TX Shooting Scripture

I just read that Psalm 100 was to be read at Sutherland Springs First Baptist Church; but the shooting occurred before the scripture reading. I am curious how you all would respond to a critic in reference to this scripture and what happened.

"Shout triumphantly to the Lord, all the earth. Serve the Lord with gladness; come before Him with joyful songs. Acknowledge that Yahweh is God. He made us, and we are His ”” His people, the sheep of His pasture. Enter His gates with thanksgiving and His courts with praise. Give thanks to Him and praise His name. For Yahweh is good, and His love is eternal; His faithfulness endures through all generations.”
Psalm 100

"Are we to accept what is good from God but not tragedy?"

"The LORD gave, and the LORD has taken away. Blessed be the name of the LORD."

Job 2:10 and 1:21

If such an answer was good enough for Job it's good enough for me.

Because, as Jesus said, even if one were to be raised from the dead, still they'd not believe.

If these Texans came out of their graves tomorrow, would Richard Dawkins repent and believe. Or would he write another best seller to slander and impugn the Name of the Author of life.

Likely the latter.

Jonathan and Monique could give a good answer as well.

https://youtu.be/jf6z98ZxhT0

They've been, "Through Deep Waters"

Technically though a believer’s RESPONSE to very bad circumstance is irrelevant to the question of how one deals with the actual scripture that says Yahweh is good, loves eternally and is faithful through all generations.

Consider this argument that an atheist might make: a child who is obedient, faithful and defends a parent who mercilessly beats him on a regular basis does not prove that the parent is good. Some might call the child a misguided fool, at worst, or brainwashed, at best.

The question people ask is "how could God allow such a thing to happen to the sheep in his flock? He would not seem to be a very good shepherd.”

It is one of the exact criticisms I saw being lodged by many on Twitter in the aftermath of the shooting.

This obviously has been a major stone thrown at Christianity for centuries; we are no closer to having a satisfactory answer now than we did then.

All this said, I would certainly agree that Job’s response is best, because realistically there is no other option.

Todd:

I would say there multitudes of texts that answer the Bad God good man question.

Savannah's text quote was a good one.

The first misunderstanding is...and I always go here first.

The question is put in the framework that God did bad by not...(fill in the blank) because those good men didn't deserve such treatment by God.

The spiritual reality...

God is good, man is not.
God can judge anytime, anyone, anywhere in any circumstance.

The retort... "Well, are you saying God doesn't care about his own? That doesn't sound like a good God"

The spiritual reality...For the unbeliever its because of people like yourself, who have made God your enemy, who are alienated from God by your own wickedness, your own suppression of the truth and your own ignorance of spiritual reality that you presume a great deal by posing some deficiency in God because the "threat of danger is not removed by God's love and the actual death of many is not stopped by Gods power".
Fact is, the unbeliever is every moment of every day exposed to a Hell just waiting for him to enter, the devils are everyday blinding, tempting, seducing and dragging the unbeliever along by his own rope. It is because God is good you are not in hell now. It is because God is kind you are not tormented in flame.

But this kind of straightforward answer is too direct, a slap in the face of their pride. They think their moral judgment of God has justified their refusal to obey God and reconcile themselves to him. They are dead wrong.
They are blind to the fact that their moral judgment of God does not excuse them from God's judgment of their sinful lives...in their judgment they make excuse and argument to us as if by persuading the Christian he is serving a mean God, they are justified to serve Satan and the flesh in love with the world. They are dead wrong.

Those murdered people, many no doubt believers foretell the coming judgment upon the wicked, where in a time they know not, in a way they know not God will require their soul and bring it to judgment. For those saints, they are with the Lord, and others attending that meeting outside of Christ are in hell.

The pretense behind the Bad God, good man question begs for the judgment of God because it assumes what is false about God and presumes in ignorance about men.

But a very cynical person would say that God created this whole system in the first place.

The questions are not easy ones. I mean, they can be easy enough to give responses that satisfy us who know Him personally. But, for the unsaved, the answers don't slide down their gullets. They choke on them.

Very true Tim. I’ll be honest and say they choke me a tad- however I can only trust that "the judge off all the earth will do right.”

Hi Tim and Todd:

Cynicism is the defense mechanism, otherwise belief is not just reasonable its necessary. But to ignore and suppress truth cynicism is a quick go-to in order to escape any pinched conscience.

The rational and obvious response to hearing "I may be next to die" is "how can I get right with God, will he accept me, forgive me...at least help me?"
But rational responses are totally unsafe because rationality is a faculty of man designed to lead man to God. Intuitively the sinful man knows this, so in order to continue in his skepticism, cynicism, atheism, agnosticism, humanism, narcissism...you name your ism rationality is no friend to his sinful nature. The best thing to do is to stonewall and that is why the emotional and the irrational are safe because they internally disconnect from reality, from rationality...and especially from a convicting word.
Cognitive dissonance is a close friend in case of truth, evidence and conviction dropped in the sinners lap without preparation to argue against it.

