Joel Osteen doesnt believe John 14:6

sermonindex Jul 8, 2005

In a June 20th interview on the international cable television program Larry King Live, the pastor of one of America's largest churches said that he does not know who goes to heaven or who goes to hell.When asked if atheists go to heaven, Joel Osteen of Lakewood Church in Houston, Texas, replied, "I'm going to let God be the judge of who goes to heaven and hell" (Charismanow.com, June 30). When asked where Jews or Muslims go if they don't accept Jesus Christ, Osteen replied, "You know, I'm very careful about saying who would and wouldn't go to heaven; I don't know."In a letter posted to his web site, Osteen later apologized for being "unclear on the very thing in which I have dedicated my life." He said: "In my desire not to alienate the people that Jesus came to save, I did not clearly communicate the convictions that I hold so precious."In fact, in his statements on Larry King Live Osteen was indeed communicating the core conviction of his church-growth philosophy, which is to preach "positive truth." He has not drawn a crowd of tens of thousands by preaching clearly on eternal Hell as the Lord Jesus Christ did, and even in his "apology" Osteen did not plainly state that those outside of Christ go to an eternal fiery Hell.When Osteen packed out the Coliseum in Charlotte, North Carolina, in March of this year, a local news reporter enthused, "Osteen doesn't rail against gays or thump a Bible, like so many others do" ("Evangelist: Don't Worry, Be Happy," The Charlotte Observer, March 8, p. E1). Osteen's message was, "Make a decision before you leave this place, you're going to get happy where you are."This is a direct fulfillment of 2 Timothy 4:3-4: "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears, and they shall turn away their ears from the truth and shall be turned unto fables."Beware of ear tickling preachers who are willing to give a wicked, apostate generation a soft, new kind of Christianity that we do not see in Scripture.Krispy

sermonindex Jul 8, 2005

By the way... Larry King asks these same questions to every single Christian "leader" he has on his show. He's done it for years. Only Jerry Falwell had the ... well... guts... to answer correctly. The Grahams, Rick Warren, Pat Robertson, etc all squirmed over the years and would not give the Truth that is found in scripture. If these jokers arent prepared to answer this question that King asks of all of them... then they need to avoid going on that show.It's a disgrace.Krispy

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Eli_Barnabas Jul 8, 2005

One day we all will be interviewed by the KING of kings.

J

Joshua99 Jul 8, 2005

Yes, I agree! I stand with you with this new "Fear of man, rather than God" gospel. We don't want to preach and teach the Truth because we will become outcasts, loose members of our churches, have problems within our leadership over doctrine. If we are called to be God's "Spokeman" for the Truth and defend it, and don't??? Woe unto us! You see, I'm right in the middle of this problem in my church, where I'm a worship leader/guitarist and teacher. The teaching of God's Word is poor at best! In a spirit-filled church at that! I been asked not to make waves by some brothers, I may be asked to leave the church, as a result of pointing out hypocrisy in the leadership and pulpit. The fear of man, dominates the American church today, lets only preach the positive word!, I'll over-look your sin, if you will over-look my sin mentality! Rubbish!

C

crsschk Jul 8, 2005

Is this necessary? Is there no tact left among us?This tendency to drag this forum down into the gutter with these kinds of things. Though many would surely agree with the problems inherent within the context here, the ease of character assassination and slander despite all that. Who is it that we think we are and Who is it that we belong to?Luk 9:55 But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. Forget the defenses and the 'offending', that's not the issue. Just think about what this looks like to the rest here and to those outside coming to this site. And take a look inside as well. Is it worth it, are you grieved or feeling a bit smug and superior over all this, it certainly gives off that impression. Think about it.

E

earnestlycontend Jul 8, 2005

I'm usually with you Crosscheck, and yes, I'm tired of all the bickering on this site too. It's not very spiritually edifying, but I do think it has its place. We may give it more of a place than it deserves, though.There is a time to point out those that are propagating falsehood in the church. Paul even called them by name and warned the church of them:1Ti 1:19 Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck: 1Ti 1:20 Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme. 2Th 3:14 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed. Kendal

sermonindex Jul 8, 2005

One day we all will be interviewed by the KING of kings.VERY good brother Eli.

