Good Fight Responds To Questions About Kanye West
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mZkHYtdcQI
read more:
On today's episode we discuss the recent news about Kanye West and his recent conversion to Christianity. We take a look at his past and how he has influenced millions of his fans into darkness. Kanye West-Is Jesus Our ‘Homeboy’?
Reading the comments on that youtube, it is certain so many folks don't trust God to save anyone...that distrust boils down to themselves eventually.
such comments about him being false convert or a false teacher is just over the top.
As I see it... 'Hey Kanye, you better fly right and look and sound like the Christian I think I am".
With Christians willing to kill their young that quickly, the abortionist has nothing over them.
Joe at the end finally said "God can even save someone like that". I know he meant it well, but it smelled of that kind of thinking that "people like me get saved and people like him don't".
Fortunately these two guys at least had enough humility to recognize God can save someone that in their estimation cant be saved.
I edited to add one more thing.
Fortunately for us reading this, your life didn't get dissected on youtube when you were a young christen while you were still cussin and lustin and thinking like the world. You were behind the scenes doing it and yet God in his grace had mercy.
Brother Marvin,
You are absolutely right about Kayne West and the brothers that criticize him. Babes in Christ make plenty of mistakes. They even fall from time to time, but please brothers, don't be a hindrance to them by cutting them down, but pray for them, encourage them, and help to pick them up when they stumble.
Brother Marvin,
Your comment/assessment wins the internet today!
Couldn’t agree more and it pains me to think of how hard he’s gonna be pounced on but... when confronted by satan demanding Peter that he might sift him, Jesus prayed that Peters faith would withstand it- perhaps that would be the thing we should pray for Kanye and that the Lord would have mercy on those whom are throwing rocks😬
Guys, I know I'm opening myself up to criticism, but at what point do you think Kanye is moving from giving a testimony or sharing his faith to speaking as or being held out as a teacher and instructor of others in the faith?
Some would question or tear apart his testimony or his conversion. Some would encourage him in his profession and hope and pray for the words to be reality. His conversion is between him and the Lord and we should pray for its sincerity and growth.
My question has more to do with what appears to be a rapid escalation of his public speaking, singing and serving as a guide to others as to what real Christianity is about. That I think is a very legitimate question and concern for him and others.
I think we can encourage and pray for him personally and yet wisely caution him about taking up a mantle of teaching for the Lord prematurely.
No matter how wide you open yourself up to criticism, you won’t get it from me... every rock I throw boomerangs back a hits me in the face 😳
I keep hearing people say he’s teaching and while I can’t say he isn’t, from what I’ve read and seen he definitely is not.... in fact he has other more mature brothers (pastors) do the teaching. It was reported that this past weekend in Louisiana over a 1000 came to faith in Christ at a service he had set up but that there was very little Kanye and a whole lotta Jesus ðŸ™ðŸ»
So as far as I have seen he is mostly giving his testimony and witnessing about what the Lord has done for him. If he is teaching then I’m not exactly sure what he would teach it’s not like he’s been thru cemetery school...
What do you think about writing Christian songs? I’m no making a statement with my question. I am thinking about this verse in my own consideration:
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16
Do you think writing songs to be sung to believers and unbelievers is a form of teaching ? Perhaps even a very impactful and powerful (for good or bad) form.
Hmmm 🤔
Well if that’s the measure then isn’t everything a born again believer does technically teaching? What I’m saying is he doesn’t seem to be setting himself to the teacher- at least not by the biblical standard.
Don’t get me wrong, I get your point... it’s just that what does or doesn’t qualify someone to teach... a seminary degree, a decade in service to the church, three years of being trained by the spirit ?
Brother aren’t you teaching with your posts here on a public forum where potentially millions of people could read and be influenced (for better or worse) by your words? So why are you qualified to teach and another younger brother not?
Just for the sake of thoroughness... let’s say your assumptions are correct and these actions are not profitable for the Lord (tho all things are) and this young brother has, in his zeal, lacked the discipline otherwise necessary to carry out the function of a mature ministry... what exactly are you suggesting the body of Christ do about it?
Hi Fletcher. I think you are asking all the right questions. These are questions I have as well which is why I posted my comment and question. The answers are important and usually people don’t even bother with the questions in a culture where eberybody’s "opinions” and thoughts on deep subjects ( or at least their right to freely express them ) is held in highest regard.
