies of those who so regard such self-denying kindness. - Abbott.

9. Ought parents, at such times of conflict with their children, or in the administration of punishment, to read the Bible and pray with them?

Yes. Parents ought to pray with their children from their earliest infancy, in all their little griefs and trials; but in a conflict so important as that of which we are speaking, if ever it should come, it is of the utmost importance that parents should pray for and with their children, and if they are old enough to understand the Bible, they should read a portion of it adapted to the circumstances, and explain it to them.

In any such conflicts, it is of the utmost importance that you should be fully satisfied that the course you insist upon is a right one, and, as has been noticed before, that the child is not, from ignorance or nervousness, mistaking your wishes or blinded as to his duty.

10. In administering chastisement, ought not parents carefully to distinguish between the faults and the misfortunes of their children?

Yes, most certainly. Children should never be punished for things they cannot help. Misfortunes deserve pity rather than penalty. Parents often apply this rule to themselves, while they neglect to act upon it with respect to their children.

For instance, a father will make a false step, or a miscalculation of distance, and consequently have an accident and break something valuable. He will be very sorry for himself, and go about asking for pity. Whereas, the child of the same man may have a fall and break some treasure, and the father will rave about it in the most angry fashion, and punish the child with the most cruel severity. All this is most unjust, and the children will feel it so, and any such punishment will do them more harm than good.

11. Then children should not be punished for misfortunes or accidents?

Certainly not. Never, under any circumstances, should they be punished for what they cannot help. We are too much in danger of measuring wrong-doing by the evil consequences which flow from it, rather than by the motive and aim which inspire it.

For instance, here is a child who has been permitted to climb on the chairs and take things from the table. While nothing serious follows, the habit is unnoticed and unreproved, but when, unwittingly, the child pushes some valuable article off the table, which breaks in falling, he is condemned to suffer punishment.

But wherein did the child do wrong? Never having been forbidden to climb on the chairs, there was no disobedience in his act. He was not aware that he was doing wrong. If only a knife had fallen instead of a fancy dish, not a word would have been said, and consequently it is sheer cruelty to punish him on account of it.

But supposing the accident to be the result of carelessness or forgetfulness, what then? Well, even then, great forbearance should be exercised. Too much ought not to be expected from children in either of these respects. We all know how easily their attention is taken off from their duty, and how readily they forget the instructions given them. Thoughtlessness and forgetfulness are the causes of most of their little troubles.

12. What occasions, then, do you think are sufficiently serious to call for punishment?

I should say:

1. Repeated acts in carelessness.

2. Wilful mischief.

3. Neglect of duty.

4. Untruthfulness.

5. Wilful disobedience.

The two last ought never to be passed lightly over. But in these, as in all other instances, in administering chastisement every effort should be made to bring the transgressor to think of the great evil of his conduct.

13. You think it necessary, then, that punishment should be inflicted in such a manner as to carry with it, to the mind of the child, the idea that it is necessary for you to administer it?

Yes; a child should not only be made to see that it is right for you to chastise it for having done wrong, but it should, if possible, be brought into that state of mind in which it will be grateful to you for doing so. Further, if the counsels we have so far given be acted upon, we think that all sincere children will be thankful that they have parents who love them sufficiently to take such pains to make them happy and good.

14. Will you name some forms of punishment that are objectionable because likely to be injurious?

(1.) Never punish your children by exciting unnatural fears.

Never do anything which is likely to unduly shock the nervous system. Many poor little things have been made cowards for life by this course of treatment. Do not allow anything of such a kind with your children as threatening them with ghosts, putting them into a dark room, telling them that some evil spirit is coming to fetch them away, or any other ridiculous and lying stories. Such treatment is calculated to arouse fears and create apprehensions that will never be destroyed, making them afraid of going into the darkness, or of sleeping alone, or going along lonely roads at night, and the like, all the rest of their days. In short, you may in this way easily create for them all manner of mental tortures, not only for the moment, but for the future, and endanger their reason as well.

The following incident is given by a writer on this subject. He says, "I knew as fine, as sprightly, and as intelligent a child as ever was born, who was made an idiot for life by being, when about three years old, shut in a dark closet by a maid-servant in order to terrify him into silence. The thoughtless creature first threatened to send him to the bad place, and at last, to reduce him to silence, put him in a dark closet, shut the door and went out of the room. She went back in a few minutes, and found the child in a fit. He recovered from that, but was an idiot for life. When the parents, who had been on a visit for two days and nights, came home, they were told that the child had had a fit, but were not informed of the cause. The girl, however, who was a neighbour's daughter, being on her death-bed a few years after, could not die in peace without sending for the mother of the child and asking forgiveness." There is little doubt that numbers of children have suffered similar evil effects from similar causes. Parents, beware.

(2.) Never punish your children in such a way as will make them appear silly in the estimation of other children.

