Fake Christians?

I have been thinking much lately about how I see so many people who are seemingly on fire for God. They are "excited" about what God is doing. They are involved in many things, busy, busy, busy. But...I think about where I am in my walk with God right now and how difficult it has been to get here, and I wonder, how do so many people just breeze right through? Are they for real?I'll use someone I know for an example. She is someone 13 years younger than me. She only begun to go to church about 5 years ago and only begun to really draw near to God maybe 2 years ago. Now, she has arrived. She is getting invitations to speak at women's groups. She has her own Christian website with weekly devotionals. Her husband and she both feel that they are being 'called into the ministry'. She calls me all the time with her prayer list. Here's what I am getting at: I see people who are religious and all fired up, and they look all good and everything, but I feel such pride in them. I feel that they have their own agenda that is about their own fulfillment that isn't really inspired by God at all. They would be angry if you mentioned such a thing. "I've already dealt with my pride on Jan. 15th, 199?" Is pride something you deal with on one occasion? Can God really use us if we are deceived like that in our own hearts? This is something I've been thinking about.I recently had a friend that I had disfellowshipped because of her continueing in sin. We hadn't really spoken in about 6 weeks. Just last week she called me up saying, "I miss you. I want us to be able to talk again. I feel like the prodigal son. I want to come home. Can we talk?" So I met with her and my pastor. She seemed sincere enough, saying she was sorry for her sins and she wanted to "submit" herself to God and to those he has placed in her life. But...a week has passed and I can see that she is still the same. She is in the dark. She is like a stone. I believe she wants to change, but she, of course, has no power to change. To me, help me here, maybe I'm wrong, but, to me, she does not truly humble herself. She doesn't really submit herself to God, she just wants people to "approve" of her. She is still going her own way. Can we go our own way and be a Christian? Love, Dian.

SpitfireI guess we all struggle with this one. The modern church cannot discern between Holy Spirit Anointed Ministry and that which is built on "natural ability and showmanship". WE had a conference here in Ireland two years ago when we sat and listened to a "Brother" from the UK who was eloquent well dressed had a clear message but all I could hear was empty human message about self development and motivation, which was identical to many business courses I had done as an accountant. Needless to say the crowd loved it bought the tapes and books and spoke about "new starts and grasping destinys". When we discussed it as pastors we were split 50/50 with the organiser saying he had made a mistake in inviting the speaker. So are they "fake" who cannot discern? I believe they are just sisters and brothers who have never grown, content to be blown around by every wind of doctrine. The Holy Spirit is the only one who will arrest them and capture them ,it is for us who have found that deeper relationship to love them and nuture them, stand against error,rebuke, and pick up the pieces and of course at all times take heed to ourselves .Yes its hard to watch but then I am sure the Lord also watches and grieves as the wheat and the tares grow side by side.Paul

and of course at all times take heed to ourselves .Oh yeah! I understand this. I don't EVEN feel like I'm ready to stand up in front of people and start talking. There's too many things I'm not sure about yet. How do so many people think they've got the truth nailed down? It scares me now to think of how many I led astray before I had the fear of God. Dear Lord! Have Mercy!I've been praying that God will help me to become so solid in my understanding, that when I do speak, I can withstand whatever persecution comes for it. Love, Dian.

I want to approach this very carefully. I know full well what you're saying here, however let me give you something that'll help keep you level in your thinking and emotions. I have learned to take all men (women too) by faith. Think of your definition of faith - evidence of things hope for substance of things not seen. I have often mused at the carnal display of what I consider godless ministries but have come to the conclusion like Paul that at least Jesus is being preached and in that I rejoice. I have learned to be quick to forgive and sometimes forgiving once outwardly and 70 times 70 inwardly. Thoughs peskey thoughts that seem to nag at me !!! I have learned to look at my failures in the light of the Face of Jesus and think about what it must have been like to be Peter standing there looking at Jesus right after he denied him the third time and Jesus looking right at him -- o' wicked man that I am! Christ is in me and knows all things. Know this that life ---and the devil --- (God being in control) have its ways of refining the dross from the silver or gold and exposing the false. Learn to love them without condition, and that means fully excepting them and being there to lift them up and gently instruct them when they fall or fail, and fall or fail they will. Through this you will discover that you're becoming the christ to them that Jesus has been toward you. I love you sis---I'll keep you in my prayers, may the God of all Grace strengthen your heart by Christ Jesus our Lord. Bro. Daryl