Everyone is called to be discipled and to be a discipler so there is always teaching going on. Clearly though, the Bible has a category of called teachers that is probably broader than an ordained pastor.. Also teachers are held to stricter standards than others who just disciple.
I honestly don’t know the answer. I have been teaching and discipling church leaders and pastors for a long time in many contexts. Never went to seminary and not a pastor but I’m clear on the calling and I’m confident in the fruit God has produced in spite of my many weaknesses.
The Kanye West strory caused me to consider and ponder the role of spiritual song writers in the church and to wonder about responsibilities and appropriate maturity and calling because I discern that there is definitely a strong teaching component to that ministry to the body.
I thought the radio show posted in the OP gave a good, balanced report on this issue.
I thought this other video by a pastor also made good points, albeit it's a more "stern" take on it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEfgyw3xrqQ&t=1872s
The pastor in that video points out that he’s been following Kanye West’s career for a long time and that he’s not convinced that this is a true conversion based on the present facts. He says that to him, if it were a true conversion, we’d be hearing him speak out against all the satanic things he promoted for all those years.
When I first heard about and looked into Kanye West’s recent profession of faith, it seemed encouraging to me. However, after learning and considering other information I have serious reservations.
For example, I saw a recent interview with him where he drops f-bombs and doesn’t seem regretful about it. I know that my foul mouth didn’t get completely cleaned up over night when I became a Christian. But I also know that when I did blurt out a cuss word I was convicted immediately and repented, and after a few months my mouth was cleaned up. He claims to have been truly converted in April, about 6 months ago, and I think by now he should be convicted about that and there should be signs of him seeking to change that habit. This is the interview:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t568Nd7k_Yk
In an interview from just a day ago he said that he doesn’t like the fact that Forbes didn’t recognize him as a billionaire but only as a millionaire. He also seemed to be "slightly” joking around as he said he might legally change his name to "Christian Genius Billionaire Kanye West.” All throughout that interview he boasted about his many "genius” accomplishments and there is not an ounce of humility as far as I could tell. This is the interview:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihfG8qlhW04
Kanye West has been claiming to be a Christian for the longest time, even while publicly worshiping Satan in his rap songs and concerts. And for years he has had this plan of starting his own church services and his own "Christian movement.”
And he seems to be serious about trying to run for president in 2024. In that recent interview he said he’s not going to need to "run” for president but only to "walk” for it.
Could it be that he’s hoping to get Christian votes behind him, just like Trump did? I know it's crazy to even think of him trying to run for president, but hey, that's what I thought when I first heard of Trump running. I was like, "no way, it can't be." I’m not saying for sure that that’s Kanye West's motive but it does make me wonder.
In the past there have been celebrities who have made professions of faith in Christ only to go on to renounce those professions of faith, whether in word or in deed. There have also been some true conversions within Hollywood though.
Yes obviously not one among us gets a "rubber stamp” with which to carry on as they please without being brought to account,... but to whom do they give account? Is it to random (and rather opinionated) strangers from around the world whom they have never even met,... or is it to the same anointing that instructs us? 🤔
See it’s very, and seriously so, important that we don’t become as the elder brother and treat our (prodigal) younger brother spitefully when he returns home... we should be rejoicing and celebrating with not only our brother but with our whole house and all the hosts of heaven!! 😇 Are we sooo holy and set apart that we can lay charge at the feet of Gods servants!??
See we should not only not have all these questions but should in fact have answers for when the unbelieving inquire as to his conversion... using it to show our Fathers mercy and grace:))) yet we throw our hat in with the unbelievers whom question.... :(
So (for me) it all comes down to this...
Why did Jesus do/say what He did?
Because His Father told Him to! -Full stop-
See allot of people read the book and took the test and learned christianese but only those who actually KNOW HIM,... who actually had a personal revelation of who He is, have any part in what is His. For He says so Himself.
If you "know” somebody, you can not only tell if someone else has met or knows them,... you can tell how well they know them and... how long it’s been since they had been with them.
