I live in Nigeria, where until recently wearing of pants by women is seen as sinful and preached against especially by conservative denominations. Brethren I need more infomation on this.
Jedidiah Ekanem
Edit: post deleted by author because unedifying.
Sister,
It can be a question of modesty and how a sister feels to be modest in her dress. It can also be a question of being distinct from men. Biblically in new covenant modest dress is encouraged amongst sisters. We are free to dress according to our conscience and how we interpretation Scriptures thus no one is put under bondage. The heart is utmost and important.
But to make others stumble by our liberty or by our convictions can be wrong also.
The early Christians were different not only in heart but practically in some ways, we need to ensure first our heart is holy and set apart before we feel in anyway the outward is important.
I trust that can help you navigating this abit to put emphasis first on your heart issues on the matter.
We started by allowing women open their hair, and like john calvin predicted, they now open their breast, we allowed women wearing trouser in the church, and today we also permit gay marriage. I am a nigerian, and if i understand the cultural mutation that has taken place amongst us, largely influenced by the west, i'll simply say like charles Finney Doubtful actions are sinful. The source and reason for a change matters more than the change in itself. On the surface it may look tolerable, but i must tell u point blank, the same spirit that drives gay is what is driving women to wearing trouser. Sorry if i hurt. Meanwhile if u're really sure of ur conviction then go ahead, i just felt i should place a red light, especially because u're in nigeria
We have a Nigerian couple in our house church and they are a precious couple that love the Lord and live holy lives. They host a prayer meeting every Thursday. They also, have deep respect by others because they radiate Christ and walk in love. She wore baggy jeans last meeting.
quote-
On the surface it may look tolerable, but i must tell u point blank, the same spirit that drives gay is what is driving women to wearing trouser. Sorry if i hurt.
-quote Iyke
You can't be truly serious, for how can you be a true minister in love to others with this kind of attitude and discernment.
Matthew 23:23-28 (NKJV)
23 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faith. These you ought to have done, without leaving the others undone.
24 Blind guides, who strain out a gnat and swallow a camel!
25 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of extortion and self-indulgence.
26 Blind Pharisee, first cleanse the inside of the cup and dish, that the outside of them may be clean also.
27 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which indeed appear beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men's bones and all uncleanness.
28 Even so you also outwardly appear righteous to men, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.
1 Corinthians 13:1-8 (NKJV)
1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, but have not love, it profits me nothing.
4 Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up;
5 does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil;
6 does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth;
7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
8 Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.
Blessings...from brother rbanks
Thank you bro Greg. 2 decades ago you could hardly find a believer (sister) with pants. It was seen as a dressing for worldly ladies. Over time, western influence brought about this practice together with all other western lifestyle. Even though trousers is more tolerable today, some people especially those in the rural area will not regard ladies on pants as christians let alone listen to them preach.
I will want to know if ladies (believers) have always been wearing pants in the west. To what extent should we Sacrifice' our liberty for the sake of not being rejected by some for the gospel.
Bro Jedidia
The sister above quoted John Calvin here is the full quote which is a prophecy of sort that has come true:
“So if women are thus permitted to have their heads uncovered and to show their hair, they will eventually be allowed to expose their entire breasts, and they will come to make their exhibitions as if it were a tavern show; they will become so brazen that modesty and shame will be no more; in short they will forget the duty of nature. Further, we know that the world takes everything to its own advantage. So, if one has liberty in lesser things, why not do the same with this the same way as with that? And in making such comparisons they will make such a mess that there will be utter chaos. So, when it is permissible for the women to uncover their heads, one will say, ‘Well, what harm in uncovering the stomach also?’ And then after that one will plead for something else; ‘Now if the women go bareheaded, why not also bare this and bare that?’ Then the men, for their part, will break loose too. In short, there will be no decency left, unless people contain themselves and respect what is proper and fitting, so as not to go headlong overboard.”
- John Calvin
I again emphasize the heart is what matters and there can be godliness if the outward matches the heart.
It is utmost to be free in the heart towards the Lord and not have a religious obedience to any form of dress. Such will bring death to one's spiritual walk with the Lord Jesus Christ. The enemy has sown tares amongst the wheat and declares an outward form better than inward holiness. There should be a measure of the outward in a true believer but this is not ever first.
Some people think ostracizing others is the way to get them to change their ways and comply with the majority group. How healthy would that kind of environment be to fellowship with if you know your outward appearance is constantly being judged and you will be dis-fellowshipped unless you conform outwardly?
