Is anyone willing to stand for truth anymore?

Stephen,If this isn't what is the cry...Authenticity. Reality. Honesty. Truth. It all seems to be of the same substance, make that, ought to be.And the difficulties, the either/or, the forwarding assumptions... 'If you believe this, you dis-believe the other. That it has to be construed to say something else when at bottom the issue is...Is it true?I've been discouraged in the past because I feared we were too divisive...this bothered me because I feared we had lost love in the process. Divisiveness can most certainly be a problem, but the opposite is much more deadly.The mighty struggle, could not agree more especially after what had gone on here some months back, the divisiveness... and the rub, that opposite, even more deadly, certainly have fallen into both of those trap's, is this not the territory of the enemy?That to care enough for truth it is to invite opposition but it must be so. To care for it will bring all the labeling and misunderstandings of intent and motives, the seemingly quirky sense of being 'unloving' or full of pride or even that one is thought to feel superior or give that appearance or that because you are being 'shot down' as it were, now you have validated yourself and can go smugly along...Not the intent, not the motive, not "I don't care what others think", not "I should compromise to be seen in a better light",... Not me, but Him.And that's just amongst brethren, what of the rest of the world... Made mention of it elsewhere, but doesn't it just seem muddy everywhere? Like your experience now in seminary and even the vast number of churches and all the strange ... muddy, teachings, 'new thing's', blending of psychology and relativism.One of the amazing truth's about Jesus was how nothing bothered Him, for all that He said and did, the uncanny thing is that it was as if it was never about Himself while it was always about Himself.This is wonderful brother, truly wonderful, hope it becomes even more of a fruitful discussion. To stand for the truth without any of the baggage or the fear of man or concern for ourselves but all the concern for others, for Him. To be like Him... To not be bothered and to go on and say what needs to be said. To take a stand for the truth of scripture and all it's weight.Brother think there are some still that will not rest until they find that reality of... Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth:And then to stand on it, never moved from it, always ready and willing to let go of that which is counter to it, not to what we think is true, but truth itself. And how else but to die to ourselves, maybe then we would be more truly loving because we love the truth.Long ways to go...

Oh! My Brothers! This is soooooo it!This is wonderful brother, truly wonderful, hope it becomes even more of a fruitful discussion. To stand for the truth without any of the baggage or the fear of man or concern for ourselves but all the concern for others, for Him. To be like Him... To not be bothered and to go on and say what needs to be said. To take a stand for the truth of scripture and all it's weight.doesn't it just seem muddy everywhere?This is so hard, guys. I'm wrestling with the pain of it everyday. Just this morning I have cried bitter tears alone with God over the painfullness of it. This place, this huge divide, is right where many turn and go back. God was dealing with me, because I so want to just give up at times. In my prayer time, God was lovingly standing behind me with his hand on my back saying, "don't turn around. I know this is hard, but don't turn around."Here's the deal. We begin to seek God like a bulldog. His truth begins to shine forth in our hearts and minds. We begin to "see" what's wrong all around us. We begin to speak up. And suddenly there's a mob of opposition. "Who are you!?" "Who died and made you God?" There's this whole mentality of, just live and let live. Don't tell anyone they are wrong. That's judgemental. Oh, it's all so confusing!Or, you begin to press in in your relationships, being honest, sharing your heart, talking about the hard, difficult things, and Wow! The person begins to back away, I mean, out of sight! That hurts. This is what I was crying about this morning. It seems that, since I've begun to draw close to God, humbling myself, willing to do anything just to know him and be about what He is about, that I find myself more and more alone. It's scary and confusing. I don't have a community of people around me encouraging me like some do. It's just me and God and a sprinkling of folks who seem to know and understand what I am talking about. This morning I told God, "I just need to know if I'm doing right here?" "Is this what you want me to do, or have I done something wrong?" I believe God spoke to me and said, "Don't turn around. You are moving toward me. Many will fall behind. Let them go. Just keep running and press into me." Oh, this is so hard! I'm realizing that my God has been myself and other people. Now that the True and Living God is being enthroned on my heart, my heart is littered with holes which are having to be filled with Him. I always looked to people to approve me. Now, I am learning to look into my Father's eyes. Let's go up to Zion, the City of Our God! Love, Dian.

Is anyone willing to stand for truth anymore?I get a little nervous when I see these words, probably because of past experience. I fear that when those words are attached to fallen natures, it leads a battle of minds, power posturing, control, pride etc. And people get hurt. (maybe their egos get bothered) I suspect that many react to that problem by getting wishy washy as you described. (God forbid that we should make anyone feel badly, so let's embrace everyone's beliefs.) Albert Einstein said: "We still do not know one-thousandth of one percent of what nature has revealed to us."Think of how much more vast the pool of spiritual truth is. We get into power struggles over "truth" when we think we know more than Einstein, or when we feel it is our duty to make someone else "see the light" as we see it. (People hate getting "set straight".) Truth, knowledge, etc without pure love is as sounding brass. If we get a little brassy, it is because we are normal. We still don't know what we don't know, and we're still in the sanctifying process, needing to get closer to the ground, and needing to grow in love for others. We don't need to have everybody agree with us in order to benefit from our fellowship. Whey! What a relief! I don't have to try to play God and "fix" up my brother who annoys me. In fact, God may be using him to enlighten me about something. Meanwhile God is working in him too. Diane