M

moreofHim Jul 8, 2005

I agree that we should not "name call" and we do have to be careful about our wording here. But, the Lord seems to be laying it on my heart very heavily that we must not be afraid to take a stand against what is false and what is being toted as "gospel" today. When there is no mention of the cross, of repentance- there is no gospel.Thousands are flocking to this easy believism, "just say and it and believe it", motivational, "what can I get from God" gospel.After some of the persecution I have faced about my own stand in the faith, i am at the point where I either have to stand for what is truly right or just sit on the fence. And i am not about to sit on the fence after what i have been through.When we start to reject what is toted as "christianity" today and is selling like hotcakes, we will offend (though we will not do so purposely- and we don't need to).Thank the Lord that He will still bring people to Himself whether they are following Joel Osteen or not.By the way, I have his book (Your Best life Now) and at one time I prayed "Lord, why can't it be so for me? Why can't it be this easy for me?" It sure looks and tastes good, but unfortunately, it is not the truth.In Christ, Chanin

sermonindex Jul 8, 2005

Sorry Mike... but I call it as I see it. I can take this thread to another site if you wish, but I think everyone here is mature enough to handle the truth, my brother. I dont think calling Osteen a liar, deciever and a wimp is out of line. He did what he did publicly... and should be held accountable publicly.If you really have an issue with this thread... so be it. I'll stick to more soft issues and avoid the truth... like Osteen. I learned a couple months ago that this site does not belong to me. I'll submit to the powers that be here. Just let me know.Krispy

K

KingJimmy Jul 8, 2005

I spoke somewhat on this issue recently in a sermon at my church (if anybody wants it, I can provide it) called "Band-Aid Religion" based on Jeremiah 6:13-14 about how the priest and the prophet alike superficially heal the wounds of people, all in the name of gain. All these 40 days with Jesus, and 7 steps to Joy type books only superficially deal with the deep spiritual problems people face, and as a result, only make matters for people worse. They teach that you can have joy and salvation, yet keep your sin. But because they fail to deal with the sin issue, they only give people a superficial joy and salvation. Jesus has been baptized into Dr Phil these days. I'll never forget the only official sermon I preached at my last church, and how my pastor who reviewed my notes (I was an intern) asked me to take talk about hell out of my sermon.... in a Pentecostal (Assemblies of God) Church at that!

J

Joshua99 Jul 8, 2005

I do want to be clear, my post here is not intended to slam another ministry or pastor, proclaiming the Gospel. My stand is to be obedient first to the Lord and contend for the faith, that was given to His Church! If we do not speak out against the false doctrine in a proper attitude, of the Spirit, we may find our hands bloody from the innocent and the decieved. I believe in these last days, even a precious brother, Oswald Chambers would not put up with much of what has been excepted as Truth.

T

tinluke Jul 8, 2005

I just have to respond to this. I'd like to share a conversation that I recently had with my mom about Joel Osteen.My mom recently gave her life to Christ and she bought Joel's best-selling book "your best life now". Well a few weeks ago she called me and said "Tina, It's so strange. I've been reading Joel's book and reading the book you gave me [a women's inspiration bible] and they seem like they are representing two different Gods. Joel's book tells me I can be successful, have a big house, promotoins, to think possitive and I will have it all. On the other hand your book tells me to give it all to God. To live 100% for HIM and to not worry about the rest. I'm confused, it's like i'm getting mixed messages." Here is my mother a "baby christian" and she's confused by Joel's message, It has become a stumbling block to her. She is single, lives on a fixed income, doesn't have a fancy house, job or car. She's content and has peace with her life...that is until she starts reading Joel's book. She's feeling like a failure, like she doesn't have enough faith or isn't positive enough to receive God's best for her life. Now I have not read the book, but this what my mom got from it.

M

MrBillPro Jul 9, 2005

Everything happens for a reason as God is involved in His kids lives all the time. God had a reason for having Pastor Joel on this talk show and I have my opinion as to why, but my opinion does not count this time. God is in the process of purifying saints, myself being at the top of His list, and He does it in ways we can't even imagine or understand. He constantly refines us to clean out the things that do not magnify Jesus. He has to clean up His church (us) first, before he can attract the world of the lost. Get ready for pruning brother because some of it is going to hurt. Ouch! Did you feel that?.:-P A friend of mine called me right before the show was starting and told me to watch it, but I told him I was not going to because I did not feel that I should. Sure enough, after what was discussed, I was glad that God kept me from watching the program. ;-)

sermonindex Jul 9, 2005

Y'all... I changed the title of the thread because it was a little too controversial. I think this title is still controversial... but very very true.Krispy

