How John Piper Became a ‘Christian Hedonist’

I would appreciate some thoughts on this podcast by John Piper.

https://www.desiringgod.org/interviews/how-john-piper-became-a-christian-hedonist

Here is a short extract -

"I came across The Weight of Glory at Vroman’s bookstore off of Colorado Avenue in Pasadena. It was one afternoon in the fall of 1968.

I opened up, and here’s the page I read: "The New Testament has lots to say about self-denial, but not about self-denial as an end in itself. We are told to deny ourselves and take up our crosses in order that we may follow Christ; and nearly every description of what we shall ultimately find if we do so contains an appeal to desire.”

Blessings

This line of thinking sorta makes me queasy. I suppose it is true that nobody would come to Christ if there was no benefit to it but to over-emphasize how your life will be better through salvation doesn't sit well with me. It reminds me too much of Joel Osteen and how he is all about chasing after blessings for yourself - wealth, happiness, success, well-being, etc. I believe in those things but I believe we receive those things as a byproduct of seeking first the kingdom. We should trust God to meet or needs, not our greeds. Think about loving God and other people and you will be blessed in your giving and all your legitimate needs will be met.

-Daniel

I've seen videos of John Piper speaking against the prosperity gospel and its offshoots.

Daniel,

You said:
"……but to over-emphasize how your life will be better through salvation doesn't sit well with me.”

Just think:

1 Cor. 2:9 ”“
but just as it is written,
"THINGS WHICH EYE HAS NOT SEEN AND EAR HAS NOT HEARD,
AND which HAVE NOT ENTERED THE HEART OF MAN,
ALL THAT GOD HAS PREPARED FOR THOSE WHO LOVE HIM."

Eph. 3:8 ”“
To me, the very least of all saints, this grace was given, to preach to the Gentiles the unfathomable riches of Christ

Phil. 3:8 ””
……I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ

Eph. 3:20 ”“
Now to Him who is able to do far more abundantly beyond all that we ask or think, according to the power that works within us, to Him be the glory in the church and in Christ Jesus to all generations forever and ever. Amen.

Immediately you think of the worldly prosperity gospel and Joel Osteen.

I do not care or think about the worldly prosperity gospel and Joel Osteen.

Immediately I think of the wondrous great love of God our Father and the super-abounding grace and riches of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Col. 2:2 ”“
………Christ Himself, in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge

2 Thess. 2:13-14 ”“
But we should always give thanks to God for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God has chosen you from the beginning for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and faith in the truth. It was for this He called you through our gospel, that you may gain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

The heavens declare the glory of God and so do I.

Col. 3:2 ”“
Set your mind on the things above, not on the things that are on earth.

Eph. 2:4-7 ”“
But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved) and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.

No one seated in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus can be touched by the world.

2 Cor. 4:4 ”“
……the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving so that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

1 John 3:8 ”“
the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.

ADD:

From the extract in OP:
"We are told to deny ourselves and take up our crosses in order that we may follow Christ; and nearly every description of what we shall ultimately find if we do so contains an appeal to desire.”

Col. 1:26-27 ”“
that is, the mystery which has been hidden from the past ages and generations, but has now been manifested to His saints, to whom God willed to make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.

Ps. 42:1-2 ”“
As the deer pants for the water brooks,
So my soul pants for You, O God.
My soul thirsts for God, for the living God;

I read Pipers "Desiring God” a long time ago which is his primer on Christian hedonism. It isn’t as bad as it sounds. He is not a prosperity teacher by a very long shot.

One thing I remember is that he reworded a passage from the Westminster catechism as follows:

Q. What is the chief end of man?
A. Man's chief end is to glorify God, and to enjoy him forever.

To:

Q. What is the chief end of man?
A. Man's chief end is to glorify God **BY ENJOYING** him forever.

OK, perhaps the clickbait title of "Christian Hedonism" prejudiced my thinking here. Hedonism is being driven by pleasure seeking. I might have jumped to a false conclusion about him seeking God for His hand and not His face. After reading the article again, he is desiring God Himself, so I misjudged what was being communicated. I still don't like him using the word hedonism in this context though. I still think that being purely motivated by self-interest, even if is pleasure of (in) God is misguided.

-Daniel

Daniel-

I was never a fan of the term "hedonism” either and I think it was unwise for him to use it. I wonder if he did it to raise hackles so people would look into it further. Regardless it seems some words should not be mixed into Christianity.

John's book 'Desiring God' contains the foundations for his exhortation to become Christian hedonists. Here he offers some correctives to the negative term and how it should be applied to a person who's delight and pleasure is as endless as God is good. With that frame of thought he works through various injunctions in scripture to enjoy God, love, know and take pleasure in him.

This is John's approach to fleshing-out what Travis was saying about God's purpose of reconciliation is for relationship with God, loving and knowing him with joy.