Dear sister and I do mean dear...For all this is 'not' here, it is a saving grace and I must be done with equivacating... :-? (What a goofball sentence that is!) It's scary and confusing. I don't have a community of people around me encouraging me like some do. It's just me and God and a sprinkling of folks who seem to know and understand what I am talking about.Me neither, maybe we need to pray more for each other (all of us here) that the Lord would join us to fellowship of similar burning hearts. For all that comes down to singular dealings with the Lord inwardly, knowing that to Him alone we live and die and move and have our being... Still, we need each other. Oh to be like Paul, going to visit the 'churches' to encourage and uplift the brethren...Am torn, have been blessed with a gift from some frequent flier miles (My, what has gone on with this fool in the the last 6-8 months!)round trip to almost any destination in the US, but to where? It is certainly fixed (loosely, 'today or tomorrow...James 4:13) in my heart to go visit one of the brethren, far too many to list and even what might be a surprise, if they were to have me, despite whatever misgivings more misunderstanding than anything. Drifting here...This morning I told God, "I just need to know if I'm doing right here?" "Is this what you want me to do, or have I done something wrong?"Yes, I mean, yes, echo's of a daily sort...Or, you begin to press in in your relationships, being honest, sharing your heart, talking about the hard, difficult things, and Wow! The person begins to back away, I mean, out of sight! That hurts. This is what I was crying about this morning. It seems that, since I've begun to draw close to God, humbling myself, willing to do anything just to know him and be about what He is about, that I find myself more and more alone. You know sis just went through a similar spell of that same exact thing as early as last week and the puzzlement of why now is this so bothersome? With everything circumstantially upside down and beyond absurd over the course of the last year or so and the times of just being carried through it all, the other times of complete heart devastation over so much... The very truth of Joh 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. And I hope that is not taking it out of context, but there are just times, perhaps they are but times of development, of trust and faith, despite it all, in fact doesn't it seem that, that is the exercise?"Will you trust ME in this?"And just as well maybe it is to the brethren as well..."Will you come alongside your comrade, lift them up not only in your heart, but with your words and encouragement?" A little personal example. Right towards the end of this quasi, somewhat leaning towards self pity...Ah, it's not that, it just... borders it perhaps, what are we to do, pull up our boot straps, suck it up? Is that being true? Got a phone call as I was just hunkering down to commiserate in bed... "Hello!...('Who's calling at this time of night grumbling to myself, can't they see I am miserable, blah, blah, blah....) It was Jeremy (Hulsey) our brother here. I thought, "Well God bless him and all...but, the timing...". Long story short, an hour later I was praising God for my misery. It was if he could see right through it all, without a word, the exact opposite of the man knocking on the door asking for bread, this time around he came delivering and I didn't even realize how hungry I was for it. That the Lord sent him for just that moment... A bit more irony, the bulk of the bread he brought was of the joy he had of finding fellowship of the same burning heart and what they shared together in person, and I found that extremely encouraging!Sorry to be taking this somewhat sideways here from Stephens original intent, but perhaps it is but another faucet of truth, being expressed in Jesus words that ...Joh 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another. Despite all the 'appearances' to the contrary when we must stand for the truth... in love.Oh, this is so hard! I'm realizing that my God has been myself and other people. Now that the True and Living God is being enthroned on my heart, my heart is littered with holes which are having to be filled with Him. I always looked to people to approve me. Now, I am learning to look into my Father's eyes. That some of God's plugs can come along and fill the holes of that wonderful container. You are beloved Diane. We may not be there, where you are physically, but we are here in this weird cyber kind of way... a wonder is it not?

I believe in U,God and I trust you. The LORD has placed it in my heart to post this here...Know that I love you all so much.I come to the garden alone,While the dew is still on the roses;And the voice I hear, falling on my ear,The Son of God discloses.He speaks and the sound of His-Her voiceIs so sweet the birds hush their singing,And the melody that He gave to meWithin my heart is ringing.And He walks with me, and He talks with me,And He tells me I am His own;And the joy we share as we tarry thereNone other has ever known.Those who seek quality time with God will learn that He is always ready, (Truth) waiting to meet with them (Truth). Quality time is one of God's great love languages, (Truth) :-)

somehow we must balance humility and love with a zeal for the truth.I am learning this as well. A year or so ago, I was walking more in "zeal", but also I see now, alot of it was flesh. I have come to believe that alot of zeal is flesh that we have not brought under control yet.Walking in humility and patience is harder and takes time to learn. You can get zeal in an instant-like anything else flesh related. Humility and patience and forebearance, takes time and alot of 'experience' in the refiner's fire.I am learning right along with you all.In Him, Chanin

