Witches Go To Bethel

This is an article about a woman who is an active practitioner of witchcraft and her friend (also a witch) who visited Bethel church in Redding.

Quote from the article (a 'prophetic word' she got from someone at Bethel):
"I feel the Lord saying to you that He is very pleased with you. You have been so faithful to Him. You have been faithful to His Word, even when though there are many people telling you that you are now going the wrong way. But God knows it isn’t true. He wants you to know that He is proud of you. God knows that you are walking with Him and He is so proud of your faithfulness.”

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/agora/2015/07/born-again-witch-witches-at-a-pentecostal-church-healings-and-prophecies/

"Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world." 1 John 4:1

Do these people have no discernment?

"Behold, I will cause those of the synagogue of Satan, who say that they are Jews, and are not, but lie, behold, I will make them to come and bow down at your feet, and to know that I have loved you.” Revelation 3:9

I actually read the entire three-part series. I found it very interesting.

It was interesting that the witches felt that during 'worship' (i.e. the portion of the service where we sing) all the songs talked about how 'everything is Jesus', and "only Jesus,' etc. The words of the songs did not allow these two witches to sing along, because they could not associate with the songs. That to me was a positive thing about the worship.

Also, the witches noted that during worship the members of the congregation were emptying themselves of themselves. That is also encouraging to hear, and hopefully true. The one who had apparently at one time been a part of the church (pretty active, apparently, and even played worship) could not enjoy it because she refused to empty herself. The other witch at first was afraid because the "energy" that was being emptied seemed to be taking hers as well, so she put up her "shield" to protect herself from being drawn into this.

If people are emptying themselves, as we are asked to do, to allow Jesus to come in, that gives me hope about those who attend Bethel. Although I do not agree with a lot of what goes on at Bethel, I believe most of those who attend are seeking to serve God. Unfortunately, they have not educated themselves enough on the Word to know that what they are being taught and what they are practicing is unbiblical.

There is, however, this false feeling of "spirituality"-- the prophesying, the dancing, etc., how the young people are "trained" to prophesy, etc.--that impresses people about Bethel. The Christian world flocks to Bethel because they are looking for that spirituality; they think that this is what it looks like to have the gifts of the Spirit, to live with the power of the Holy Spirit. I have spoken to people who have been there who come back impressed and feeling belittled because they do not have that. The whole problem is the biblical illiteracy that exists, even in the pastors, and the hunger and thirst for "signs and wonders."

I was also saddened about the commercial feeling of this church, which one of them likened to a tech conference. Unfortunately, that is true in so many of our churches.

By the way, the witch tells that she received the same prophecy (about being on the right path and that God is pleased with her) THREE different times from people at Bethel, twice on this visit, and once prior at a different location. That gives me pause as to whether I want any of them laying hands on me...

romanchog, that was a very insightful and non-judgmental post.

"The whole problem is the biblical illiteracy that exists, even in the pastors, and the hunger and thirst for "signs and wonders."

Well said.

"That gives me pause as to whether I want any of them laying hands on me..."

I personally won't let anyone lay hands on me unless I know them very well and I know they have a solid walk with God.

I remember several years ago I was at a friends house for a Bible study and there were 2 men I had never met before. One of them asked if he and the other man could lay hands on me. The one who asked me seemed okay, but the other one, for some reason I knew something was wrong, so I politely declined. I found out later the man I felt uneasy about had serious spiritual problems, i.e. calling himself an apostle, supported polygamy etc.

One other thing is "training" people to use spiritual gifts just doesn't sit well with me. I know people that genuinely speak in tongues, for example, and others who fake it to fit in, because they feel excluded if they don't.

This sounds similar to the meetings held in the book of Acts, don't ya think?

Paul the apostle probably would've told those at Bethel to just read what he wrote to the Corinthians in chapter 13 of his first letter.

And then he'd have proceeded to join the worship band and lead them in the chorus, "All You Need is Love."

I know Paul wouldn't want to offend anyone.

He'd probably sign Bibles for everyone, and then treat everyone after church to go and see the movie, "The Shack."

On the way to the movie he'd probably tell everyone to stop being so judgmental, because they'll just chase people away and give the church a bad name.