For the record; after I was converted and baptized (in prison) I went straight back to a life of crime... actually committing the largest one I had to date and you know what, the Lord covered me because I was His. Though because I was His, the success of this sin no longer held any pleasure for me and without even realizing it, I gave it up in large part because the desire of my heart had changed. Though for another decade I continued to sin rather consistently and with a certain entitlement till one day (after Jesus just kept giving me more of Himself) I realized I liked being with Jesus more than I liked smoking weed and getting high... so I thought I’ll just hang out with Jesus instead of going to get stoned but I quickly found out I HAD to go get stoned... I was a slave (addicted) to it and didn’t even know it. Now mind you I had been promoting Jesus and all He had done for me publicly and yet I was in bondage to sin. It was then and there that He told me He could "take that from me” if I wanted Him to.... and only because He had ALREADY deposited the faith in my account and had been training me to hear and trust and follow His voice, having His grace abound towards me, was I able to yield to Him and allow Him to set me free from the spirit of addiction ðŸ™ðŸ»ðŸ˜‡ðŸ˜‡ðŸ™ðŸ»ðŸ’¯
So maybe we should, at the least, give God the benefit of the doubt that His arm is NOT shortened unto salvation and He is mighty to save!!!
I know it may be unbelievable that He could do this for Kanye but our God is the God of impossible things :))))
And maybe we should ALL prayerfully consider the song "God is” on the album Jesus is King... tell me if after you hear that if you still have any doubts that this man met the Lord of Lords ?
I know most of the old/older generation, still hang on to the old school morals, and thank God we do. A lot of this new generation is lost, really lost, and it's pretty obvious most are not going to listen to us old/older folks. If it takes someone like Kanye West to get their attention, "and I pray he does" please allow God some time to work through Kanye to help bring this lost generation to Christ.
We all should know very well, sometimes God takes a long time to bring the lost to Christ, it took him 45 years to work on me, to get me somewhat straightened out, and I'm still under construction. God is not like a microwave, he's not into fast food, he sometimes sends folks into our lives to feed us a little at a time. I don't know "anything" about Mr. West, but it doesn't matter what I know, what matters is what God knows.
"Anyone having been born of God does not practice sin, because His seed abides in him, and he is not able to continue sinning, because he has been born of God." 1 John 3:9
"We know that everyone having been born of God does not continue to sin, but the One having been begotten of God protects him, and the evil one does not touch him." 1 John 5:18
"And those on the rocky soil are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no firm root; they believe for a while, and in time of temptation fall away." Luke 8:13
"But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who it was that would betray Him." John 6:64
"Nevertheless, the firm foundation of God stands, having this seal, "The Lord knows those who are His,” and, "Let everyone who names the Name of the Lord depart from wickedness.”"
2 Timothy 2:19
"We know that everyone having been born of God does not continue to sin, but the One having been begotten of God protects him, and the evil one does not touch him." 1 John 5:18
So I guess I haven't been born of God, because I probably commit some type of sin everyday. :-(
Due to the prevalence of the hyper-grace message in the past 100 years, many Christians have missed the biblical truth and reality of false conversions. Yet the Scriptures clearly warn about that reality. We are exhorted to examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith (2 Cor. 13:5) and to make our calling and election sure (2 Pet. 1:10). Paul spoke of being "in perils among false brethren” (2 Cor. 11:26). The main theme of the epistle of 1 John is to provide certain evidences of true conversion whereby one can examine one's self to see if one has a justifiable reason to have assurance of one's salvation. The best sermon I’ve ever heard based on 1 John is this one by Paul Washer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ky8dTyPpiAo
Many times when Christians seek to discern whether or not someone has been genuinely saved, the "Judge not lest you be judged” card is pulled, taking that verse (Matt. 7:1) out of context and misapplying it. It is not taken into account that shortly after that verse in that same chapter Jesus went on to warn and say the following:
"Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thorn bushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them. 21 "Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’”
I know from personal experience about the deception of a false conversion. Sometimes when we are confronted with the possibility that we may have had a false conversion experience in the past, our first reaction is to vehemently deny that possibility. I know that that was the case with me. And it’s understandable because who wants to admit straightaway that their religious experience was a total sham? Yet we must let the Scriptures instruct us on what a true conversion looks like. As 2 Corinthians 5:17 says, "Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.”
Again, the scriptures aforementioned here as well as those referenced by savannah, as well as others such as 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 and Galatians 5:19-21 clearly teach that those who continue to practice sin will not go to heaven, regardless of their profession of faith.
