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Theology

Deception / Deceived

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Elibeth Jul 10, 2014

I have been giving some considerable thought on this verse and subject
in Rev.12:9,..."And the great dragon was cast out,that old serpent,called
the Devil and Satan,who 'DECEIVETH THE WHOLE WORLD' ; "

My thoughts were and question to you is:..If he deceiveth the whole world,then WHO is,or can be,exempt or excluded ?

We know that the Word where Jesus is speaking,and one is calling Him Lord,Lord,...We look at those scriptures, and see that deception can be with one all the way until one stands before The Lord.

What is your thoughts ?


elizabeth

sermonindex Jul 10, 2014

I think there's deception even in orthodox groups

any time a person trusts in himself deception is right there

sermonindex Jul 10, 2014

Elisabeth we read in John 10:1-10 the sheep follow the Shepherd because they know His voice. The sheep will not listen to a stranger.

Sister if we stay close to the Shepherd, Jesus and hear His voice, His word. He will keep us from deception.

My thoughts, dear sister.

Blaine

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Elibeth Jul 11, 2014

Thank you Noah for your thoughts.

Yes Bro.Bear,
I do believe,that is the only way that will keep us from being deceived.

elizabeth

sermonindex Jul 11, 2014

I feel part of an important picture is that the body of Christ would follow the Lord and servant leaders He has put in the body. When the ideology of everyman doing what is right in his own eyes becomes prevalent so does deception and apostasy. Individualism is hurtful because it is not what our Lord modelled, He rather encouraged servant leaders (apostles) and others to "shepherd" and lead people. (1 Peter 5). Wolves prey on those lone straying sheep that feel they have the corner on truth and know better then most pastors.

As other posters have also mentioned we are not immune from deception in varying degrees. The most important thing is to continue in daily relationship with the Lord and be in fellowship with the larger body of Christ submitting to leadership.

--

Judges 2 New International Version (NIV)

The Angel of the Lord at Bokim
2 The angel of the Lord went up from Gilgal to Bokim and said, "I brought you up out of Egypt and led you into the land I swore to give to your ancestors. I said, ‘I will never break my covenant with you, 2 and you shall not make a covenant with the people of this land, but you shall break down their altars.’ Yet you have disobeyed me. Why have you done this? 3 And I have also said, ‘I will not drive them out before you; they will become traps for you, and their gods will become snares to you.’”

4 When the angel of the Lord had spoken these things to all the Israelites, the people wept aloud, 5 and they called that place Bokim.[a] There they offered sacrifices to the Lord.

Disobedience and Defeat
6 After Joshua had dismissed the Israelites, they went to take possession of the land, each to their own inheritance. 7 The people served the Lord throughout the lifetime of Joshua and of the elders who outlived him and who had seen all the great things the Lord had done for Israel.

8 Joshua son of Nun, the servant of the Lord, died at the age of a hundred and ten. 9 And they buried him in the land of his inheritance, at Timnath Heres[b] in the hill country of Ephraim, north of Mount Gaash.

10 After that whole generation had been gathered to their ancestors, another generation grew up who knew neither the Lord nor what he had done for Israel. 11 Then the Israelites did evil in the eyes of the Lord and served the Baals. 12 They forsook the Lord, the God of their ancestors, who had brought them out of Egypt. They followed and worshiped various gods of the peoples around them. They aroused the Lord’s anger 13 because they forsook him and served Baal and the Ashtoreths. 14 In his anger against Israel the Lord gave them into the hands of raiders who plundered them. He sold them into the hands of their enemies all around, whom they were no longer able to resist. 15 Whenever Israel went out to fight, the hand of the Lord was against them to defeat them, just as he had sworn to them. They were in great distress.

16 Then the Lord raised up judges,[c] who saved them out of the hands of these raiders. 17 Yet they would not listen to their judges but prostituted themselves to other gods and worshiped them. They quickly turned from the ways of their ancestors, who had been obedient to the Lord’s commands. 18 Whenever the Lord raised up a judge for them, he was with the judge and saved them out of the hands of their enemies as long as the judge lived; for the Lord relented because of their groaning under those who oppressed and afflicted them. 19 But when the judge died, the people returned to ways even more corrupt than those of their ancestors, following other gods and serving and worshiping them. They refused to give up their evil practices and stubborn ways.