sermonindex Jul 9, 2005

How about watching the leading Holy Spirit?I would say the vast majority of posters here would refer to themselves as mature Christians. I would agree with that as well. Is it not time for us to be preachers and teachers?I know there must be somebody on TV who is preaching led by the Holy Spirit. Many on TV started that way. But big business has lured them into modifying the truth of God's Word.Folks, these TV preachers need prayer. I visited Lakewood Church.......once. Once was enough. I just did not feel right in the place. So who am I to matter if I feel right in a place or not? Well, it's probably not important to you at all. But it is very important to me. Jesus said, "My sheep know my voice". Those who continually feed on spiritual pablum are seeking what satisfies the flesh, not the spirit.I think the bible refers to it as the "apostacy". It looks good and tastes good, but it does not satisfy where it counts. That is why the carnal minded keep flocking to this mess, and worse yet, funding it's continuation. The horrible part about it is that millions will show up at Heaven's Gate and think they have "made it" only to hear Jesus tell them to depart, for He never knew them. Instead of refering to what Jesus said, they will refer to what their preacher said and Jesus will have no choice but to deny them. It is the Holy Spirit Who leads and guides into all truth. Yes, He often uses others to "feed us" until we can "feed ourselves". But once we begin to mature, books, tapes, and video about the bible should pale at the desire for the Book of Books. Our "need" to listen to others should fade and our hunger should be for the meat of the Gospel. Our feet should begin to realize that we are now standing....on the Rock of our salvation.Saints, there will be apostate preachers and teachers until Jesus comes again. We are to place all our hope, not in man, but in the Good Shephard, Jesus Christ. When "men" get in public places and cowar at the truth, this should not surprise us. They are proclaiming the truth of God's Word because He warned us this would happen. Jesus said, "If I be lifted up, I will draw all men unto me. Not the Holy Spirit lifted up. Not the big name preacher lifted up. Jesus. Where the Spirit of God is, Jesus will be gloried. It's not about Joel Osteen, or you, or me. It's all about Jesus. He is the author and the finisher of our faith. He has more delightful truth for anyone who will take Him at His Word, than all the preachers in this world combined. What makes people like Tozer, Ravenhill, and so many more such memorable figures on this site is because these men were worshippers. They spent time with God. God and His Messiah was the passion of their lives. Their ministry was what spilled out of an overflowing life in Christ Jesus. That is why His Word flows so sweetly from them. It is Life, because it is inspired by God. Sadly, men like this have fallen by the way side for a substitute. Satan is in the "substitute business", has been from the beginning. What we see all around us today is inspired by personal gain more than anything else, gain and control. Big kingdoms are hard to manage..by yourself. God said, "I set before you life and death, choose life". The life is in the blood. The blood had better be that of Jesus Christ and no other. Our righteousness and holiness had better be imputed to us by Him, or it will never stand in the presence of the Father. If you are not immersed in Christ, you are lost. Turn off the "tv man", and turn to Jesus. Immerse yourself in His life, and you will have plenty to talk about, plenty to share. Not only will you be alive in Christ, but from your belly shall flow rivers of living water. To God be the glory, now and forever amen.at peace with God through Jesus Christ my Lord,Lahry

M

moreofHim Jul 9, 2005

Lahry,amen to your post! Apostacy is the first word that comes to my mind as well when it comes to this kind of easy/sweet gospel. It concerns me and yes, we need to stand up and offer the real thing. We need to be bold about proclaiming the real gospel which is to not only believe on Him, but if we are to be His disciples we must deny ourselves, pick up our cross and follow after Him. '"If any of you wants to be my follower," he told them, "you must put aside your selfish ambition, shoulder your cross, and follow me.' Mark 8:34In Christ, Chanin

sermonindex Jul 9, 2005

Narrow is the road and few are those who find it... and anytime something comes along that is incredible popular I am immediately suspect of it. I think the whole Purpose Driven phenom is the best example of this. It's just amazing that so many people who call themselves believers bite on these things. It used to be the devil had to use fancy fishing lures and spinner baits... but anymore it seems he can just use a hook with nothing on it at all.Simply amazing.hmmm... the weather is nice and my analogy put the thought in my head to go fishing. I think I'll be out on the lake the rest of the day!Later y'all!Krispy

M

MrBillPro Jul 9, 2005

KrispyKrittr wrote:something comes along that is incredible popular I am immediately suspect of it. KrispyI think Jesus fit that catagorie when he was born, and I guess many were suspect of him. :-)

S

Spitfire Jul 9, 2005

By the way... Larry King asks these same questions to every single Christian "leader" he has on his show. He's done it for years.Since reading this, I have received an email from Joyce Meyer Ministries to view the video of her appearance on Larry King Live. I just wanted to see what she had to say in answer to those questions. It was really good. She did not sidestep Larry King at all. I'm not sure what the locals here think of Joyce Meyer, but you have to admit she knows her Bible real well, and she ain't skeerd to tell the truth. Here's the link if anyone would like to listen. Love, Dian.http://www.joycemeyer.org/projects/lkl_replay/LKL_replay.php

C

ChrisL Jul 9, 2005

Spitfire, Here is a link to an article you might be interested in. In His peace, Chrishttp://www.afcministry.com/Joyce_Meyers.htm