I'm so glad you all love me here on SI, and that you are so patient and understanding with me.

I've gotta go now. Gotta go and rehearse with the other members of the worship team. I'm so thankful for the extra money I can make each Sunday to help with my mortgage and car payments.

Enjoy the weekend...

I was thinking further about these two women. One of them professed at one time to be a Christian and described how much she had enjoyed "worshipping" (praise and song) as a Christian. She went to Bethel seeking to feel that wonderful feeling again but was unable to.

While it is possible that she may have just been emotional during her prior experiences, I was reminded of Hebrews 6:4-6.

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.

This woman may have tasted the heavenly gift, been a partaker of the Holy Spirit. But she has rejected Christ and is now unable to participate of His presence. So sad.

Its possible she could have fallen away from Christ and can't come back; in my understanding, though, this state only comes on people when they reject the Holy Spirit's conviction over and over, for perhaps a very long time. God is very patient and longsuffering; He took me back after I purposely rejected Him and lived a wicked life for 6 years (I became a heroin addict). It is also possible she never really has known Christ. Sometimes people genuinely feel God's presence but never surrender to Him.

I don't doubt that there are sincere seekers after God at Bethel, but if I could I would recommend they go elsewhere. The teaching seems to be very off kilter. And we have to remember that the Bible warns about another Jesus, another Spirit, and another gospel.

I agree that Bethel meets the definition of another Jesus, another Spirit, another gospel.

But there are so many thousands of churches in America that are theologically sound but so dead in the Spirit that I am not sure which is worse.

Which is worse: a church that "over welcomes" the HS or a church where he is, for all intents and purposes, forbidden?

Todd those were my exact thoughts earlier today.

TMK said: "Which is worse: a church that "over welcomes" the HS or a church where he is, for all intents and purposes, forbidden?"

The problem with places like Bethel is that they have not learned to test the spirits. In my opinion, they are welcoming spirits that are not of God, while also welcoming the Holy Spirit. That is to me worse, because it is dangerous.

I am in an unusual position, because I attend what is basically a cessationist church (where most manifestations of the Holy Spirit would not be welcome), but teach at a Christian school where they believe in the gifts of the Spirit (which I believe in).

The pastor at the "cessationist" church gives solid biblical teaching, and I come away every Sunday feeling edified and fed; I also have a wonderful fellowship with believers there.

On some Sundays, I also attend the school's church. The Holy Spirit is definitely "welcome" there. However, I usually leave feeling that I have heard a motivational speech, or that the teaching was just milk. The school's church also has ties to Bethel. I do my best to avoid attending when they have guest speakers/ministers from Bethel, but sometimes it is required of me.

I would much rather sit in the church where some of the Holy Spirit is not 'welcome' and receive truth, than sit at the one where the Holy Spirit is supposedly welcome and receive nothing, or worse, receive untruth, and not grow any closer to Christ. It took me a long time to get to this point. I remember Art Katz saying that we need to be so hungry for truth that we would even be willing to give up these "experiences" of the Holy Spirit. After all, the Holy Spirit lives in me and I can fellowship with Him at home in my own time.

On the other hand, I fellowship with both groups of believers and find that both have something different to offer the body of Christ. And I know both pastors well and know that they both want to do the will of God and to live entirely for Christ. Like all of us, they are walking a walk and learning. Unfortunately, their learning affects many others.

This is my humble opinion.

"I would much rather sit in the church where some of the Holy Spirit is not 'welcome' and receive truth, than sit at the one where the Holy Spirit is supposedly welcome and receive nothing, or worse, receive untruth, and not grow any closer to Christ."

Natalie I lean this way as well.

Here's a question: supposing you had a new christian who wanted a good church, but the only churches available were either dead or had these excesses like Bethel etc. Which one would you recommend? (Or neither?)

Nigel said: "Here's a question: supposing you had a new christian who wanted a good church, but the only churches available were either dead or had these excesses like Bethel etc. Which one would you recommend? (Or neither?)"

Before joining any church, I would recommend that a new believer first study the Word on his/her own, being led only by the Holy Spirit, to learn especially the New Testament backwards and forwards. Then he will be filled with the knowledge of the truth and will be able to discern when he is being taught the truth and when what is going on around him is biblical.