Learn to love them without condition, and that means fully excepting them and being there to lift them up and gently instruct them when they fall or fail, and fall or fail they will. Through this you will discover that you're becoming the christ to them that Jesus has been toward you.So are they "fake" who cannot discern? I believe they are just sisters and brothers who have never grown, content to be blown around by every wind of doctrine. The Holy Spirit is the only one who will arrest them and capture them ,it is for us who have found that deeper relationship to love them and nuture them, stand against error,rebuke, and pick up the pieces and of course at all times take heed to ourselves .I suppose I am confused again. Here lately, I don't know where to go. I've found so few true believers. I guess I really believe like Tozer, he said, probably only about 2 percent of confessing Christians are born again. You know, I can tolerate a homeless addict better than I can a fake Christian. But...I realize that I was one myself. It grieves me so much! Seems like something is terribly wrong! I'm thinking the problem is religion, just like when Jesus walked on earth. It's much easier to stay in our pride and play a game than to turn to God. Pride is so strong and so deceptive. I feel like I'm trying to dig myself out of layers of dirt everyday as I humble myself to God. I realize that I cannot be trusted until God has broken me with 40 years in a desert place. I am about to begin attending a church that God has dealt with me for some time now to attend. I've fought it so bad. They are so religious there! But...I know God is leading me to go there and to enter into fellowship with these people and to support the pastor as a Caleb was to Moses. I know I can't go there thinking I am better than they are. Oh God! Help me! I need to have understanding. Ya'll, Please pray for me. Love, Dian.

The subject of "fake" christians is a troubling one for sure. I'm reminded of what Bonhoeffer said about the desciple Judas Iscariot who presumedly witnessed and performed miracles with the others desciples: He was a "dark riddle."Some of the best preaching, (most doctrinally sound and some might even qualify as "annointed") I ever sat under was from a fellow that was secretly carrying on with one of the prominent women in the church for seven to eight years. Obviously the sparkling gifts of the spirit aren't to be mistaken for the humble fruit of the spirit. When discovered he was defiant and arrogant. We suddenly no longer recognized him. Who is this strange man citing the story of David and Bathseba as proof that he can keep his new lover? He was respected by many pastors as an apostle (sic) over some 20 churches in the community. All of us who were ever touched by his preaching and ministry, including his dear wife, were heart-broken and abit humiliated over the lack of discernment. Apparently the ememy plants tares in our midst that bear a striking resemblance to wheat. Less then a year later this pastors' pastor had married his new bride, both leaving their spouses and children, for a gig at a church down in Florida.Stories like this are too numerous to tell. Each one of us could take turns apalling each other with the audacity of the wolves in sheeps clothing. We might be tempted to become cynical about the person sitting next to us in the pew. We might even become doubtful of our own authenticity. I find this Matthew 13 parable from Jesus a relief from taking on the burden of cleansing His church for Him."Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field: But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way. But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?It's clear that the servants woke up and discovered that not everything growing in the field was planted by the master. What to do about it?He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up? But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn. At the end of the age there is to be two different gatherings. In the meantime we know a tree will eventually bear it's fruit which will becomes that tree's undeniable testimony.(By "fruit" I mean a life of rebellion...not the character flaws that we all have.) I believe if we try to purge fake Christians prior to the fruit being fully manifested we run the following risks. 1. Pulling up the tares would damage the roots of the wheat.2. To go through a field of wheat pulling up tares would mean trampling down and hurting a lot of wheat. A Christian knows he is a Christian. But does a a 'tare' know he or she is a 'tare'? I suspect many lay tares don't know they are tares because they are measuring themselves to the professional tares in the pulpits. It is a fearsome thing that causes me to inspect myself closely.God have mercy on His church! Holy Spirit comfort your people! Amen.MC

This thread has been a help to me, as a music ministry I sing for has had some foibles of late.The convicting of the Holy Spirit has been strong whenever I/we stray into the reliance on our talent and artistic ability.the tares of music firmly entertwine their roots with the wheat.

Brother LahryQuote: Furthermore, it is a continual struggle to give God all the glory. You can't help but feel good about being used of God to bless someone. But as soon as you are motivated by impressing others, the whole thing goes sour. God has left me alone so long, that all I have is Him to impress, and He only yeilds to faith and obedience. But He is worth it all. Yes, He Is!!!