20 Therefore the Lord was very angry with Israel and said, "Because this nation has violated the covenant I ordained for their ancestors and has not listened to me, 21 I will no longer drive out before them any of the nations Joshua left when he died. 22 I will use them to test Israel and see whether they will keep the way of the Lord and walk in it as their ancestors did.” 23 The Lord had allowed those nations to remain; he did not drive them out at once by giving them into the hands of Joshua.

Footnotes:

Judges 2:5 Bokim means weepers.
Judges 2:9 Also known as Timnath Serah (see Joshua 19:50 and 24:30)
Judges 2:16 Or leaders; similarly in verses 17-19

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Elibeth Jul 11, 2014


Yes, I know this is very deep,but sincere thinking..But please bear with me,
..I do believe it is very important.

What really prompted this subject,was the thought about unforgivness...
Being 'deceived' in one's heart.and,...could that be just one of the things Satan could deceive us in. And what benefit could it be to him ?

Never willing to forgive....i have been there.It is a hard thing,in our carnal /
Fleshly way,And to ever see that WE MUST ! We may just go along through life,and not think how very dire it is,until by the mercies of God,He shows us,...we see it in His Word, and cry out ,and say Lord ! 'I cannot do
this, and Your Word says I must,so please help me'


But because the Word says that our hearts are deceitful, I believe The Lord wants us to look deep within our hearts,that are so easy to be deceived,and judge ourselves so we do not have to be judged.


What will happen if we do not forgive?
Is it detrimental to truly forgive ?
Can we be deceived in our heart ?

If Satan deceiveth the whole world,...How many things can we be deceived in. .?..And will there be an end consequences if we do not plead / ask for
The Lord'help in showing us and help in doing something about it ?

And can Satan even 'deceive' us into thinking that we have truly ended
Any deception that may be in our heart,...like forgiveness, complete bondage broken ?

I do hope this makes sense to you.
Elizabeth


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brothagary Jul 11, 2014

two fundamantel truths have allways hepled me forgive people and sinnners in particular ,,,that christ should not have saved me and forgiven me ,so the least i can do is forvive others like he for gave me ,,,and that the person who hurt me ,more then likely will suffer in hell ,,this induces compassion in me ,,and also cause me to pray and bless those who may have hurt me

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rookie Jul 11, 2014

The answer to your question is found in the following verse...
2Th 2:9
The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders,

2Th 2:10
and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.


Those who do "not receive the love of the truth" will be deceived. Only those who have overcome Satan through the growth in the Word of God will be enabled to discern between good and evil.

So then what does it mean to "receive the love of the truth" ?

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Sidewalk Jul 11, 2014

Anyone who is truly born again must come to realize that prior to conversion they were living in some form of deception. And anyone who has been born again for any length of time must realize that deception is in constant war with one's soul.

When I say it is very easy to be deceived, I am looking in the mirror.

"Search me and know me, O God, and see of there be any wicked way within me!" This is not an unbeliever's prayer, but the cry of a man who has come through pain to realize just how near and how destructive deception is.

Elibeth is so right about unforgiveness, one of the widest open doors to deception there is. (Lust for sex, money, and prestige are pretty wide doors as well...)

Deception and pride are hand in glove, whereas forgiveness and gratefulness will lead to truth.

I see truth as two things. The reality of what actually is, and the person of Jesus Christ. The first is difficult, in that my perceptions may not be accurate. But when Christ is inside, I have actual truth within, and the details outside will fall into place.

Ongoing battle! Even today, I pray that I may be led to truth, better truth, more of Him who is truth.

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rookie Jul 11, 2014

Elizabeth writes:

What will happen if we do not forgive?
Is it detrimental to truly forgive ?
Can we be deceived in our heart ?

This question is not for you sis alone but for those who contemplate this thread,


How does this thought relate to "receive the love of the truth"?

sermonindex Jul 11, 2014

Rookie if we love the truth, rather Him who us the Truth, then we should have a forgiving heart toward others.

Just my thoughts.

Blaine

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rookie Jul 11, 2014

Blaine writes;

"Rookie if we love the truth, rather Him who us the Truth, then we should have a forgiving heart toward others."


Yes one expects that this is the outcome for one who loves the truth. Yet, Scripture teaches us that there is a work that God does in each individual so that they will believe in His Son Jesus Christ and that the individual can know with certainty that the Spirit of God is giving that individual a love for the truth.