They should be very extreme cases in which anything is done to destroy the child's self-respect, or to make him ridiculous in the eyes of his companions. This applies to some of the systems of punishment at schools and elsewhere, which, we are very glad to say, are getting out of fashion, such as "the dunce's cap," setting children on a form to be gazed at by others, making them wear some mark to signify that they are blockheads, or truants, or otherwise rendering them the laughing-stock of all who are about them. Avoid all such nonsense.

At the same time you will, of course, see that no child can be punished without it being known to the whole household, and the dread of this amount of shame and exposure will become a very valuable part of the child's training to avoid evil.

15. What modes of punishment do you recommend?

With young children we should be inclined to the old-fashioned method of "a little whipping," which may be made very terrible to the youngsters, and it will always add materially to the effect of it if it follows quickly after the offence. With older children the consideration of their age and circumstances must help to determine what is likely to be most effective

If the children see that it is a great grief to you to give them pain, that, more than anything else, will distress them, and they will not very often give you reason to resort to this part of your duty. Nevertheless, you must do so if necessary, and you must be faithful and prompt in discharging it, and the more prompt and faithful you are, the less call will there be for it in the future.

There are plenty of ways of inflicting chastisement without having recourse to any of the objectionable methods already named; for instance,--

(1.) Children can be deprived of their ordinary privileges -such as holidays-or their little luxuries, or the enjoyment of your own company, or they can be prevented from coming to table for meals, which, as a rule, is felt to be a great hardship. They can be fined, if they have any money, or their pocket-money can be confiscated.

(2.) You can impose solitary confinement. Only care must be taken not to fall into the error we have just mentioned. When children are sent by themselves, care should be taken that they have something to employ their time; something less agreeable than that in which they would have been employed but for their offence, and at the same time something likely to be useful, if that be possible. We have found it a good plan to require children to write a letter expressing their sorrow and repentance for their offence, if they feel any.

(3.) Tasks can be set children, if they are old enough to learn them.

We do not think it wise to follow a very common custom of making children learn or write out portions of the Bible as punishment, such a course being calculated to create a distaste, if not a positive hatred, for the Book. We know it has been so in many instances. Rather let them learn something in the ordinary course of their education.

(4.) Extra work can be insisted upon.

16. Is it not important that the quarrels and disagreements which unavoidably arise among children should be dealt with according to the strict principles of truth and justice?

Certainly. It is most important that at such times there should be a careful investigation, and every effort should be made to decide who is in the right and who in the wrong, in order that praise or blame be administered accordingly.

The course very often taken on such occasions is simply to condemn all present and to give a little lecture on the folly of quarrelling, winding up with a general order to "kiss and be friends again."

In small and trifling matters this may be the best plan, but even then we question it. But in matters of any serious moment, the wrongdoing should be carefully uncovered, and the wrongdoer impartially condemned.

A favourite, foolish, and most unjust mode of dealing in such cases is very common both with respect to children and adults, namely, that of saying, "Oh, there are faults on both sides," or, "There's six of one and half a dozen of the other," whereas it frequently happens that the weakest and most conscientious are overborne and misrepresented by the cleverer and less scrupulous. When thus summarily dealt with, of course a double injury is inflicted, and the innocent made to suffer for the guilty. The only way for real reconciliation between any offending and offended parties is, that the one who has done the wrong shall fully confess and repent of it, and then a reconciliation can be effected. It is with children as it is with adults; while the sufferer is smarting under a sense of wrong, his soul cries out naturally for justice. Let that be done, and then comes the time to willingly and cheerfully make the quarrel up and be friends again. And that is the friendship likely to be lasting; indeed, there is no other.

http://www.gospeltruth.net/booth/Boothtrainingchildren/booth_child_training_chap17.htm

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proudpapa Jun 21, 2016


...A lot of people react to the spanking of the children. The world says, “It’s cruelty. It’s suppression. The child will hate you. It will cause rebellion in their hearts.” But nothing could be further from the truth. Those who withhold the rod are the ones whose children put them in the rest homes. Did you ever think about that? The rest homes are just full and running over today. Who puts their father and mother in the rest homes? But the children who never had the rod used on them. That’s an interesting observation.

The using of the rod goes against your natural love. If you’re here this evening, and your poor heart says, “Oh, I could never spank my children.” You are a victim of natural love. And natural love is okay. I think we need to love our children. I think we need to be filled with love when we see them running to us. But if that natural love stops us from disciplining them with a rod, then that natural love needs to be crucified and replaced with spiritual love, which is agape love, which is God-like love, which is love that love’s by principle, and not by feeling. That’s what we’re speaking about this evening - disciplining the children, a love that loves by principle and not be feeling.

Now the Holy Spirit inspired some very powerful words on the use of the rod. The Bible says that the rod will give wisdom unto your children. The Bible says that the rod will cleanse away evil from your children. The Bible says that the rod is an expression of love. The Bible says that the rod will clear the conscience of your child. The Bible says that the rod will keep your child from going to hell. ThatÂ’s what the Bible says. The Bible says that it will give calm and order into your childÂ’s life. So letÂ’s look into some of these verses this evening....

read more at : https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/articles/index.php?view=article&aid=2059

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