I feel the same way brother." I always looked to people to approve me. Now, I am learning to look into my Father's eyes. "The lord is doing much the very same thing with me. I'ts beautiful. He is preparing us, to stand in the midst of all this and be a lighthouse, that does not cover itself. We are called to be like John the Baptists in this generation, Prepare Ye the Way of The Lord!I find this simplistic statement, look into my Father's eyes, is so very important. I myself must keep my eyes on Him, all the time, clinging to my savior that bought me, trusting in Him, putting all my confidence in Him, I must stay humble, and pursue love.At the same time, i am being very convicted and overwealmed with the truth of so many things. The great Apostacy in the world within those professing the be the church. And the great many that are being lulled away into damnation. That article on Wolves in Sheeps Clothing, really hits the nail on the donkey. Reading that i was very overwealmed, angry, sad, and desired to want to help make things right.The Gospel has degenerated within just mainline christianity, to a half gospel, no power, no repentence, its become humanistic, works gospel;trusting in a prayer rather than the savior, people first dont even know what there being saved from, poeople are not told their sinners, nore shown experientially by the law, that they may truly see their need of the savior. All Christ bought for us is not preached; not just salvation when we die but now; sanctification, justification( certain sects are denying His will, and power and work, to heal and deliver today)It makes you want to scream!Lust of flesh, of the eyes, the pride of life, is slowly creeping in being covered by subtle things.Prosperity doctrine. Love of money, self.The whole way the Church functions in america, its blueprint, is not really biblical at all. Its all about a building, and a one man show, trying to build his little kingdom, self, self.Its all about the building. Its not a family, but like the world, a heiarchy organization or something. Its a one day a week entertainment show, rather than an everyday, lifestyle.Theres just so much thats all must up. Election of God, and the Soverignty of God, isnt taught. Mostly because of mans pride. Trying to steal from Gods Glory. The whole Counsel of God isnt preached over all.Church excepts for the most part, witchcraft, and rebellion, with saying that its ok to watch, Lord of Rings,(glorifys witchcraft, saying that there can be a good sorcerer,WHEN ALL SORCERY IS EVIL! AND IS AN ABOMINATION TO GOD!) God warns heavily to his people against having to do with such things, yet we make so many excuses to why its ok, because its just a movie, YOU ARE BEING ENTERTAINED BY SOMETHING GOD HATES, AND CALLS AN ABOMINATION! Judge for yourselves, harry potter, star wars(ALL FANTASY) and etc.We will spend hours watching this crap, how many hours do we spend with the lord in his word? Not to mention these things are contrary to Him, they deny Him, and His reality, but Glorify Man, Self, self power, humanism. Some say that God ministerd to Me through those movies, take heed that it isnt a Evil spirit seducing you into thinking that these things God calls an abomination are ok.We dont have time for this stuff, TV, movies, sports, This is all what the world is entertained by we must remeber this. God did not design these things. They are all a very big distraction to us. They consume and waste are time, they desensatize us to the mind of the world. Its what the world loves, God doenst love it we shouldnt love it either. We must seek His kingdom first.RCC, is said to be apart of the church, when it is a Cult. We must stand on the truth, the foundational doctrines, if anyone has a diff gospel, we should not be in fellowship with them, and not act as we are brothers. We should warn them out of love. If we truly love them we will.I could go on and on, but whoever started this thread, yes Im very concearned, quite shook up, and just trying my best to seek the Lord, be disciplined with Him, obey Him, prepare for His work for me, stay humble, abide in His love. I try to keep all fellow brethren in prayer. Lets keep our chin up, this encouraged me much today:Meditation for This MorningSaturday, May 28C. H. Spurgeon"Whom He justified, them He also glorified." --Romans 8:30Here is a precious truth for thee, believer. Thou mayest be poor, or in suffering, or unknown, but for thine encouragement take a review of thy "calling" and the consequences that flow from it, and especially that blessed result here spoken of. As surely as thou art God's child today, so surely shall all thy trials soon be at an end, and thou shalt be rich to all the intents of bliss. Wait awhile, and that weary head shall wear the crown of glory, and that hand of labour shall grasp the palm-branch of victory. Lament not thy troubles, but rather rejoice that ere long thou wilt be where "there shall be neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain." The chariots of fire are at thy door, and a moment will suffice to bear thee to the glorified. The everlasting song is almost on thy lip. The portals of heaven stand open for thee. Think not that thou canst fail of entering into rest. If He hath called thee, nothing can divide thee from His love. Distress cannot sever the bond; the fire of persecution cannot burn the link; the hammer of hell cannot break the chain. Thou art secure; that voice which called thee at first, shall call thee yet again from earth to heaven, from death's dark gloom to immortality's unuttered splendours. Rest assured, the heart of Him who has justified thee beats with infinite love towards thee. Thou shalt soon be with the glorified, where thy portion is; thou art only waiting here to be made meet for the inheritance, and that done, the wings of angels shall waft thee far away, to the mount of peace, and joy, and blessedness, where,"Far from a world of grief and sin, With God eternally shut in,"thou shalt rest for ever and ever.P.S IF ANYONE AGREES WITH ME ON ALL WHAT I HAVE SAID OR MOST, PLEASE EMAIL MEadonaisarmy@netscape.net