We’re not talking about sinless perfection here. We’re talking about being truly broken over and ashamed of one’s past lifestyle as a God-hater.
In one of the interviews to which I shared the link, Kanye West was asked if he was ashamed of his former lifestyle, to which he replied that he had nothing to be ashamed of whatsoever. It reminded me of when Trump was asked if he believed he needed to ask God for forgiveness, and he said no because he thinks he’s been a good person.
Totally get where you’re coming from -
You wrote;
" Yet the Scriptures clearly warn about that reality. We are exhorted to examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith (2 Cor. 13:5) and to make our calling and election sure (2 Pet. 1:10). Paul spoke of being "in perils among false brethren” (2 Cor. 11:26). The main theme of the epistle of 1 John is to provide certain evidences of true conversion whereby one can examine one's self ”
Notice in all cases we are admonished to examine OURSELVES .........
just sayin
And just for the record... the "radio show” host are Calvinist
So just to be clear, by the standard you and Savannah are putting forth by your interpretation of scripture, John Calvin himself would miss heaven by a country mile... 🤔
Brother, the Good Fight radio show host who founded that ministry is a Calvary Chapel pastor who is definitely not a Calvinist but that is neither here nor there. While I'm not a Calvinist I agree in some areas with their biblical interpretations. On the issue of true and false conversion and the need to exercise discernment and church discipline many Calvinists have gotten it right imo.
We are not only exhorted to examine ourselves but also to examine the fruit of those who profess to know God. We're given Matthew 18:15-20 and 1 Corinthians 5 as instructions on how to exercise church discipline, on how to determine when to excommunicate someone who professes faith in Christ. Notice particularly 1 Corinthians 5:9-13,
"I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner””not even to eat with such a person. 12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person.”
In 2 Tim. 2:3 Paul describes false teachers in the last days as those "having a form of godliness but denying its power," and admonishes, "And from such people turn away!"
In Titus 1 Paul gave the following admonition to Titus regarding certain false teachers of his day (which applies today regarding any who would set themselves up as teachers within the church yet lack certain fruit in keeping with repentance):
"They profess to know God, but in works they deny Him, being abominable, disobedient, and disqualified for every good work."(Tit. 1:16). In verse 13 Paul says, "Therefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith."
From what I can tell, Kanye West does not really have any real accountability to any godly men. This is desperately needed especially if and when one is a new convert. A godly and mature brother can exhort and rebuke when needed, and a true believer will appreciate that kind of biblical correction and guidance.
I know that a Calvinist pastor was trying to disciple him for some time but it seems Kanye sort of got away from that and went off and did his own thing afterward.
Anyway, in the end only God truly knows if Kanye is truly born again. Our place is to pray for him but at the same time to exercise discernment. And as Joe Schimmel said in the radio show, we must be careful not to quickly fall hook line and sinker for the deceptions of the enemy in these last days.
"So just to be clear, by the standard you and Savannah are putting forth by your interpretation of scripture..."
Just to be clear, please tell me and the forum the standard I'm putting forth by my interpretation of Scripture. Please do so from my one post on this thread, prior to this one, my second.
Thanks
Mr. Bill,
Very sorry to hear that you have come to such a conclusion after reading God's inspired Word.
But God...
Brother Oracio,
Again, I get where you’re coming from but,... when did Kanye "set himself up to be a teacher” ?
Everyone keeps sayin things like that but -
Seems like he’s just witnessing and again where do the scriptures EVER license us to throw rocks at other believers that we’ve never even met?
Please site those scriptures for me because in my ignorance I keep missing them.
I don’t know Kanye, and will probably never meet him this side of heaven,... but I will offer praise to God for what He has done!
I mean 38,000,000 people downloaded the album Jesus is King in the first 12 hrs it was available!
So even if this is some super elaborate scheme of the devil who intends it for evil.... even if that is the case here,... Our God will use EVEN THAT to the good to glorify His Son our Lord Jesus ðŸ™ðŸ»ðŸ˜‡
It honestly seems like you all don’t want him to be a Christian!
I mean this is really ridiculous to even be having this discussion!
Because IF ANY of you detractors were spending half as much time before the Lord in prayer on behalf of this young brother, his wife, and their children then you all wouldn’t have time to cynically offer your public unbelief-
Why do christians kill their young!??
This discussion is locked.