Greg, your post was excellent.
I like colorful flowing skirts the best. Tight form fitting pants are so distracting. My wife wears Saris and Punjabi. Indian Style!
We started by allowing women open their hair, and like john calvin predicted, they now open their breast, we allowed women wearing trouser in the church, and today we also permit gay marriage. I am a nigerian, and if i understand the cultural mutation that has taken place amongst us, largely influenced by the west, i'll simply say like charles Finney Doubtful actions are sinful. The source and reason for a change matters more than the change in itself. On the surface it may look tolerable, but i must tell u point blank, the same spirit that drives gay is what is driving women to wearing trouser. Sorry if i hurt. Meanwhile if u're really sure of ur conviction then go ahead, i just felt i should place a red light, especially because u're in Nigeria. Iyke
Given that this saying is a matter of discernment and not a matter of condemnation, it is both true and truthfully stated. The progress is well documented as are the men and women who brought it to fruition. By which I mean homosexuality as an accepted sin in the church and the rise of feminism with all the clear intentions of those who promoted its agenda. In fact feminism has done more to support and loosen homosexuality on societies than homosexuality itself has been able to do. Homosexuality was withstood publicly and privately whereas feminism has its roots in the percieved injustices of men against women. None of which had to do with the wearing of clothes but was entirely to do with societal politics and the public space. In short the church has learned from the world instead of being a light to the world.
Some people think ostracizing others is the way to get them to change their ways and comply with the majority group. How healthy would that kind of environment be to fellowship with if you know your outward appearance is constantly being judged and you will be dis-fellowshipped unless you conform outwardly?
Amen sister it is not a healthy atmosphere and actually dangerous. Christian assemblies should never have that religious pressure of outward performance. True Christian assemblies will have some beautiful expressions of outward modesty but that will not be a standard. To dis-fellowship as you mentioned or judge others outwardly is usually fuelled by religious pride in oneself and not to know the mind of the Lord.
Nothing is worse to be in a conservative fellowship and sense a sensual spirit off sisters who are fully covered. The last is worst then the first.
Edit: post deleted by author because unedifying.
You asked for input by the brethren. I am a female...and you may reject what I have to say simply because of it.
All of us are wearing something. We all agree that God decided to clothe the first humans because of sin. Until then they were naked, but sin required a covering up of the flesh.
Since then the devil's job is to work to undo, pervert what God has decreed. The Scriptures teaches us the details how the devil worked in the past and is still working to this end. It also teaches us God's will in life and lifestyles.
My suggestion is for you to make it a study, beginning with Genesis and going all the way through the WORD and see what you find - all the while being in prayer and being open to what the WORD teaches you.
You posted a question here that evokes a lot of discussion because of the differences in opinion, maturity, culture. At the end of life it is God you must give account to, not anyone here or anywhere else. Let this be your motivation and guide. When you experience a God-given conviction it will be yours - and that is a sacred possession.
God bless.
QUOTE:
"“So if women are thus permitted to have their heads uncovered and to show their hair, they will eventually be allowed to expose their entire breasts, and they will come to make their exhibitions as if it were a tavern show; they will become so brazen that modesty and shame will be no more; in short they will forget the duty of nature. Further, we know that the world takes everything to its own advantage. So, if one has liberty in lesser things, why not do the same with this the same way as with that? And in making such comparisons they will make such a mess that there will be utter chaos. So, when it is permissible for the women to uncover their heads, one will say, ‘Well, what harm in uncovering the stomach also?’ And then after that one will plead for something else; ‘Now if the women go bareheaded, why not also bare this and bare that?’ Then the men, for their part, will break loose too. In short, there will be no decency left, unless people contain themselves and respect what is proper and fitting, so as not to go headlong overboard.”
- John Calvin"
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Calvin wrote that!!???
Now I have to do a search to find the source. Do you have it, Greg?
4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.
5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:
6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
.........
Our LORD Jesus Christ is the perfect image of GOD. And our LORD focus was always on the inner and not the outer.
ginnyrose wrote,
"Calvin wrote that!!??? Now I have to do a search to find the source. Do you have it, Greg?"
The source:
Men, Women and Order in the Church, translated by Seth Skolnitsky, Presbyterian Heritage Publications, pages 12-13 from a Sermon on 1 Cor 11:2-3 by John Calvin
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