2Th 2:10
and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

2Th 2:11
And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie,

2Th 2:12
that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

2Th 2:13
But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth,


Paul warns of a deception which men will perish because "they did not receive the love of the truth..."


This is a spiritual precept. Where in Scripture do we find testimony of how God through the "sanctification by the Spirit" brought the individual to love the truth that is from God?

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Elibeth Jul 12, 2014

Rookie,

You asked,'So then what does it mean to " receive the love of the truth"?

I believe it is when the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts,..It gives
Us SUCH a love for His Word / Truth,...we just hunger and thirst for it.
And that love,Who is God / Love / Word /Spirit /causes us to love His Word,
And also to love others.

I remember long ago when The Lord was working in me,when at the first,I suddenly looked around,and and could not think of anyone that I did not love.

So,It is He who gives us the love of the Truth / Word
We can open our hearts and gladly receive The love of The Truth / His Word,spoken to us or us reading it,..meditating on It / Him,....or we can reject it.

And this 'Getting to a know Him,..to know Him,..to have the mind of Christ, learn His judgments in matters..(relationship) will help / or keep us safe from the many forms of deception.

Did Satan not even try to deceive Jesus,using Scripture,when He came up out of the wilderness ?. ...But Jesus could not be deceived.His eyes were single,...Only on His Father God.

Thank you Rookie,...I enjoy the communion in The Lord.

elizabeth

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Elibeth Jul 12, 2014

Sidewalk,
Thank you,..I so appreciated your well thought- out ,,,wisdom on this so important subject.

Because if we be deceived until we stand before The Lord,How will He judge in the mater ?Yes it is a constant battle.and yes,I believe it is dire.

Now I am thinking about The Word where it says to " Keep ourselves in the love of God"

Bless you,
elizabeth

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Elibeth Jul 12, 2014

Bro Gary ,
Thank you...appreciate your thoughts.
elizabeth

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brothagary Jul 12, 2014

your very welcome elizabeth


ya the truth will set you free ,,in more ways then one

sermonindex Jul 12, 2014

What will happen if we do not forgive?
Is it detrimental to truly forgive ?
Can we be deceived in our heart ?

Hi Elizabeth

It is sometimes possible to think that we have forgiven someone, but have not done it completely and at times it takes the revelation of God to show it. But what I have found, is that the times I have not felt love for all men, later on and not just at the beginning when we first meet the Lord, then it means that there is some un-forgiveness towards someone we know.

And for being deceived - yes. One little lie will do it. One little belief that we are holding that comes from the pit and not from God. There was one little lie that had me for quite some time. And it was not exactly untrue in one sense because in my lifetime, I have felt an outsider due to having Aspergers Syndrome. The little lie was 'you are all alone and no-one cares' and this lie caused me untold grief and held me in deception over other things, especially over unforgiveness.

One day however, I made a stand against the lie and said NO, I am not alone because I have God, and it broke the deception and allowed a huge blessing to fall on me, so I would say to others to ask God to reveal whether there is a little lie from the pit and to look into your hearts to see if it is so.

It is my understanding, that if we think we cannot be deceived or are not being deceived, then it is a sign that we are, whereas if we daily seek to be assured that we are in the light, then we will be able to walk in the light.

None of us can stand against the deceptions of Satan without a constant walk in the light.

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dfella Jul 12, 2014

In answer to the original question about satan deceiving the whole world speaks ONLY of those who are IN and OF the world. The church, Christians, the Body of Christ are NOT in or of the world, they are the "called out Ones". We as obedient faithful believers are in the world as Jesus says, but we are not of this world.

I would encourage you to read Jesus' prayer for His church in ALL of John 17 not just the few verses quoted below.

John 17:11-16 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are. (12) While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled. (13) And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves. (14) I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. (15) I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil. (16) They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

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rookie Jul 12, 2014

Elizebeth wrote:

And also to love others.

I remember long ago when The Lord was working in me,when at the first,I suddenly looked around,and and could not think of anyone that I did not love.

............................

God has done that for me for certain individuals while others, God has used to show me what is not right in my own heart.

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rookie Jul 12, 2014

dfella wrote:

In answer to the original question about satan deceiving the whole world speaks ONLY of those who are IN and OF the world.

............................

Yes this is true for those who have received the covenant from the Lord. But what of those who are being called and not yet chosen?

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