The more the Christian presses the sinner the more obvious it becomes to both sinner and Christian their complaint against God is suppression of truth coupled with unbelief masked with intellectual sounding questions and retorts based solely upon their enemy-mindset looking for even more escape routes...and hoping you dear Christian will provide another.

My point is I never let them off the hook, I never let them try to step over the cross, I set before them a stumbling block. Not because I am clever but because to faithfully proclaim the message of truth the cross is built-in to it. They stumble because God made it necessary for sinful man to stumble, he must choke on it, he must fall and be broken. That is part of what it means to introduce Jesus to them.
They want to play word games and duel with me over philosophical issues then defend myself because of Christian failures or supposed God failures and finally if they can, get me to believe they have some kind of superior view by way of science, philosophy, and evolution. All of these are marshaled against the Christian when they propose their God failures. Their axioms go flyin and their truisms are thrown like a fast-ball...but they don't realize Jesus in me provides a shield of faith and is able to quench fiery darts of Satan let alone irrationality masquerading as logic and good morals.

If they stumble at the word, that word is God doing his work perfectly. If they are pleased, placated with a philosophy that lets them off the hook, you get to have the appearance of helping them but have denied the power of the cross and shunned the work of the Holy Spirit.

Their stumbling is a good thing.

Precious in the sight of the LORD is the death of his saints.

Think about what all was and had happened when David penned these words...

And Paul here; For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better:

And John here; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
19 ¶ And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.

In light of these and other passages and the experiences of the apostles, shouldn’t we as Peter says; Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.
17 ¶ For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

Maybe we’re looking at this all wrong?

Hi Fletcher:

I don't think Im looking at this issue wrongly because I am discussing another slant that unbelievers take when questioning the Christian about God's lack of concern for the death of his own.

Your text is a fine example of showing the division the Lord makes upon the His return as well as those who die in Christ and those who die outside of Christ.
Those who suffer for Christ and those who suffer while being an enemy of God.

No matter which way you turn, the cross and the stumbling block are present to cause the fall of men.

It's important to know that all scripture is subject to argumentation, striving, disagreement. Every scripture pushes the sinner back and the rebellious response is to push the question in another direction...
How could you believe a God that was not faithful to your loved ones and let them die?
How could you believe in a God that allows the killing of children, teens who did no wrong?
Why would anyone think there is consolation in a myth-book with a non-existent God?

This an a hundred more retorts can be given against any text presented. But the issue is not to find the 'exact' text that somehow quenches all questions, my response is to put the sinner on trial, its he that must defend himself when the God who judges all men hears and sees everything used by sinful men to hide themselves from truth.
Jesus words are true, "If you do not believe that I am he, ye shall die in your sins" Their complaints and arguments only distract from the reality of their own peril.

It is a secret thing of God to know why those people, why those children, why that Church. It is revealed in scripture what we should do when we see calamity, death, injustice...
"for unless ye repent for ye shall likewise perish".
Jesus turned the question back on them, that is what I attempt to do as well.

Brother Marvin,

That was not meant as an affront to you or any contributors, rather I was hoping to show a different way of responding, especially to a "critic” by revealing that this is not our home and we look to another, better inheritance than this. As such, if while walking in obedience to God, we should die (no matter how gruesome) then that is a day of rejoicing for we have graduated, released from the prison of this mortal coil with its fallen tendencies and moved on to our everlasting treasure, namely the eternal presence of God without distractions:)

We know from the scriptures (Job, 1 John, etc...) that if we are walking in obedience to God then the enemy cannot touch us without permission from the Father, so if something "bad” befalls us then the Lord allowed it. While He Himself doesn’t personally take part in the "bad” regarding His children, He nonetheless allows it... (or so my understanding goes).

For some there’s a choice,... a "garden of gethsemane” moment of ultimate surrender or like Stephen who was so honored in the mist of such a horrific act,.. and oh how God was glorified:)))

Ours is not to appease the critic but to glorify God and let them see it, especially amidst tragedy’s shadow, responding not to them or the situations, but to Him that all may see that Christ is risen and alive in us and then let Holy Spirit bring conviction and do what only He can do:)

Hi Fletcher: No affront was taken, sorry if my post gave that impression.

The post was well said, we are on the same page.

I especially like... "Ours is not to appease the critic but to glorify God and let them see it, especially amidst tragedy’s shadow, responding not to them or the situations, but to Him that all may see that Christ is risen and alive in us and then let Holy Spirit bring conviction and do what only He can do:)"

I wish I'd said that.

AMEN

Yes amen